SCI 14,000-year-old village discovered in Canada

[Melodi]

And once gain now that "Clovis Only" has finally bitten the dust, the real ages of sites in North America are being sorted out - a village this early is really amazing for ANYWHERE in the world, much less North America.

14,000-year-old village discovered in Canada one of oldest settlements ever found in North America

Site on Triquet Island confirms Heiltsuk Nation’s stories of ancient coastal communities passed on through generations

Chloe Farand

The Independent US
village-canada-edit.jpg
Archaeologists at the site are unearthing tools for lighting fires, fish hooks and spears dating back to the Ice Age CTV/ Hakai Institute

An ancient village believed to be one of the oldest human settlements ever found in North America has been discovered during an excavation on a remote island in British Columbia.

The village, which is estimated to be 14,000 years old, has been found on a rocky spit on Triquet Island, about 500 kilometres northwest of Victoria, Canada.

It is estimated the village is older than Egypt’s pyramids.
Read more

Scientists said the artefacts being unearthed, which include tools for lighting fires, fish hooks and spears dating back to the Ice Age, are painting a picture of how civilisation began in North America, CTV Vancouver Island News reports.

Alisha Gauvreau, an anthropology PhD student at the University of Victoria and a researcher at the Hakai Institute, which supports the archaeological team, took part in the excavation work.

She told the Canadian television network: “I remember when we get the dates back and we just kind of sat there going, holy moly, this is old. What this is doing is just changing our idea of the way in which North America was first peopled.”

Experts believe a large human migration may have occurred on British Columbia’s coastline.

But the discovery also matches the oral history of the Heiltsuk Nation, a First Nations government in British Columbia.

According to Heiltsuk Nation’s oral traditions, stories of ancient coastal villages have been passed down for generations.

William Housty, from the Heiltsuk Nation, said: “To think about how these stories survived all of that, only to be supported by this archaeological evidence is just amazing”.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-oldest-settlment-north-america-a7673726.html

 

[Dozdoats]

Science evolves when the scientists holding the old outdated theories die off - and not before.

 

[packyderms_wife]

Science evolves when the scientists holding the old outdated theories die off - and not before.

couldn't have said it better. Next up they'll be finding ancient remains and the people were exceptionally tall.

 

[Yogizorch]

Duh...maybe man did cause climate change and the ice ages.

 

[Dozdoats]

Melodi,

That's a spooky picture in the OP.

Back in my undergraduate days at the University of Alabama I was involved in field work at http://moundville.ua.edu/ . I had an assigned 3'X3' square that had already been cleared of overburden to a depth of about 3 feet. That was claustrophobic enough... a site as deep as the one in the OP would be a little scary. Even as well bulwarked as that seems to be.

 

[Melodi]

Science evolves when the scientists holding the old outdated theories die off - and not before.

Yep, and there were about five or six (all male as far as I recall) guys who made their entire careers on "proving" Clovis only and for decades if you said anything different - you soon found yourself out of a job, your research declared "badly done" or even "fraud" and stacking shelves at the local Wallmart for employment.

If nothing else, I hope this well documented; decades long fiasco will serve as a lesson at least for the next few generations (if we keep the internet and modern science) of how horribly damaging that sort of so-called "science" actually is to real discovery.

 

[Publius]

Academics that somehow get in a position to run things get to call the shots and something like the Clovis people cannot be allowed as it completely rewrites history.
So the concept of people crossing over from what is now known as Russia to Alaska is the only way people got to north america. Anything else that shows people came here 14,000. to 14,500 years ago and long before the last Ice Age must be swept under the rug and hidden.

 

[Laurane]

Too bad they haven't found any samples of a written language - it would make it so much easier......lol

 

[Broken Arrow]

Very cool!!

 

[Meadowlark]

Duh...maybe man did cause climate change and the ice ages.

The darned woolly mammoths smoke cigarettes and drove SUVs.

 

[Gercarson]

The darned woolly mammoths smoke cigarettes and drove SUVs.

Wooly mammoth flatulence maybe.

 

[packyderms_wife]

Yep, and there were about five or six (all male as far as I recall) guys who made their entire careers on "proving" Clovis only and for decades if you said anything different - you soon found yourself out of a job, your research declared "badly done" or even "fraud" and stacking shelves at the local Wallmart for employment.

