ALERT RUSSIA INVADES UKRAINE - Consolidated Thread

Red Baron

Paleo-Conservative
_______________
Which is a DIRECT final warning to the West that Poland Germany etc. are now included in the very first round of tactical nuke targets. As well as probably some of the US bases in Europe.

If Putin does this - I have little doubt he will hit a plethora of targets to send a message to multiple entities to cease and desist assisting Ukraine.

If you think about it - it really doesn't matter at all WHICH targets he selects - as SOON as he tactically nukes anything - anywhere - everyone in the West is going to shit their pants and run around like the monumental idiots they clearly have proven to be suicidally determined to DO SOMETHING to stand up to Russia.

Real Men as leaders would take a series of strikes like that - realize they are primarily last ditch messages - and back the **** up - stand down their Ukraine assistance and avert the destruction of the entire planet.

But we don't have leaders like that do we ?

Who is to say when Russian adventurism will ever stop? Who ever said appeasement could work against a dictator?

Russia already took over Georgia, Crimea, and Donbass.

Russia's illegal and immoral invasion of the sovereign nation Ukraine has resulted in the near collapse of the Russian conventional armed forces.

Maybe Putin should be the one to know when to stop?
 

Grumphau

Veteran Member
One thing here: it's not necessarily "racist" for the Russians to recruit from far-off provinces. It may be thought that they will be less sympathetic to Ukrainians and more willing to fight. That is what the Chinese did in the Tianamen Square Incident; local Beijing troops would not fire on protestors so the CCP brought in troops from the provinces.
 

jward

passin' thru
Who is to say when Russian adventurism will ever stop? Who ever said appeasement could work against a dictator?

Russia already took over Georgia, Crimea, and Donbass.

Russia's illegal and immoral invasion of the sovereign nation Ukraine has resulted in the near collapse of the Russian conventional armed forces.

Maybe Putin should be the one to know when to stop?
Even if one buys into your premise 1001%, there is a compelling reason to look at the west/nato's "leaders" and say now is not the time to have this discussion, we, for the good of all, will wait till we can seat an adult or two at the table...
 

jward

passin' thru

Ukraine war: US says it takes Putin nuclear threat seriously​


By Patrick Jackson​


By Patrick Jackson
BBC News
Media caption,
White House says Vladimir Putin's threat is 'irresponsible'

The US is taking "seriously" Vladimir Putin's veiled threats to use nuclear weapons to defend areas in Ukraine, a top White House official told the BBC.
John Kirby said the US was not changing its "strategic deterrent posture", but that Mr Putin spoke irresponsibly.
On Wednesday Russia's leader warned his country would use all the means at its disposal to protect its territory.
It came as four Ukrainian regions part-occupied by Russian forces are about to stage snap votes on joining Russia.
Ukraine and its allies call these votes a sham exercise, designed to give spurious legitimacy to an illegal annexation.
"It is a dangerous precedent for Mr Putin to be using this kind of rhetoric in the context of a war clearly that he's losing inside Ukraine," National Security Council spokesman Mr Kirby told the BBC.
"We have to take these threats seriously and we do... We've been monitoring, as best we can, his nuclear capabilities, I can tell you that we don't see any indication that we need to change our strategic deterrent posture at this point."
He dismissed plans for Russia to annex further parts of Ukraine as "nothing more than a ploy by Vladimir Putin to try to gain... through politics and electoral issues, that which he cannot gain militarily".
"But it's not going to work," he said. "No one's going to recognise it. And what needs to happen is Mr Putin needs to leave Ukraine. He needs to stop this war."
Russia's conduct in Ukraine was strongly condemned at a special meeting of the UN Security Council in New York on Thursday.

"This week, President Putin said Russia wouldn't hesitate to use 'all weapon systems available' in response to a threat to its territorial integrity - a threat all the more menacing given Russia's intention to annex large swathes of Ukraine in the days ahead..." said US Secretary of State Anthony Blinken.
"This from a country that in January of this year joined the other permanent members of the Security Council in signing a statement affirming that 'nuclear war can never be won and must never be fought'."
Former Russian leader Dmitry Medvedev said in a statement on social media on Thursday that the means by which Russia would defend itself included "strategic nuclear weapons".
But Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov accused some Security Council members of trying to impose a false narrative on Moscow's operations in Ukraine, and restating allegations that ethnic Russians had been persecuted by Ukrainian government forces.

