WAR trouble brewing again in ukraine

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
The blockade of Maripol by sealing the Kerch Strait is an ACT OF WAR. RUSSIA AND THE UKRAINE ARE NOW AT WAR.
Biden's "State of Emergency with Russia" means the USA is also now in a state of defacto war with Russia. Cold war/lukewarm war whatever you want to call it.
It is only a matter of time before we go hot.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
And not any sign of awareness by the :sheep: biden has essentially declared war on Russia. I hit the Target with nobody acting unusual. I will go back and shop some more. Can you say supply chain disruptions?
A city full of liberals without a clue about anything out of the normal going on. Sheesh.
 

AlfaMan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Posted for fair use.....

Russian military vehicles with ‘invasion stripes’ descend on Ukraine border


By Jesse O’Neill


April 15, 2021 | 12:28am | Updated



Enlarge Image
Russian tanks sit on Russian-Ukrainian borderline on April 6, 2021.


Russian tanks sit on Russian-Ukrainian borderline on April 6, 2021. Reuters





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More than 100,000 Russian troops in assault vehicles painted with “invasion stripes” were headed to Ukraine’s border Wednesday, intensifying fears of war between the neighboring nations.

The advancing force includes 1,300 battle tanks, 3,700 drones, 1,300 artillery and mortar units and 380 multiple launch rocket systems, according to documents leaked to The Daily Mirror.

Tensions between the countries have been escalating following Russia’s annexation of Ukraine’s Crimea territory in 2014; an attempt by Moscow to keep NATO away from its borders. Ukraine is not a member of NATO, but support for the organization has risen in recent years, and the country is allied with many NATO nations — including the US.

Kyiv has claimed 14,000 people have died in the ongoing conflict, and many fear that Russian President Vladimir Putin believes that the COVID-19 pandemic is the right time to attack and control large parts of the country, according to the report.

The appearance of painted stripes on Russian armored vehicles headed to the frontlines reminded military experts of similar stripes on tanks used by the Soviet Army during the 1968 invasion of Czechoslovakia, The Mirror reports. The stripes are used as a deterrent to friendly fire.

Warships of the Russian Navy’s Caspian Sea flotilla sail on the waters that separate Russia and Ukraine on April 13, 2021.Russian Defence Ministry/AFP via

The military exercise could also be seen as a challenge to the US, as President Biden is expected to impose sanctions against Russia for election interference, hacking and bounties on troops in Afghanistan.

The Biden administration has sent warships to the Black Sea to defend against the military buildup, and Russia has warned the US to stand down.

The Kremlin has claimed it is offering protection to pro-Russian citizens in East Ukraine, warning of a return of “Nazi Europe,” according to the article.

I wouldn't be so worried about Russian invasion stripes on the tanks. People had best be concerned at the amount and thickness of the Chobram reactive armor on all those T-72s!!!!!!! The plates are layered around the turret; the part of the turret and the main body of the tank is a "trap" for well placed shells, guaranteed to pop the turret off like popping the head off a tick.
What's telling is the fact there's layered armor on top of the turret. On tanks the top of the turret is usually thinner than the rest of the turret; missiles like TOWs and Hellfires do a "pop up" and hit on top of the tank to guarantee kills.
Again, more proof the Russians are looking at taking the Ukraine but prepping for battle with US/NATO forces. Ukraine is the appetizer, eastern Europe/Baltics are the main course.
 

AlfaMan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Unless they still have one or two that are function, the Soviets did have nukes stationed there; but still working is the 64,000 Dollar Question (with a means of delivery).

The nuke warhead and bombs were either given back to the Russians in the 1996-2000 timeframe or escaped the view of our forces (who were the ones doing the destruction and verification of said nukes.........) There was also some HEU (highly enriched uranium-weapons grade) stuff that got missed.

