WAR U.S. Asks Taliban to Spare Its Embassy in Coming Fight for Kabul

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
US Forces Being "Rushed" To Kabul Airport As Embassy Evacuation Underway

BY TYLER DURDEN
ZERO HEDGE
THURSDAY, AUG 12, 2021 - 02:18 PM

update(2:18eastern): A CNN national security correspondent is reporting that hundreds of US embassy personnel in Kabul are preparing to be evacuated. The US Embassy Kabul has a total staff of thousands, including over 1,000 which are deemed "diplomats".

US troops are now being "rushed" by the Pentagon to the capital city's international airport amid a Taliban advance which is coming closer and closer. This is reportedly to assist in rapid evacuation efforts. State Department spokesman Ned Price has issued a statement, saying it's "not a full evacuation" at this point, but an evacuation of many personnel nonetheless.

This comes after reports earlier in the day Thursday suggested the US State Department is mulling the complete evacuation of the embassy at a moment the Taliban has already taken some 70% of the country, and is now a mere 90 miles away from the capital.

Ned Price making the announcement of pending evacuation...

CNN further reports that the embassy may "relocate" to the confines of the more secure Karzai International Airport, which is largely protected by a contingency of Turkish troops.


Kabul's international airport, via Reuters


As Dave DeCamp of AntiWar.com detailed earlier based on a report published by Politico Wednesday, the US is considering shuttering its embassy in Kabul, Afghanistan, as the Taliban is making significant gains across the country. One source told Politico that the embassy could be evacuated by the end of the month.

The evacuation is just one option being considered, and the State Department said Tuesday that it is evaluating the security of the embassy on a "daily basis." The US ordered a drawdown of its diplomatic staff in Kabul at the end of April, right before the withdrawal of US troops started.


US Embassy Kabul, source: Department of State


Also on Wednesday, US officials told several media outlets that Kabul could fall to the Taliban within 90 days, based on a new intelligence assessment. The Taliban hasn’t moved to take Kabul yet, but a source told Reuters that the Taliban could "isolate" Kabul within 30 days.

There are currently about 650 US troops left in Afghanistan. President Biden said he will complete his withdrawal by August 31st, but the US plans to leave most of the remaining troops at the Kabul embassy, and the Pentagon has established a military command structure based out of the facility.

While the US is desperate to maintain a military presence in Afghanistan, if the diplomatic staff is forced to evacuate, the 650 troops will likely leave with them.

The US and Turkey have been negotiating a deal that would keep Turkish troops at the Kabul airport to secure it so US personnel can come and go.

Despite the Taliban gains, Turkey says it still wants to guard the airport, but no plan has been finalized.

US Forces Being "Rushed" To Kabul Airport As Embassy Evacuation Underway | ZeroHedge

If they're going to hold the airport for any meaningful time, they can't do it with just rifle companies and their weapons platoons, they'll need to bring in 105mm and 155mm howitzers as well because CAS can't do it all. Khe Sanh and Dien Bien Phu immediately come to mind.....
 

mzkitty

I give up.
:rolleyes:

1628810581474.png

Secretary Blinken and Secretary Austin’s Call with Afghan President Ghani


Readout

Office of the Spokesperson

August 12, 2021

The below is attributable to Spokesperson Ned Price:

Secretary of State Antony J. Blinken and Secretary of Defense Lloyd J. Austin III spoke today with President of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan Ashraf Ghani to stress that the United States remains invested in the security and stability of Afghanistan in the face of violence by the Taliban. Secretary Blinken and Secretary Austin informed President Ghani that the United States is reducing our civilian footprint in Kabul in light of the evolving security situation and will accelerate the tempo of Special Immigration Visa (SIV) flights. The Secretaries both emphasized that the United States remains committed to maintaining a strong diplomatic and security relationship with the Government of Afghanistan. During the call, Secretary Blinken, Secretary Austin, and President Ghani exchanged views on the security environment in Afghanistan, efforts to curb violence, and ongoing diplomatic efforts. Secretary Blinken affirmed that the United States remained committed to support a political solution to the conflict.