"There's an attempt today to impose on us a completely different narrative to show Russian aggression as the origin of all the tragedy," Mr Lavrov said.
"This ignores the fact that for over eight years the Ukrainian army and fighters from the nationalist formations killed and continue to kill inhabitants of [the east Ukrainian region of] Donbas with impunity simply because they refused to recognise the results of the coup d'etat in Kyiv. They decided to uphold their rights, which were guaranteed by the Ukrainian Constitution, including the right to freely use Russian, their mother tongue."
Russia attempts to justify its invasion by saying it is fighting neo-Nazis, a claim widely dismissed by the international community, as well as resisting Nato expansion.

In his speech on Wednesday, President Putin also announced a call-up for reservists in a move analysts say is a sign that Russia's forces in Ukraine are struggling to hold on to the strip of territory they occupy in the east and south.
Queues have sprung up along Russia's borders as men attempt to leave the country to avoid the draft.

 

mecoastie

Veteran Member
Watched a youtuber out of Moscow confirm yesterday that besides pulling students out of their classes, the security forces are pulling men right out of their office doing their jobs and taking them straight away to be inducted.

This started shortly after the announcement from Putin showing they had the lists already made up and ready to go.
I am assuming these are all men with prior service and are part of the reserves. They must be afraid they will try to bail if they are getting them at school and at work.
 

northern watch

Has No Life - Lives on TB

North Korea denies sending arms to Russia amid Ukraine war​

North Korea says it hasn’t exported any weapons supplies to Russia during the war in Ukraine and has no plans to do so in the future
By KIM TONG-HYUNG Associated Press
September 21, 2022, 11:47 PM

WireAP_cfba85906bc948809744ee599e44655f_16x9_992.jpg


SEOUL, South Korea -- North Korea says it hasn’t exported any weapons to Russia during the war in Ukraine and has no plans to do so, and said U.S. intelligence reports of weapons transfers were an attempt to tarnish North Korea's image.

In a state media report Thursday, an unnamed North Korean defense official told the U.S. to stop making “reckless remarks” and to “keep its mouth shut.” Biden administration officials earlier this month confirmed a declassified U.S. intelligence assessment that Russia was in the process of purchasing arms from North Korea, including millions of artillery shells and rockets, as Moscow attempts to ease severe supply shortages in Ukraine worsened by U.S.-led export controls and sanctions.

The North Korean statement came weeks after Moscow described the U.S. intelligence finding as “fake.”

North Korean arms exports to Russia would violate United Nations resolutions banning the country from importing or exporting weapons.

The North Korean official stressed that Pyongyang has never recognized the “unlawful” U.N. Security Council sanctions against the country “cooked up by the U.S. and its vassal forces.” The official said the export and import of military equipment is a “lawful right peculiar to a sovereign state,” according to an English translation of the statement published by the North’s official Korean Central News Agency.

“But we take this opportunity to make clear one thing. We have never exported weapons or ammunition to Russia before and we will not plan to export them,” said the official, who was described as a vice director general of the National Defense Ministry’s general equipment bureau.

“It is not sure from where the rumor originated which the U.S. is spreading, but it is aimed at tarnishing the DPRK’s image,” the official said, referring to the country’s formal name, the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea.

Facing sanctions and export controls, Russia in August bought Iranian-made drones that U.S. officials said had technical problems. Experts say North Korea, if willing, could become a major source of small arms, artillery and other ammunition for Russia, considering the compatibility of their defense systems based on Soviet roots.

North Korea has sought to tighten relations with Russia even as most of Europe and the West has pulled away, blaming the U.S. for the crisis and decrying the West’s “hegemonic policy” as justifying military action by Russia in Ukraine to protect itself.

The North Korean government has even hinted it is interested in sending construction workers to help rebuild pro-Russia breakaway regions in Ukraine’s east. In July, North Korea became the only nation aside from Russia and Syria to recognize the independence of the territories, Donetsk and Luhansk.


