HEALTH MAIN EBOLA DISCUSSION THREAD -09/01/14 - 09/15/14

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Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
Survivors of the disease, who are immune to reinfection, were being used to look after thousands of children of people with suspected Ebola.
Second time today in different articles where this kind of statement has been made when only last week, articles were saying that with the mutation of the virus, over 400 genetic differences discovered so far across many different samples, there was no guarantee that one could not be re-infected with a slightly different strain of the Ebola virus.

Methinks they be grasping at straws (using survivors to help out) or they don't really have a clue whether you can get re-infected or not.
 

SheWoff

Southern by choice
I cannot find THOSE numbers detailed anywhere on the WHO site yet. I am at 4,452 and 2,261 based on the numbers I can find on the WHO site. In recent days, WHO has changed the WAY they report them, WHERE (which document) they report them in and HOW FREQUENTLY they update the numbers so it is bit of a "Where is Waldo?" situation to find these numbers now.

That doesn't surprise me. It just shows more of the .gov not knowing what each other are doing. I expect it will be harder as we go along to find correct numbers from them, or numbers that match their best guess. Might panic the sheep into stampede if they get too high ya know?
 

SheWoff

Southern by choice
Ebola: NMA set up screening centre in UBTH

The Nigeria Medical Association on Friday said that it has set-up a screening tent at the University of Benin Teaching Hospital, Ugbowo, as parts of efforts to prevent the spread of the deadly Ebola virus.

The Edo State Chairman of the association, Professor Afekhide Omoti, who disclosed this in a telephone interview with our correspondent, explained that the tent, which was set up by the association’s emergency response committee on Monday, would be the first port of call for every patient entering the teaching hospital.

Professor Omoti said that the tent had facilities capable of also screening patients for any infectious disease, before gaining entrance into the main hospital.

According to him, individuals going into the hospital would walk through the tent, where there their feet would be sterilised and their temperature assessed through an infrared thermometer.

He stated that any person suspected of having an infectious disease, sequel to the initial screening at the tent, would undergo another screening to ascertain the status of the individual.

He added that the tent was purchased and equipped by the association and would be handed over to the staff of the hospital for further use, while a similar measure would be applied at the Central Hospital in the state capital on Monday.

“Every patient entering the hospital goes straight there. There are four facilities there for screening everybody, not only for Ebola, but for any infectious disease.

“If we find that you are ok, then you will enter the hospital and continue. If we find that there is something dangerous that could infect other people, then we will hold you back and, then, test you properly and decide that it is not a dangerous thing like Ebola before we can send you to the appropriate place.”

“We donated one but we are assisting the hospital to get about three more. But our primary job is to donate one and equip. So, it is the same thing we will do for the Central Hospital,” he said.

Meanwhile, the management of the University of Benin has said that it is not leaving anything to chance to forestall an outbreak in its campuses.

http://www.punchng.com/news/ebola-nma-set-up-screening-centre-in-ubth/
 

Possible Impact

TB Fanatic
Survivors of the disease, who are immune to reinfection, were being used to look after thousands of children of people with suspected Ebola.
Second time today in different articles where this kind of statement has been made when only last week, articles were saying that with the mutation of the virus, over 400 genetic differences discovered so far across many different samples, there was no guarantee that one could not be re-infected with a slightly different strain of the Ebola virus.

Methinks they be grasping at straws (using survivors to help out) or they don't really have a clue whether you can get re-infected or not.

Sounds like a great way to run a controlled study with full Plausible deniability.

Keeps all recovered patients in close proximity to lab & hospital.
Gives them a job. (great cover for the transmission test of Ebola)
Kids of Ebola patients would naturally be tested multiple times for disease presence...
Careful structuring of teaching tasks could limit or quantify closeness of contact to children.



 

SheWoff

Southern by choice
Kris, the updated numbers are now on the WHO site. They are reporting them on the "roadmap" for ebola and it's in a pdf form which I have no idea how to post here...

She
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
re: the numbers...

Remember, MSF says they are "turning away at least 30 patients DAILY" from their facilities... and those are NOT being counted. This is FAR, far worse than any official numbers are telling us.

Summerthyme (and of course, the 30 patients daily aren't staying in any sort of isolation, so are going to infect dozens more before they die... at least those who get into a clinic or hospital "only" infect one or two health care workers. And no, I'm not saying that health care workers don't count, or that ANY infections aren't important. But again, it's the exponential growth that is just going to be much worse when visibly ill people are told "sorry, we can't help you- go home". God help us all!)
 

Seabird

Veteran Member
DOC WARNS OF AIRBORNE EBOLA...

Didn't see this posted...

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/12/o...dit_tnt_20140911&nlid=745484&tntemail0=y&_r=1
What We’re Afraid to Say About Ebola

By MICHAEL T. OSTERHOLMSEPT. 11, 2014


This story is included with an NYT Opinion subscription.
Learn more »
Continue reading the main story

MINNEAPOLIS — THE Ebola epidemic in West Africa has the potential to alter history as much as any plague has ever done.

There have been more than 4,300 cases and 2,300 deaths over the past six months. Last week, the World Health Organization warned that, by early October, there may be thousands of new cases per week in Liberia, Sierra Leone, Guinea and Nigeria. What is not getting said publicly, despite briefings and discussions in the inner circles of the world’s public health agencies, is that we are in totally uncharted waters and that Mother Nature is the only force in charge of the crisis at this time.

There are two possible future chapters to this story that should keep us up at night.

The first possibility is that the Ebola virus spreads from West Africa to megacities in other regions of the developing world. This outbreak is very different from the 19 that have occurred in Africa over the past 40 years. It is much easier to control Ebola infections in isolated villages. But there has been a 300 percent increase in Africa’s population over the last four decades, much of it in large city slums. What happens when an infected person yet to become ill travels by plane to Lagos, Nairobi, Kinshasa or Mogadishu — or even Karachi, Jakarta, Mexico City or Dhaka?

The second possibility is one that virologists are loath to discuss openly but are definitely considering in private: that an Ebola virus could mutate to become transmissible through the air. You can now get Ebola only through direct contact with bodily fluids. But viruses like Ebola are notoriously sloppy in replicating, meaning the virus entering one person may be genetically different from the virus entering the next. The current Ebola virus’s hyper-evolution is unprecedented; there has been more human-to-human transmission in the past four months than most likely occurred in the last 500 to 1,000 years. Each new infection represents trillions of throws of the genetic dice.

If certain mutations occurred, it would mean that just breathing would put one at risk of contracting Ebola. Infections could spread quickly to every part of the globe, as the H1N1 influenza virus did in 2009, after its birth in Mexico.

Why are public officials afraid to discuss this? They don’t want to be accused of screaming “Fire!” in a crowded theater — as I’m sure some will accuse me of doing. But the risk is real, and until we consider it, the world will not be prepared to do what is necessary to end the epidemic.

