OP-ED I cut off all contact with my mother.

[mawmaw]

I feel some guilt, because my person I had to distance myself from was my Mom, Long story but very close to what has all ready been said, now that she has passed, I don't miss her or long for her as others miss their Mom's and I feel bad about it, but I guess it is still messing with my mind, In a normal world one would miss and long for days gone by, but not me.

 

[thompson]

Many years ago I stumbled across a site that speaks directly to those with toxic relatives (parents, in particular) who are unnecessarily tortured by those who would point their finger and tell you it's "NOT Christian!!!" to separate yourself from a family member.

Luke 17:3 Ministries

snipped...

"When my father and mother forsake me, then the Lord will take me up" Psalm 27:10 KJV.

"Can a mother forget the baby at her breast and have no compassion on the child she has borne? Though she may forget, I will not forget you! See, I have engraved you on the palms of my hands" Isaiah 49:15-16 NIV.

"TAKE HEED TO YOURSELVES: IF THY BROTHER TRESPASS AGAINST THEE, REBUKE HIM; AND IF HE REPENT, FORGIVE HIM" Luke 17:3


Luke 17:3 is the scripture often misquoted, usually by an abuser or his Silent Partners, when he tells you that the Bible says 'Forgive and Forget', or that you must forgive him because you are a Christian.

However, Jesus is very specific when He tells us to rebuke the sinner, and if he repents, to forgive him. Have you rebuked your abuser, and has he or she repented?

The Bible tells us to forgive as God forgave us (Ephesians 4:32, Colossians 3:13). God forgives us when we come to him, confess our sin, ask for forgiveness (apologize) and repent (turn from our sinful ways).( Ezekiel 33:10-19, Isaiah 55:6, Jeremiah 6:16 & 26:3, Luke 13:3 & 5, Acts 3:19).

He does not forgive those who are 'stiff-necked', continue doing evil, or refuse to repent. The Lord does not expect more of us than he himself is willing to do! Do we imagine ourselves to be holier than God? God requires repentance, and so must we.

 

[Homestyle]

Point to any name on any random list. You don't have any feelings toward that person one way or the other. That's how I feel about some of my siblings and relatives. They are just names on a list. Until you have no feelings good or bad toward them then you are not free of them.

 

[ainitfunny]

Many years ago I stumbled across a site that speaks directly to those with toxic relatives (parents, in particular) who are unnecessarily tortured by those who would point their finger and tell you it's "NOT Christian!!!" to separate yourself from a family member.

Luke 17:3 Ministries

snipped...

"When my father and mother forsake me, then the Lord will take me up" Psalm 27:10 KJV.

"Can a mother forget the baby at her breast and have no compassion on the child she has borne? Though she may forget, I will not forget you! See, I have engraved you on the palms of my hands" Isaiah 49:15-16 NIV.

"TAKE HEED TO YOURSELVES: IF THY BROTHER TRESPASS AGAINST THEE, REBUKE HIM; AND IF HE REPENT, FORGIVE HIM" Luke 17:3


Luke 17:3 is the scripture often misquoted, usually by an abuser or his Silent Partners, when he tells you that the Bible says 'Forgive and Forget', or that you must forgive him because you are a Christian.

However, Jesus is very specific when He tells us to rebuke the sinner, and if he repents, to forgive him. Have you rebuked your abuser, and has he or she repented?

The Bible tells us to forgive as God forgave us (Ephesians 4:32, Colossians 3:13). God forgives us when we come to him, confess our sin, ask for forgiveness (apologize) and repent (turn from our sinful ways).( Ezekiel 33:10-19, Isaiah 55:6, Jeremiah 6:16 & 26:3, Luke 13:3 & 5, Acts 3:19).

He does not forgive those who are 'stiff-necked', continue doing evil, or refuse to repent. The Lord does not expect more of us than he himself is willing to do! Do we imagine ourselves to be holier than God? God requires repentance, and so must we.

`

ALL sins were forgiven BY GOD at the Cross.
Both BELIEVERS AND UNBELIEVERS, repentant and unrepentant person's sins.(ROMANS CH 5)

Your mothers sins against YOU were forgiven as well as your sins against others.

Before we repented, while we were yet sinners God forgave, suffered, and redeemed us.
NOBODY GOES TO HELL for any sin EXCEPT ONE. The one sin Jesus could not die for.