 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Canadian special forces ready to evacuate embassy after Kandahar falls to the Taliban
Murray Brewster 19 mins ago
CBC

a man holding a gun: Afghan security personnel take a position during fighting between Taliban and Afghan security forces in Herat province, west of Kabul, Afghanistan, on Aug. 3, 2021.

© Hamed Sarfarazi/Associated Press Afghan security personnel take a position during fighting between Taliban and Afghan security forces in Herat province, west of Kabul, Afghanistan, on Aug. 3, 2021.

Special forces troops are on standby to help evacuate Canada's embassy in Kabul, a defence source tells CBC News.

The highly-trained soldiers are expected to work alongside allies, such as the United States and the United Kingdom, which are sending thousands of troops to the Afghan capital to aid in the partial evacuation of their embassies as security throughout the war-torn country rapidly deteriorates
.

In what can only be described as a major military and psychological victory, on Thursday the Taliban captured both Kandahar and Herat — Afghanistan's second and third largest cities.

The confidential source, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said that at the moment the government has no intention of deploying a large conventional force, as both the Americans and British plan to do. (The U.S. is sending 3,000 troops, the British 600.)

There has been extensive discussion between the Canadian military and U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM) — which is responsible for the Middle East — about providing logistical and transport assistance to Canada, should it be required, said the source — who is not being identified by CBC News because they were not authorized to discuss the issue publicly.

The decision to shut down the Canadian embassy or reduce its operations lies with the federal government.

Foreign Affairs Minister Marc Garneau's office was asked to comment, but no one was immediately available.

The 'security situation is deteriorating' — Sajjan

Earlier Thursday, before the news out of Afghanistan, Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan acknowledged that Kandahar — the city Canadians fought and died to protect for five years — could fall.

"We're monitoring the situation extremely closely," Sajjan said during a media availability in South Vancouver. "In fact, I have daily briefings on this, and I had one this morning.

"All I can say is right now, yes, the security situation is deteriorating. We do have contingency plans in place to make sure that our personnel are safe."

Sajjan would not elaborate on those plans.

a group of people on a beach: Members of the Afghan National Police are seen at a shura (meeting) with soldiers from the Canadian Armed Forces in Kandahar, southern Afghanistan, on April 20, 2006.

© John D McHugh/AFP/Getty Images Members of the Afghan National Police are seen at a shura (meeting) with soldiers from the Canadian Armed Forces in Kandahar, southern Afghanistan, on April 20, 2006.

Addressing one portion of his remarks to members of the military and to the families of the 158 Canadian soldiers who died in Afghanistan, Sajjan said their sacrifices and contributions to Canada were "extraordinary."

He even tried to suggest those sacrifices will endure, noting that the Taliban committed many heinous acts in Kandahar before they were driven from power in 2001 by the U.S.-led invasion and that Canada helped to transform the city in the years afterward.

"The stadium in Kandahar City that was used for atrocities, it was again used for people to play soccer. Girls were able to go to school ..." he said.

"There's a generation of Afghans who have benefited from the tremendous sacrifice that have been made by Canadians and our allies. And I want to say this — no one can erase that now."

Taliban reportedly hunting down those who worked for western forces

Sajjan acknowledged, however, that Canada can't "choose a destiny" for Afghanistan. He said that Canada will continue to support the Afghan people.

In areas conquered by the Taliban recently, humanitarian groups — notably Human Rights Watch — have reported militants executing prisoners and hunting down people who worked for western forces and civilian agencies.

Quoting an anonymous Afghan official, the Associated Press reported that Kandahar had fallen after weeks of heavy street-to-street fighting.

a group of people riding on the back of a motorcycle: Taliban fighters patrol inside the city of Ghazni, southwest of Kabul, Afghanistan, Thursday, Aug. 12, 2021. The Taliban captured the provincial capital near Kabul on Thursday, the 10th the insurgents have taken over a weeklong blitz across Afghanistan as the U.S. and NATO prepare to withdraw entirely from the country after decades of war.