In 2012, a team of Canadian researchers proved that Ebola Zaire, the same virus that is causing the West Africa outbreak, could be transmitted by the respiratory route from pigs to monkeys, both of whose lungs are very similar to those of humans. Richard Preston’s 1994 best seller “The Hot Zone” chronicled a 1989 outbreak of a different strain, Ebola Reston virus, among monkeys at a quarantine station near Washington. The virus was transmitted through breathing, and the outbreak ended only when all the monkeys were euthanized. We must consider that such transmissions could happen between humans, if the virus mutates.



So what must we do that we are not doing?



First, we need someone to take over the position of “command and control.” The United Nations is the only international organization that can direct the immense amount of medical, public health and humanitarian aid that must come from many different countries and nongovernmental groups to smother this epidemic. Thus far it has played at best a collaborating role, and with everyone in charge, no one is in charge.

A Security Council resolution could give the United Nations total responsibility for controlling the outbreak, while respecting West African nations’ sovereignty as much as possible. The United Nations could, for instance, secure aircraft and landing rights. Many private airlines are refusing to fly into the affected countries, making it very difficult to deploy critical supplies and personnel. The Group of 7 countries’ military air and ground support must be brought in to ensure supply chains for medical and infection-control products, as well as food and water for quarantined areas.

The United Nations should provide whatever number of beds are needed; the World Health Organization has recommended 1,500, but we may need thousands more. It should also coordinate the recruitment and training around the world of medical and nursing staff, in particular by bringing in local residents who have survived Ebola, and are no longer at risk of infection. Many countries are pledging medical resources, but donations will not result in an effective treatment system if no single group is responsible for coordinating them.

Finally, we have to remember that Ebola isn’t West Africa’s only problem. Tens of thousands die there each year from diseases like AIDS, malaria and tuberculosis. Liberia, Sierra Leone and Guinea have among the highest maternal mortality rates in the world. Because people are now too afraid of contracting Ebola to go to the hospital, very few are getting basic medical care. In addition, many health care workers have been infected with Ebola, and more than 120 have died. Liberia has only 250 doctors left, for a population of four million.

This is about humanitarianism and self-interest. If we wait for vaccines and new drugs to arrive to end the Ebola epidemic, instead of taking major action now, we risk the disease’s reaching from West Africa to our own backyards.
 
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closet squirrel

Veteran Member
So, for people who think "ebola is an African thing, we don't need to worry" Here is how easy it would be to get here:

I carpool my daughter and 2 girls in our neighborhood to volleyball practice several times a week. One of the girls is of African decent. Her grandmother had been here visiting last year for like 6 months or so, and went back home sometime around May I think. I noticed a few days ago that she was back. I had no idea where in Africa they were from so while driving them to school just now I asked the girl where her grandmother lives in Africa. Nigeria. I asked when she got back here and she said about a week ago.

I asked her questions about if she had mentioned that people were getting worried or things like that. She said that was why she came back here, because though she didn't live in the area were the outbreak was, that people were starting to worry. She said her grandmother said they scanned people for temperatures at the airport but that is all (This from a 14 year old so who knows)

So anyway, just that fast, I was sitting in a car with someone who lives with someone who was in Nigeria up until a week ago.
 

Hurricanehic

Veteran Member
This whole page of news, and the one that comes before it, have taken on a tone identical to that of people standing on the beach, watching the water flow out, rapidly, while knowing full well that a tsunami is about to hit.
_________________
Quote from Pixie over at the Pandemic Flu site.

* This has a ring of truth to me-Hurricanehic
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
Kris, the updated numbers are now on the WHO site. They are reporting them on the "roadmap" for ebola and it's in a pdf form which I have no idea how to post here...

She

Read the Roadmap document which is from AUGUST, checked the GAR and the DON reports...I STILL do not find any newer numbers or the numbers mentioned above. Can you provide a link to the document you found?
 

bw

Fringe Ranger
This whole page of news, and the one that comes before it, have taken on a tone identical to that of people standing on the beach, watching the water flow out, rapidly, while knowing full well that a tsunami is about to hit.

Nasty as that feeling is, at least you can see the tsunami. Your neighbors haven't seen it yet, and when they do, you want to be out of their path.
 

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
So, for people who think "ebola is an African thing, we don't need to worry" Here is how easy it would be to get here:

I carpool my daughter and 2 girls in our neighborhood to volleyball practice several times a week. One of the girls is of African decent. Her grandmother had been here visiting last year for like 6 months or so, and went back home sometime around May I think. I noticed a few days ago that she was back. I had no idea where in Africa they were from so while driving them to school just now I asked the girl where her grandmother lives in Africa. Nigeria. I asked when she got back here and she said about a week ago.

I asked her questions about if she had mentioned that people were getting worried or things like that. She said that was why she came back here, because though she didn't live in the area were the outbreak was, that people were starting to worry. She said her grandmother said they scanned people for temperatures at the airport but that is all (This from a 14 year old so who knows)

So anyway, just that fast, I was sitting in a car with someone who lives with someone who was in Nigeria up until a week ago.
And don't think it isn't just that easy to suddenly become part of the "first wave". I imagine your daughter has actually had physical contact so, should Ebola actually arrive here, a lot of us will really be contracting it from our own kids.
 

closet squirrel

Veteran Member
And don't think it isn't just that easy to suddenly become part of the "first wave". I imagine your daughter has actually had physical contact so, should Ebola actually arrive here, a lot of us will really be contracting it from our own kids.

Yup the first thing I thought of too. Kids on a sports team, even IF they don't share water bottles, at the very least are rubbing sweat with each other
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
It is interesting the information doom dam is now starting to break with the German and American university doctor confirming what we here at timebomb have been saying for quite a while. We are reaching the point where arguments about actual numbers versus the fantasy WHO ones no longer have any meaning.

For the last two weeks I have seen story after story about hundreds of people of sick people, potentially Ebola infected people, being turned away from the collapsed health care system in Liberia. Basic logic tells me this means that these same potentially infected people have been wandering around aimlessly, with no hope, no treatment and have very likely further spread the Ebola virus. It is also clear that all the people these people have infected aren't even bothering to go to the hospitals since they know they will be turned away. Finally, this means Ebola is now totally out of control in Liberia. You add all of the above up and there is no way any rational human being can think we are not facing an unprecedented humanitarian disaster in West Africa, especially Liberia.

Liberia is a long ways down the road to where all of Africa, eventually in the six to nine month time frame, is going to be.

Social collapse and anarchy. CHECK

Collapsed health care and government systems. CHECK

Food shortages, transportation issues, starvation. CHECK

A failed, totally inadequate 1st world response. CHECK

Sorry, Bill and Melinda Gates, you may be preening for the press conference, but you are not a factor in dealing with the Ebola epidemic.

THE MAN SAID EBOLA WAS DOUBLING, REPEAT DOUBLING EVERY TWO WEEKS. It is the example of the one rice grain on the first square of the chess board. Two on the second, and four on the third. By the time you get to the final square you have a warehouse full of rice.

Ebola is out of control in Liberia. There is no possible impact to be made on the situation at this point. Liberia is going to fall on the sword with grave consequences for the rest of Africa. The other thing is the systematic effort to intentionally suppress the "other Ebola epidemic" in the DRC is starting to fail.