North Korea also has used the war as a window to accelerate its own arms development, testing dozens of weapons including its first long-range missiles since 2017, exploiting a divide in the U.N. Security Council, where Russia and China have blocked U.S. attempts to tighten sanctions on Pyongyang.

The North has punctuated its testing activity with repeated threats of nuclear conflict with Seoul and Washington. The latest was a law passed by Pyongyang’s rubber-stamp parliament this month that further enshrined the country’s status as a nuclear power and authorized the preemptive use of nuclear weapons over a broad range of scenarios where its leadership comes under threat.

Sung Kim, the Biden administration’s special representative for North Korea, met with South Korean counterpart Kim Gunn in Seoul on Thursday where they expressed “serious concern” over the North’s escalating nuclear doctrine spelled out in the new law, South Korea’s Foreign Ministry said.

The diplomats reaffirmed the U.S. commitment to defend South Korea in the event of a nuclear war with the full range of its military capabilities, including nuclear. The allies also maintained their months-old assessment that North Korea is gearing up to conduct its first nuclear test since 2017 and discussed “stern” countermeasures to such an action, the ministry said.

 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?

Russia is setting up a great war: Fleet Mobilization & Air Force in the Baltic – Call of reservists to Estonia and prime minister's address!​

The rest of the Baltic countries follow suit...​

23/09/2022 - 00:24
War News 24 / 7

We also have rapid developments in the Baltic as a series of military moves by Russia forces the states of the region to put their Armed Forces on the highest alert.

Already the fact that mobilization began and in Kaliningrad sounded the alarm.

Estonia has just made a start, as the Prime Minister of the country made an unusual and rare gesture to address the people about the situation with Russia.

The Estonian Armed Forces have been placed in a state of utmost readiness, while reservists are invited to present themselves for a readiness exercise.


Estonia is Russia's main target especially after the country's agreement with Finland to create a naval exclusion zone against the Russian Fleet.

Double exercise of the Baltic Fleet to protect and strike convoy...​

Immediately after the mobilization ordered by V. Putin, the Russian Baltic Fleet and the rest of the forces stationed in Kaliningrad were put on alert and began large exercises.

More than 15 ships participated in the Command and Staff Exercise of the Baltic Fleet, the naval air force and the ground forces of the Iskander ballistic systems were activated.

The ships and aviation of the Baltic Fleet carried out a large double exercise. 15 aircraft were reportedly also involved.
The Patrol Car Yaroslav the Wise, corvettes Stoiky and Soobrazitelny participated in an exercise to provide cover for a convoy in the Baltic Sea.

This was followed by exercises with naval strikes, search and rescue exercises as well as the impact of the ships of the Baltic Fleet.

Naval aircraft launched a missile attack on convoys and protection ships in the Baltic Sea.

Having received data on rocket launches from virtual enemy ships and the take-off of aircraft, the air defense systems of escort ships were put on alert, electronic warfare systems for camouflage for misinformation of the enemy were activated.

At the next stage of the exercise, the crews of the ships located and ranked the targets, and the anti-aircraft missile and artillery crews destroyed cruise missiles and virtual enemy aircraft in the most remote line of defense.

The purpose of the exercise was to elaborate the scenarios of guarding the convoy, repelling air attacks from a virtual enemy from various heights and conducting combat operations against surface ships.

The Baltic Fleet task forces, consisting of the Ships Odintsovo, Zeleny Dol, Sovetsk, Passat and Liven, and the vessels Chuvashia and Dimitrovgrad continue to perform tasks as part of the exercise.

The crews of the ships completed the tasks of searching for ships and locating a virtual enemy in the Baltic Sea. This was followed by electronic launches of the Kalibr, P-120 Malachite (4K85) and P-270 Moskit missile systems at the identified naval targets.

As a result of electronic launches, all the set targets were successfully hit.

During the performance of their duties, the crews of the ships carried out a series of exercises such as defense against sabotage while performing a set of measures for air defense, anti-ship and anti-submarine defense.

The pilots of the Baltic Fleet during the exercise tried to hit a convoy of a virtual enemy.

