CRIME Wisconsin boy, 10, killed mom over VR headset

[Kewpie]

Well, you DO mean to pry actually. You’ve only been here a year and I don’t know you. So I won’t volunteer additional information.

If I meant to pry, I would have demanded info. Or manipulated, but I 100% respect the boundary. I wasn’t sure if this was something you had been open about or not, which is why I asked. I haven’t been here long, so just didn’t know if it was openly discussed or not.

And really, it’s just my own interest in psychiatry and how the brain works. I would have become a psychiatrist or therapist, but after hearing my SILS stories (her specialty is children, pain management, and addiction, and when the collide it’s the saddest stories I’ve ever heard), I’m not sure my psyche could take hearing some of that stuff on a regular basis. FAR too much empathy.

I’m hoping everything worked out well for your family in the end. With early intervention, almost ALL behavior anomalies can be mitigated or managed.

 

[mzkitty]

So, you believe all that…and never once considered this child may be a victim of some pedophile, MK Ultra, mind poisoning conspiracy, OR is a victim of adult victims/perpetrators that warped him? No? We just jump straight to punishment instead of a deep dive investigation?

This is why I can’t take modern CTers seriously. They stopped valuing REAL research in favor of watching youtube channels that ‘told’ them the truth, or blogs who ‘summarize’ the truth, you know, for their own good to save them time and all…

He murdered his own mother, and was cruel to an animal. Sorry, no second chances after something like that. I don't care what the excuse is.

 

[Kewpie]

I am fairly certain the child is a victim in various ways. Our society is geared that way now. In case you didn't notice, I did try doing a little research. A little hard when you can't even find the names of the people involved. But I care not to spend hours digging this out... for what reason would I do that? I would expect a news report to give the pithy information, and not just emotional blather, uhh... kind of like you are doing now.

You tried doing online research, but due to mob mentality and anonymity bravado, it’s no longer safe to report details anymore. Suffice it to say, that other people who are close to the situation and actual professionals probably ARE investigating further, rather than just take the ‘lock ‘em up and throw away the key’ approach or ‘kill it now’ approach.

It’s just disturbing how many people are co-signing for the murder of a child or incarcerating him with GROWN EVIL MEN (and you know exactly what I’m referring to) for something we don’t even know the details of.

 

[Kewpie]

He murdered his own mother, and was cruel to an animal. Sorry, no second chances after something like that. I don't care what the excuse is.

So, for example, the little girl who exhibited the same behavior: they found a tumor on her brain, but after surgery and therapy, she became a normal child, graduated high school, and by all appearances, is having a happy and healthy life.

You’re telling me, they should have just killed her or incarcerated her, rather than seeking 3rd, 4th, 5th opinions?

This is the reason why the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world. :facepalm:

 

[toxic avenger]

Since the beginning of humanity, bad eggs were brutally stopped in their tracks in the most severe and irreversible way because even prehistoric humans knew defective people exist and that was the only way to stop them. “Evolved” society has just proven once again that society isn’t really better, just window dressed a little prettier.

The asylums of the past need to be brought back and the electric chairs need to be frying 24/7 to reverse the bad course our society has been going the last 50 years

 

[LightEcho]

With early intervention, almost ALL behavior anomalies can be mitigated or managed.

All behavior anomalies ARE being mitigated or managed in some way now. Modern psychiatry seems to have followed the same path as modern medicine: pharmakeia. When desired behavior is lacking, drug them more.

At some point you have to admit when a limb is gangrenous.

 

[Melodi]

Changed how?

What would have prevented this murder, and any and all subsequent evil, except to terminate it.

Don’t be over come by evil, but overcome evil with good…a good sedative and then he’s God’s to judge.

Well, perhaps an actual working and accessible system of mental health options could have been accessed as soon as the child started torturing the family pets.

As it is, the guy that nearly shot up congress (and killed I think a security guard) ended up being committed and hushed up because it turned out his parents had tried for over twenty years to get the State to do something. They were terrified he would hurt or kill someone, and there was a long-long list of their attempts to get the police, the health system, and anyone to get him committed or at least under mandatory treatment. They had finally kicked him off their farm after he shot and killed the family barn cats the day before - he then drove to DC and tried to shoot up congress killing one person.