People have to realize we are dealing with TWO SEPARATE Ebola epidemics in Africa. The first is centered in West Africa, Liberia in particular. It ranges from the bungling Nigerian government to Sierra Leone. The DRC is hundreds of miles away from West Africa. Given the DOCUMENTED FACT that even "recovered" Ebola patients have infected with live Ebola virus semen, the men anyway <G> this nearly guarantees the same disease vector as HIV. It was unprotected sex between truck drivers and prostitutes at truck stops that spread HIV in Africa, especially South Africa.

South Africa is the lynch pin of the DRC Ebola epidemic. Nigeria is the lynch pin in the West African Ebola epidemic. If both Nigeria and South Africa can avoid having an Ebola epidemic we may, repeat may, dodge the global pandemic threat.

The minimum that is going to happen over the next six months is Liberia is going to cease to be a functioning state. It will have rotting corpses from one end of the country to the other. South Africa has multiple millions of HIV infected people. What happens when they get exposed to Ebola, with their depressed immune systems, is the difference between a few thousand dead and the end of South Africa as a functional society.

Again, this is 1348 to 1352 BLACK DEATH level stuff. It is entirely possible we will have 100 MILLION dead Africans 18 months from now at a minimum. And when the rest of the world starts to see that, Kris all PC nonsense will go out the window fast.
 

Possible Impact

TB Fanatic
I cannot find THOSE numbers detailed anywhere on the WHO site yet. I am at 4,452 and 2,261 based on the numbers I can find on the WHO site. In recent days, WHO has changed the WAY they report them, WHERE (which document) they report them in and HOW FREQUENTLY they update the numbers so it is bit of a "Where is Waldo?" situation to find these numbers now.

As Ebola grows out of control, WHO pleads for more health workers
By Kate Kelland and Tom Miles
LONDON/GENEVA Fri Sep 12, 2014 11:20am EDT
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/12/us-health-ebola-idUSKBN0H70PJ20140912



Ebola surging beyond control, WHO's Margaret Chan warns
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/ebola-surging-beyond-control-who-s-margaret-chan-warns-1.2764285

CBC News Posted: Sep 12, 2014 9:25 AM ET
Excerpt:
Ebola virus cases in West Africa are rising faster than the ability to contain
them, the World Health Organization says, as experts warn that the
exponential rise could become a worldwide disaster.

The death toll has risen to more than 2,400 people out of 4,784 cases,
WHO director general Margaret Chan told reporters at the UN health
agency’s headquarters in in Geneva on Friday, noting the figures could be
an underestimate.

 

Possible Impact

TB Fanatic
It is interesting the information doom dam is now starting to break with the German and American university doctor confirming what we here at timebomb have been saying for quite a while. We are reaching the point where arguments about actual numbers versus the fantasy WHO ones no longer have any meaning.

For the last two weeks I have seen story after story about hundreds of people of sick people, potentially Ebola infected people, being turned away from the collapsed health care system in Liberia. Basic logic tells me this means that these same potentially infected people have been wandering around aimlessly, with no hope, no treatment and have very likely further spread the Ebola virus. It is also clear that all the people these people have infected aren't even bothering to go to the hospitals since they know they will be turned away. Finally, this means Ebola is now totally out of control in Liberia. You add all of the above up and there is no way any rational human being can think we are not facing an unprecedented humanitarian disaster in West Africa, especially Liberia.

Liberia is a long ways down the road to where all of Africa, eventually in the six to nine month time frame, is going to be.

Social collapse and anarchy. CHECK

Collapsed health care and government systems. CHECK

Food shortages, transportation issues, starvation. CHECK

A failed, totally inadequate 1st world response. CHECK

Sorry, Bill and Melinda Gates, you may be preening for the press conference, but you are not a factor in dealing with the Ebola epidemic.

THE MAN SAID EBOLA WAS DOUBLING, REPEAT DOUBLING EVERY TWO WEEKS. It is the example of the one rice grain on the first square of the chess board. Two on the second, and four on the third. By the time you get to the final square you have a warehouse full of rice.

Ebola is out of control in Liberia. There is no possible impact to be made on the situation at this point. Liberia is going to fall on the sword with grave consequences for the rest of Africa. The other thing is the systematic effort to intentionally suppress the "other Ebola epidemic" in the DRC is starting to fail.

People have to realize we are dealing with TWO SEPARATE Ebola epidemics in Africa. The first is centered in West Africa, Liberia in particular. It ranges from the bungling Nigerian government to Sierra Leone. The DRC is hundreds of miles away from West Africa. Given the DOCUMENTED FACT that even "recovered" Ebola patients have infected with live Ebola virus semen, the men anyway <G> this nearly guarantees the same disease vector as HIV. It was unprotected sex between truck drivers and prostitutes at truck stops that spread HIV in Africa, especially South Africa.

South Africa is the lynch pin of the DRC Ebola epidemic. Nigeria is the lynch pin in the West African Ebola epidemic. If both Nigeria and South Africa can avoid having an Ebola epidemic we may, repeat may, dodge the global pandemic threat.

The minimum that is going to happen over the next six months is Liberia is going to cease to be a functioning state. It will have rotting corpses from one end of the country to the other. South Africa has multiple millions of HIV infected people. What happens when they get exposed to Ebola, with their depressed immune systems, is the difference between a few thousand dead and the end of South Africa as a functional society.

Again, this is 1348 to 1352 BLACK DEATH level stuff. It is entirely possible we will have 100 MILLION dead Africans 18 months from now at a minimum. And when the rest of the world starts to see that, Kris all PC nonsense will go out the window fast.


Much much much much more than just a warehouse!
Exponential Growth and the Legend of Paal Paysam
http://www.singularitysymposium.com/exponential-growth.html

Exponential Growth is an immensely powerful concept. To help us grasp it
better let us use an ancient Indian chess legend as an example.

The legend goes that the tradition of serving Paal Paysam to visiting
pilgrims started after a game of chess between the local king and the lord
Krishna himself. (picture of 18th century Miniature of Lord Krishna playing
Chess against Radha from National Museum, New Delhi)

The king was a big chess enthusiast and had the habit of challenging wise
visitors to a game of chess. One day a traveling sage was challenged by
the king. To motivate his opponent the king offered any reward that the
sage could name. The sage modestly asked just for a few grains of rice in
the following manner: the king was to put a single grain of rice on the first
chess square and double it on every consequent one.

Having lost the game and being a man of his word the king ordered a bag
of rice to be brought to the chess board. Then he started placing rice
grains according to the arrangement: 1 grain on the first square, 2 on the
second, 4 on the third, 8 on the fourth and so on:

Exponential_growth_chessboard_with_rice.jpg


Following the exponential growth of the rice payment the king quickly
realized that he was unable to fulfill his promise because on the twentieth
square the king would have had to put 1,000,000 grains of rice. On the
fortieth square the king would have had to put 1,000,000,000 grains of
rice.

