GUNS/RLTD Ghost gun poll

[Luddite]

So, why not just put a serial number on anything you make?

Some people got tired of playing "mother may I" with the batfaggots. Barrel length. Foregrip on a pistol or a rifle. Make a mistake and the consequences are lasting. Just ask R. Weaver. (Nothing changed the lethality either. Just emotional strokes to the back of American kitten-people)

Don't forget the fact that these have been legal. People have been complying.

Changing the rules as well as making them murky have been the batfaggots' MO for years. Jmho

Eta: Now that many unserialized lowers are out in the wild, they may try to get people to retroactively put a number on them. See, I suspect any further false flags will be done with clean lowers. Makes their job of ensuring "sanitized tools" easier. The fast&furious debacle as well as Paddock at LV were a potential minefield for them. Pure speculation on my part.

 

[Cag3db1rd]

I call them Paranormal Pewpews, of which I have none, do not have any knowledge of the creation of such, nor do I have equipment, materials, or STL files to print any parts.

 

[WalknTrot]

Just offhand, I'd say there are probably multiple 1000X's as many - with serial numbers - that are in the hands of folks, passed down in families/private sale/gifts (legally), many from before anybody thought about paper, or after, ownership muddled beyond any traceability (again - legally).

If a 'ghost gun' is one made without a serial number - haha, and not just filed off by a gang-banger or a paranoid bunker bunny....there ain't that many. (**Adding...they probably just tend have a higher profile and show up more often than Grandpa's deer rifle, stored in police evidence lock-ups. )

Another added thought: Do you think anybody is checking/tracing serial numbers in Ukraine right now?

 

[Luddite]

there ain't that many.

I believe you're wrong. Many companies have been making 80 percent lowers for years.
How many 3 d printers have been sold?

This all started when Stag arms got caught with unserialized lowers in their shop.
Rumors at the time circulated they were making them for some "black ops" and one goobermint agency was stepping on another agency's weiner. Again pure speculation...

 

[Thinwater]

I believe you're wrong. Many companies have been making 80 percent lowers for years.
How many 3 d printers have been sold?

This all started when Stag arms got caught with unserialized lowers in their shop.
Rumors at the time circulated they were making them for some "black ops" and one goobermint agency was stepping on another agency's weiner. Again pure speculation...

My little company has produced several hundred thousand of them.

There are always many unsterilized lowers in a shop, you have to make them first so you don't serialize junk parts then have to track their destruction. Stag had a bunch of parts not serialized when ATF was there and still had not serialized them when ATF came back many weeks later, and admitted it.

We have strict rules here about serializing any finished lower within 24 hours.

 

[Thinwater]

So, why not just put a serial number on anything you make?

Its not about having a number on it.

They want you to put on a serial number, maker info (Your info), have a background check done on a 4473 at a FFL with markings trackable back to the store who did the background check. Then they can confiscate it later since it is on paper and they know you have it when they collect the 4473 forms when the dealer goes under of they pass gun control and collect the 4473 forms.

 

[drafter]

I’ve got a metal saw, grinder, welder, and a drill press. A regular manufacturing facility according to the government I suppose.

 

[Dobbin]

Then they can confiscate it later since it is on paper and they know you have it when they collect the 4473 forms when the dealer goes under of they pass gun control and collect the 4473 forms.

Like Hunter Biden's "Dumpster Gun."

"Top Men" are now handling it.

Dobbin

 

[33dInd]

Decades ago
Kurt Saxon , if memory serves me , sold plans on how to build a slam fire ww2 grease gun
All you needed to buy at that time was a barrel and a magazine. Everything else was shop built

 

[2ndAmendican]

Hell, there's an entire industry built on "parts kits". People who have the slightest bit of mechanical/fabrication skills can either make their own receiver or purchase an 80% and finish it. I bet there are at least 100,000 built per year.

 

[WTSR]

Credit card companies do not have that information.

We do not know WHAT you bought only WHERE you bought it. So yea, we know that you bought something at Cabela’s or the local gun store but we do NOT know WHAT you bought.

We know the card # and 4 pieces of information: the ISSUING BANK that the money comes from when you spend it, the MERCHANT, as in Cabela’s or whoever, the ACQUIRING BANK, where the MERCHANT banks which is where the money will be deposited, and the AMOUNT of the transaction.

That is all of the info about the transaction we as a credit card company get on our end.

The merchant’s point-of-sale system (POS) is a whole different matter in regards to what it might collect and keep either locally or centrally at Cabela’s headquarters for example.

Yes this starts the investigation when you purchase something from a particular vendor (small subset of vendors that sell these things) then they simply request the records, many of them might hold FFLs, they have really no choice if they are served a search warrant.

Banks will comply if asked about purchases from certain vendors as well, I remember this occurring recently.

 

[ShadowMan]

So, why not just put a serial number on anything you make?

I've got it! just use a "CEREAL NUMBER"! i.e. "Corn Pop 1", that's a CEREAL number....right? ....and use the same number on every receiver.