If nothing else, I hope this well documented; decades long fiasco will serve as a lesson at least for the next few generations (if we keep the internet and modern science) of how horribly damaging that sort of so-called "science" actually is to real discovery.

Agreed. This so-called archeology that's dominated the world stage needs to go the way of the dodo bird. There is still so much we don't know about planet earth. I'm still convinced that Noah and crew were living in a very modern society, why else would you mock someone for building an archaic craft? If they were all knuckle dragging cave men then no need to mock, but a very advanced society that believes it has no need for God and that their tech will save them? Those people I can see mocking Noah.

Anyway, I still remember you telling me about someone you knew on a dig site that dug up plastic dolls that were estimated to be some 4000-6000 years of age. Gee maybe someone lost her dollie in a massive flood?

 

[Richard]

Well humans have been around for much longer that 14,000 years so why is this unusual.........

 

[packyderms_wife]

Well humans have been around for much longer that 14,000 years so why is this unusual.........

Those that think they're in charge didn't get to push this one into the dust bin of history.

 

[Illini Warrior]

makes sense - migration across the Bering Sea ice bridge has been proven - following the coastline south until you hit a more temperate climate is logical ...

 

[Richard]

makes sense - migration across the Bering Sea ice bridge has been proven - following the coastline south until you hit a more temperate climate is logical ...

Migration around the world must have happened way before Columbus, navigation by sea around the world is so easy, why should N America have been cut off, there is so much buried history of humans that has been dismissed by people who think in terms of mere centuries.........the older it is the more likely it has been buried.......see Maps of the Ancient Sea Kings etc.........

Human history is not recorded much before 10,000 BC, humans have been around for a lot longer so where is the evidence.........

 

[Publius]

Well humans have been around for much longer that 14,000 years so why is this unusual.........

Because the last ice age did not happen until 1000 years later (13,000. years ago) and it took much longer than that for most of the earths water to end up as snow and ice build up on land (12,000 or 11,000 years ago?), thus lowering the seas a little each year and exposing a ridge known as the Bering land bridge, this is located in the Bering sea in the Alaskan area.

They reject the idea that humans were smart enough to build rafts or other sea going craft and somehow end up in what whould later be known as North America.

 

[Melodi]

Agreed. This so-called archeology that's dominated the world stage needs to go the way of the dodo bird. There is still so much we don't know about planet earth. I'm still convinced that Noah and crew were living in a very modern society, why else would you mock someone for building an archaic craft? If they were all knuckle dragging cave men then no need to mock, but a very advanced society that believes it has no need for God and that their tech will save them? Those people I can see mocking Noah.

Anyway, I still remember you telling me about someone you knew on a dig site that dug up plastic dolls that were estimated to be some 4000-6000 years of age. Gee maybe someone lost her dollie in a massive flood?

I don't think that was me, though there are rumors the Romans may have briefly had a "clear glass that did not break but bounced when dropped" and a friend of my husband's was doing translations of mostly boring old Roman documents in the Roman military archives (there are many documents still be translated from all over the ancient world it takes grant money and training to do this stuff) anyway he found a document that was basically a suggestion for a "secret" weapon that was an internal combustion engine! Instead of building it, his superiors wrote back something to the effect of "too expensive and too far out there; please give us something more practical that we can use now."

The Romans did have factories and even assembly lines (of slaves) so they could have built something like a powered tank if they had taken this guy up on his idea; they also had steam engines (used mostly to power rich people's toys and to make temple doors open on command) so they also could have used steam power; they did use some water power but again with huge numbers of slaves never seemed to have felt the need for things like power looms.

Then there were the Chinese that in the 9th century were forging steel and came very-close to their own industrial revolution; if they can not stalled out at that point, we would probably all be speaking Chinese now...

So that's lot of inventions right there (I skipped the Egyptian glass making and some other things) even without going into the "unusual" and "weird finds" that don't fit anywhere so they tend to get ignored or put in books like "Forbidden Archeology."

The "Clovis Only" thing was a particular pet peeve of mine because it impacted my education and to some degree influenced my decision not to try to keep working in the field; I had desperately wanted to teach Ancient History and become an academic but I just couldn't deal with people who intentionally decided what the "truth" was and you simply were not allowed to suggest that the evidence might lead elsewhere.