It was quietly and quickly dealt with by having him committed to a hospital for the criminally insane when it was realized a trial was going to bring out the decades of refusal by the State medical and mental health systems to do ANYTHING because well, he hadn't killed anyone yet.

I am not saying this child would have been prevented from killing his own mother, but he might have been in there was any easy access to proper mental health care, which today almost no one but the very wealthy can access, and even then it is often simply a nice holding cell with heated towels.

 

[LightEcho]

So, for example, the little girl who exhibited the same behavior: they found a tumor on her brain, but after surgery and therapy, she became a normal child, graduated high school, and by all appearances, is having a happy and healthy life.

You’re telling me, they should have just killed her or incarcerated her, rather than seeking 3rd, 4th, 5th opinions?

This is the reason why the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world. :facepalm:

Relax dude, or dudette. Due process.

 

[LightEcho]

You tried doing online research, but due to mob mentality and anonymity bravado, it’s no longer safe to report details anymore. Suffice it to say, that other people who are close to the situation and actual professionals probably ARE investigating further, rather than just take the ‘lock ‘em up and throw away the key’ approach or ‘kill it now’ approach.

It’s just disturbing how many people are co-signing for the murder of a child or incarcerating him with GROWN EVIL MEN (and you know exactly what I’m referring to) for something we don’t even know the details of.

You clearly live by and are ruled by your emotions which are playing off your misunderstandings. Good luck with that.

 

[Dennis Olson]

I’m hoping everything worked out well for your family in the end. With early intervention, almost ALL behavior anomalies can be mitigated or managed.

It did NOT end well. Early intervention started at age seven. You can’t get much earlier than that. He spent another 18 months as a guest of the state starting at about 15, when he crowbarred his way through our deadbolted steel bedroom door, and stole two handguns and 100 rds of ammo, then headed for the Mall of America.

You some kind of social worker?

 

[Kewpie]

Relax dude, or dudette. Due process.

Not sure if you’ve read this thread, but many people are asking for suspension of due process.

All behavior anomalies ARE being mitigated or managed in some way now. Modern psychiatry seems to have followed the same path as modern medicine: pharmakeia. When desired behavior is lacking, drug them more.

At some point you have to admit when a limb is gangrenous.

In MANY instances, sociopathy, psychopathy, there IS no pharmaceutical treatment. For things like bipolar and schizophrenia, there are. Drugs are not the end all be all. If you’ve ever worked with abused animals, the approach is the same. Drugs may work to manage initially, but if you’re not doing behavioral therapy simultaneously, they’re useless in the long run.

Just because your opinion is that ‘drug it’ is always the answer, doesn’t mean you are educated on the issue. That stereotype is perpetuated by humans who want an immediate solution with little work. In almost ALL instances, behavioral modification therapy is at least recommended. People CHOOSE not to follow recommendations.

 

[Kewpie]

It did NOT end well. Early intervention started at age seven. You can’t get much earlier than that. He spent another 18 months as a guest of the state starting at above 15, when he crowbarred his way through our deadbolted steel bedroom door, and stole two handguns and 100 rds of ammo.

You some kind of social worker?

I’m honestly VERY sorry for your experience, it sounds heartbreaking, and I don’t expect or need any details. Not everyone can be saved, and too often, people lack the skills to deal with that depth of mental Illness. You can shoulda/coulda/woulda it to death, but you can’t change the past. I’ve had that experience firsthand too many times.

Social worker, oh HELL no. You couldn’t pay me enough for that job. Set up for failure from the beginning.

I’m just a mom with a huge streak of empathy, who experienced my own mental break in my younger years, and witnessed my sister be victimized by a state mental institution a few weeks after giving birth. She was trying to get help for PPD, but because she was poor (on Medicaid) no one bothered to really HELP her, they just wrote a prescription, wrote her off, and many of those scrips were contraindicated.

 

[LightEcho]

Not sure if you’ve read this thread, but many people are asking for suspension of due process.

In MANY instances, sociopathy, psychopathy, there IS no pharmaceutical treatment. For things like bipolar and schizophrenia, there are. Drugs are not the end all be all. If you’ve ever worked with abused animals, the approach is the same. Drugs may work to manage initially, but if you’re not doing behavioral therapy simultaneously, they’re useless in the long run.