© Gulabuddin Amiri/Associated Press Taliban fighters patrol inside the city of Ghazni, southwest of Kabul, Afghanistan,
Thursday, Aug. 12, 2021. The Taliban captured the provincial capital near Kabul on Thursday, the 10th the insurgents have taken over a weeklong blitz across Afghanistan as the U.S. and NATO prepare to withdraw entirely from the country after decades of war.

The news agency said the provincial governor and other officials managed to flee the city by air on Thursday.

The capture of both Kandahar and Herat brings to 12 the number of provincial capitals which have fallen to the Taliban offensive in recent days.

Earlier this week, the city of Ghazni was also overrun. It is on the main highway between Kandahar and the capital and its demise means the hardline Islamist movement is tightening its grip on Kabul.

Canadian special forces ready to evacuate embassy after Kandahar falls to the Taliban (msn.com)
 
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northern watch

TB Fanatic
I am posting this as a stand-alone because the story is so shocking, and I really just can't believe my eyes. Also, the US "thinks" it will take 90 days for the Taliban to "take Kabul" with stories like this I suspect they know it might really be this week or by the end of the month (probably sooner). So if this article is correct we not only might have The Fall of Siagon 2.0 but Embassy Hostage Crises 2.0. In the Worst Case if we are "asking the Taliban to leave the US embassy alone," we could have Libya 2.0 and this time it WILL MATTER. - the World is watching this one, it is being reported over here too....


U.S. Asks Taliban to Spare Its Embassy in Coming Fight for Kabul
August 12, 2021in News


WASHINGTON — American negotiators are trying to extract assurances from the Taliban that they will not attack the U.S. Embassy in Kabul if the extremist group overruns the capital in a direct challenge to the country’s government, two American officials said.

The effort, led by Zalmay Khalilzad, the chief American envoy in talks with the Taliban, seeks to stave off an evacuation of the embassy as the fighters rapidly seize cities across Afghanistan. The Taliban’s advance has put embassies in Kabul on high alert for a surge of violence in coming months, or even weeks, and forced consulates and other diplomatic missions elsewhere in the country to shut down.

American diplomats now are trying to determine how soon they may need to evacuate the U.S. Embassy should the Taliban prove to be more bent on destruction than a détente. On Thursday, the embassy urged Americans who were not working for the U.S. government to leave Afghanistan immediately on commercial flights.

Biden administration officials insist that there are no immediate plans to significantly draw down the embassy’s staff of 4,000 employees, including about 1,400 Americans, as U.S. troops formally complete their withdrawal from the country.

“We are withdrawing our forces from Afghanistan, but we are not withdrawing from Afghanistan,” the State Department said in a statement. “Although U.S. troops will depart, the United States will maintain our robust diplomatic engagement with Afghanistan.”

Five current and former officials described the mood inside the embassy as increasingly tense and worried, and diplomats at the State Department’s headquarters in Washington noted a sense of tangible depression at the specter of closing it, nearly 20 years after U.S. Marines reclaimed the burned-out building in December 2001.

Several people gloomily revived a comparison that all wanted to avoid: the fall of Saigon in 1975, when Americans were evacuated from the embassy from a rooftop by helicopter.

The fears underscore what was unfathomable just a few years ago, when thousands of American forces were in Afghanistan and the U.S. Embassy in Kabul hosted one of the largest diplomatic staffs in the world.

“I don’t think people are yet at the point where they would say we need to get out the door, but they will be looking at the door a lot more often,” said Ronald E. Neumann, who was the American ambassador to Afghanistan from 2005 to 2007 and is now the president of the American Academy of Diplomacy in Washington.

Mr. Khalilzad is hoping to convince Taliban leaders that the embassy must remain open, and secure, if the group hopes to receive American financial aid and other assistance as part of a future Afghan government. The Taliban leadership has said it wants to be seen as a legitimate steward of the country, and is seeking relations with other global powers, including Russia and China, in part to receive economic support.

Two officials confirmed Mr. Khalilzad’s efforts, which have not been previously reported, on condition of anonymity to discuss the delicate negotiations. The State Department’s spokesman, Ned Price, declined to comment on Wednesday, but said funding would be conditioned on whether future Afghan governments would “have any semblance of durability.”

