SCI Who's a good boy? Why 'dog-speak' is important for bonding with your pet

[Housecarl]

For links see article source....
Posted for fair use.....
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/03/180306115803.htm

Who's a good boy? Why 'dog-speak' is important for bonding with your pet

Date: March 6, 2018
Source: University of York
Summary: Scientists have shown that the way we speak to our canine friends is important in relationship-building between pet and owner, similar to the way that 'baby-talk' is to bonding between a baby and an adult.

Scientists at the University of York have shown that the way we speak to our canine friends is important in relationship-building between pet and owner, similar to the way that 'baby-talk' is to bonding between a baby and an adult.

Speech interaction experiments between adult dogs and humans showed that so called "dog-speak" improves attention and may help humans to socially bond with their pets.

Previous studies on communicating with dogs had suggested that talking in a high-pitch voice with exaggerated emotion, just as adults do with babies, improved engagement with puppies but made little difference with adult dogs.

Researchers at York tested this theory with new experiments designed to understand more about why humans talk to dogs like this and if it is useful to the dogs in some way, or whether humans do this simply because they like to treat dogs in the same way as babies.

Dr Katie Slocombe from the University of York's Department of Psychology said: "A special speech register, known as infant-directed speech, is thought to aid language acquisition and improve the way a human baby bonds with an adult. This form of speech is known to share some similarities with the way in which humans talk to their pet dogs, known as dog-directed speech.

"This high-pitched rhythmic speech is common in human interactions with dogs in western cultures, but there isn't a great deal known about whether it benefits a dog in the same way that it does a baby.

"We wanted to look at this question and see whether social bonding between animals and humans was influenced by the type and content of the communication."

Unlike previous experiments, the research team positioned real humans in the same room as the dog, rather than broadcasting speech over a loud speaker without a human present. This made the set up much more naturalistic for the dogs and helped the team test whether dogs not only paid more attention more to 'dog speak', but were motivated to spend more time with the person who had spoken to them in that way.

Researchers did a series of speech tests with adult dogs, where they were given the chance to listen to one person using dog-directed speech containing phrases such as 'you're a good dog', and 'shall we go for a walk?', and then another person using adult-directed speech with no dog-related content, such as 'I went to the cinema last night.'.

Attention during the speech was measured, and following the speech, the dogs were allowed to choose which speaker they wanted to physically interact with.

The speakers then mixed dog-directed speech with non-dog-related words and adult-directed speech with dog-related words, to allow the researchers to understand whether it was the high-pitched emotional tone of the speech that dogs were attracted to or the words themselves.

Alex Benjamin, PhD student from the University's Department of Psychology, said: "We found that adult dogs were more likely to want to interact and spend time with the speaker that used dog-directed speech with dog-related content, than they did those that used adult-directed speech with no dog-related content.

"When we mixed-up the two types of speech and content, the dogs showed no preference for one speaker over the other. This suggests that adult dogs need to hear dog-relevant words spoken in a high-pitched emotional voice in order to find it relevant.

"We hope this research will be useful for pet owners interacting with their dogs, and also for veterinary professionals and rescue workers."

Story Source:

Materials provided by University of York. Note: Content may be edited for style and length.

Journal Reference:

Alex Benjamin, Katie Slocombe. ‘Who’s a good boy?!’ Dogs prefer naturalistic dog-directed speech. Animal Cognition, 2018; DOI: 10.1007/s10071-018-1172-4

 

[dstraito]

I wonder if dog talk is better interaction than trying to get them to scoot over so I will have room in the bed.

Just wondering.

 

[seraphima]

I wonder if dog talk is better interaction than trying to get them to scoot over so I will have room in the bed.

Just wondering.

For sure! : We've considered a king size bed, but the room is too small.

 

[Garryowen]

I wonder if dog talk is better interaction than trying to get them to scoot over so I will have room in the bed.

Just wondering.

That's a major point of contention. But I have resigned myself to sleeping on the edge for at least a couple hours.

 

[Rayku]

Not being very knowledgeable on dogs, for those of you who are, do you agree or disagree with the article and why for either case?

 

[Chili]

I lectured my 12 y.o heeler in an adult directed tone using adult language about his eating the kittys food, and he just looked at me like I was crazy.