That is the sin of Unbelief, dishonoring God, REFUSING JESUS'S GIFT OF FORGIVENESS, ETERNAL LIFE AND SALVATION which he purchased with His blood on the Cross.
There is NO DEFENSE before God for that.
You will not be given a hearing, nor opportunity to Justify unbelief.

Only the good works of Christians count towards rewards in heaven.

ALL The "good works" of unbelievers are as contemptible as a used Kotex, (bloody menstrual rag) in God's eyes. (Without faith, it is impossible to please God.)

Isaiah 64:6 [Full Chapter]
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

That salvation is obtained by Believing and trusting in Jesus Christ as Lord and SAVIOR and that he DIED OUR DEATH FOR US (ALL) on the Cross and took our punishment.

You don't get to have YOUR sins forgiven but your mother's not.

Jesus, by the Cross, thereby purchased PEACE BETWEEN MEN, as well as peace between man and God.

You and I really have nothing against anybody, regardless of the gravity or outrageous evil.
THAT takes some serious meditation, prayer, Scripture and Holy Spirit to realize.
Most won't invest it to gain that.

The world is awash in undiscipled, Baby Christians who want cheap Grace and easy answers.

 

[Bumpkin]

one of the worst things to discover is that ones mom is a sociopath. been there! done that!

Mine was, passed in 2011, I cut her out of my life not quite a year before she finally managed to destroy herself. I wish I would have dropped her years earlier. I only regret that she was a parasite and narcissist, NOT that I ended the misery of keeping her in my life. When I got the news of her death in 2011, at first I was shocked, and then I cried with absolute relief. It was definitely the beginning of the rest of my life and in a very happy way.

!!!Walk away!!!

 

[vestige]

Rough crowd.

Nothing follows

 

[Countrymouse]

Point to any name on any random list. You don't have any feelings toward that person one way or the other. That's how I feel about some of my siblings and relatives. They are just names on a list. Until you have no feelings good or bad toward them then you are not free of them.

This.

As long as you don't forgive, YOU are the one in prison and enslavement---not them.


Forgive.

Love (not the "feeling" of love---Love is NOT "feelings"--it is how you ACT)

RELEASE them from owing you ANTHING.


You will not be at peace until you do.


And---I have a little secret for you.


As long as you hold them in hate or resentment or ANYTHING less than full forgiveness in your heart---

YOU WILL NEVER BE FREE OF THEM.


It doesn't matter if you move to the other side of the earth--


YOU WILL CARRY THEM WITH YOU WHEREVER YOU GO.


They are IN you---

because the resentment, hurt, anger, etc., you feel---is still IN you.


Until you let it GO--you have NOT forgiven.


Someone above said that God only forgives when we ASK for it.


I disagree---God has ALREADY provided for our forgiveness, by Jesus' death---but it's like a check for $1,000,000---it does us no good until we "cash" it--by receiving and believing in Jesus.

The "check" (the forgiveness) is ALREADY THERE---but it won't be REAL FOR US until we ACCEPT it.


GOD is not WITHHOLDING forgiveenss---WE are REFUSING to RECEIVE it.


But God also said this:

"Forgive us our trespasses, IN THE SAME WAY AS WE FORGIVE those who have trespassed against us."


Think about that.

Would we want GOD to treat us in the same way as we treat those who have sinned against us?

We WILL be forgiven on the basis of HOW WE FORGIVE others, this verse indicates.


One last thought.


I once heard a preacher say, when people told him, "I HATE my ______________! I will NEVER NEVER be like _____!"

He'd respond, "Wow. That's too bad."

They'd say, "Why?"

He'd answer: "Because in a few years you will be JUST like ________"

They'd respond, indignantly, in anger--"HOW dare you say that!?!? That person did ________ to me, and I've NEVER done _____to anyone in my life!"

The preacher would respond---

"When you say, 'I'll NEVER be LIKE so-and-so', you are centering the thoughts of your mind ON that person and on all the things you hate about them. The Bible says, 'What a man thinks in his heart, SO HE IS'--and by centering your throughts on this other person, constantly rehearsing their faults over and over, you are concentrating your THOUGHTS on them. Even if all you do is tell yourself, 'I'll NEVER be LIKE _____', you are centering your thoughts on them within, constantly thinking about and comparing them in your mind to your own behavior and to others. Eventually, what you THINK ABOUT will manifest. You may not be a wife-beater as ____ was, but you may demonstrate the same anger and impatience with others in OTHER situations. You may never cheat on your spouse as _______ did, but you distance yourself from them in other ways, such as putting work ahead of your family relationships. You may not be addicted to alcohol or drugs as __________ was, but you excuse your weaknesses and faults in some other way and avoid taking responsibility for them. You may not treat others hatefully verbally as _______ did, but you develop a critical, cynical, or suspicious attitude that manifests itself in other areas. No matter WHAT you do, if you do not forgive, you TAKE THAT PERSON EVERY WHERE YOU GO, and eventually--YOU WILL BECOME LIKE THEM."