“Legitimacy bestows, and essentially is the ticket, to the levels of international assistance, humanitarian assistance for the Afghan people,” Mr. Price said.

Other governments are already warning the Taliban that it will not receive aid if it overtakes the Afghan government, given the rampage its fighters have waged across the country in recent days. On Thursday, Foreign Minister Heiko Maas of Germany said Berlin would not give the Taliban any financial support if it ultimately rules Afghanistan with a hard-line Islamic law.

In other posts around the world, U.S. diplomats said they were closely watching the perilous situation in Kabul to see how the State Department will balance its longstanding commitment to stabilizing Afghanistan against protecting the Americans who remain there as military forces withdraw.

Mr. Neumann described a push-and-pull strain between the Pentagon and the State Department in similar situations, given the military’s responsibility for carrying out evacuations and diplomats’ duty to maintain American assistance and influence even in danger zones.

“If the military goes too early, it may be unnecessary, and it may cost you a lot politically,” Mr. Neumann said. “If the diplomats wait too late, it looks like Saigon off the roof or the departure from Mogadishu after everything was already lost, and it puts the military people at risk. So there’s no guaranteed right side.”

Another senior U.S. official expressed alarm this week at the fall of the provincial capitals across Afghanistan, and said that if other cities follow, particularly Mazar-i-Sharif, the only major northern city still under government control, the situation could disintegrate quickly. But Pentagon officials also noted that Afghan commandos are fighting hard in Lashkar Gah and Kandahar and have so far held off Taliban advances there.

Even so, officials in Washington and Kabul said, the embassy was holding regular meetings of an emergency action committee, which is set up in every American diplomatic post to assess whether or how soon an evacuation may be necessary. The content of the meetings is classified because, in part, they review intelligence about specific attack scenarios.

Representatives from the State Department headquarters in Washington and the U.S. Embassy in Kabul would not discuss how often the committee was meeting.

The committee can only make recommendations, and it would be up to the embassy’s top-ranking diplomat — in this case, Ross Wilson, the chargé d’affaires in Kabul — to order an evacuation after consulting with senior officials in Washington. On Thursday, Mr. Wilson warned the Taliban that “attempts to monopolize power through violence, fear and war will only lead to international isolation.”

Starting in April, the embassy began sending home nonessential employees as security became more untenable in Kabul. Other staff members have been allowed to leave, without penalty to their careers, if they feel in danger.

One diplomat said a number of what he described as small military elements have recently been brought in to reinforce the embassy, which is inside what is probably already the most hardened compound in Kabul’s international zone, where diplomatic missions and the Afghan government are based.

At the same time, officials said, fewer diplomats are rotating into Kabul to replace colleagues who have left to further cull the number of Americans posted there. That has raised concerns in the American diplomatic corps that the embassy would have trouble recruiting staff for years to come.

“It’s a wrenching time,” said Eric Rubin, the president of the union that represents career foreign service officers and who is a former ambassador to Bulgaria. He said about one-quarter of the current U.S. diplomatic corps have been posted to either Afghanistan or Iraq over the last 20 years and remain emotionally invested in the war zones in which they worked.

“There was a lot of sacrifice,” Mr. Rubin said. “Everyone who served there for the most part served without their families, and under difficult conditions; at times under mortar fire. So it wasn’t easy.”

As recently as last month, senior officials at the embassy in Kabul voiced confidence that personnel there could be evacuated quickly if necessary, noting a sufficient number of commercial flights leaving from the capital’s international airport every day could accommodate the compound’s staff.

It is not clear, however, whether an evacuation would include all of the embassy’s foreign personnel along with American citizens, and the fate of Afghan employees who would all but certainly be targeted by the Taliban for aiding the United States is of acute concern to senior officials, according to several people familiar with the discussions.

Officials also said the Biden administration is concerned that an evacuation of the American Embassy could create a domino effect that accelerates the departure of other diplomatic missions and international support — and, in turn, leads to the collapse of the Afghan government.