Clovis was North American archeology and my interests were always more in Europe and the Middle East when I was younger; but the same sort of thinking exists there.

For example no one right now will even apply for grants to research if the "cocaine" mummies from Egypt are the result of the actual use of cocaine on the part of the deceased or since most evidence was found in European museums were the findings of cocaine and tobacco due to contamination by 19th century "researchers" whose did not have the same standards for working with artifacts as we do today?

Either answer would be very interesting; but because the first answer would indicate trade with the America's (even very limited) because there simply are no plants producing Coca on this side of the water (there is one that has some tobaccoids but no coca) and well - the "facts" just can't let that happen so the question can't be asked.

Ten years on or so from the original paper; my hunch is that now DNA testing is so much better that it would take about 5 minutes for a lab to determine if the cocaine was from the mummy's body or contamination from a more recent source - but again, no one is even "allowed" to ask this question and if they do it seriously their paper will not be published, they have been warned their careers will be over and don't even try it.

I have this from an inside source, who of course I can't name but I trust is correct and the fact that this huge story totally died (outside of woo-woo sites) I believe it likely to be true.

But since when is a larger, ancient trading network than we realized "woo-woo"? Since the current holders of academic department chairs said it was; once they die off we may see this question revisited again.

A highly technological civilization as suggested by the Vedas is of course not even allowed for discussion in academics; again that is "career over" time...which doesn't mean it might not be real, it just means it is a "forbidden" area of research.

 

[ShadowMan]

To me the very concept that humans DIDN'T or COULDN'T travel the globe much as they can do today is beyond ignorant. We have people today that have ROWED across both the Atlantic and Pacific oceans. Sailboats routinely circumnavigate the globe. Walkers/hikers/campers traverse the continents. Why would anyone think that ancient humans couldn't do the same. How the hell do they think humans got all over the place? Time and again archeology has been shown that trade routes and trade goods crossed thousands and thousands of miles! To believe that ancient people didn't travel far afield is simply ludicrous!

What really gets my goat when you're watching some show on ancient civilizations and cultures is how the "experts" say these people did this or these people thought that, or they believed such and such. Unless you have a written journal from someone from that period of time you don't know squat. All you know is that a tool or piece of artifact was found there, in the dirt at that level. Why, how, when, for what purpose.....is all speculation and nothing but a SWAG (Scientific Wild Ass Guess). Hell even when we have written journals from recent history we're still doing a lot of guessing and speculating.

After I retired from the navy and went back to college we had this little old lady on campus that had to be in her mid-eighties taking classes at the university. If you were over 65 all you paid for a class was one dollar for the class and then any books you needed. One of my buddies was in a history class with her when the professor was talking about a particular period in the early 1900's, WWI or something and made a statement about what people of the period thought about an event and the little old gal corrected him! "No that's not what people generally thought about that." Students loved her!! She was a spitfire for sure.

When asked why she went back to school at her age she answered: "What am I supposed to do just sit around and wait to die?" She took History classes, Art and Music classes. She was having a great time. Didn't move very fast but she always got there!

 

[Melodi]

Well humans have been around for much longer that 14,000 years so why is this unusual.........

Because when I was in school in the 1970's and until about six years ago it was "doctrine" that "The Clovis People" were the "First" people to get to the Americas and by golly that was only 9,000 years ago so any find that was older was "obviously" a hoax or a "mistake."

For about five years after better DNA and other technologies proved that even one of the Clovis sites was about 12,000 years old; all this did was move the "The Clovis" people back (reluctantly) to 12,000 years.

This "theory" (taught as fact) was called "Clovis Only" and any researcher who found sites (and they were found) that was/is older than that; during the forty to fifty years this "theory" was in place were either told to "change" their findings or be black balled right out of mainstream archeology - including losing jobs, tenure or the ability to publish in any mainstream journal.

Now that the last of the "Clovis Only" jerks are dead, sites are being found or re-dated to their dates earlier than 12,000 years ago (not everyone who believed this was a jerk, but the jerks are the ones who felt their entire reputation was staked on being correct so they destroyed the careers and dismissed the evidence of others).