And, finally on the sixty fourth square the king would have had to put
more than 18,000,000,000,000,000,000 grains of rice which is equal to
about 210 billion tons
and is allegedly sufficient to cover the whole
territory of India with a meter thick layer of rice. At ten grains of rice per
square inch, the above amount requires rice fields covering twice the
surface area of the Earth, oceans included.

 

mala

Contributing Member
South Africa is the lynch pin of the DRC Ebola epidemic. Nigeria is the lynch pin in the West African Ebola epidemic. If both Nigeria and South Africa can avoid having an Ebola epidemic we may, repeat may, dodge the global pandemic threat.

Doug,

Could you expound on why these two countries are lynch pins? Thanks very much.
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
As Ebola grows out of control, WHO pleads for more health workers
By Kate Kelland and Tom Miles
LONDON/GENEVA Fri Sep 12, 2014 11:20am EDT
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/12/us-health-ebola-idUSKBN0H70PJ20140912



Ebola surging beyond control, WHO's Margaret Chan warns
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/ebola-surging-beyond-control-who-s-margaret-chan-warns-1.2764285

CBC News Posted: Sep 12, 2014 9:25 AM ET
Excerpt:
Ebola virus cases in West Africa are rising faster than the ability to contain
them, the World Health Organization says, as experts warn that the
exponential rise could become a worldwide disaster.

The death toll has risen to more than 2,400 people out of 4,784 cases,
WHO director general Margaret Chan told reporters at the UN health
agency’s headquarters in in Geneva on Friday, noting the figures could be
an underestimate.


Thanks...but yes, I have seen these numbers and these "quotes" of Margaret Chan in several articles today but NOT in any of the official WHO documents I check daily to update the numbers in the Ebola Tracking thread. Up until a couple of weeks ago, WHO would put out a DON document (Disease Outbreak News) every couple of days typically with the entire chart, and counts by country, infected, dead, CFR, etc. The last DON report for West Africa was 9/4/2014 here: http://www.who.int/csr/don/2014_09_04_ebola/en/

Then 2-3 weeks ago they also moved the numbers into what WHO calls an Ebola Situation Report which came out maybe twice a week and the DON reports seemed to begin to dwindle away from their prior frequency.

But I just found the latest Situation Report... http://www.who.int/iris/bitstream/10665/133073/1/roadmapsitrep3_eng.pdf?ua=1 from TODAY but only through 9/7/2014 as far as the counts are concerned.


So I have STILL found nothing on the WHO site that contains the "The death toll has risen to more than 2,400 people out of 4,784 cases" numbers. That must be a number Chan knows but is not officially published yet.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
First, I have been solemnly told it is really LINCHPIN. Perhaps I was thinking of a naval belaying pin used to bash heads? LOL

Nigeria is a game changer since it has an International Airport in Lagos. Worst case is infected asymptomatic people start to spew out of it and fly to who knows where. The other thing is Nigeria's population is 167? million I think. It is larger than all of the rest of West Africa, it has more people, is part of the global air travel network, and is also a place where lots of foreigners work. It is also a significant source of oil for the USA.

South Africa is also a large country with multiple millions of people, many foreign workers, as well as being a part of the global air travel net. Finally, South Africa has been dealing with staggering amounts of HIV infected people. I read somewhere that 60 percent of the South African military was HIV positive.

We will likely get a regional West African Ebola epidemic with several million dead if Nigeria avoids an Ebola epidemic. However, if EITHER South Africa or Nigeria does so the numbers of the dead go from several million dead to well over 100 million. People in Nigeria and South Africa, or at least the elite do, have the money to bribe their way out of the country if Ebola goes wild.
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
First, I have been solemnly told it is really LINCHPIN. Perhaps I was thinking of a naval belaying pin used to bash heads? LOL

Nigeria is a game changer since it has an International Airport in Lagos. Worst case is infected asymptomatic people start to spew out of it and fly to who knows where. The other thing is Nigeria's population is 167? million I think. It is larger than all of the rest of West Africa, it has more people, is part of the global air travel network, and is also a place where lots of foreigners work. It is also a significant source of oil for the USA.

South Africa is also a large country with multiple millions of people, many foreign workers, as well as being a part of the global air travel net. Finally, South Africa has been dealing with staggering amounts of HIV infected people. I read somewhere that 60 percent of the South African military was HIV positive.

We will likely get a regional West African Ebola epidemic with several million dead if Nigeria avoids an Ebola epidemic. However, if EITHER South Africa or Nigeria does so the numbers of the dead go from several million dead to well over 100 million. People in Nigeria and South Africa, or at least the elite do, have the money to bribe their way out of the country if Ebola goes wild.

Nigeria population estimate as of 2013 - 174.5 million - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigeria

Nigeria - USA Oil imports - about 89,000 bbls per day (11th on the table of top USA oil imports, so not that big a deal out of 7.6 million bbls imported daily it is 1.1%) - http://www.eia.gov/petroleum/imports/companylevel/ and http://www.upi.com/Business_News/En...S-importing-less-oil-data-show/9671410528026/
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
Kris, watch what happens in the oil markets if Nigeria announced it was shutting down its oil exports to the USA.

I am not sure the USA could absorb, without price increases, even "only" 90,000 bpd.

My main point was the combined populations of Nigeria and South Africa are many, many times what the entire West Africa ones are. Lagos has 20 million plus people. Monrovia has one million. If Ebola gets loose in Lagos, the damage will be 20 times as bad as in Monrovia.
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
Kris, watch what happens in the oil markets if Nigeria announced it was shutting down its oil exports to the USA.

I am not sure the USA could absorb, without price increases, even "only" 90,000 bpd.

My main point was the combined populations of Nigeria and South Africa are many, many times what the entire West Africa ones are. Lagos has 20 million plus people. Monrovia has one million. If Ebola gets loose in Lagos, the damage will be 20 times as bad as in Monrovia.

If nothing changes (R0 of 2.785 as we came out of August 2014) and assuming BEST CASE that "the numbers are what they are" at this moment 2 weeks later....we hit 100 million dead in mid-July of 2015...then 1 BILLION by late September 2015. Move those dates closer by 2 months if the numbers are 4 times worse than reported.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
Yep, Kris gets the Doomer Doug associate award. he he he

If the Bible is correct, and one third die, you are looking in the 2.5, out of 7 Billion plus, range.
 

Possible Impact

TB Fanatic
You boys are having too much fun with this.

Heh, I've got to take my elevator UP to get to Camp Fooked!
(Not to mention the two airlocks to get to the elevator!)

I already painted a "12" on my Ebola response dial.
(Which was already cranked up to 11...)
Don't make me have to go modify that thing to "13" now! :D
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
You boys are having too much fun with this.

I keep hoping and praying that SOMETHING will happen to change the trajectory but this thing just keeps plodding along month after month getting worse and not better...yet. I spent the morning researching old WHO reports from ALL previous Ebola Outbreaks.