The preacher said that this was what Jesus meant when he said, "You that judgest....DOEST the same things."

 

[Old Gray Mare]

I think what Countrymouse is trying to say is:

Unless you can truly forgive those who hurt you, thru rehashing painful memories, they will continue to hurt you. Forgiveness takes away the ability of those memories to inflict more pain.

What you resist you become.

Note: to forgive doesn't mean to forget or that you need to try to have a relationship with them again. Ever.

I found the hardest person to forgive is myself. Part of it was for not recognizing sooner that I expected something from someone who was not capable of giving or had no intentions of giving, despite promises to the contrary.

Forgiveness is one of Jesus's most important teachings and one of God's greatest gifts.

 

[homepark]

Some of you have no sense of shame. Life is difficult, that is for sure. Suffering is optional. If you are in a toxic relationship, you are part of the problem. Run, don't walk away. I believe that God does wants us to be happy, joyous and free. Drop the baggage.

 

[echo19]

I did the same with my mother. She was toxic to the very end.

 

[psychgirl]

I'm an INFJ. Same here. Once I cut ties, I am DONE.

Same here... INFJ...I “might” still talk to someone or feel sorry and sad... but I’m like a concrete block inside, once I’m “done”... I’ll never trust again, ignore invites, ignore attempts to start over... it’s almost as though the person isn’t even in my memory bank anymore. I might even shed some tears....but just “undraw” that line in the sand.

 

[echo19]

Same here... INFJ...I “might” still talk to someone or feel sorry and sad... but I’m like a concrete block inside, once I’m “done”... I’ll never trust again, ignore invites, ignore attempts to start over... it’s almost as though the person isn’t even in my memory bank anymore. I might even shed some tears....but just “undraw” that line in the sand.

My mother died a year ago. It was quite a relief to be honest. The only thing I ever felt bad about was not shedding a tear over her death. Like something was wrong with me.

 

[CaryC]

Some things/verses to consider:

This verse has been noted:

Exo_20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

And the following verses should at least be viewed in conjunction with the above verse:

Mat 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
Mat 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

Luk 12:51 Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
Luk 12:52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
Luk 12:53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

And this verse was quoted:

Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

It should be noted that that verse was directed to the disciples, for the disciples, not unbelievers. And it should be noted that in the first couple hundred years of Christianity it was cited as being true.

It should also be noted that over the course of Jesus' ministry (3 years) he started out talking to the multitudes, and the challenges of the Pharisee's, as time went on He withdrew from them due to rejection, name calling, and accusations, and spent His time with those that believed in Him. Mary, Martha, the 12. In the end while praying in the garden, they came and sought Him out for trial, He didn't go looking for them.

Jesus loved us all, enough to die for us all, BUT He didn't spend his time with those that didn't believe in Him (Pharisee's). He separated Himself from them.

No where in scripture, as far as I know, is it stated that we are to endure abuse in family relationships. Love yes, forgive when they repent, yes. But to stay in an abusive relationship, no.

We are warned that we will be abused by society, and unbelievers, as a factual statement.

And I would also note that for each individual that line in the sand will be at a different place.

 

[Homestyle]

I didn't attend my father's funeral. Hadn't seen him in years. A cousin called to tell me about the funeral arrangements. I said whatever is arranged is not my concern or business. No feeling of sadness or anger. My DD asked me not long ago if I knew if my father was still alive and I said I heard he died.

 

[Bones]

Dealing with toxic family was terrible.

Now that my mental brother in law is cut out, he doubles down on my 85 year old mother in law as to how good HE is and how horrible EVERYONE else treats him.

We see him this way: An alcoholic who causes destruction for decades decides he is no longer an addict. Because HE decided the past is the past ( which has happened many times already ) everyone else is to forget his awful behavior and be a family.