Finally, people living in settled villages 14,000 years ago don't show up very often ANYWHERE in the world for those early dates; you get a few, there was at least one village making pottery and weaving 28,000 years ago in Eastern Europe (before the time the glaciers moved down) but most evidence from before 12,000 years ago has people living as hunters and gatherers rather than settled villagers; especially outside of the Middle East and parts of Asia.

Recent finds in Turkey HAVE rocked the world of archeology with monumental architecture - but even there for the first five years after the discovery of the site; mainstream academics were still insisting it "had" to be built by hunters and gatherers which is insanity and the mainstream is finally admitting these must have been settled people and may go back as far as 14,000 or more years ago.

But that's a story for another thread (and has been covered here) this answer is way too long already - but it is a complex situation.

 

[Flashyzipp]

Wow! I may be incorrect, but this is a long time before the Cahokia mounds which is supposedly one of the oldest civilizations in North America.

 

[Melodi]

Shadowman I've mentioned this before, but in my first day in the "Archeology of the Americas" class circa 1975 the book said "the only time people could cross over into the Americas was during a brief period for land bridge about 10,000 years ago" (or words to that effect).

I raised my hand and said "why did they need a land bridge; people cross back and forth in that area all the time today using boats, I mean we are pretty sure that people had boats back then."

My teacher raised and eyebrow and being a good and wise man said "good point"...but of course the test came from the book at exam time.

Now of course we know (and didn't know then) that Australia was settled by people who even with a lower sea level HAD to have used boats at least 50,000 years ago and possibly 75,000 years ago...and one of the "hottest" new theories in the archeology of the Americas is a very early "colonization" by boat that might have had people living from Alaska to the tip of South America within less than a few hundred years (maybe even less than 100).

 

[Richard]

Shadowman I've mentioned this before, but in my first day in the "Archeology of the Americas" class circa 1975 the book said "the only time people could cross over into the Americas was during a brief period for land bridge about 10,000 years ago" (or words to that effect).

I raised my hand and said "why did they need a land bridge; people cross back and forth in that area all the time today using boats, I mean we are pretty sure that people had boats back then."

My teacher raised and eyebrow and being a good and wise man said "good point"...but of course the test came from the book at exam time.

Now of course we know (and didn't know then) that Australia was settled by people who even with a lower sea level HAD to have used boats at least 50,000 years ago and possibly 75,000 years ago...and one of the "hottest" new theories in the archeology of the Americas is a very early "colonization" by boat that might have had people living from Alaska to the tip of South America within less than a few hundred years (maybe even less than 100).

OK write a book about it if you are sure rather than posting on this forum if not keep it to yourself, your experiences are no more valid that anyone else's. write a book with substantial evidence that will be verified., otherwise shut up.................

 

[Melodi]

Wow! I may be incorrect, but this is a long time before the Cahokia mounds which is supposedly one of the oldest civilizations in North America.

Cahokia is not nearly the earliest; it is about 10th century and in fact we researched this for a proposed novel on the Vikings in Vinland (that we still hope to right someday) a major point of view person in a Native American Trader who has been to Cahokia (which had a standing army) and explains to the Norse what he found there, making them think twice about going too far inland and too far South at least during Lief Erickson's time of attempted colonization.

Other groups may have done it, but so far evidence is scarce (and husband feels for extremely detailed reasons involving rune forms that the Kensington is a very good 19th century fake) but this was a great plot device for the novel to explain the limited expansion on the East Coast.

 

[Melodi]

OK write a book about it if you are sure rather than posting on this forum if not keep it to yourself...........

I am afraid I don't understand what your issue here is Richard; as a student I asked why people needed a land bridge when they could have used boats; at the time that was not considered possible by the official textbooks; today it is recognized as one way that some people probably did get to the Americas.

I don't need to write a book, although I'm sure some of the East Coast stuff will go into the novel if Nightwolf and I ever get time to write it - but that's 10th century stuff not 14,000 years ago; I didn't get to work in the field so I'll leave writing academic books and field reports to those who have now been set free from the former restraints of flawed academic theories; to write them.

These days outside of blogs, and Timebomb; most of my writing is fiction and that written with my husband.

 

[Richard]

I know that melodi is a travel writer, I think she should start to promote her books etc to the general public rather than making out she has this great claim to other people's experiences, every post contains some sort of of someone else's verification of melodi's opinion, quite honestly that is the most arrogant opinion I have ever heard, but no doubt Melodi will have her defence

 

[Melodi]

Wow! I may be incorrect, but this is a long time before the Cahokia mounds which is supposedly one of the oldest civilizations in North America.