Ukraine does have a large number of uranium mines in the country, as well as a pretty hefty source (about 160 metric tons) of uranium perfect for dirty bomb operations. And it's less than 100 miles north of Kiev.
Chernobyl folks, that's what I'm talking about. It's close to the border with Belarus, and Belarus lost 22% of the country's total arable land due to that exploding reactor. Add yet another reason for Belarus to be somewhat interested in gaining some land-help the Russians take over the country, get a free oblast or two to call their own on their borders.

Everything I've read on this subject today literally makes me want to vomit. This situation makes the Cuban missile crisis look like a walk in the park. And nobody in the MSM is making a squeak about it.
I guess people will know what's going on when the air raid sirens begin to whine.
 

toxic avenger

Senior Member
And nobody in the MSM is making a squeak about it.
I guess people will know what's going on when the air raid sirens begin to whine.
Sadly, the few people who MAY hear warning sirens are those near military bases, as base readiness offices receive the warning directly from Norad. There is no longer a civil defense officer in Cheyenne Mountain. The civil defense warning system is almost nonexistent. Most county public safety answering points no longer have the ability to activate an attack signal. Most communities no longer have working sirens capable of sounding a distinctive attack warning signal, and most people wouldnt know what to do anyway.
 

skwentnaflyer

Veteran Member
Sadly, the few people who MAY hear warning sirens are those near military bases, as base readiness offices receive the warning directly from Norad. There is no longer a civil defense officer in Cheyenne Mountain. The civil defense warning system is almost nonexistent. Most county public safety answering points no longer have the ability to activate an attack signal. Most communities no longer have working sirens capable of sounding a distinctive attack warning signal, and most people wouldnt know what to do anyway.

What's the difference between the tornado siren and attack siren? Communities in tornado country have warning sirens, and use them. They test them every month here.
 

toxic avenger

Senior Member
What's the difference between the tornado siren and attack siren? Communities in tornado country have warning sirens, and use them. They test them every month here.
The universal attack signal is 3 to 5 minute warbling (rising and falling) on a siren or short blasts on a horn. The tornado siren is usually a 3-5 minute steady siren or horn.

To complicate matters, this was never enforced so volunteer fire departments often use it for signaling their members.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
The USA has more tsunami warning sirens than civil defense ones. My personal favorite is the one on the Oregon Coast that they test with a cow mooing sound. :kaid:

I doubt most Americans would even realize we are under attack, much less have any time to deal with it.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
Anybody want to draw straws and watch a mainstream whore media, like ABC, or CBS, or NBC to see what the sheeple are ACTUALLY being told about the fact the USA is now in a de facto war with Russian and China? I can't watch them anymore, I turn psychotic. :hof:
 

EMICT

Veteran Member
Anybody want to draw straws and watch a mainstream whore media, like ABC, or CBS, or NBC to see what the sheeple are ACTUALLY being told about the fact the USA is now in a de facto war with Russian and China? I can't watch them anymore, I turn psychotic. :hof:
... are you saying that up until this post, you've actually watched them a lot?
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Closing prices for crude oil, gold and other commodities
Closing prices for crude oil, gold and other commodities, and foreign exchange levels

By The Associated Press
15 April 2021, 12:59

Benchmark U.S. crude oil for May delivery rose 31 cents to $63.46 a barrel Thursday. Brent crude oil for June delivery rose 36 cents to $66.94 a barrel.

Wholesale gasoline for May delivery rose 1 cent to $2.05 a gallon. May heating oil rose 1 cent to $1.90 a gallon. May natural gas rose 4 cents to $2.66 per 1,000 cubic feet.

Gold for June delivery rose $30.50 to $1,766.80 an ounce. Silver for May delivery rose 44 cents to $25.96 an ounce and May copper rose 9 cents to $4.22 a pound.

The dollar fell to 108.66 Japanese yen from 108.94 yen. The euro rose to $1.1975 from $1.1970.

Closing prices for crude oil, gold and other commodities - ABC News
 

Melodi

Disaster Cat
One thing that really bothers me is that while I'm pretty sure Russia is upping their civil defense, checking their bunkers (for normal people as well as VIPs) food supplies in shelters, etc, etc, the US isn't doing anything at least not for the average person.