“I am quite sure that no one in our Foreign Service who’s involved in this effort is advocating closing down the embassy and evacuating,” Mr. Rubin said.

While decisions about the embassy’s security are on the horizon, he said, “there’s no reason to think that there’s an imminent security threat to our people.”

“The first thing is, obviously, the mission, and the mission is changing,” Mr. Rubin said. “But I don’t think anybody’s going to propose to walk away.”

The post U.S. Asks Taliban to Spare Its Embassy in Coming Fight for Kabul appeared first on New York Times.

I think that when the Taliban arrive in Kabul, then the city will fall to the Taliban
 
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mecoastie

Veteran Member
Oh man! Before I left all those weapons and ammo fall into ‘Tallywacker‘ hands, I’d frig all of them up so they had catastrophic failures every time they attempted to fire them!

Rounds peppered all throughout the cases of ammo that we’re loaded to 3x Saami specs, barrels with obstructions in them, etc.
Not if you are running for your life. The defense is collapsing so fast nobody even thought to throw a grenade or explosive in there.
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Nightwolf and I were just talking about this, he is also absolutely stunned.

We both also noticed that the US has just told its enemies that it will take at least 48 hours to get US troops into the area, and with the Taliban just 90 miles away they just told them "you have 48 hours to push on and grab our embassy and personnel."

Nightwolf said: "who exactly is running the US military? I haven't seen a cockup like this since Sadaam Hussain was listening to CNN to see where the US was moving their troop's positions!"
Melodi,

I think that we have developing another Fall of Khartoum, not Saigon 2.0

The Battle of Khartoum, Siege of Khartoum or Fall of Khartoum was the conquest of Egyptian-held Khartoum by the Mahdist forces led by Muhammad Ahmad of Sudan. Egypt had held the city for some time, but the siege the Mahdists engineered and carried out from 13 March 1884 to 26 January 1885 was enough to wrest control away from the Egyptian administration.

After a ten-month siege, when the Mahdists finally broke into the city, they killed the entire garrison of Egyptian soldiers, along with 4,000 mostly male Sudanese civilians, and enslaved many women and children. According to some accounts, they killed and beheaded British General Charles George Gordon, delivering his head to the Mahdi.

Siege of Khartoum - Wikipedia
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
I'm not sure the USA military could survive a unrestricted, Khartoum style massacre.
User1911 put up the 1965 Charlton Heston Lawerence O livier? version here at timebomb.
Anyway, Kabul gets a medieval level sack and the USA might just collapse.
 

Squib

Veteran Member
I'm not sure the USA military could survive a unrestricted, Khartoum style massacre.
User1911 put up the 1965 Charlton Heston Lawerence O livier? version here at timebomb.
Anyway, Kabul gets a medieval level sack and the USA might just collapse.

With the nursing home body double, the whore, and SecDef Mr. Bogangles, probably…but there are others who could take charge and make them all ‘good jihadis!‘

Cut the US Marines loose on them…the Taliban usually ran from the jarheads…as did the Somali war lords forces, etc.

As one poster said earlier, get the artillery out there!

A few years ago, at Raqqa, a battery of Marine artillery fired so many rounds they burned out 2 M777 155mm howitzer barrels…that’s a buttload of firepower!
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Canadian military preparing to evacuate Canadians from Afghanistan: sources
David Lao and Mercedes Stephenson 1 hour ago
Global News
August 12 2021

a man in a military uniform: FILE: Canadian soldiers patrol southwest of Kandahar, Afghanistan, Monday, June 7, 2010.

© THE CANADIAN PRESS/AP/Anja Niedringhaus FILE: Canadian soldiers patrol southwest of Kandahar, Afghanistan, Monday, June 7, 2010.

Canada’s military is preparing to pull Canadians out of its embassy in Afghanistan, Global News has learned.

Global News has learned a number of Afghans who worked for Canada and their families are currently inside a Canadian compound hoping to be rescued along with Canadian citizens.

Sources say there are young Afghan children among those taking shelter.

The Canadian government has not yet made a decision on their fate, but multiple sources told Global News they fear the families will be executed by the Taliban.