Uh I think it is a matter of wording, Cahokia is the LARGEST CITY IN NORTH AMERICA so far discovered; it was a huge urban center with perhaps up to 1 million people living both in and around it; they had a standing army and amazing irrigation centers.

It was also mostly made of wood and only discovered because of the modern city of St. Louis being built on top of it; therefore there MAY have been other cities we have not found that simply were destroyed by time and the elements.

The big Ancient Cities we know about in the Americas are mostly in South America - there is one on the coast of Peru and the mountains of the Andes; they keep pushing back dates but some are at least 4,000 years old and there are a few that may be as old as 10,000. Stone is very hard to date (in terms of when it was used in a building) so unless rope, wood or other biological remains are found (or fire pits) dating gets dicey.

 

[Richard]

Those that think they're in charge didn't get to push this one into the dust bin of history.

Who are those in charge?

 

[colonel holman]

OK write a book about it if you are sure rather than posting on this forum if not keep it to yourself, your experiences are no more valid that anyone else's. write a book with substantial evidence that will be verified., otherwise shut up.................

nice

 

[zeker]

OK write a book about it if you are sure rather than posting on this forum if not keep it to yourself, your experiences are no more valid that anyone else's. write a book with substantial evidence that will be verified., otherwise shut up.................

wow bud.

somebody stepped on your last nerve?

 

[Melodi]

Chart won't copy but here is the dating chart for some of the ancient Peruvian sites - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_sites_in_Peru

Information on Cahokia - the "one million" population figure is one I heard on the history channel but was talking about the entire area of influence the city itself was probably about 20,000 people...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cahokia

Smithsonian article on the migration by boat theory of the Americas
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart...ericas-along-coast-not-through-ice-180960103/

 

[Melodi]

SmartNews Keeping you current
First Humans Entered the Americas Along the Coast, Not Through the Ice
Evidence mounts against the traditional story of early human migration through an ice corridor

image: https://thumbs-media.smithsonianmag...d079/ice_free_route.jpg__800x600_q85_crop.jpg
View
A view of the area of the ice-free corridor today (Mikkel Winther Pedersen)
By Jason Daley
smithsonian.com
August 11, 2016

The traditional story of human migration in the Americas goes like this: A group of stone-age people moved from the area of modern-day Siberia to Alaska when receding ocean waters created a land bridge between the two continents across the Bering Strait. Once across, the giant Laurentide and Cordilleran ice sheets, which blocked southern Alaska and the Yukon Territory in western Canada, halted the migrants' progress. But about 13,000 years ago, the ice sheets began retreating, opening a 900-mile-long ice-free corridor following the Canadian Rockies. This, many researchers believe, is how the Clovis culture moved south and colonized other parts of the Americas.

But new evidence has made that timeline hazy over the last decade. Research shows that humans were living south of the ice sheets before the ice-free corridor opened up. A settlement in Monte Verde, Chile, shows people had made it all the way down South America 15,000 years ago and a more recent discovery indicates that humans hunted mammoth in Florida 14,500 years ago.

Now, a new study by an international team of researchers may finally rip the ice corridor hypothesis out of the textbooks once and for all. Using sediment cores and DNA analysis, the scientists reconstructed the corridor's environment. This research shows that there just weren’t enough resources in the pass for the earliest human migrants to successfully make the crossing.

“The bottom line is that even though the physical corridor was open by 13,000 years ago, it was several hundred years before it was possible to use it,” project leader Eske Willerslev, an evolutionary geneticist from the University of Copenhagen and Cambridge University, says in a press release. “That means that the first people entering what is now the US, Central and South America must have taken a different route. Whether you believe these people were Clovis, or someone else, they simply could not have come through the corridor, as long claimed.”

image: https://public-media.smithsonianmag...9571-4fcf-b698-905870d97d8f/migration_map.jpg
Migration Map
(Mikkel Winther Pedersen)

Nicholas Wade at The New York Times reports the researchers looked at an area of the ice-free corridor that was once part of a large lake dubbed Glacial Lake Peace that would have blocked the path. The migrants would not have been able to cross the 6,000-square-mile body of water until it began to recede, an event that would show up in the lake bed sediments in the remains of plants and animals.