Given the level of heat, at least looking at funding and re-upping the civil defense program would seem indicated as just good old common sense at this point. Also, a return to the intentional buying and storing of a percentage of the grain harvest, dairy, and other produce by Uncle Sam.

It can always be distributed as commodities (as it used to be) when it is about to go out of date, I'm not talking about the Federal Government buying everything, just a portion like they used to. That is put away some actually in public shelters and much of it in special storage for use to feed the civilian population in case of a nuclear war or other disasters.

That is no different than Joseph filling up the granaries during the seven fat years in preparation for the lean ones.
 

John Deere Girl

Veteran Member
One thing that really bothers me is that while I'm pretty sure Russia is upping their civil defense, checking their bunkers (for normal people as well as VIPs) food supplies in shelters, etc, etc, the US isn't doing anything at least not for the average person.

Given the level of heat, at least looking at funding and re-upping the civil defense program would seem indicated as just good old common sense at this point. Also, a return to the intentional buying and storing of a percentage of the grain harvest, dairy, and other produce by Uncle Sam.

It can always be distributed as commodities (as it used to be) when it is about to go out of date, I'm not talking about the Federal Government buying everything, just a portion like they used to. That is put away some actually in public shelters and much of it in special storage for use to feed the civilian population in case of a nuclear war or other disasters.

That is no different than Joseph filling up the granaries during the seven fat years in preparation for the lean ones.
The American people are on their own.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
They haven't done that for decades, Melodi. The USA has no civil defense in general public terms.
No public shelters, just look at hurricane response like Katrina. We are screwed. This naked to our enemies like civil defense or emp is intentional TREASON.
 

Melodi

Disaster Cat
They haven't done that for decades, Melodi. The USA has no civil defense in general public terms.
No public shelters, just look at hurricane response like Katrina. We are screwed. This naked to our enemies like civil defense or emp is intentional TREASON.
Oh, I know that I visit (or did) every year or two and also I've got folks here on the forum that have reported this. Heck, they had stopped doing most of it even by 1989 when I was in the San Francisco Earthquake much less all these years later.

But I'm saying that if there is a "real" national emergency over "Russia" as Biden is claiming, then the first obvious step would be to re-fund and re-mobilize civil defense. If nothing else, it gives the civilian population something to do for a while; some of the funding could be used for temporary jobs in selecting, creating, and stocking new (and older) shelters.

Of course, all of this is difficult both from a lack of funding and the whole "social distancing thing," but if there really is a full-out war, the US population needs to understand that this time it might not stay "over there."

Europe and the UK still have enough people alive who know this, and that was another thing that made the comparison between two back-to-back trips one to the US and the other to the UK in 2001 (just after 9/11) so stark.

At the time I remember Nightwolf saying, "that's because the Brits know what war on the homeland is actually like, they know it is terrible, they also know you just have deal with it and keep getting on with things as best you can and try to live through it."

Which explained the difference between what I called: "The Amazing Red White and Blue Christmas" hysteria and the "Oh Jolly Good, we're going to have a war, brace up and get a cup of tea, White Cliffs of Dover; Keep Calm, and Carry On."
 

Doughboy42

Veteran Member
They haven't done that for decades, Melodi. The USA has no civil defense in general public terms.
No public shelters, just look at hurricane response like Katrina. We are screwed. This naked to our enemies like civil defense or emp is intentional TREASON.
I have said it before. While there are plans for continuity of government, there are no plans for continuity of the governed.
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
WEAKNESS USA and green light to Russia to launch invasion? - CNN: Destroyers will not enter the Middle Sea dueto... fear of escalation - They remain in the
Aegean What were the Americans afraid of?


WarNews 247
April 15 2021
Translated from Greek

The likelihood of Russian aggression has increased dramatically in the last 24 hours. The Kremlin took Biden's phone call to Putin as a sign of weakness, and now Russia will probably act," russian analyst Poontkovsky said.