Just because HE forgets, doesn't mean we all forget. It isn't a matter of if, but when, he will misbehave and manage everyone with his temper tantrums as it has always been.

 

[homepark]

Trust and respect are earned commodities. If BIL was serious about his sobriety, he would know that.

 

[Cardinal]

Losers always blame everyone else for their situation.

This is rather a sad thread. I knew it would be.
Too many dysfunctional families out there.

 

[raven]

Considering the number of INTJs here, I am certain just about everyone has a similar story.
Personally, I have four or maybe twenty, not really hard to keep count. I just don't really care.

 

[Bumpkin]

delete

 

[Bumpkin]

This.

As long as you don't forgive, YOU are the one in prison and enslavement---not them.


Forgive.

Love (not the "feeling" of love---Love is NOT "feelings"--it is how you ACT)

RELEASE them from owing you ANTHING.


You will not be at peace until you do.


And---I have a little secret for you.


As long as you hold them in hate or resentment or ANYTHING less than full forgiveness in your heart---

YOU WILL NEVER BE FREE OF THEM.


It doesn't matter if you move to the other side of the earth--


YOU WILL CARRY THEM WITH YOU WHEREVER YOU GO.


They are IN you---

because the resentment, hurt, anger, etc., you feel---is still IN you.


Until you let it GO--you have NOT forgiven.


Someone above said that God only forgives when we ASK for it.


I disagree---God has ALREADY provided for our forgiveness, by Jesus' death---but it's like a check for $1,000,000---it does us no good until we "cash" it--by receiving and believing in Jesus.

The "check" (the forgiveness) is ALREADY THERE---but it won't be REAL FOR US until we ACCEPT it.


GOD is not WITHHOLDING forgiveenss---WE are REFUSING to RECEIVE it.


But God also said this:

"Forgive us our trespasses, IN THE SAME WAY AS WE FORGIVE those who have trespassed against us."


Think about that.

Would we want GOD to treat us in the same way as we treat those who have sinned against us?

We WILL be forgiven on the basis of HOW WE FORGIVE others, this verse indicates.


One last thought.


I once heard a preacher say, when people told him, "I HATE my ______________! I will NEVER NEVER be like _____!"

He'd respond, "Wow. That's too bad."

They'd say, "Why?"

He'd answer: "Because in a few years you will be JUST like ________"

They'd respond, indignantly, in anger--"HOW dare you say that!?!? That person did ________ to me, and I've NEVER done _____to anyone in my life!"

The preacher would respond---

"When you say, 'I'll NEVER be LIKE so-and-so', you are centering the thoughts of your mind ON that person and on all the things you hate about them. The Bible says, 'What a man thinks in his heart, SO HE IS'--and by centering your throughts on this other person, constantly rehearsing their faults over and over, you are concentrating your THOUGHTS on them. Even if all you do is tell yourself, 'I'll NEVER be LIKE _____', you are centering your thoughts on them within, constantly thinking about and comparing them in your mind to your own behavior and to others. Eventually, what you THINK ABOUT will manifest. You may not be a wife-beater as ____ was, but you may demonstrate the same anger and impatience with others in OTHER situations. You may never cheat on your spouse as _______ did, but you distance yourself from them in other ways, such as putting work ahead of your family relationships. You may not be addicted to alcohol or drugs as __________ was, but you excuse your weaknesses and faults in some other way and avoid taking responsibility for them. You may not treat others hatefully verbally as _______ did, but you develop a critical, cynical, or suspicious attitude that manifests itself in other areas. No matter WHAT you do, if you do not forgive, you TAKE THAT PERSON EVERY WHERE YOU GO, and eventually--YOU WILL BECOME LIKE THEM."

The preacher said that this was what Jesus meant when he said, "You that judgest....DOEST the same things."

You are right. I am holding that burning coal in my hand and hoping that it will hurt the ones who hurt me. It has taken me years to think of my mother in a positive way, and I now miss her, "even tho". Mom and her partner spelled it that way on purpose, and it's high time for me to adopt it fully. I thank you for your words, and I am saving them and will look at them often to help me.

 

[Bumpkin]

Some of you have no sense of shame. Life is difficult, that is for sure. Suffering is optional. If you are in a toxic relationship, you are part of the problem. Run, don't walk away. I believe that God does wants us to be happy, joyous and free. Drop the baggage.

How does this have anything to do with shame?