Today, that area is covered by Lake Charlie in British Columbia and Spring Lake in Alberta. The team visited the lakes during winter, drilling down into the lake beds to gather sediment cores.

They then applied a technique called “shotgun sequencing” to the materials they brought up, which allowed them to date when plants and animals began colonizing the lake bed. “Instead of looking for specific pieces of DNA from individual species, we basically sequenced everything in there, from bacteria to animals,” Willerslev says in the release. “It’s amazing what you can get out of this. We found evidence of fish, eagles, mammals and plants.”

Wade reports that the scraps of ancient DNA show how Lake Peace receded, slowly opening the ice corridor. Grasses, sedges, birch and willow began colonizing the edges of the shrinking lake, and as it dried, they found evidence of bison, voles, and jack rabbits moving in starting around 12,500 years ago. That means it’s unlikely the area produced enough resources like food and wood for the long migration before that date. Instead, early humans probably followed the Pacific Coast around the ice sheets when colonizing the Americas.

The study echoes another paper that came out in June. In that study, researchers looked at the DNA of northern and southern populations of bison concluding they did not intermingle until 13,000 years ago, meaning the corridor was blocked till then.

Now, to complete the story of human migration in the Americas researchers need to focus on evidence along the coast. That's tricky since erosion, tides and now the effects of climate change make coastal archeological sites very rare.
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[Melodi]

There you go Richard - I invite you to do further research and you will seen these are not just "my" opinions..I read about them because I am very interested in the topic as are many other people here; if your not feel free to skip the threads...

 

[Melodi]

Who are those in charge?

The academics who previously held the positions of power as the Chairs of departments of archeology of several large and influential universities and who also tended to edit and publish the main journals of archeology of the day; if an archeologist "defied" them; they would be "blackballed" again don't believe me fine; go do your own research on this topic (and read the many articles by people who towed the line and those who gave in to keep their jobs during this period).

I am just tankful it is over; sites like Monte Verde that were no question at least 15,000 years old and modern dating technology made this possible - again feel free to research.

 

[Richard]

I don't think that was me, though there are rumors the Romans may have briefly had a "clear glass that did not break but bounced when dropped" and a friend of my husband's was doing translations of mostly boring old Roman documents in the Roman military archives (there are many documents still be translated from all over the ancient world it takes grant money and training to do this stuff) anyway he found a document that was basically a suggestion for a "secret" weapon that was an internal combustion engine! Instead of building it, his superiors wrote back something to the effect of "too expensive and too far out there; please give us something more practical that we can use now."

The Romans did have factories and even assembly lines (of slaves) so they could have built something like a powered tank if they had taken this guy up on his idea; they also had steam engines (used mostly to power rich people's toys and to make temple doors open on command) so they also could have used steam power; they did use some water power but again with huge numbers of slaves never seemed to have felt the need for things like power looms.

Then there were the Chinese that in the 9th century were forging steel and came very-close to their own industrial revolution; if they can not stalled out at that point, we would probably all be speaking Chinese now...

So that's lot of inventions right there (I skipped the Egyptian glass making and some other things) even without going into the "unusual" and "weird finds" that don't fit anywhere so they tend to get ignored or put in books like "Forbidden Archeology."

The "Clovis Only" thing was a particular pet peeve of mine because it impacted my education and to some degree influenced my decision not to try to keep working in the field; I had desperately wanted to teach Ancient History and become an academic but I just couldn't deal with people who intentionally decided what the "truth" was and you simply were not allowed to suggest that the evidence might lead elsewhere.

Clovis was North American archeology and my interests were always more in Europe and the Middle East when I was younger; but the same sort of thinking exists there.

For example no one right now will even apply for grants to research if the "cocaine" mummies from Egypt are the result of the actual use of cocaine on the part of the deceased or since most evidence was found in European museums were the findings of cocaine and tobacco due to contamination by 19th century "researchers" whose did not have the same standards for working with artifacts as we do today?

Either answer would be very interesting; but because the first answer would indicate trade with the America's (even very limited) because there simply are no plants producing Coca on this side of the water (there is one that has some tobaccoids but no coca) and well - the "facts" just can't let that happen so the question can't be asked.