As part of the command and staff exercise of the Baltic Fleet forces, the crews of the Su-24M frontline tactical bombers and the Su-30SM fighters bombed surface targets in sea areas of the Baltic Sea.

A virtual enemy attempted a landing on a coast of the Kaliningrad region. Immediately a Su-24M was sent which preceded the main blow.

After locating the virtual enemy, Su-24M and Su-30SM aircraft took off along with Su-27 fighters that provided coverage.

In total, up to 15 bombers and multi-role fighters of the Baltic Fleet naval aviation participated in the exercise.

In the area there are also three MiG-31s with Kinzhal hypersonic missiles...

Address by the Prime Minister of Estonia​

In her address, the Prime Minister of Estonia, Kaya Callas, said the following:

"The mobilization announced in Russia did not change the image of the threat to us. Estonia is protected and will remain protected. We can all continue our daily activities calmly, knowing that Estonia is protected by our own defence forces and our allies in NATO and the European Union.

Dear people of Estonia, I am addressing you because in recent days they have brought news from the security front, which has raised questions among people. And I believe that in turbulent times for the world, it is necessary to talk directly about these issues.

Russia is holding fake referendums in Ukraine with the aim of annexing the occupied territories to Ukraine. Vladimir Putin threatens with nuclear weapons and announced a mobilization. It's meant to scare, and that's nothing new. There is currently no direct military threat against Estonia and we should not be discouraged.

On Thursday, the government decided to invite 2,861 reservists and defense allies to the additional training rally "Okas 2022". We have done such exercises in the past and we will definitely do it in the future.

This year's "Okas" has the distinction of being the biggest gathering we have ever organized. This means defensive capability – readiness and confidence that we know exactly what to do in the event of a crisis. We have a capable defensive force, a will to defend and world-class equipment. We exercise so that what we practice is never needed.


I thank all the families whose mother, father, brother, sister, son or daughter will help strengthen our defense in the coming days. And I thank all the employers for their understanding.

The announcement of the mobilisation in Russia has raised many questions among the people of Estonia. I assure everyone that the border between Estonia and Russia is protected. Estonia closed the border to Russian tourists as early as September 19. It was the right decision at the right time. Estonia is a home for our people, not for refugees coming from an aggressive country.

There are also people with Russian citizenship living in Estonia, who Putin will most likely call to war. I believe that no one who lives in Estonia and shares our values is ready to go to a criminal war against Ukraine. Democracy and freedom are values that everyone in Estonia knows their value and importance. We have a common future, a common security and a common home, let's focus on that.

If, however, there is anyone who is thinking of joining the Russian forces, my message is specific: do not go, because there is no turning back. Anyone who raises a gun against a free nation, a free Ukraine, also raises a gun against Estonia and commits a crime that we will not forgive.

Estonia supports Ukraine together with its Western allies unreservedly and for as long as necessary.

Dear Estonian citizens, let us remain calm in difficult times and take care of each other. Together we can overcome the difficult times.


Russia will try to divide our society. Hybrid-type attacks, cyberattacks are likely to occur...

I ask you to be ready and calm to face difficult situations, such as possible temporary power outages.


The armed forces of Finland and Lithuania are also on alert​

Finland is closely monitoring the situation in its neighbour Russia after Russian President Vladimir Putin today declared partial mobilisation, Finnish Defence Minister Andy Kaikkonen said.

"Regarding the areas around Finland, I can say that the military situation is stable and calm," Kaikkonen pointed out.

"Our armed forces are well prepared and we are closely monitoring the situation."
In increased readiness

At the same time, Lithuania announced that it had increased the readiness of its army's immediate response units "in order to prevent any provocation by the Russian side,"
according to the country's Defense Minister Arvindas Anushauskas.

"As Russia's partial mobilization also concerns the Kaliningrad region, Lithuania cannot just monitor," he added.

Well, a logical result, though still concerning.
 

jward

passin' thru
Which is a DIRECT final warning to the West that Poland Germany etc. are now included in the very first round of tactical nuke targets. As well as probably some of the US bases in Europe.