 

[Bumpkin]

Losers always blame everyone else for their situation.

This is rather a sad thread. I knew it would be.
Too many dysfunctional families out there.

Cardinal, even with the endless combinations of bad relationships, are you condemning receivers and abusers? You did say that losers always blame everyone else for their situation. I don't consider myself a loser in the situation with my mother, but it did ruffle my feathers. Just because someone is in a relationship with a toxic person does not make them a loser. Although, I must say, that for the last 10 years of my mother's life, she managed to make me the bad guy around almost everyone with whom she interacted, she was a master manipulator and I think that was her only pleasure in life

 

[Bumpkin]

Manipulative people HATE it when their target just up and walks away.

Yes, they do. And as a former target, I can say that it is a wonderful feeling.

 

[Bardou]

Rough crowd.

Nothing follows

I like to think of myself as a "tough" person in the crowd. It's called self preservation. Toxic people regardless of who they are in relation to you, seek to suck the life blood out of you...only if you allow it. Yes, WALK AWAY if you love yourself. I'm happy and the better for it. Not rough at all.

 

[Cardinal]

Cardinal, even with the endless combinations of bad relationships, are you condemning receivers and abusers? You did say that losers always blame everyone else for their situation. I don't consider myself a loser in the situation with my mother, but it did ruffle my feathers. Just because someone is in a relationship with a toxic person does not make them a loser. Although, I must say, that for the last 10 years of my mother's life, she managed to make me the bad guy around almost everyone with whom she interacted, she was a master manipulator and I think that was her only pleasure in life

Read the post above mine (#56)

 

[homepark]

How does this have anything to do with shame?

Shame on those preaching selected Bible quotes to those in such obvious pain.

 

[WalknTrot]

I don't know who or how far back someone taught me this lesson, but it is that all of your relationships with spouses, friends, family, business partners, should make you a BETTER person, not a worse one. If knowing and spending time with a person doesn't inspire you, makes you more caring, teach you something valuable, or brings you joy, it is not a healthy combination. If the relationship makes you a worse person - time to cut ties.

There are still too many people out there who are a minus - not a plus. Life is short. 'Nuff said.

 

[ShyGirl]

I have cut ties with several people and my life has gotten better for it. The worst is the cut with my daughter. I stay out of her life and I do not talk with her. I email her, like on her birthday but that is it. She pushes all of my buttons and calls me names but that is not the real problem. I grew up being beaten by my mom a lot and it made me tough. I fight back! I did everything I could to raise my children different from my upbringing but my daughter just likes to get at me and I don't want to argue and fight with her, but I will if pushed. If I am backed into a corner I WILL fight back and I feel that I just don't want our relationship to be that way. I feel it is better for us to not talk because she will go after me and we are both very opinionated. She is a total liberal and she has even called me racist and talked bad about my husband because of his guns. I am sure we will not have a chance at any reconciliation until at least after Trump is out of office, sad to say.

 

[Bumpkin]

Read the post above mine (#56)

That did not answer my question. I'm not into cryptic games.

 

[Walrus Whisperer]

The cost of love, when faced with hate:

Is it EASIER on US to cut off people that hurt us?

Of course.

Is it right?

Well---let me ask this.

How much have each of us--have you--hurt God by our sins?

I know I've hurt Him times beyond count--

And if He treated me as I deserve for hurting Him---

well, the answer is obvious.


What if God treated us as we deserve?


"What if God had treated me the way I am treating________________?"


It is very hard.


Very hard.


Impossible, in fact.


That is why, the only way we can love that way....


Is if HE loves those UNLOVABLE people....


through us.



he does not treat us as our sins deserve
or repay us according to our iniquities.

For as high as the heavens are above the earth,
so great is his love for those who fear him;

as far as the east is from the west,
so far has he removed our transgressions from us.

As a father has compassion on his children,
so the Lord has compassion on those who fear him;

for he knows how we are formed,
he remembers that we are dust.



John 13:35
By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Fu7nnt<

country mouse, I just found 2 more copies of the Passion Of the Christ, watched both to make sure they were ok so now I have 3 available to give away. One is mine.
The persons i gave up on was my mother and my half brother. Mother had something against me from day one, i never understood why. she did horrible mean things to me her whole life. my sisters could do no wrong. my Brother molested me and then got my daughter years later. there are a few more now in the expanded next generation who are toxic, ya just avoid them when possible. I take great joy in my firstborn grandson, who is one of the best men you could ever want and hes approuching 30. and my daughter just had another baby in april. I spend most of my life alone, just to keep humanity as far away from me as possible, since most of them are shits and dont even know it. I have my LORD, THE COMFORTER.