The prior outbreaks for which WHO has detailed published information are (I have all the basic info in a spreadsheet now):

1976 Zaire Outbreak
1976 Sudan Outbreak
1979 Sudan Outbreak
1994 Gabon Outbreak
1995 Kikwit Outbreak
1996 Gabon Outbreak #1
1996 Gabon Outbreak #2
2000 Uganda Outbreak
2001 Gabon Outbreak
2001 Rep of Congo Outbreak
2002 Gabon Outbreak
2002 Rep of Congo Outbreak
2003 Rep of Congo Outbreak


Here is a little food for thought:

The LONGEST prior outbreak was Gabon in 2001 - 194 days but because of the remoteness of the villages and isolation of the victims it only represented 65 cases with 53 dead for a CFR of 82%.

The LARGEST prior outbreak was Uganda in 2000 - 425 cases with 224 dead for a CFR of 53% but it ran its course beginning to end in only 115 days.

The SMALLEST outbreaks were in 2002 but they were the most deadly totaling 11 infected and 10 dead for a CFR of 91%.

The TOTALS of ALL prior outbreaks are 1,795 cases with 1,259 dead for a CFR of 70%.

The AVERAGE outbreak lasted 116 days, infected 138 people of which 97 died.

The CURRENT 2014 OUTBREAK is 261 days old, with 4,846 cases and 2,481 deaths for a CFR of 51%.

So this one already has almost TRIPLE the number of cases of all other outbreaks combined and DOUBLE the deaths (the lower CFR is why the deaths are not also triple) and has lasted over TWICE as long as the average of all prior outbreaks. AND...it shows NO SIGN of ending or slowing down, anytime soon.
 

fi103r

Veteran Member
You boys are having too much fun with this.

You can laugh or you can cry, I'm going to laugh.

About the time I figured 0(zero TM) and his obammunauts were the worst of all possible .gov the WHO and various West African .gov made his incompetence irrelevant.

Yes we are standing on the beach watching the water (time/options) flow away and some folks are wondering what that white line on the horizon is. The residents(inmates) of Camp Fooked are trying to get to higher ground but the higher ground is nebulous at best see post by closet squirrel whose kid plays sports with a kid who lives with a recent arrival from West Africa. Multiply that by fact AIRLINES STILL FLY OUT OF THE EFFECTED AREA. 'STRINGENT MEASURES' Laughable measures is more like it.

Oh for a real laugher Field support hospitals usually have 250 beds so 0(zero TM) sends the very best assistance, no not his putt putt course and spare putters but a 25 bed R&R hospice for the health care providers.

OK where is the keg of ale I'm thirsty.

r
 

skeptic

Contributing Member
Second time today in different articles where this kind of statement has been made when only last week, articles were saying that with the mutation of the virus, over 400 genetic differences discovered so far across many different samples, there was no guarantee that one could not be re-infected with a slightly different strain of the Ebola virus.

Methinks they be grasping at straws (using survivors to help out) or they don't really have a clue whether you can get re-infected or not.

As far as I know nobody has been unlucky enough to get Ebola twice. If ever is such a case I'm sure it will be big news everywhere.
 

BREWER

Veteran Member
Posted for fair use and discussion.
https://in.news.yahoo.com/netherlands-evacuate-two-doctors-had-contact-ebola-victims-101916632.html?

Netherlands to evacuate two doctors who had contact with Ebola victims
ReutersReuters – 2 hours 51 minutes ago


AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - Authorities in the Netherlands are preparing to evacuate two Dutch doctors who had unprotected contact in Sierra Leone with patients who later died of Ebola, a Dutch public health official said on Friday.

The two doctors have shown no symptoms of the virus but authorities believe there is cause for concern because they were not wearing full protective clothing when they came into contact with the patients, who had not yet been diagnosed with Ebola.

"The two doctors' personal protection should be considered inadequate. They could potentially have been exposed," said Jaap van Dissel, director of the Dutch Centre for Infectious Disease Control.

The two doctors will be evacuated on a special flight to minimise the risk of contagion to other passengers and monitored closely on arrival, according to media reports.

"It's only contagious if they have a fever," van Dissel said, and added that if symptoms developed, the two would be placed in quarantine in a university hospital.

Dutch public television said the case was discovered when the doctors came to the Netherlands' nearest embassy in Ghana after the patients they had been in contact with at the Lion Heart Medical Centre in Yele town died of Ebola.

The clinic, which normally deals with cases of malaria, which has symptoms similar to Ebola, has since been shut down by authorities in Sierra Leone.

More than 2,400 people have died so far from Ebola in West Africa since the outbreak started in March, taking a particularly heavy toll among medical workers, more than 120 of whom have died of the disease as of late August, according to the World Health Organisation.

(Reporting by Thomas Escritt; Editing by Sonya Hepinstall)

==============

Pixie: Comment

Note that the Dutch doctors crossed the border from Sierra Leone and headed into Ghana.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Posted for fair use and discussion.
http://who.int/csr/don/2014_09_10_ebola/en/

Ebola virus disease – Democratic Republic of Congo
Disease outbreak news
10 September 2014


Epidemiological situation

Between 2 and 9 September 2014, there have been 31 more cases of Ebola virus disease (EVD) reported in the Democratic Republic of the Congo (DRC), increasing the cumulative number of cases to 62 (14 confirmed, 26 probable, and 22 suspect). In total, 35 deaths have been reported (9 confirmed and 26 probable). No deaths have been reported among suspected cases. Nine health-care workers have been diagnosed with EVD, including 7 deaths. All the cases have been localized in Jeera county. The affected villages are Watsi Kengo, Lokolia, Boende, and Boende Muke. Currently, 9 cases have been hospitalized: 4 in Lokolia; 2 in Watsikengo; 2 in Boende; and 1 in Boende Moke. A total of 386 contacts have been listed and 239 contacts have been followed-up. All cases and contacts are linked to the initial index case reported to the World Health Organization on 26 August 2014.

Response activities

During a regional meeting between the Ministry of Health of DRC and the Southern African Development Community on the management and prevention of EVD transmission, the following measures were recommended: standardization of the interventions for the prevention of EVD and enhancement of sanitary border control without impeding international traffic.

Under the leadership of the Government, the international community is providing strong logistical support and sending experts, equipment, food, and transportation means to the field.

A team of national and international specialists have been deployed to work with the local response teams. Patients are being treated in temporary isolation units in Watsi Kengo, Lokolia, Boende, and Boende Muke. A mobile laboratory from the National Institute of Biomedical Research (INRB) has been installed in Lokolia and is currently functional. Two laboratory epidemiologists from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have arrived in DRC to support the INRB field team.

Contact tracing activities are being carried out by an assigned team with supervision from of a medical epidemiologist and a community worker, and when required, psychologists visit and dialogue with communities. Ongoing sensitization activities to mobilize community leaders are being implemented.

Data reported in the Disease Outbreak News are based on official information reported by the Ministry of Health. These numbers are subject to change due to ongoing reclassification, retrospective investigation, and availability of laboratory results.

WHO does not recommend any travel or trade restrictions be applied except in cases where individuals have been confirmed or are suspected of being infected with EVD or where individuals have had contact with cases of EVD. (Contacts do not include properly-protected health-care workers and laboratory staff.)