Just because your opinion is that ‘drug it’ is always the answer, doesn’t mean you are educated on the issue. That stereotype is perpetuated by humans who want an immediate solution with little work. In almost ALL instances, behavioral modification therapy is at least recommended. People CHOOSE not to follow recommendations.

The only lack of due process I saw was your allegations.

Drugs are the final solution for all medical and psychiatric dead ends. Can't fix em, drug em. In case you haven't noticed, ALL of society is bathed in behavior modification therapy. TV, commercials, movies, radio, advertisements, school programs, "news" reports, government programs, etc. The programs smothering the world are programming the de-programmers. But you seem to think that is fine.

At some point, you need to realize the battle is between good and evil, God and rebels, law and destruction. If you think there are no evil people then you have much to learn.

 

[mzkitty]

So, for example, the little girl who exhibited the same behavior: they found a tumor on her brain, but after surgery and therapy, she became a normal child, graduated high school, and by all appearances, is having a happy and healthy life.

You’re telling me, they should have just killed her or incarcerated her, rather than seeking 3rd, 4th, 5th opinions?

This is the reason why the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world. :facepalm:

One out of how many have brain tumors? Not very many, I'd wager.

 

[Meemur]

I once read that the Classical Greeks of history would execute a kid like this.

Yep. And I agree: eye for an eye. He willfully killed his mother: death penalty. That will also remove his DNA from the gene pool.

 

[Kewpie]

One out of how many have brain tumors? Not very many, I'd wager.

Good question. It’s such a small segment of society, and there are quite a few long term studies currently happening. There’s really no telling. It’s not usually ONE single thing that contributes to the behavior, but several, and it has to be a perfect storm of events to create a perfect monster. You could have the same brain tumor and not experience that kind of rage, have the same childhood and not experience that kind of rage, but when you pair tumor + childhood, it MIGHT cause that. Or…might not. There’s still so much of human behavior and the brain that is an absolute mystery. But why immediately write off any person exhibiting that behavior than taking time to give them a full medical and psychological evaluation, as SO MANY people here advocate doing?

 

[Kewpie]

Yep. And I agree: eye for an eye. He willfully killed his mother: death penalty. That will also remove his DNA from the gene pool.

Classical Greeks also had men taking young boys as lovers, eating poop was a medical prescription, wiped with rocks, and had penis parades.

Maybe not all their ideas were the greatest, ya know?

 

[Hfcomms]

Bonafide psychopathy right there. Knew what he was doing, emotionally detached from what he did and after killing his mom went online to order what he wanted. He needs not only to be locked up but needs to stay locked up.

 

[mzkitty]

Good question. It’s such a small segment of society, and there are quite a few long term studies currently happening. There’s really no telling. It’s not usually ONE single thing that contributes to the behavior, but several, and it has to be a perfect storm of events to create a perfect monster. You could have the same brain tumor and not experience that kind of rage, have the same childhood and not experience that kind of rage, but when you pair tumor + childhood, it MIGHT cause that. Or…might not. There’s still so much of human behavior and the brain that is an absolute mystery. But why immediately write off any person exhibiting that behavior than taking time to give them a full medical and psychological evaluation, as SO MANY people here advocate doing?

Because there are SO MANY, who for whatever reason (and some say it was Satan) that are amongst us today.

They kill many people. How many are still out there, just waiting for their chance to be mass murderers?

You know the answer to that.

 

[Red Baron]

Ever notice how many times the mistreatment of animals, at an early age, is associated with people who murder later in life?

 

[Cardinal]

Classical Greeks also had men taking young boys as lovers, eating poop was a medical prescription, wiped with rocks, and had penis parades.

Maybe not all their ideas were the greatest, ya know?

No one is claiming they were culture geniuses but they created an enduring philosophy of governance and may have known something about how to deal with genetic defects.

 

[Kewpie]

Because there are SO MANY, who for whatever reason (and some say it was Satan) that are amongst us today.

They kill many people. How many are still out there, just waiting for their chance to be mass murderers?

You know the answer to that.

That’s an interesting way of looking at it. Of the percentage of people who have the capability of being mass murderers (for whatever reasons) how many have:
1. Gone through with it.
2. Haven’t been presented with the right opportunity but would.
3. Have been presented with the opportunity but didn’t take it.