 

[Countrymouse]

Some of you have no sense of shame. Life is difficult, that is for sure. Suffering is optional. If you are in a toxic relationship, you are part of the problem. Run, don't walk away. I believe that God does wants us to be happy, joyous and free. Drop the baggage.

Do NOT assume that I do not speak from experience.


I am an only child---the darling and pet of my father.


The year I graduated high school, my daddy got sick with what seemed like a cold--but despite weeks of treatment, it was only getting worse.

Finally the doctor put him in the hospital. He was admitted on my 18th birthday. What I had hoped to be a happy milestone--my "official" entry into adulthood---became a day filled with stomach-crunching and soul-grinding fear.

One week later--a week to the day after my birthday--Daddy died of massive heart failure.

A month after that--during an argument (and my mother and I had LOTS of those)--I threw up to her that she wouldn't be talking to me that way if Daddy was still here. (He often stepped in between us and defended me or at least defused arguments when she'd attack me.)

She shouted back, "YOU'RE the one who KILLED your Daddy! He was worried to death over the way you act! YOU are the reason he's DEAD!"

(and just as a side note---I never drank, never smoked, up to this point had never dated or even kissed a boy, went to church, read the Bible, made straight A's and was my high school class's Valedictorian, was making plans for college when my Dad died, and did my best to help him and my mom around the house and farm.)

And then she marched out of the house to the back yard.

And I went to the cabinet--where my Daddy's pistol was kept--and came within a hair of using it, so I could escape that hell and be with him again.

I will skip over the next 14 years, to my marriage.

Mother complained and quarreled the entire time I took her with me to shop for my wedding dress (which I paid for--she refused absolutely to pay for the wedding. It wasn't so much that she disapproved of the man--just of the fact that I was marrying at all, and thus leaving her alone). I was so embarrassed at the dress store, as she sat outside the dressing room while I tried on dresses (I ended up choosing one of the samples off the rack, to save money---not saying that for pity, because I'm proud of how my Heavenly "Daddy"--God--provided EVERYTHING for me to have a BEAUTIFUL wedding, even on a very short shoestring)--she sat there and LOUDLY complained and quarreled about me, about me getting married, about what a bad daughter I was, so everyone in the store could hear her and several turned and looked curiously at us----think Vickie Lawrence's portrayal of Eunice's mom on the Carole Burnett show, and how she talked to Eunice, and you'll have the picture.

After I got married, only a few months after my wedding, I lost a baby when 3 months along to a miscarriage. When I told my mom--expecting understanding since she had, I knew, lost several babies to miscarriage (that was why they gave up and adopted me)---her response was to reply, in a low, angry voice: "I hope you NEVER DO have any children!" Even as used as I was to her sharp-as-a-butcher-knife comments, this one floored me. For a minute I couldn't speak at all, and when I got my breath back I could only whisper, "Mom--that is a TERRIBLE thing to say to me! Why would you say something like that to me?" She just responded, "Well, I know what you're like, and I'm afraid you wouldn't be good to them."

These are only a few examples.

But I will not give more.

I absolutely HATED that woman, for many years.

But then I realized---I would never be FREE of her, until I FORGAVE her. (Which, I am sorry to say, I was unable to truly do until many years after her death).

Otherwise, her meanness--and MY RESPONSE to it-- would make me her prisoner forever.

I thank God that now I can look at her actually with compassion, and understand things about her (thanks to things others shared with me about her youth) that help me see WHY she acted as she did. Understanding some of those things now, I can actually wonder how she handled life as well as she did. In many ways, she was a victim of abuse, herself (verbal and emotional, not physical or sexual).

But I wasn't "free" of the pain her hurtful comments caused UNTIL I could "let go"---release her from my own unforgiveness and resentment and pain, and leave her to God and HIS righteous judgement.

I have other such stories as well---but that one will do, for now.

 

[Countrymouse]

Some things/verses to consider:

This verse has been noted:

Exo_20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

And the following verses should at least be viewed in conjunction with the above verse:

Mat 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
Mat 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

Luk 12:51 Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
Luk 12:52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
Luk 12:53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

And this verse was quoted:

Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

It should be noted that that verse was directed to the disciples, for the disciples, not unbelievers. And it should be noted that in the first couple hundred years of Christianity it was cited as being true.