====================================================================
Posted for fair use and discussion.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/13/world/africa/ebola-who-africa.html?

Ebola Outpaces Global Response, W.H.O. Says

By NICK CUMMING-BRUCESEPT. 12, 2014

GENEVA — A month after declaring the Ebola outbreak in West Africa a global health emergency, the World Health Organization warned on Friday that the disease is still outpacing the international response to contain it.

“The Ebola outbreak that is ravaging parts of West Africa is the largest, most severe and most complex in the nearly four-decade history of this disease,” Margaret Chan, the health organization’s director general, said at a news conference. “The number of new cases is moving far faster than the capacity to treat them.”

So far, 4,784 Ebola cases have been reported and more than 2,400 people have died in the outbreak, which is concentrated in Guinea, Liberia and Sierra Leone, Ms. Chan said on Friday, citing the latest data available. But she made clear the figures were “an underestimate.”

A surge of 400 new cases in Liberia in the past week, double the number of new cases in the preceding week, was “a particular cause for concern,” the health organization said. Sierra Leone reported 200 new cases in the past week and a high rate of transmission in the capital, Freetown, the W.H.O. said. Nearly half the total number of infections in West Africa and just over half the deaths occurred in the last 21 days, it said.

Releasing a road map to guide the international response to the crisis two weeks ago, the health organization said some 20,000 people could ultimately be affected, but Ms. Chan said Friday that the estimate could change as the epidemic evolves.

The outbreak has already stricken more people than all other outbreaks of the disease combined, Sarah Crowe, a staff member for the United Nations children’s fund, Unicef, told reporters in a telephone briefing from Monrovia, the capital of Liberia.

Ms. Chan’s comments came at a joint news conference with Cuba’s public health minister, Roberto Morales Ojeda, to announce that Cuba would send 165 doctors and nurses to Sierra Leone, the biggest commitment of personnel to the health crisis so far by any country, Ms. Chan said.

The new team, now receiving specialist training in Cuba, will deploy in the first week of October and will stay six months, the health organization said in a statement.

“I’m quite positive more support will be forthcoming,” Ms. Chan said, noting assistance offered by Britain, Canada, the Democratic Republic of Congo, the European Union, France, Uganda and the United States.

The World Health Organization has said it will earmark $100 million to fight the outbreak. Other commitments include $200 million from the World Bank, $181 million from the European Union, $75 million from the United States and $50 million from the Gates Foundation.

Among other aid commitments, the United States said this week that it would send a 25-bed military field hospital to Monrovia to treat health care workers infected by the virus, and Britain has promised to provide a 62-bed unit for Sierra Leone.

But despite the efforts to scale up the response, World Health Organization data makes clear that the resources available to date are a small fraction of what is needed. In Liberia, which accounts for roughly half the number of cases and more than half the number of deaths reported so far, not a single hospital bed is available to receive people infected, Ms. Chan said.

Liberia has a total of 314 beds in centers for treating Ebola patients, but Monrovia alone needs another 760 beds, the W.H.O. said this week.

“The thing we need most of all is people, health care workers,” Ms. Chan said, citing the urgency of providing pay and hazard allowances to get national staff in the affected countries back to work.

Already fragile health services in countries that rank among the world’s poorest have been weakened by the effect of the Ebola epidemic on medical staff, who have lacked sufficient supplies of the materials and equipment needed to protect themselves.

In Sierra Leone, where health care workers have died in disproportionate numbers since the epidemic began, officials said on Friday that a fourth doctor, Olivette Buck, had become infected with the virus and that the three other doctors to contract the disease had died.

The authorities in Sierra Leone were urgently attempting on Friday to evacuate Dr. Buck for treatment abroad, saying the loss of another prominent doctor would be disastrous for the country’s already battered morale.

In Liberia, where 153 health workers have become infected and 79 have died, Unicef said it had delivered nearly 248 metric tons of personal protection equipment, hygiene kits and the chlorine needed for routine hand washing, but it reinforced the warning that the international efforts still fell far short of what was needed.

“We don’t have enough partners,” Ms. Crowe said in her telephone briefing. “Many Liberians say they feel abandoned.”

“Ebola has turned survivors into human booby traps, unexploded ordnance — touch and you die,” Ms. Crowe said in an article published by the BBC. “Ebola psychosis is paralyzing.”

“It’s quite surreal,” she added in her briefing. "Everywhere you go there’s a sense of this virus taking over.”

The outbreak is deeply disturbing for children who “are seeing family members and relatives taken away by people in astronaut suits,” Ms. Crowe said. They live in a “twilight zone” where normal play with their peers is a risk. “It’s almost as if they have to unwire their normal human ways,” she said.

Aid agencies are also concerned that the impact of the epidemic is collapsing the ability of health services to address other medical needs. Unicef said children were dying from measles because they had not been vaccinated, and pregnant women had few places where they could safely deliver children.

Emerging from years of brutal conflict, Liberia had achieved the fastest rate of decline in child mortality in Africa, Sheldon Yett, Unicef’s representative in Liberia, said in a statement. “Now Ebola is threatening to wipe out all those hard-earned gains for children and for Liberia,” he said.

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Posted for fair use and discussion.
http://www.digitaljournal.com/life/h...rticle/402920?

New study demonstrates how fast Ebola virus can spread
13 mins ago in Health
By Karen Graham


Earlier this week, Liberia's defense minister, Brownie Samukai told the U.N. Security Council that Ebola "is now spreading like wildfire, devouring everything in its path." A new study just released shows us how fast the deadly virus is spreading.

New research was published on Sept. 11, demonstrating the rates of transmission of the Ebola virus in West African nations. The work is a combined effort between Arizona State University and the University of Tokyo using case counts provided by the World Health Organization up to Aug.26, 2014.

The paper, "Early transmission dynamics of Ebola virus disease, West Africa, March to August 2014," was published yesterday in Eurosurveillance.

Associate professor Gerardo Chowell-Puente, ASU School of Human Evolution and Social Change, and Hiroshi Nishiura of the University of Tokyo, were able to demonstrate the transmission rate for every single Ebola case consistently showed at least one or more new cases being transmitted.

The researchers were able to show country-specific rates of transmission in Liberia and Sierra Leone that were in keeping with their analysis of every single new case adding one to two secondary transmissions.

"Our analysis of the reproduction numbers of Ebola cases shows continuous growth from June to August 2014 that signalled a major epidemic," Nishiura said. "Uncontrolled cross-border transmission could fuel a major epidemic to take off in new geographical areas as was seen in Liberia."

Statistical analysis showed the rate of transmission increased from June to July in Sierra Leone and Liberia fro 1.4 to 1.7 respectively for every individual case. "Our findings suggest that control of the Ebola epidemic that has taken so many lives could be attained by preventing more than half of the secondary transmissions for each primary case. This could be attained by isolating those with Ebola and tracing each case to its source," Chowell said.