If Putin does this - I have little doubt he will hit a plethora of targets to send a message to multiple entities to cease and desist assisting Ukraine.

If you think about it - it really doesn't matter at all WHICH targets he selects - as SOON as he tactically nukes anything - anywhere - everyone in the West is going to shit their pants and run around like the monumental idiots they clearly have proven to be suicidally determined to DO SOMETHING to stand up to Russia.

Real Men as leaders would take a series of strikes like that - realize they are primarily last ditch messages - and back the **** up - stand down their Ukraine assistance and avert the destruction of the entire planet.

But we don't have leaders like that do we ?

And from Putin's standpoint - he can't back down because now HIS back is against the wall - because he KNOWS that if he backs down at this point - the West will carve Russia up like the world's most delicious turkey to extract the greatest supply of resources left on the planet.

Putin is ALL in on this hand.

If the West does not fold - we all DIE.

You really think two small provinces in Ukraine are worth that ?
I hear where yer coming from, and much appreciate the timely and serious analysis, but still think it may likely prove to be that Man plans, Gods laugh... One way or another, time will tell it's tale.
 

155 arty

Veteran Member
Hackers of the international group Anonymous hacked the website of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation and leaked the data of 305,925 people who will be mobilized first. TWlink

List of 305,925 names comprising the 1st of presumably 3 waves of Putin's draft has been leaked. Pieces fiting together to further corroborate that 1 million people are intended for the draft, not 300,000.

View: https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1572925733223432192
going to have to draft a million to come up with 300,000 qualified
 

jward

passin' thru







Rob Lee
@RALee85
10m

Alexander Kots admits that Russian forces are facing a manpower shortage, particularly among riflemen, mechanic-drivers, and gunners for motorized rifle units. He says he knows of brigades with only 60 infantrymen left. https://t.me/sashakots/35835

He also emphasizes the issue with refuseniks who now will face criminal penalties for refusing to fight.
View: https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1573095049520619520?s=20&t=Cwk24n4JLd8ElcQsVCoPLw
 

jward

passin' thru

northern watch

Has No Life - Lives on TB

Hungary to poll public on support for EU sanctions on Russia​

Hungary’s governing party says it wants to poll the country’s citizens on whether they support European Union sanctions imposed against Russia over its war in Ukraine
By JUSTIN SPIKE Associated Press
September 22, 2022, 11:43 AM

Viktor Orban

Hungary's Prime Minister Viktor Orban speaks during a news conference with Serbian President Aleksandar Vucic in Belgrade, Serbia, Friday, Sept. 16, 2022. Orban is on a one day working visit to Serbia. (AP Photo/Darko Vojinovic)
The Associated Press

BUDAPEST, Hungary -- Hungary's governing party said Thursday it wants to poll the country's citizens on whether they support European Union sanctions imposed against Russia over its war in Ukraine.

Fidesz plans to call for a “national consultation” on energy sanctions which he said had been decided on by the EU’s “Brussels elite," the party's caucus leader, Mate Kocsis, said at a news conference Thursday following a closed-door meeting.

“The sanctions are causing harm. They are destroying Europe’s economy," Kocsis said. “We have to convince European decision-makers, the members of the elite, that they shouldn't maintain the energy sanctions because big problems will come out if it.”

The poll, which the government calls a “national consultation,” is an informal survey available to every adult in Hungary which can be returned by mail or filled out online.

Such surveys, issued several times by the governments of nationalist-populist Prime Minister Viktor Orban since he came to power in 2010, have been criticized by pollsters and opposition parties for containing biased and leading questions, and for having no binding legal relevance.

In the news conference, Kocsis acknowledged that the consultation is a “political tool” which the government can use in its debates with the EU over whether to extend or impose further sanctions against Russia. He said the government would decide on the timing of the survey.

Hungary's government has vocally opposed EU sanctions against Moscow, arguing they were doing more damage to European economies than to Russia. Budapest has also refused to supply neighboring Ukraine with weapons, or to allow their transfer across its border with the embattled country.

Pro-government newspaper Magyar Nemzet on Wednesday reported that Orban — who has for years nurtured a close relationship with Russian President Vladimir Putin — had told the Fidesz conference that sanctions against Russia should be scrapped, and that doing so would curb inflation and cut gas prices in half.