It is no coincidence that the US has decided to temporarily freeze the mission of the two US destroyers USS Donald Cook (DDG 75) and USS Roosevelt (DDG-80) in the Black Sea. The destroyers will remain in Souda and await further instructions.

CNN: Outside the Black Sea the two U.S. destroyers

"U.S. destroyers will remain out of the Black Sea for now as the move would mean escalation.

The ships will remain close to the Aegean region ready to respond if necessary,"
Pentagon officials told CNN.

Now that this move would mean "escalation" at a time when Putin has transferred half the Army to the Ukrainian border, only CNN knows. Also escalating is the imposition of sanctions and the expulsions of Russian diplomats announced just now by the White House.

They also state that:

"The Pentagon assessed Russian forces on the Ukrainian border and said they are not ready for offensive operations due to a lack of logistical support, fuel and medical capacity.

But this situation can change quickly. The evaluation is only valid for a few days.

"According to our estimate, Russia has transferred 40 Battalions and a total of 40,000 military forces along with anti-aircraft systems

There is no indication that Russia is reducing its forces or sending de-escalation signals. And the data on the ground could change quickly," CNN reported.


Finally, Ukroboronprom, Ukraine's defence industry, has announced that it is ready to double the production of war material for the Ukrainian Armed Forces.

NATO: Russia to withdraw troops

NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg today called on Russia to withdraw its troops from the border with Ukraine.

"NATO allies fully support Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity," Stoltenberg said after the joint talks of the foreign and defence ministers of the North Atlantic Alliance member states.

"We call on Russia to immediately de-escalation, to stop the pattern of aggressive provocations and to respect its international commitments," the Secretary-General added.

Αδυναμία ΗΠΑ και πράσινο φως σε Ρωσία για έναρξη εισβολής; – CNN: Τα αντιτορπιλικά δεν θα εισέλθουν στη Μ. Θάλασσα λόγω… φόβου κλιμάκωσης – Παραμένουν στο Αιγαίο - WarNews247
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
British journalist Graham Phillips: "People will die -Zelenski is naïve if he thinks he has NATO's backs" "The Russians will take it all the way"

WarNews 247
April 15 2021
Translated from Greek

For a dramatic escalation of tension, on the Ukraine-Russia border, which could cause a war conflict, says British journalist and filmmaker Graham Phillips, speaking to OREN TV.

Graham Phillips spent seven years in the Donbass war zone with Russian-speaking separatists.


He fears that with rivals the two superpowers, Russia and NATO, there will be a dramatic increase in civilian deaths while at least he considers the Ukrainian prime minister naïve, trusting westerners on the collision course with the Russians.

"People are going to die. Zelenski is naïve. If he thinks he has NATO's backs," he said characteristically, while answering the question what in his view is the worst-case scenario that can result from tension in the region he replied:

"There could be a lot of conflict, but the difference is that on donbass's part they certainly have Russia's support and it is certainly credible, whereas as far as Zelenski is concerned the question is whether he really has NATO support. And the last thing countries want coming out of the pandemic is to send soldiers to a conflict field."

Βρετανός δημοσιογράφος Γκράχαμ Φίλιπς: «Θα πεθάνει κόσμος -Ο Ζελένσκι είναι αφελής αν πιστεύει ότι έχει τις πλάτες του ΝΑΤΟ» (βίντεο) - WarNews247
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Will Ukraine be able to survive Russian attack?
By Illia Ponomarenko.
Kyiv Post
Published April 15. Updated April 15 at 9:28 pm

Iskander_RUMinOb_2sdsdsd-1200-800x520.jpg

Russian Iskander missiles systems presumably en route to the city of Voronezh on April 13, 2021.
Photo by Ministry of Defense of Russian Federation

What if Russia, defying reason, launches a larger-scale invasion of Ukraine?


If Russian mechanized convoys rush toward Kharkiv, their marine forces lay siege to the coastline between Odesa and Mykolaiv, and their special forces destroy missile defense radar stations deep in the rear?