In examining the case counts in the two affected countries using data from WHO, the information was divided into two groups: "confirmed and probable cases; and the total number of reported cases (confirmed, probable and suspected cases)." The researchers found the rates of transmission in this Ebola outbreak to be consistent with the rates of spread from earlier outbreaks in Central Africa.

Using statistical analysis, the researchers demonstrated the probability of increasing cases of Ebola at a rate of 1.0 to 2.0 for all three countries studied (Guinea, Sierra Leone and Liberia). They showed that in Sierra Leone and Liberia, where the importation of the disease was probable, the significant rise in cases in June and July demonstrated a major epidemic.

According to the researchers: "Uncontrolled cross-border transmission could fuel a major epidemic to take off in new geographical areas (e.g. as seen in Liberia). Unaffected countries at risk of transnational spread should be on high alert for potential EVD introductions and be ready to launch comprehensive and timely containment responses to avert outbreaks."

The Washington Post reported on Thursday that 4,293 Ebola virus cases have been confirmed by WHO, with 2,296 deaths as of Sept. 6.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Osterholm's opinion piece gets picked up by the BBC:

Posted for fair use and discussion.
http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-29168905?

Ebola mutation 'presents nightmare scenario'

12 September 2014 Last updated at 16:21 ET


Virologists may not be publicly talking about the possibility that the Ebola virus could someday mutate into an airborne strain, writes Michael T Osterholm in the New York Times, but it's something they are "definitely considering in private".

The director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota says that the virus - which currently can only be transmitted through contact with bodily fluids - has proven to be "notoriously sloppy in replicating", which increases the chances that it could turn into something more contagious.

"Why are public officials afraid to discuss this?" he asks. "They don't want to be accused of screaming 'fire!' in a crowded theatre - as I'm sure some will accuse me of doing. But the risk is real, and until we consider it, the world will not be prepared to do what is necessary to end the epidemic."

The second disturbing scenario he envisions is if the Ebola virus is brought to a more densely populated area of the world, where it would be more difficult to contain.

According to the World Health Organisation, the virus has already infected almost 4,800 people and killed around 2,400. It is now predicting that more than 20,000 may contract the virus before the current outbreak is over.

"What happens when an infected person yet to become ill travels by plane to Lagos, Nairobi, Kinshasa or Mogadishu - or even Karachi, Jakarta, Mexico City or Dhaka?" he asks. The more people who get infected, he says, the greater the opportunities for mutation.

"The current Ebola virus' hyper-evolution is unprecedented; there has been more human-to-human transmission in the past four months than most likely occurred in the last 500 to 1,000 years," he writes.

To prevent this, Osterholm says, the United Nations should be put in charge of overseeing containment of the outbreak by managing air supply chains, providing hospital beds and training medical staff.

Waiting for a vaccine isn't a realistic solution, he concludes. By the time one is developed, the disease could be in "our own backyards".

Although Osterholm paints a dark picture - and it's not the first time he's taken to a major daily newspaper to do so - other public health professionals are unconvinced. Scott Gottlieb, former deputy director of the US Food and Drug Administration, writes in Forbes that it is very unlikely that the Ebola virus would ever mutate into an airborne version.

"It would be unusual for a virus to transform in a way that changes its mode of infection," he writes. "Of the 23 known viruses that cause serious disease in man, none are known to have mutated in ways that changed how they infect humans."

Tara C Smith, writing for ScienceBlogs, says that diseases similar to Ebola have already appeared in the US and have been easily controlled. She adds that she is much more concerned with "ordinary" viruses like influenza and measles.

"Ebola is exotic and its symptoms can be terrifying, but also much easier to contain by people who know their stuff," she concludes. {right, easy…}

In 2005 Wendy Orent, writing in the New Republic, called Osterholm a "doomsayer" who has been on the "disease and terrorism circuit" for decades, warning of impending dangers like smallpox, mosquito-borne viruses and swine flu.

So is Osterholm's op-ed a "clarion call to action" or nothing but "fearmongering", as one molecular virologist called it on Twitter?

If it's the former, we've been warned. If it's the latter, then it's fearmongering on some prime real estate - the opinion pages of the New York Times.
 

BREWER

Veteran Member
Posted for fair use and discussion.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/12/health-ebola-liberia-idUSL5N0RD4T720140912?rpc=401

U.S. to train Liberian armed forces to help tackle Ebola crisis

Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:29pm EDT
By Derick Snyder and Umaru Fofana


MONROVIA/FREETOWN, Sept 12 (Reuters) - The United States said on Friday it would train Liberia's security forces to assist in isolation operations to tackle an Ebola epidemic ravaging the West African nation, after a boy was killed when soldiers opened fire on a protest last month.

The worst Ebola outbreak on record has killed more than 2,400 people in West Africa - more than half of them in Liberia. Liberian officials have called the outbreak the greatest threat to national stability since a 1989-2003 civil war.

Many in the country, founded by descendants of freed American slaves, have looked to Washington for support, as they did during the civil war, which killed nearly 250,000 people.

The U.S. government has already committed around $100 million to tackle the outbreak by providing protective equipment for healthcare workers, food, water, medical and hygiene equipment.

U.S. Ambassador to Liberia Deborah Malac told reporters in Monrovia that the United States would support Liberia both through the epidemic and beyond.

"We're committed, as President Obama has said, to see this through to the end as well to address the lingering impact, especially on the economic side, that Liberia is expected to experience as the result of this outbreak," she said.

Liberian President Ellen Johnson Sirleaf faced criticism after troops fired live rounds at a protest over a quarantine imposed in the ocean-front slum West Point in the capital. A 15-year-old boy was fatally shot.

"We're going to be training the Liberian national police and the armed forces on how they can best support isolation operations and to provide security near hospitals, holding centres and treatment units," Malac said, without providing further details.

EVACUATION CALLS

With the death toll from Ebola in West Africa rising sharply in the last week, the World Health Organization (WHO) said on Friday at least 500 foreign experts were needed.

Medical charity Medecins Sans Frontieres (MSF) has also called on wealthy nations to send military medical teams to West Africa to boost healthcare systems that have been completely swamped by the disease.

Cuba on Friday announced that it would deploy 165 medical personnel to Sierra Leone next month, the largest contingent of foreign doctors and nurses committed so far.

The U.S. military said this week it will build a 25-bed, $22 million field hospital in Liberia to care for health workers infected with the virus. A Pentagon spokesman said it would be built by the U.S. military and handed over to Liberians to run.

France has also said it would deploy 20 specialists in biological disasters to its former colony Guinea. Britain will also build and operate a 62-bed hospital in Sierra Leone.

MSF has said, however, the pledges by Western government represent just a fraction of the beds required to cope with the disease. It estimates that hundreds of additional beds are needed in Monrovia alone, where Ebola patients have been turned away from overflowing clinics.

In Sierra Leone, calls grew for a local doctor infected with Ebola to be medically evacuated to Europe after several foreign healthcare workers were flown out for treatment overseas. Dr Olivette Buck, who ran a health centre in a western suburb of Freetown, was the fourth Sierra Leonean doctor infected.