Sources tell Global News that the embassy is now in the process of “ripping out,” an evacuation process that includes disposing classified items and evacuating staff.

Canadian special operations forces will be deployed to begin evacuating Canadians at its embassy in Kabul, according to the sources.

They have told Global News that Canadian Special Operations units helping to evacuate the embassy includes the Canadian Special Operations Regiment (CSOR) and Joint Task Force 2 (JTF2), the latter of which specializes as an elite terrorist and hostage rescue unit.

The move to evacuate also comes as several cities have begun falling to the Taliban just weeks before the U.S. is set to completely withdraw from the country.

The government has previously committed to pulling out Afghan interpreters amid fears of retaliation from the Taliban, though the process has been mired by roadblocks such as visa issues.


Canadian military preparing to evacuate Canadians from Afghanistan: sources (msn.com)
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Canadian military preparing to evacuate Canadians from Afghanistan: sources
David Lao and Mercedes Stephenson 1 hour ago
Global News
August 12 2021

a man in a military uniform: FILE: Canadian soldiers patrol southwest of Kandahar, Afghanistan, Monday, June 7, 2010.

© THE CANADIAN PRESS/AP/Anja Niedringhaus FILE: Canadian soldiers patrol southwest of Kandahar, Afghanistan, Monday, June 7, 2010.

Canada’s military is preparing to pull Canadians out of its embassy in Afghanistan, Global News has learned.

Global News has learned a number of Afghans who worked for Canada and their families are currently inside a Canadian compound hoping to be rescued along with Canadian citizens.

Sources say there are young Afghan children among those taking shelter.

The Canadian government has not yet made a decision on their fate, but multiple sources told Global News they fear the families will be executed by the Taliban.

Sources tell Global News that the embassy is now in the process of “ripping out,” an evacuation process that includes disposing classified items and evacuating staff.

Canadian special operations forces will be deployed to begin evacuating Canadians at its embassy in Kabul, according to the sources.

They have told Global News that Canadian Special Operations units helping to evacuate the embassy includes the Canadian Special Operations Regiment (CSOR) and Joint Task Force 2 (JTF2), the latter of which specializes as an elite terrorist and hostage rescue unit.

The move to evacuate also comes as several cities have begun falling to the Taliban just weeks before the U.S. is set to completely withdraw from the country.

The government has previously committed to pulling out Afghan interpreters amid fears of retaliation from the Taliban, though the process has been mired by roadblocks such as visa issues.


Canadian military preparing to evacuate Canadians from Afghanistan: sources (msn.com)
The Canadian Embassy is now burning their papers
 

northern watch

TB Fanatic
Official: Canada sending forces to close Afghan embassy
A source familiar with the plan told The Associated Press Canadian special forces will deploy to Afghanistan where Canadian staff in the Kabul embassy will be evacuated before closing

By ROB GILLIES Associated Press
12 August 2021, 18:41

TORONTO -- Canadian special forces will deploy to Afghanistan where staff in Canada's embassy in Kabul will be evacuated before it closes, a source familiar with the plan told The Associated Press.

The official, who was not authorized to talk publicly about the matter and spoke on condition of anonymity, did not say how many special forces would be sent.

Just weeks before the U.S. is scheduled to end its war in Afghanistan, the Biden administration is also rushing 3,000 fresh troops to the Kabul airport to help with a partial evacuation of the U.S. Embassy.

The moves highlight the stunning speed of a Taliban takeover of much of the country, including their capture on Thursday of Kandahar, the second-largest city and the birthplace of the Taliban movement.

Britain also said Thursday that it will send around 600 troops to Afghanistan to help U.K. nationals leave the country amid growing concerns about the security situation. And Danish lawmakers have agreed to evacuate 45 Afghan citizens who worked for Denmark’s government in Afghanistan and to offer them residency in the European country for two years.

Some 40,000 Canadian troops were deployed in Afghanistan over 13 years as part of the NATO mission before pulling out in 2014.