This darkest hour would be the ultimate test for the nation’s seven-year drive to defend itself from the Kremlin.

Would Ukraine’s 250,000-strong armed forces and paramilitaries have a chance to survive the massive strike?

Many experts believe that despite all the unresolved problems that have haunted the Ukrainian military for years, the answer is still yes.

But this would be a David-versus-Goliath battle, in which Ukraine’s military can succeed only if it sheds its old Soviet doctrines and acts like a truly mobile and flexible force, making use of its homeland’s terrain and ensuring swift coordination among its elements.

If it doesn’t, Ukrainian defenses can be destroyed within a few days.

But if it succeeds, the Ukrainian military could foil Russian hopes for a blitzkrieg takeover, dragging the invaders into a war they can’t win and exposing the Kremlin to devastating global sanctions.

000_93978Y_a.jpg

A Ukrainian soldier walks along the trench on the front line of the war with Russia-backed separatists in Donetsk region on Feb. 16, 2021. (AFP)

Plans for war

According to the latest figures from Ukraine’s military intelligence directorate, Russia has deployed 89,000 troops in areas bordering eastern Ukraine and in Kremlin-occupied Crimea.

This is the largest concentration of Russian military power in the region since July 2014, when the Donbas war was in full swing, the directorate’s head, Colonel Kyrylo Budanov, reported to the Verkhovna Rada on April 14.

Ukrainian intelligence expects the continuing buildup to reach an estimated 110,000 troops before it ends on April 20.

It sees three possible options in the near future.

Russia may continue to saber-rattle for political gain without going on the offensive. It may invade and seize Ukraine’s southern regions to re-establish water supply to Crimea. And it may incite a major escalation of hostilities in Donbas to set up a casus belli.

Experts and former battlefield leaders polled by the Kyiv Post predicted three of the most dangerous and probable axes of Russian assault.

Russian forces can rush through Kharkiv Oblast, block the city of Kharkiv and continue all the way to Dnipro.

Simultaneously, they can strike in Donbas, driving towards Mariupol and on to Zaporizhia.

If successful, these two advances could cut off supplies to the 40,000 Ukrainian troops defending Donbas as well as other pockets of Ukrainian resistance, allowing them to be split and surrounded.

There’s also a possibility of an assault from Crimea towards Kherson, Mykolaiv, and Odesa, aimed at seizing key coastal infrastructure and cutting Ukraine off from the sea.

If this operation is to succeed, it must take no longer than one week. But if it works, it may bring Ukraine to its knees, forcing it into a devastating new reality, with the Kremlin dictating its future.

Rough chances

Ukraine’s chances don’t look great.

According to the Military Balance 2020 database, Ukraine can count on nearly 145,000 army troops, 8,000 airborne troops, 2,000 marines, and 102,000 paramilitary personnel (such as the National Guard and the Border Guard Service). According to Ukrainian authorities, the country has up to 200,000 experienced former combatants enlisted in its rapid response reserves.

It can also count on over 800 main battle tanks, over 1,100 infantry fighting vehicles, and nearly 1,800 artillery pieces.

While the invaders would be weaker in terms of raw manpower, Russia may enjoy air and sea superiority. Ukraine’s air force of nearly 125 combat-capable aircraft (including at least 30-year-old Mikoyan MiG‑29 and Sukhoi Su‑27 fighters) are no match for the air power of Russia’s Western and Southern Military Districts.

The Ukrainian navy consists of a handful of aging warships and patrol boats that aren’t expected to make much of a difference. Coastal defense depends on a number of 152-millimeter D‑20 howitzers and heavy 220-millimeter Uragan missiles. The Ukrainian program to deploy new coastal defense Neptune cruise missiles is still in its early stages.

The Ukrainian skies are also defended by over 300 surface-to-air missile systems, which include 250 aging S‑300P/PS/PT systems (NATO reporting name SA‑10 Grumble).