"We have already lost three doctors (and) with our already limited amount of doctors and health workers we cannot afford to lose another one," Muctar Turay, leader of the group WeCare Sierra Leone, told Reuters.

Including nurses and other staff, over 30 health workers have died of Ebola in Sierra Leone since the outbreak began.

Ibrahim Ben Kargbo, an adviser to President Ernest Bai Koroma, said the government was "seriously looking into the matter" and a decision would be taken soon.

(Writing by Daniel Flynn; Editing by Hugh Lawson)

===========

Pixie's Comment:

They're not going to build the needed beds and staff them. If that was going to happen, it should have, and would have, already happened. So the priority has changed.

They're going to enforce isolation as best they can and try to save some of the country.

Remember our wildest, most fantastical, prognostications for a high-CFR pandemic back at Old Yeller, our thoughts on how, worst case scenario, Island North America, if it had been breached, might be saved? That may be about to happen in Liberia.


ETA: And that's the longest I've ever sat with my finger on the send button before hitting it.
 

BREWER

Veteran Member
Posted for fair use and discussion. Sheep sleep time...
http://time.com/3342305/airbone-ebola-not-happening/?

Airborne Ebola Is Extremely Unlikely, Expert Says
Alexandra Sifferlin @acsifferlin 4:16 PM ET


On Friday morning, the New York Times published an op-ed from infectious disease expert Michael T. Osterholm of the University of Minnesota called “What We’re Afraid To Say About Ebola.” In the piece, Osterholm addresses the dangerous possibility that Ebola, which is currently spread via direct contact with infected bodily fluids, could mutate and become transmittable through the air.

Osterholm is right in saying that possibility would be terrifying, but other experts say he’s off-base when it comes to how likely that situation is—and how concerned infectious disease experts should be about it.

“I am asked this often,” says Dr. Anthony Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID). “The answer is always going to be ‘yes , it’s possible,’ but then people wind up in a panic. Practically speaking, it is not likely. I could never tell the New York Times editorial board that they’re wrong because it’s not impossible. But it’s very unusual for a virus to change how it’s transmitted.”

Viruses mutate and change—no one is arguing with that. When a virus infects a lot of people, it has more opportunities to replicate, and therefore more opportunities to mutate. However, Fauci explains, the overwhelming majority of these mutations are irrelevant. Among the minority that are relevant, there are several changes that are much more likely than a new type of transmission. For instance, a virus could mutate and become resistant to the drugs used to treat it. It could mutate and become more virulent. It could mutate and spread easier. But to mutate and completely change how it transmits from one person to another, while not impossible, is very unusual.

Take HIV. It’s infected around 77 million people and killed around 35 million and it’s constantly replicating in the millions of people currently infected. “Of all the years we’ve known HIV, and with all the replication and mutation, it has never changed its transmission,” says Fauci.

In his op-ed, Osterholm cites a 2012 study in which researchers were able to show in a lab setting that a strain of Ebola could spread in the air from pigs to monkeys. It should be noted, that the virus did not then spread from monkey to more monkeys. Not to mention, the lab setting for this scenario was important. “You can make almost anything happen in the lab,” says Fauci.

“Is it at the back of my mind? Yes. I will watch out for it as we follow the evolution of the virus,” he says. “But that is not the paramount issue on my mind because it’s fundamentally unlikely.”

============

Pixie's Comment:

Ok, that's a reasonable response. But curious minds want to know: what IS the paramount issue on your mind, Dr. Fauci?
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
In his op-ed, Osterholm cites a 2012 study in which researchers were able to show in a lab setting that a strain of Ebola could spread in the air from pigs to monkeys. It should be noted, that the virus did not then spread from monkey to more monkeys. Not to mention, the lab setting for this scenario was important. “You can make almost anything happen in the lab,” says Fauci.

Except, he apparently isn't aware (or doesn't want to discuss) of the Reston Virginia episode, where monkeys IN SEPARATE ROOMS, being cared for with utmost care to prevent transmission by caretakers, had Ebola spread between them. There is almost no possible scenario that *doesn't* include airborne (NOT droplet) transmission in Reston...

Summerthyme
 

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
The official reinfection rate must be terrifyingly higher than 1.7 people infected from every person contagious, they seem to be lying through their teeth. Most people live in crowded slums with three generations of family sharing one or two rooms. One guy (on the NYTimes? video) was hanging around the hospital praying for his mother and sister to live SINCE HE HAD ALREADY LOST 14 OTHER FAMILY MEMBERS TO EBOLA and so far, only he has recovered!!
 

BREWER

Veteran Member
So, for people who think "ebola is an African thing, we don't need to worry" Here is how easy it would be to get here:

I carpool my daughter and 2 girls in our neighborhood to volleyball practice several times a week. One of the girls is of African decent. Her grandmother had been here visiting last year for like 6 months or so, and went back home sometime around May I think. I noticed a few days ago that she was back. I had no idea where in Africa they were from so while driving them to school just now I asked the girl where her grandmother lives in Africa. Nigeria. I asked when she got back here and she said about a week ago.

I asked her questions about if she had mentioned that people were getting worried or things like that. She said that was why she came back here, because though she didn't live in the area were the outbreak was, that people were starting to worry. She said her grandmother said they scanned people for temperatures at the airport but that is all (This from a 14 year old so who knows)

So anyway, just that fast, I was sitting in a car with someone who lives with someone who was in Nigeria up until a week ago.

Greetings, closet squirrel: I must say this is disturbing. It certainly brings home how close we all are to potential infection/transmission.
I trust you will need to consider alternative carpooling or volleyball needs to be canceled. No sport is worth that risk. Good luck. Take care. BREWER
 

kittyknits

Veteran Member
Well crap.

Every Thursday is lunch at the local Senior Center. Guests are welcome, usually family members. Today the guests were a mom and her 3 young children (or, if you will, a daughter and 3 grandkids). Missionary, just back from... West Africa. Guinea.

There's a fall festival here this weekend which is why, I assume, they are here and not at their home, in Iowa. Here being - small town, southwest ND.

Stay home. Seriously. Have they been in a 21-day quarantine? We all need to be vigilant and strict. Guinea is one of the really bad spots.
 

ittybit

Inactive
One of the reasons the current CFR is "only" 51% is because of the trailing nature of the deaths in relationship to the new cases which are exploding the numbers. If you took the current 4700 of which 2350 where new cases from the most recent two week period, many of those newly confirmed cases have not yet had time to reach terminus either as recovered or dead. From another chart I have seen using a standard statistical adjustment the current CFR is about 80% give or take. On that chart the number has ranged from 70% to 90% over the past few months.

And one has to review and consider that a doubling of cases every 2 weeks means an R0 of 4 M-O-M. Just last week the discussed doubling period as 3 weeks, now (a week later) its two weeks. At some point we have to ask if a new transmission route has emerged (airborne). This will probably be the ONLY hint that it has gone airborne (ie - a sudden explosion in the 'second derivative' behavior - or a continuing upward change in the rate of change).
 
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