Chili

 

[Ractivist]

looking back on a nine dogs........ I'd say there's truth here. It's like when you go face to face and go into the good boy, good girl..exaggerated speak, the tail goes wild, the paws pulsate and bounce..... compare that with bad dog, firm resonating in their face......cowire, knowing why I'm upset, along with a little something up in their nose to reinforce why they were a bad dog....... or grabbing them by the collar and making sure to correlate what bad is about.

Dogs are smart for the most part.... not always. They are loveable... and always willing to go there.

 

[Dozdoats]

I wouldn't say I'm very knowledgeable about dogs, but I agree changing (raising) pitch, emoting and using consistent vocabulary with dogs is helpful in communicating with them, especially as puppies while they are learning. Later we shift to conversational tones but use the same vocabulary, we always incorporate hand signals with verbal communication when we can to emphasize and demonstrate what's intended.

 

[jward]

Not being very knowledgeable on dogs, for those of you who are, do you agree or disagree with the article and why for either case?

At first reading, I would agree. Dogs are happy to wiggle for you for any reason, or no reason at all, but they do have a vocabulary, and presumably feel more drawn into conversations
about which they've some knowledge. On the other hand, I didn't watch the experiment, so who knows what non verbals were given. The dogs do, that's who LOL.

As far as sharing the bed, it is against the pet's code of honor. All pets. My cat's mastered laying in the middle of the bed, with limbs as far askew in every direction, so there's no room left.

 

[willowlady]

I wonder how much they spent on this study and if they asked any dog owners about it first. It seems like a big "duh" to me, but then my family has had animals all our lives. Dogs are definitely smarter than cats; it's a fact you can say the most terrible, awful things to a cat in a syrupy voice and they are sure you are praising them and they have you trained well as good staff. I suspect dogs actually understand some language, if they are trained to do so.

 

[TerryK]

Talking to your dog is good for both you and your dog.
I don't think they needed a scientific study to prove that.

 

[Rayku]

Thanks to all who answered my questions. Haven't been in a position to have a dog since I was a child. Now that I am, I will probably after I've learned some more.

 

[Millwright]

It's mostly in the intonation and facial expressions.

You can string the most nonsensical words together in the happy voice and they will wag and smile.

Even command words in the wrong voice and context get mixed results.


The goose works mostly from facial expressions and sometimes a finger snap when we are in public.

 

[Dennis Olson]

Hermione was totally finger snap and hand movement. Aja is struggling with it.

 

[Racing22]

Not being very knowledgeable on dogs, for those of you who are, do you agree or disagree with the article and why for either case?

In my experience, I believe people talk in the higher tones to their dogs because they think their dogs are their babies. We, as humans, project the same tonal quality we use with human babies onto our fur babies, so that's what the dogs react to.

but I agree changing (raising) pitch, emoting and using consistent vocabulary with dogs is helpful in communicating with them, especially as puppies while they are learning.

I think that works for puppies until they learn the language, you can trick them by raising the pitch, since they don't know the vocabulary yet, so they think they did something good.

Later we shift to conversational tones but use the same vocabulary, we always incorporate hand signals with verbal communication when we can to emphasize and demonstrate what's intended.

This is what I do, even with the pup. I talk to him in the normal conversational tone, as I want him to learn the syllables and verbal cues from the actual words. That, tied together with hand signals, will get him to learn all the necessary commands.

The goal is to trigger the cue when he hears certain words, or see the hand signal, no matter what the tone it's given in, and by who gives it.

 

[Racing22]

The goose works mostly from facial expressions and sometimes a finger snap when we are in public.

This is where I got to with my last dog and really didn't realize it until after she was gone. I rarely had to give a verbal cue, it was always hand signals a quick whistle or snap to get her attention.

But it went even deeper, we had a connection where she would read my body language or facial expression and know exactly what I wanted her to do. Sometimes I believed she could actually read my mind, and she responded appropriately. It never dawned on me the connection was this deep, until I saw someone else reference the same thing with their dog.

 

[Dennis Olson]

Us too.

 

[Racing22]

Us too.

What was really strange for us was that I never intentionally set out to accomplish that goal or even did any formal training. It all just came along naturally. She only went to one basic training class around 1 year old, but we never worked specifically on any cues after that. What progressed was just what happened during life.

Even the hand signals, it was nothing I learned from a training class, I just started adding them to the verbal cues, I guess to just help reinforce what I was asking. Then eventually I stopped asking and just used signals.