Really no way to apply appropriate l parameters for that kind of data collection, but it would be really interesting if we could!

 

[Kewpie]

Ever notice how many times the mistreatment of animals, at an early age, is associated with people who murder later in life?

Most people deem that ‘empathy’. Very young children are not capable of empathy (I.e hitting/biting) but develop it later. It can be delayed and the extent it develops (or is later influenced) can vary drastically.

But it’s not uncommon for children who mistreat animals to gain empathy and outgrow the behavior, likewise it’s not uncommon for people with little to no history of cruelty to animals become murderers later in life. Again, same questions, nature vs. nurture, and the scope to execute or suppress their desires.

 

[Walrus Whisperer]

It's an animal. Put it down now.

 

[West]

Ever notice how many times the mistreatment of animals, at an early age, is associated with people who murder later in life?

Why making a kid kill skin, gut and then cook and eat a small legal animal should be a requirement, even before age 10. Also catch fish, clean and cook, etc....

It just puts things into perspective. Kids don't value life cause today life has no value, you just get it from the stores, etc....

It's mind set!

Just saying.

 

[packyderms_wife]

Not necessarily. I believe this kid is psychotic (Schizophrenia? hears voices) or demonically possessed, if you want to go "old School" with this.
Not every other kid is.
Some just lack a daddy to warm their hide.
I once read that the Classical Greeks of history would execute a kid like this.

Most societies of yore would execute a kid like this, even our ancestors knew that a child so evil could not be fixed!

 

[Countrymouse]

I doubt this kid will do anything but live his life out in a psych ward for the criminally insane. Or at least he will if society wants to prevent a serial killer from forming. He is already a cold-blooded killer of one.

There aren't any, anymore.

The mentally ill are put in with the regular prison population.

The DAMocrats made sure ALL mental institutions were shut down beginning in the late 70's, and by the end of the 80's.

Due to these bleeding-heart liberals thinking they're "freeing" the "poor oppressed mentally ill"--they basically sent millions of people with the minds of 2-year-olds out into the cold to fend for themselves--and have left families with mentally-ill children--some of whom they are afraid of because they KNOW they have DANGEROUS issues---with NO WHERE TO SEEK HELP for their loved one.

See smokin's thread about this: HEALTH - New York mayor plans to hospitalize mentally ill people involuntarily

And remember:

"The boy, who family members said has mental health issues, is being held in juvenile detention."

 

[Cardinal]

Why making a kid kill skin, gut and then cook and eat a small legal animal should be a requirement, even before age 10. Also catch fish, clean and cook, etc....

It just puts things into perspective. Kids don't value life cause today life has no value, you just get it from the stores, etc....



Just saying.

I would counter that by suggesting that every kid should be forced to help a Veterinarian sew up an injured animal. And then nurse that creature back to health.

 

[GB Appling]

Biblical Law allows the death penalty. Follow through.

 

[West]

I would counter that by suggesting that every kid should be forced to help a Veterinarian sew up an injured animal. And then nurse that creature back to health.

Good idea!

But still at the vary least catch, gut and cook-eat a fish!

 

[Hfcomms]

Biblical Law allows the death penalty. Follow through.

No matter how heinous the crime you don’t execute a child unless you wish to find yourself in the company of those who do like the Taliban. God is just and he will execute judgement in the end. A child is not held to account like an adult of full age is and even adults of full age who are adjudicated as criminally insane are not executed as they are deemed not able to be held to account due to their mental status.

An adult found to be of sane mind who commits a premeditated capital crime may be held to account by the death penalty by the State and this indeed is biblical….but not a child of tender years and not someone who was not mentally competent. One might also consider that with the same judgement you use can be rendered against you as well and this is also biblical. Mercy triumphs judgement and all circumstances need to be considered.

 

[ShadowMan]

I don't know Hfcomms.....we shoot rabid animals. There's something that just ain't right in the head with that lad.

 

[GB Appling]

No matter how heinous the crime you don’t execute a child unless you wish to find yourself in the company of those who do like the Taliban. God is just and he will execute judgement in the end. A child is not held to account like an adult of full age is and even adults of full age who are adjudicated as criminally insane are not executed as they are deemed not able to be held to account due to their mental status.