Ten years on or so from the original paper; my hunch is that now DNA testing is so much better that it would take about 5 minutes for a lab to determine if the cocaine was from the mummy's body or contamination from a more recent source - but again, no one is even "allowed" to ask this question and if they do it seriously their paper will not be published, they have been warned their careers will be over and don't even try it.

I have this from an inside source, who of course I can't name but I trust is correct and the fact that this huge story totally died (outside of woo-woo sites) I believe it likely to be true.

But since when is a larger, ancient trading network than we realized "woo-woo"? Since the current holders of academic department chairs said it was; once they die off we may see this question revisited again.

A highly technological civilization as suggested by the Vedas is of course not even allowed for discussion in academics; again that is "career over" time...which doesn't mean it might not be real, it just means it is a "forbidden" area of research.

Sorry melodi I think you are a complete fantasist, yes your comments on CA are relevant due to your experience of having lived there but everything you say otherwise is totally dubious and predictable to say the least I think seriously you need to see a shrink having said that I applaud your posts as I think they are amusing, but the final analysis is that your posts will go on forever without having any effect in human life in the long term, as you do not have any representation in the Republican of Eire assemblies, and long may this be so as an ex pat.

 

[Dozdoats]

Melodi,

Have you read any of the fiction written by the Gears? http://www.gear-gear.com/

I always enjoy reading their notes and seeing works by some of my old anthropology and archaeology profs cited.

 

[Melodi]

Melodi,

Have you read any of the fiction written by the Gears? http://www.gear-gear.com/

I always enjoy reading their notes and seeing works by some of my old anthropology and archaeology profs cited.

Oh yes and I'm a huge fan; I love how their work has progressed and as new information comes to light they just meld it into the story lines; and they are not shy about a lot of the politics that goes on in the world of archeology either, and they show that by almost always having the modern day archeologist finding a site and then going back in time in the next chapter to the people living there.

I still love People of the Earth, which I think is the first one; even if it is now pretty clear this would not have been the very first people to arrive, I think of them as one brave group who did.

For those who don't know this is a whole series of wonderful fiction books written by a husband and wife team who explore various periods of Native American history using both fiction and real archeology; I can't recommend them enough.

https://www.amazon.com/People-Earth-First-North-Americans/dp/0812507428

People of the Wolf is another favorite (prehistoric California)

https://www.amazon.com/People-Wolf-...1491690927&sr=1-1&keywords=People+of+the+Wolf

 

[Laurane]

Well Richard.....when you get to heaven you can ask all the questions you want......

until then, you will have to wait like everyone else for answers.

until then, speculation is interesting and one person's opinion is as good as anothers.

 

[Publius]

I am afraid I don't understand what your issue here is Richard; as a student I asked why people needed a land bridge when they could have used boats; at the time that was not considered possible by the official textbooks; today it is recognized as one way that some people probably did get to the Americas.

I don't need to write a book, although I'm sure some of the East Coast stuff will go into the novel if Nightwolf and I ever get time to write it - but that's 10th century stuff not 14,000 years ago; I didn't get to work in the field so I'll leave writing academic books and field reports to those who have now been set free from the former restraints of flawed academic theories; to write them.

These days outside of blogs, and Timebomb; most of my writing is fiction and that written with my husband.

Boat or similar (raft) is very posable! There is an area between Alaska and Russia that only 90 Kilometers (56 miles) from one land mass to the other and there is two small islands in between and one is called Big Diomede and the other Little Diomede. Now even walking is posable when there is enough ice and it sounds crazy to be walking for miles completely out of sight of land (12 miles) and keep going until you stumble upon land never seen before with lots of good hunting and fish. Yeah they go back and tell the rest of their group about it and I'm sure they got stuck on the alaskan side and followed the sun south.

I recall they found a cave in the upper mid-western U.S. with human bones claimed to be 14,000 years in age and it was quickly swept away/blown off as imposable, they may be connected to these same people in the above article.

 

[Melodi]

Thank you Publius very good points; and that cave site is just one of many I expect to be "revisited" by modern science now that it is "allowed" to do so; I know there has been a rush to re-date many of the sites that had "unusual dates" during the period when being before 9,000 years ago was simply not permitted to be published, at least not in the United States or Canada.

I should point out that things were not as restricted in South America, which is probably one reason they were the first places to have verified older dates for some of their sites.