So this go around with my new pup, I know what the end result is that I want, so I'm trying to mold the training around having an even better final product and even better dog. He's got a real high bar to clear and has a real tough act to follow.

 

[Disciple]

The article is true but doesnt go far enough. If I say "go for a ride" or "a walk" they know exactly what I mean. If I say "cookies" or bones" they come running. At times when we are talking you can tell they understand. So yes I think the exaggerated tone helps, and just doing things with them and otherwise talking they will become pretty intelligent for an animal.

 

[Millwright]

I use one word for most verbal discipline commands...."Hey", in about 10-20 variations.

It can mean anything from come to stop what you're doing or break her from a dead run, chasing a squirrel. It just depends on the intonation

She usually knows what I want in most situations out in public so commands are really just confirmations to her.

 

[BoPeep]

Omg, our old rotty could spell. We couldn't say out loud, "go for a walk" until we were ready to take her....cause she'd go insane....even if she heard the word in normal, everyday conversation. So like with little kids, we started spelling w-a-l-k when we were discussing it. That dog learned to put those letters with the word....and would go berserk. I swear....that dog was soooo intelligent. I didn't realize just how intelligent until much later. Two of our current dogs are not that smart....and one....is an idiot. Lol!

 

[BadMedicine]

Not being very knowledgeable on dogs, for those of you who are, do you agree or disagree with the article and why for either case?

YEs def. Two reasons, the smaller "baby language" lacking complex speech patterns not understood by kids, far better for dogs.. They definitely can understand words and commands, but long sentences of events and stories, unlikely. So Nouns and verbs and "baby or young child" speech is best. Though I do speak frankly to my dog all of the time and try to teach him things like a child, for commands and actual expectations, I keep it to one and two word commands & gestures. As with babies, lots of gestures mixed in with body language, is really speaking the language other dog. They will read & learn YOUR body language, whatever it is FAR better than language because THEIR language is body language and even facial expression, YES dogs and animal HAVE MUCH facial expression and use it as language, and can read yours, much as babies can before language develops.

Tonal / TONE - A high pitch "baby talk" "Baby voice" is maternal, caring, submissive, and not scary. a deep voice is dominant, aggressive & scary. This is why we speak to babies and children in high or soft voices and same for pets. Helps them adapt to us when younger and also using a different voice, either rough or high pitch when adressing them either in play & affirmation, or in commands and scolding, help the animal know when you are addressing it even if you don't use it's name, in a world full of talking and strange sounds, havin it's own "channel" can def help with communication.

And finally, some dogs are smarter than others. For two reasons, just like Children. Genetics, & upbringing. Working dogs, and particular herding dogs, have a history or HUGE intuition, waching & learning from owner, making their own language and just filling in where & when they are needed. You can be a sh*t dog owner, get a herd dog, and the thing will train itself and be 60% of your life in a year because they are so smart. Further, some dogs are for looks and do not have a long history of breeding for intelligence and usefulness and might learn a few commands, and be cute, will not ever be a "working" dog.
Then there is upbringing. Some animals even if bred right, if they are never used or trained simple commands, can atrophy and be worthless for command or play or even turn violent even after being raised in a home with ample food after 40k years of domestication! So there is def genetics and upbringing in the mix, some dogs will never be smart, english bulldogs, shitzus, most the yappy ones, chihuahuas,.... and some can have a vocab of 200+ words (border collie).

And as for the Rotty who could "Spell" ..I have heard this from other dog owners before! smart dogs, and patterns will be picked out. They have been with us longer than ANY OTHER domesticated animal, Dogs 30-40,000 years ago, goats and then sheep about 8k years ago, horses 5-6k... Dogs are VERY intuned with us as their 'pack' and can read our moods and gestures. They study us at all times.

Dogs are awesome. For being primates down a totally different evolutionary branch, our recent pack structure and hunting strategies started to parallel and we become un-matched blood brothers for eternity. Fire-Monkey and War-dog, Forever!!

 

[Rayku]

"some dogs are smarter than others. For two reasons, just like Children. Genetics, & upbringing. Working dogs, and particular herding dogs, have a history or HUGE intuition, waching & learning from owner, making their own language and just filling in where & when they are needed. You can be a sh*t dog owner, get a herd dog, and the thing will train itself and be 60% of your life in a year because they are so smart."
Any particular breed of herd dog recommended (highlighting on lifespan, intelligence,
and safe around Children)?