An adult found to be of sane mind who commits a premeditated capital crime may be held to account by the death penalty by the State and this indeed is biblical….but not a child of tender years and not someone who was not mentally competent. One might also consider that with the same judgement you use can be rendered against you as well and this is also biblical. Mercy triumphs judgement and all circumstances need to be considered.

idk I read in a book one time a quote to consider...."Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place....And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you..."

 

[jward]

Rule o' thumb is to wait to pull out the SJW screeds until an actual argument to the contrary is presented- otherwise it sorta just looks like a preconceived agenda being trotted out in a knee jerk fashion. :: shrug ::

Ever notice how many times the mistreatment of animals, at an early age, is associated with people who murder later in life?

Well, yeah. It's part of the triad, though the latest, most fashionable schools o' thought have begun to walk that tell back some- but I wouldn't.

..what strikes me, and this is purely ancedotal, and thus worthless in any actually useful discussion, is how often we're seeing these outlier damaged children in the WI area. The thin man (?) girls come to mind, for instance.


-

 

[Meemur]

..what strikes me, and this is purely ancedotal, and thus worthless in any actually useful discussion, is how often we're seeing these outlier damaged children in the WI area. The thin man (?) girls come to mind, for instance.

Few to no mental health services or social workers to intervene, and some families keep their "bad seeds" to themselves in hopes the child will "outgrow" the problem. In past days, I think more relatives intervened with "fatal farm accidents" if the bad seed got too out of control, but not all of them did.

Even now, I've heard kids being warned to stay away from "Cousin Eddie" (not his real name) who "isn't quite right in the head." So the parents are aware that there is a potential problem. I suspect that happens a lot across the Midwest.

 

[jward]

I agree that in the past there was more personal responsibility, up to and including, eliminating the irredeemable and criminally dangerous from the pool.

Not sure that MH services are lacking in WI, that good ole boy/MN nice/Luthern esthetic was alive and well in WI too and reflected in their efforts.

 

[Hfcomms]

idk I read in a book one time a quote to consider...."Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place....And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you..."

Judge how you wish to be judged. Do you want God to render unto you what you deserve or do you want him to show mercy to you? I choose mercy as I need it.

No excuses and the child needs to be held to account for his crimes….but he is a child. Do you believe that God will condemn someone that is not of a sound mind or competent for their actions? Pretty telling if one believes that even carnal men representing a carnal government show more mercy to children and the insane than what we ascribe to the almighty.

 

[MMWW]

I worked with disturbed children in a mental hospital, ages 4-12. About half got better. Half didn't, no matter what.

 

[Kewpie]

Judge how you wish to be judged. Do you want God to render unto you what you deserve or do you want him to show mercy to you? I choose mercy as I need it.

No excuses and the child needs to be held to account for his crimes….but he is a child. Do you believe that God will condemn someone that is not of a sound mind or competent for their actions? Pretty telling if one believes that even carnal men representing a carnal government show more mercy to children and the insane than what we ascribe to the almighty.

I believe the first part of that verse said something about the son being a glutton and a drunkard before stoning him. Or maybe it was a slovenly drunkard? Maybe they should check the scales, their cleanliness, and alcohol intake before calling judgement of others.

Sadly, too many people are eagerly anticipating some sort of great judgement. For everyone else, dontcha know. They may have made mistakes, but it’s everyone ELSE who should be punished for it.

It says a lot about people to read their takes on how a 10 year old child should be dealt with.

 

[coalcracker]

Stanton Samenow’s “Inside the Criminal Mind” is a classic book, and for good reason. It’ll change the way you think.

Some humans look at other humans as prey. It’s difficult for a person with normal psychological development to understand this, but it is a well documented fact. Samenow, and others, have been studying this for decades.

Once a person accepts the dark and calculated thinking inside a criminal mind as their starting point, they will immediately do two things:
1. Carry a firearm.
2. Advocate, as a minimum, for life sentences without parole for any perp who commits heinous sociopathic crimes.
Why?
Because evil is.

Quick subpoint:

Empathy developes very early in a human life. Normally around 2 years old. This 10 year old boy is way past that point. Call him a child if you want, but you’d be more correct to call him a sociopath.