———

Follow the AP’s coverage of the war at Russia-Ukraine | Breaking News & Live Updates | AP News

 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
Which is a DIRECT final warning to the West that Poland Germany etc. are now included in the very first round of tactical nuke targets. As well as probably some of the US bases in Europe.

If Putin does this - I have little doubt he will hit a plethora of targets to send a message to multiple entities to cease and desist assisting Ukraine.

If you think about it - it really doesn't matter at all WHICH targets he selects - as SOON as he tactically nukes anything - anywhere - everyone in the West is going to shit their pants and run around like the monumental idiots they clearly have proven to be suicidally determined to DO SOMETHING to stand up to Russia.

Real Men as leaders would take a series of strikes like that - realize they are primarily last ditch messages - and back the **** up - stand down their Ukraine assistance and avert the destruction of the entire planet.

But we don't have leaders like that do we ?

And from Putin's standpoint - he can't back down because now HIS back is against the wall - because he KNOWS that if he backs down at this point - the West will carve Russia up like the world's most delicious turkey to extract the greatest supply of resources left on the planet.

Putin is ALL in on this hand.

If the West does not fold - we all DIE.

You really think two small provinces in Ukraine are worth that ?
Putin gets those two small provinces, then miraculously more provinces will spring up westward from there. Or anywhere else Moscow deems worthy of "liberation"...

Say such leaders as you advocate exist, and once nuked they back off, any enemy with a credible nuke threat (and maybe a lot less restraint) will feel the West will roll over and pee themselves at the threat. And if they don't, well WTH, nukes are valid now, Russia showed that, right? Let 'em fly!

This is why WWIII is such a clusterf*ck, avoiding it is rather easy about 90% of the way, it's the last 10% that is a damned steep slope. And there are no clean hands.
 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
One thing here: it's not necessarily "racist" for the Russians to recruit from far-off provinces. It may be thought that they will be less sympathetic to Ukrainians and more willing to fight. That is what the Chinese did in the Tianamen Square Incident; local Beijing troops would not fire on protestors so the CCP brought in troops from the provinces.
That's a valid point. I'm not sure it's the reason why they're doing it, but it definitely is in the selection set.
 

northern watch

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Behind a paywall, but seems interesting, if anyone's read it or has credible info from it to share. . .
View attachment 365683
Ankit Panda
@nktpnd
5m

“The United States for several months has been sending private communications to Moscow warning Russia’s leadership of the grave consequences that would follow the use of a nuclear weapon, according to U.S. officials”
View: https://twitter.com/nktpnd/status/1573097806172106752?s=20&t=Cwk24n4JLd8ElcQsVCoPLw
“The United States for several months has been sending private communications to Moscow warning Russia’s leadership of the grave consequences that would follow the use of a nuclear weapon, according to U.S. officials”

What are these grave consequences?
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
Putin gets those two small provinces, then miraculously more provinces will spring up westward from there. Or anywhere else Moscow deems worthy of "liberation"...

Say such leaders as you advocate exist, and once nuked they back off, any enemy with a credible nuke threat (and maybe a lot less restraint) will feel the West will roll over and pee themselves at the threat. And if they don't, well WTH, nukes are valid now, Russia showed that, right? Let 'em fly!

This is why WWIII is such a clusterf*ck, avoiding it is rather easy about 90% of the way, it's the last 10% that is a damned steep slope. And there are no clean hands.

A reminder as to why they want Ukraine in part or whole back into "the fold".....

Imagen2-1.jpg


Notice that the oil is in the Donbas.....
 

Doc1

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Prominent Russian human rights lawyer Pavel Chikov says he has been made aware of multiple reports of men in their 40s, 50s and even 60s (!) receiving military call-up notices since yesterday

View: https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1573013521276755975

I have no idea of what the reality is behind this report. Part of the trouble with this (and most other wars) is that information is selectively leaked or fabricated as part of the propaganda efforts on both sides. Understand that I'm not accusing Onetimer of fabricating anything.