 

[Lei]

I have 2 standard poodles , a golden doodle, and a mini dachshund.
The female poodle is a 70 pound genius. She learns so easily it is scary. She has become a great watch dog. The male poodle was abused as a pup so he is not as social or smart. The golden doodle is smarter than a Golden Retriever but has the Goldens cuddly personality. The Dachshund is a retarded clown, but we love him anyway.

 

[Disciple]

Omg, our old rotty could spell. We couldn't say out loud, "go for a walk" until we were ready to take her....cause she'd go insane....even if she heard the word in normal, everyday conversation. So like with little kids, we started spelling w-a-l-k when we were discussing it. That dog learned to put those letters with the word....and would go berserk. I swear....that dog was soooo intelligent. I didn't realize just how intelligent until much later. Two of our current dogs are not that smart....and one....is an idiot. Lol!

Yes I was just getting ready to type about this when I saw your post. One of our Dogs was so in tune with us we really did have to spell. But he also figured THAT out! We have 4 in the house and when the smartest one gets it the others then pick it up from them. They are amazing.

 

[Dozdoats]

Any particular breed of herd dog recommended

Be careful with all the OTHER breed specific traits - working dogs NEED to have a job and human interaction, let them get bored and you will be amazed at the damage they can do to your home while you are gone. Not just as puppies, either.

Our original "pack" consisted of a Brittany, an old Fila Brasiliero and a young Fila Brasileiro. The Brit was the smartest dog I've ever had, our neighbor's little girl at six wanted to teach the dog how to read . Filas are basically people guard/herd dogs, their size, strength and temperament make them unsuited for beginning dog owners and many experienced dog owners as well. The last member of the original pack died a couple of months ago at age 9, the larger breeds tend not to live as long. The Brit made it to 13, the older Fila to 12, which is pretty unusual for the breed.

Brits are all purpose bird dogs, they will point and retrieve and are always eager to go to work. They are a medium sized dog at about 35 pounds. With Brits. there are not two separate lines for show dogs and field dogs as is usually the case, a show champion is likely to be a field trial champion too.

Filas are big, our two were over 100 pounds each. We hope to get another Fila pup this spring or summer. The breed has its problems and there are fewer breeders today than there were a dozen years ago, too many people find Filas more dog than they can handle and blame it on the breeder. But we love Filas the way Dennis loves his shepherds despite the issues they have.

There's a lot of guidance available out there, some good, some not so good. Be careful, people tend to be about dogs like they are about cars, some are Chevy people and some are Ford people and some drive imports

 

[PghPanther]

Based on what I've studied I would infer some major credibility to this...

First, dogs like all mammals are born warm blooded and dependent of their survival with the strong identity and bonding of a mother for their initial food source.......

....this makes them like all mammals capable of being a social species beyond infancy due to this bonding period....as a result of the interaction of those whom their brain makes imprints from visual, audible and especially in the case of dogs...smell sense of those whom they find company, fun adventurous activities (ride in the car doggie?) and food source provisions.....

Recent studies have shown that rats have recreational activities with each other and you can actually tickle them and they will "laugh"..........

So as you climb up the ladder of brain development and cognitive functioning this social interaction becomes more sophisticated.......by the time you get to the brain of a cat or dog you are well on your way to having a strong bonding beyond infancy based on imprint identity with those other living species who have positive or symbiotic dependent interactions with that mammal.

A dog would certainly perform well in this area and I'm not surprised one bit that vocalization by voice inflection impacts this interaction with a dog.......

Of course any long time dog owner would say this is very apparent and confirm that without having to express what I took the time to do above..........

 

[tiredude]

I think this is what my wife is doing to me.....

 

[Dennis Olson]

Filas are NOT recommended for people who have regular visitors to their home, transient children coming and going, or who entertain guests.

Filas have a marked propensity to want to ATTACK AND KILL intruders. Everyone not in their world at the puppy stage will be an intruder. They also will want to attack anyone who approaches you when you take them out in the world. You CANNOT train that out of them. I consider myself a VERY experienced GSD owner and pack Alpha, and I would NEVER have a Fila. And I have NO ONE coming into my home.

Filas are best for people who never have outside visitors, and never take the dogs off the property. These are basically naturally-bred attack dogs.