It should also be noted that over the course of Jesus' ministry (3 years) he started out talking to the multitudes, and the challenges of the Pharisee's, as time went on He withdrew from them due to rejection, name calling, and accusations, and spent His time with those that believed in Him. Mary, Martha, the 12. In the end while praying in the garden, they came and sought Him out for trial, He didn't go looking for them.

Jesus loved us all, enough to die for us all, BUT He didn't spend his time with those that didn't believe in Him (Pharisee's). He separated Himself from them.

No where in scripture, as far as I know, is it stated that we are to endure abuse in family relationships. Love yes, forgive when they repent, yes. But to stay in an abusive relationship, no.

We are warned that we will be abused by society, and unbelievers, as a factual statement.

And I would also note that for each individual that line in the sand will be at a different place.

Agreed.

NO WHERE did I say we have to remain with the person who is hurting you or treating you with abuse.

I stayed with my mom because she was my mother, a widow (no husband or other male relative to help her run our farm), elderly (in her 60's when Daddy died), in poor health (diagnosed with cancer some 10 years before it finally killed her--she refused all treatment and it finally took over her whole system), and because I felt I would be disobeying God to leave her, since she and Daddy had adopted me and given me a home (which was relatively happy in my childhood--it was only after Daddy was gone and I had no one to stand between me and her that things got really unbearable) and I believed it would be disobeying the command to "honor your father and mother" for me just to say, in essence, "Well, good luck, you old ____. I've had it with the way you treat me, and I'm leaving. See ya in the funny papers."

Don't think I wasn't tempted.

But when I got older, I learned that I didn't have to let her "arrows", actually "hit" me any more. I learned how to detach myself emotionally--to ask myself honestly "Am I REALLY guilty of this thing she is accusing me of? Am I REALLY the bad person she is SAYING I am?" and realize-- NO, the person I am is who GOD says I am, and my value is the value HE places on me--NO other human.

And after I got married and had a home of my own, I still came by (almost daily) and cleaned her house, took her grocery shopping or to the doctor or hair dresser, cut her grass, etc. I often wished I DIDN'T have to come. I often left her home so angry I was beating on the steering wheel and screaming. So I am NOT saying I was a perfect angel, or that the forgiveness was something that came easily and instantly.

BY NO means am I saying that.

And I know--in some cases, where there is danger of PHYSICAL attack--then YES we need to get out of there. God did not give us our lives to throw away, and He does NOT ask us to submit to sexual abuse. In those cases, of COURSE get out if you can.

What I am talking about is NOT what is happening OUTSIDE you, but INSIDE you.

And if you want to be free of them---truly---then INSIDE your own heart, you must forgive. You must release. And you will know you have, when the pain doesn't feel like a knife anymore, and when the remembrance of all the hurtful things they did and said doesn't make you want to kick holes in the wall, or throw their picture across the room, or....well, you get the idea.

 

[Bardou]

0The biggest blow will come when you pass on, your money and private property is left to a more deserving endeavor than a child who hates you. I don't have that problem, just a toxic family outside of my children and husband.

PS Scripture doesnt work with me. I don't believe in guilt trips. Banging someone over the head with the Bible turns me further away and probably others. Had enough guilt trips from sitting in the pew.

 

[homepark]

One of the great self deceptions is that if it worked for me, it will work for everyone. It is a bigger blessing to understand, than be understood. Suffering really is optional in many cases.

 

[Countrymouse]

It's sort of like the threads we have all the time on various diseases.

And those who have HAD the disease--and found a cure that WORKED, and said, "Try this! It worked for me!"---were never accused of being "judgmental" or of "hitting others over the head" or of trying to cause "guilt trips"with their suggestions.

They shared what WORKED--because it DID work--and they hope to alleviate others' suffering and HELP them.

I am sorry so many are in pain.

I have been there (and still struggle, with other situations, though not with my mom any more. It is, of course, harder to forgive WHILE you are IN the situation, and the person is currently hurting you continually.

I only thought to help ease your pain--by sharing what worked for me---by going to the only One who HAS experienced more pain, and more offenses against Himself TO forgive, than any one of us EVER will.

HE--ultimately--is therefore the ONLY one who truly HAS all the answers.

Pax. May you find peace.