The first planeload of Afghan refugees who supported the Canadian military mission in Afghanistan arrived in Canada earlier this month. The Canadian government last month announced a special program to urgently resettle Afghans deemed to have been “integral” to the Canadian Armed Forces’ mission, including interpreters, cooks, drivers, cleaners, construction workers, security guards and embassy staff, as well as members of their families.

The government says more than 800 Afghans who supported the mission have been resettled in Canada over the past decade but acknowledges that many more remain in Afghanistan.

The Taliban, who ruled the country from 1996 until U.S. forces invaded after the 9/11 attacks, have taken 12 of Afghanistan’s 34 provincial capitals as part of a weeklong sweep that has given them effective control of about two-thirds of the country.

The seizure of Kandahar and Herat marks the biggest prizes yet for the Taliban. Canada's former military mission was based in Kandahar. More than 150 Canadian soldiers died during the Afghanistan mission.

Official: Canada sending forces to close Afghan embassy - ABC News (go.com)
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
Upside of the Taliban in control?
There will be NO POPPY production. None, zero, zilch.
They do not tolerate heroin production.

THAT is a good thing!
I wish that was a certaintity but those scumbags would have no problem, NONE, ramping up production to sell more of that crap to undermine the West. They know there is a considerable market for illicit drugs and will follow any course of action they see as weakening their enemies.
I hope you're right but I'm pretty sure they're astute enough to capitalise on anything that might sow discord and cause issues for us.

I've been divorced x2 so I can be wrong.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
Official: Canada sending forces to close Afghan embassy
A source familiar with the plan told The Associated Press Canadian special forces will deploy to Afghanistan where Canadian staff in the Kabul embassy will be evacuated before closing

By ROB GILLIES Associated Press
12 August 2021, 18:41
Well Canadian special forces should mean JTF2 who, although they don't have the breadth of experience SAS, SEALS et al have, are pretty serious. Between them & the Brits, they may be able to assist some of the Afghans who supported US troops in getting out as JB certainly has been proactive there. Hopefully the American troops returning to protect Americans will be tasked w/ getting those people out but I'm not sure JB thinks along those lines.

That will, of course, mean an American/UK Airlift as the CAF has limited heavy lift/mass movement resources thanks to decades of Liberal Government military capacity cuts in; there! that's how you fund socialised healthcare! How's that look, Joe B!??!

No matter what happens in the next few months there, this is an enormous CF and will be a black mark for JB & Co going forward.

If Afghanistan wants a western-style 'free' existence, they're going to have to bleed for it. If they won't /can't throw out the medieval Muslim hordes of killers & rapists, that's their problem. Spilling blood/losing coalition lives on their behalf should have come to a screeching halt years ago.
 
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Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
I will clarify myself. A Khartoum level sack of Kabul is 50,000 rotting corpses on the street plus HORDES of refugees smashing their way into Pakistan from the khyber pass. Burning embassies shot down transport planes etc. AND a 55 days at Peiking type seige with ALL the foreigners trapped.
My read, Housecarl is the Taliban can be in downtown Kabul raping and murdering within 72 hors, say Monday? 600, plus some british and Canadians ain't going to stop a rampaging taliban horde with all the modern us captured weapons in tow.
This a ROUT and the western soliers haven't got a chance. Evac an embassy, in a sea of chaos, under fire against taliban that are better armed than you are. The brits have TANKS? :hof: Taliban just took the tanks we gave our allies.
 

steve graham

Veteran Member
I have only one question. Why the hell didn't we get our people out when it was known that Biden was caving to the Taliban? Why didn't all the other countries get their people out? This is an outrage........it's a shitshow!! We wait til the enemy is blowing down the damn door? What is this? I'm so outraged I'm shaking!
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
Well Canadian special forces should mean JTF2 who, although they don't have the breadth of experience SAS, SEALS et al have, are pretty serious. Between them & the Brits, they may be able to assist some of the Afghans who supported US troops in getting out as JB certainly has been proactive there. Hopefully the American troops returning to protect Americans will be tasked w/ getting those people out but I'm not sure JB thinks along those lines.