 

[Dennis Olson]

"some dogs are smarter than others. For two reasons, just like Children. Genetics, & upbringing. Working dogs, and particular herding dogs, have a history or HUGE intuition, waching & learning from owner, making their own language and just filling in where & when they are needed. You can be a sh*t dog owner, get a herd dog, and the thing will train itself and be 60% of your life in a year because they are so smart."
Any particular breed of herd dog recommended (highlighting on lifespan, intelligence,
and safe around Children)?

German Shepherds.

 

[Dozdoats]

A properly socialized Fila is no more a ravening killer lunging on a leash than one of Dennis' German shepherds. But Filas do require socialization, just as any other dog breed does. Filas do learn "their people" early along - they usually come into their temperament (become protective) at about a year. After that, they are slow to warm up to anyone new in their world.

I used to beg our neighbor to come visit while our old Fila was a pup. He was always too busy, but his little girl (the one who wanted to teach our Brit to read) was a constant visitor, and Ria the Fila just loved her - they basically grew up together. A year or so later this kid could do anything with this dog which was way bigger than the little girl - while Ria wouldn't let her dad inside the gate.

We tried to tell him ...

Filas don't forget who their friends are - or otherwise. A family friend who knew Ria as a pup went off to A'stan for 13 months and was worried the dog wouldn't remember him when he got back. As soon as she smelled him she was overjoyed to see him again.

No, Filas are not good bets for a busy household with lots of company. But there is no better protection dog available, in a situation where a Fila is a good fit. Filas are fearless where their people are concerned. But Filas require good fences and controlled access to the home by people the dog does not know and accept. Since Filas can bite five times harder than a German Shepherd, due diligence is called for.

 

[summerthyme]

8

You can be a sh*t dog owner, get a herd dog, and the thing will train itself and be 60% of your life in a year because they are so smart."

Sorry, I STRONGLY disagree. As a nearly lifelong Border Collie and other working/herding breed owner, and occasional breeder, I've seen way too many "sh*t dog owners" either utterly ruin a good dog, or be so outsmarted by the dog they end up giving it away and complaining bitterly about the dog, the breed and the breeder. I refuse to sell Border Collie pups to anyone who doesn't have a job for them, or a solid plan to do *something* (agility, obedience, search and rescue) with them.


Anyone who tells me they plan on crating the dog past the early stages doesn't get a pup.

Rayku.... look into the English Shepherd breed. After owning pretty much every common herding breed (Border Collies, Australian Shepherds, Blue Heelers, and several crosses of them, I've come to view the English Shepherd as the perfect homestead dog.

They will herd... but they done HAVE TO HERD LIKE most Border Collies. Red, our 9 year old BC bitch, will get done with a job... bringing the beef cows in and helping put them in their stalls, for example. You call her over and praise her for a job well done, and her response is, "yeah, yeah... aren't there more cows to herd?"

English Shepherds also hunt (small game... rabbits, woodchucks)... Dixie feeds herself most every summer on mice, holes and chipmunk. They are protective of the farm, people and livestock... we leave Dixie out summer nights and don't lose meat chickens (which we pasture) despite good sized packs of coyotes.Last fall, we found a yearling whitetail deer doe that coyotes had taken down at the end of a hayfield... but they hadn't touched the 150 meat bird chicks in a pen at the other end of that field.

They respect boundaries... Dixie never leaves the farm, even if she's in heat, and intact male's I've had have been the same way. They will bark to alert you of danger, but otherwise they aren't barkers.

And they adore children! I'll never forget when Dixie was about 9 months, and my grandson was about 7 months. The baby was sitting on a blanket, and we had put Dixie in a "down-stay" on the other side of the kitchen, brcause his mother was nervous about the big dog being near him. I was watching her out of the corner of my eye, and so I saw her start a slow, "Army crawl" (still obeying the "down", but sort of bending the "stay"!). She crawled 9 feet to his blanket, and then reached out and carefully touched one bare foot with a big paw. He giggled. Clearly feeling she'd been given permission, she crawled the rest of the way to him, whereupon he wrapped hus arms around her head and started chewing on her nose! She was in .Heaven... And every part of her body was wiggling in joy, except her head and shoulders... she was just so careful not to knock him over.

As far as lifespan, Dixie's grandsire is 16, and the breeder lost two 15 year old dogs in the last year. We saw the grandsire last year, and he could easily pass for a dog of 8 or so... clear eyes, gorgeous coat, beautiful, smooth flowing gaiet. He does have some hind end weakness due to a spinal injury a couple years ago, but he's an amazing dog for his age.