The standing army would require assistance from organized civilian militia in the rear. As of now, Ukraine formally deploys 25 weekend warrior brigades across the country. But its territorial defense grid is still embryonic, and it is often criticized for being chaotic and only there for show.

The 89,000 Russian troops near eastern Ukraine and in Crimea include two motorized infantry divisions, two rifle brigades, a marine, and an airborne brigade.

While this is a formidable force, some experts, such as defense journalist Yuriy Butusov, believe that the Russian group falls short of having sufficient operative reserves for a major offensive on Ukraine’s mainland.

Therefore, Butusov believes that this is a display of power rather than a real preparation for war.

ca980eb06d02edeb7490413e83baf33d_1607268984_extra_large_a.jpg

President Volodymyr Zelensky kneels next to the graves of Ukrainian soldiers killed in battle on the front line of the war in the Donbas on the Armed Forces Day on Dec. 6, 2020. (Presidential Press Service)

Mobile warfare

On the bright side, Ukrainians would have home-ground advantage. They would be more motivated than their enemies, who were brought in from somewhere in central Russia to fight a clearly unjust war away from home.

Besides, experts believe the invasion would trigger a massive self-mobilization of combat-hardened Donbas veterans and new volunteers from among the civilian population. Given the potential scale of hostilities, the surge of volunteers would definitely outshine that of the early days of Russia’s war in 2014.

The key to victory would depend on the Ukrainian forces’ ability to move and react quickly.

“Relying on static defense, erecting borderline anti-invasion barriers, painting ‘not-a-step-back’ lines on maps would be a fatal error,” says Viktor Vertsner, a Ukrainian-born Israel Army reserve officer and former volunteer firearms instructor for Ukraine’s National Guards.

“The assailant always enjoys the element of surprise, it would choose the place, the time, and the direction of its main and auxiliary strike. A defense barrier will be overwhelmed, and we’d get new death traps.”

Instead, Ukrainian forces should embrace mobile defense, making use of terrain, constantly harassing the Russians, coordinating their actions with air defense, artillery, and militias, and constantly trying to lure the enemy into killing zones.

“The goal behind such a campaign must be to make the enemy pay an unacceptable price,” Vertsner said.

“Hostilities will be halted as soon as this aim is accomplished.”

Glen Grant, a retired British Army colonel and former advisor for Ukraine’s Defense Ministry, also suggested putting an emphasis on mobility — and on greater freedom of action of combat units instead of the ineffective and slow Soviet-style highly-centralized command.

“This war, if it happens, will be won by maneuver, quick defense, flexible thinking of commanders, and stubborn resistance by soldiers of every level,” the retired officer said. “Senior commanders who are control freaks must be removed before the invasion starts. They will never accept the loss of control or think quickly enough.”

Despite years of NATO-style reforms and record-high budgets, Ukraine’s armed forces still suffer from poor service conditions, overwhelming bureaucracy, and Soviet-style mismanagement that has already forced tens of thousands of motivated career personnel to leave the ranks and return to civilian life.

Still, even in its current condition, the Ukrainian military is in better shape compared to 2014. If everything is done right, there is hope of defeating a new Russian invasion.

“The armed forces of (Ukraine) today are much better prepared and more experienced at most levels,” said retired Lieutenant General Ben Hodges, the U.S. Europe Army commanding officer from 2014–2017.

“If Russian forces were to in fact invade further, it would be extremely costly for them. There are, however, still problems that must be addressed: air and missile defense, electronic warfare capabilities, and secure communications are at the top of the list.”

Ukraine’s armed forces would have to fight as they are now, Grant added.

“There are no magic potions to make them better. But some practical things can be done,” he said.

“First of these is to give clear political direction that this war must be won. This must come from both the commander-in-chief and parliament. There must be no doubt in the mind of any officer or soldier or society, that if Putin decides to invade — he must lose.”

Will Ukraine be able to survive Russian attack? | KyivPost - Ukraine's Global Voice
 
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