That will, of course, mean an American/UK Airlift as the CAF has limited heavy lift/mass movement resources thanks to decades of Liberal Government military capacity cuts in; there! that's how you fund socialised healthcare! How's that look, Joe B!??!

No matter what happens in the next few months there, this is an enormous CF and will be a black mark for JB & Co going forward.

If Afghanistan wants a western-style 'free' existence, they're going to have to bleed for it. If they won't /can't throw out the medieval Muslim hordes of killers & rapists, that's their problem. Spilling blood/losing coalition lives on their behalf should have come to a screeching halt years ago.

Any facility, embassy buildings etc being abandoned by the US, UK, Canada or any other NATO/Coalition members should be razed & there should only be a smoking hole where they stood.

Just my Right-of-Centre opinion.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
How soon will the media start praising china joe for ending the war and getting our troops home? No matter the cost in dollars or lives, old slo-joe will be hailed the hero in all this by the dem's and media.
NOT @ my house!
 

goosebeans

Veteran Member
Melodi,

I think that we have developing another Fall of Khartoum, not Saigon 2.0

The Battle of Khartoum, Siege of Khartoum or Fall of Khartoum was the conquest of Egyptian-held Khartoum by the Mahdist forces led by Muhammad Ahmad of Sudan. Egypt had held the city for some time, but the siege the Mahdists engineered and carried out from 13 March 1884 to 26 January 1885 was enough to wrest control away from the Egyptian administration.

After a ten-month siege, when the Mahdists finally broke into the city, they killed the entire garrison of Egyptian soldiers, along with 4,000 mostly male Sudanese civilians, and enslaved many women and children. According to some accounts, they killed and beheaded British General Charles George Gordon, delivering his head to the Mahdi.

Siege of Khartoum - Wikipedia

I have this book on my kindle. It's free at project Gutenberg:

Ten Years' Captivity in the Mahdi's Camp 1992 - 1892

It's quite the read!

 

Walrus

Veteran Member
There's a lot of good kids who are going to die soon trying to pull off this fiasco. Round-the-clock multi-level air support might be the only thing which can save them but I don't think Bai-Den and his generals have the balls to make it happen.
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
Um, the taliban have looted at least a dozen, or more of Afghan army bases. They got TANKS, not sure how modern but likely OUTCLASS the light units going in. It's the Libyian arms depots or ISIS stripping Mosul's division base.


The taleban likely has large numbers of mobile artillery 105mm to 175mm.
Don't be chest thumping too much. Taleban likely got our Dragon? anti armor and our anti aircraft weapons and base defense mortars.


Roll up to the burbs of kabul and light um up. Shell the runways? Put some 175mm into our embassy.
Yep, the taleban may settle for smoking some hash and watch us all crawl off into the sunset.

Or they may put 1000 175mm into our embassy inbetween rape fests.

WE LOST. THEY WON. They define the terms. Iran may get involved. Taleban may send some stuff to the Uighrs and mess with china or OVERTHROW PAKISTAN.

Sheesh, the entire region is being shaken and we just gave the taleban enough first class military supplies to equip ENTIRE DIVISIONS.

It all comes down to how much the taleban wants to F=#/_ with us. Watch as we fly out, or kill as many as they can.

Housecarl, I KNEW when they bailed out of the airbase at midnight, and the black market horde came in early morning this would happen.
Bloodbath or laughing at us like Blackhawk down. Running away while the line the road jeer at us.
My read is bloodbath because the despise biden et al.
 
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Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
I'm not sure the USA military could survive a unrestricted, Khartoum style massacre.
User1911 put up the 1965 Charlton Heston Lawerence O livier? version here at timebomb.
Anyway, Kabul gets a medieval level sack and the USA might just collapse.

Such an event would be an "administration killer"....
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
I have only one question. Why the hell didn't we get our people out when it was known that Biden was caving to the Taliban? Why didn't all the other countries get their people out? This is an outrage........it's a shitshow!! We wait til the enemy is blowing down the damn door? What is this? I'm so outraged I'm shaking!

Because the fools in DC were lapping up the honeyed words the were hearing at the negotiation table and ignoring anything that didn't match what they wanted to hear.
 
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