If the report is true, it almost certainly has to be taken with a large grain of salt. No military - except the most desperate - is going to draft men in their fifties and sixties for front line combat service. If the report is at all true, I suspect that former NCOs might well be drafted for admin and training duties. That could free younger men for combat service.

Towards the very end of WWII, the desperate German forces were indeed drafting guys in their fifties and sixties - as well as kids under 16 - for combat service in the Volksturm. The Volksturm was a sort of last ditch home guard. In the event, recruiting these troops was found to be hardly worth the effort and their combat record was generally dismal.

Long before things reached that critical point, the Wehrmacht was recruiting older and disabled soldiers to perform the sort of training and admin functions I mentioned earlier.

I've seen absolutely no indication that the Russian forces are in any sort of desperate condition.

Best
Doc
 

von Koehler

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Who is to say when Russian adventurism will ever stop? Who ever said appeasement could work against a dictator?

Russia already took over Georgia, Crimea, and Donbass.

Russia's illegal and immoral invasion of the sovereign nation Ukraine has resulted in the near collapse of the Russian conventional armed forces.

Maybe Putin should be the one to know when to stop?

When I was a boy, the saying "Better dead then Red" was popular.
 

northern watch

Has No Life - Lives on TB

NATO Says China's Role In Ukraine War A "Challenge" To The Alliance​

BY TYLER DURDEN
ZERO HEDGE
THURSDAY, SEP 22, 2022 - 07:40 PM

Authored by Kyle Anzalone & Connor Freeman via The Libertarian Institute,

During remarks on Wednesday, the civilian head of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) slammed China as a "challenge" to the alliance. In an interview with Reuters, Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said Beijing’s support for the war in Ukraine, its opposition to NATO expansion, and its territorial claims justify the alliance assigning China this label.

Largely in response to Washington’s increasing hostility, Moscow and Beijing have strengthened their ties for well over a decade. Prior to the invasion of Ukraine, China and Russia carried out several rounds of military exercises. Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chinese President Xi Jinping have met several times since the war began, reaffirming the two Asian powers’ growing ties.

While Beijing has not given public support to Moscow’s war, China has refused several demands to condemn Russia’s invasion. Beijing has drastically increased its economic ties with Moscow as Russia has become more isolated from Western markets.


NATO image

After Moscow’s invasion of Ukraine, Washington leveled massive sanctions on Russia and many NATO member states agreed to scale back Russian energy purchases. The intention was to crush the Russian economy and disable the Kremlin’s war machine.

However, the Western economic war on Russia caused energy prices to spike, allowing Moscow to replace the shrinking European market with Asian customers. While Russian oil is selling below market rates, Moscow’s increased exports to China, India and Turkey pushed the rouble to seven-year highs this summer.
“The sum of all is this just increases the importance of NATO allies standing together and realizing that China is part of the security challenges we need to face today and in the future,” Stoltenberg said in the interview with Reuters.
Meanwhile, India and Turkey have followed Beijing in importing more Russian goods. Ankara is a NATO member state. The US and several other NATO members recently engaged in war games with India.

Stoltenberg also took issue with Beijing over its opposition to NATO expansion. At the fall of the USSR in 1990, the North Atlantic alliance only had 16 members. In the 30 years since, NATO has added 14, soon to be 16, new members. Many of the new additions to the alliance are former Warsaw Pact or USSR states. Moscow has long protested NATO expansion. In 2008, the US Ambassador to Russia said expanding the alliance to Ukraine and Georgia violated all of Russia’s red lines. NATO has also expanded its global reach.

This week, NATO members, the US and Canada, conducted a joint transit through the Taiwan Strait. Last year – eyeing Beijing and following Washinton’s imperial lead, with British, French and German warships sailing the South China Sea.

This year, NATO targeted China in its new Strategic Concept document. UK Prime Minister Liz Truss has even openly called for a “global NATO” to defend Taiwan and confront China in the Asia Pacific. Under Truss, Beijing will be classified as a “threat” to England’s “national security for the first time… for a tougher approach to Beijing,” the Times reported last month. In his first Congressional address, Biden boasted he “told President Xi that we will maintain a strong military presence in the Indo-Pacific just as we do with NATO in Europe…”

 
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