 

[Bob the Builder]

[QUOTE="Thinwater,
We will FLOOD the country with low priced, high quality, AR15 lowers if they ban our 80% products. We will find dealers to do $10 lower transfers and crank out 300-500 a day.
[/QUOTE]
$10 dollar transfers hell. Been doing this since 1980 and never charged a dime for a transfer yet. One in a great while someone in the know will drop off a nice single malt but all transfers are free.
I understand those who do though. Gotta keep the lights on.
Edited to add:
Say the word and the sale begins

 

[Publius]

I do not own any ghost guns and I have no problem with people that do. As for the government claim that people are building them and then selling them to black street gangs is bogus. From what I know and learned in life most blacks cannot fix a lawn mower never mind building a rifle from parts that need to be fitted with a degree of precision.

 

[Luddite]

From what I know and learned in life most blacks cannot fix a lawn mower never mind building a rifle from parts that need to be fitted with a degree of precision.

Dats rayciss.
True, but rayciss

 

[Thinwater]

I expected this last week. Now the AP says it is coming "Soon"

Last chance if you ever wanted to build one.

Associated Press
Biden expected to release rule on ghost guns in days
By MICHAEL BALSAMO, Associated Press - 4h ago
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194

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© Provided by Associated Press



WASHINGTON (AP) — The Biden administration will come out with its long-awaited ghost gun rule — aimed at reining in privately made firearms without serial numbers that are increasingly cropping up at crime scenes — as soon as Monday, three people familiar with the matter told The Associated Press.

Completion of the rule comes as the White House and the Justice Department have been under growing pressure to crack down on gun deaths and violent crime in the U.S.


The White House has also been weighing naming Steve Dettelbach, a former U.S. attorney from Ohio, to run the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, or ATF, the people said. Biden had to withdraw the nomination of his first nominee, gun-control advocate David Chipman, after the nomination stalled for months because of opposition from Republicans and some Democrats in the Senate.

For nearly a year, the rule has been making its way through the federal regulation process. Gun safety groups and Democrats in Congress have been pushing for the Justice Department to finish the rule for months. It will probably be met with heavy resistance from gun groups and draw litigation in the coming weeks.

The exact timing of the announcement hasn't been set, the people said. They could not discuss the matter publicly and spoke to AP on condition of anonymity. The White House declined to comment.

On Sunday, the Senate's top Democrat, Sen. Chuck Schumer, of New York, implored the administration to move faster.
“It’s high time for a ghost gun exorcism before the proliferation peaks, and before more people get hurt — or worse,” Schumer said in a statement. “My message is a simple one: No more waiting on these proposed federal rules." Ghost guns are "too easy to build, too hard to trace and too dangerous to ignore.”


Biden expected to release rule on ghost guns in days (msn.com)

 

[Thinwater]

CNN is reporting that they expect the new rules "As soon as tomorrow"

 

[wintery_storm]

The other thread made me want to post this poll. Before continuing, note that in this software (unlike our old vB software) it is impossible to look up who voted how on polls. They are completely and securely anonymous. That being said, do you own a ghost gun? Do you have the ability to MAKE a ghost gun?

This is a multiple choice poll.

what is a ghost gun.

 

[WTSR]

Illinois General Assembly - Full Text of HB4383

Legislation listing for the Illinois General Assembly

ilga.gov

Illinois passes Ghost Gun ban in the middle of the night.

 

[Dennis Olson]

what is a ghost gun.

Look it up.

 

[Luddite]

what is a ghost gun.

A gun that doesn't have a serial number.
Not more lethal. No magic properties.

Stupid, emotional people have gotten squeamish.

 

[desert_fox]

My question is if this "new regulation " will affect parts. Need a barrel? A BCG? New trigger? 4473 it.

 

[Thinwater]

From USA Today


WASHINGTON – President Joe Biden will announce new federal regulations on Monday to rein in the use of untraceable firearms known as ghost guns that law-enforcement officers say are turning up frequently at crime scenes across the country.



The new rules, which Biden and Deputy Attorney General Lisa Monaco will announce during a Rose Garden ceremony, will target privately made firearms that can be assembled from do-it-yourself kits purchased online or in a store. The weapons contain no serial number, which makes it difficult to trace the owner.




Senior administration officials, who briefed reporters ahead of Biden’s announcement, said Sunday the new rules will clarify that the unfinished parts sold in the kits, such as the fame of a handgun or the receiver of a long gun, will qualify as firearms under federal law.



Commercial manufacturers of the kits will have to be licensed and must add serial numbers on the kits’ frame or receiver. Commercial sellers of the kits also will have to become licensed and will be required to run background checks on potential buyers prior to a sale, just like they must do with commercially made firearms.

 

[Marthanoir]

They were all chufty bollox last month
when the Ukrainians were handing out full auto AKs to anyone that wanted one.

 

[ainitfunny]

Wisdom suggests "skip this thread" but I just had to put my 2cents in.

 

[Thinwater]

Wisdom suggests "skip this thread" but I just had to put my 2cents in.

Exactly why I deleted my Facebook page a few years ago. I can't keep my big mouth shut.

 

[bracketquant]

I own no guns. I'll stay away from gun owners turning each other into ghosts.