There ARE a couple of bad lines in the breed, and if you're interested, PM me and I'll give you more info. Also, I'll be driving 500 miles late this spring to breed Dixie to a gorgeous male, who is also a working homestead dog, and the son of a fabulous dog who completed his agility Championship before he was a year old. This will likely be her only litter, and they should be very special. We will be keeping a female pup, as our "pack" is starting to age a bit...

Summerthyme

 

[Dennis Olson]

I do believe we basically said the same thing DD.

Check the breed's temperament according to the breed standard. It's quite graphic.

 

[Millwright]

People don't grasp how much effort & dedication it takes to get a dog to a level of discipline that is suitable for going anywhere in public.

IMO, that's a minimum acceptable level of behavior.

 

[Cascadians]

Have two service Newfoundlands, awesome water working versatile breed. Very high maintenance. Count on at least an hour per day on combing / grooming.

Have had 8 marvelous years of long walks out in the boonies, adventures, and lots of high-end training classes.

Right now my famous older Newf, Orka, is 8 and aging rapidly. He has mobility problems. We are treasuring every day.

My younger, Brook, almost 4, tore his cruciate, had TPLO surgery and almost died twice from hyperthermia. Nursing him back to health now.

So suddenly instead of adventuring, dealing with 2 fragile huge dogs, whom I love dearly.

We keep track of expenses and literally could have bought and paid for a house with the money we have spent on these Newfs.

Worth it, what a huge pivotal experience this has been.

With high end most advanced sports / service training we use verbal commands, lots of play, lots of cuddling, hand signals at beginning of learning new task but quickly transfer to verbal only.

The loving clear simple way of communicating with one's dog is of paramount importance.

 

[Dennis Olson]

Millwright, for Hermione, it took 4 months, but it took another two years for her to calm down enough to allow the inevitable groups of people to surround her and pet her.

For Odin, the first time I took him out in the world, I had him in a harness. He was lunging and growling at the people going by, and it was all I could do to hold him. Six months later, he was able to walk on a leash out in public, and while not being friendly toward strangers, allowed them to pass pretty much ignored. That took hundreds of hours of public exposure to deprogram him. His former owners were not Alphas, and knew nothing about GSDs. Odin OWNED them. They said they couldn't take him out in public because he was uncontrollable. Well, I couldn't have a dog like that, so I had no choice but to address it. (Note that with any rescue dog, you can get one with a behavior pattern that takes many months to alter. That's what I mean by a "project dog." I don't want to have to FIX something stupid owners "broke.")

 

[Dennis Olson]

So suddenly instead of adventuring, dealing with 2 fragile huge dogs, whom I love dearly.


And here's the really bad part: I could lift Hermione into the back of the car, even though it was a significant struggle. There is NO WAY you can lift those dogs from the ground into a car. No. Freakin. Way.

And there WILL come a time when you have to.

 

[mrrk1562]

i would rather talk to a dog more so then most people .seems i have a way with dogs and its does tie into what this post is about .it is how we communicate with them which 3 basic ways .commands which are short and direct .correction which i use just one sound which is a loud and strong aaat .and the use of praise which is soft baby like talk which makes them happy because you are happy .really smart dogs have about the same thinking capacity as a 10 year child this is important to remember because some dogs are just like a loaded hand gun ie the k9 working dogs and have to be under your control at all times whether you have them on a lead or not .every thing comes from you the owner not the dog .
dogs like being commanded and they want to please you and when they do the things you ask they should be rewarded .rewards come in 3 forms .food ,toys and baby talk praise .treat should not be the only reward as it just spoils the dog it becomes a bribe to behave or act .toys can wind up much the same as treats plus costs you money .but baby talk praise is free and the dog loves it just as much

 

[BadMedicine]

SummerThyme, taken in context you'll see it was about the ability to train themselves, and no not all of them are capable, nore does the persons life allow for it / incubate that behavior... but sometimes, and herd dogs are the dogsfor it...

Futher, in order of bat-shitness for "needing to herd" Yes Border collies NEED A JOB, heelers, petty much too, then aussies, then english, many others in there too. I lave an aussie husky cross. He's super smart. I think or people who want a great fam dog but arent necessarily a working fam, a 1/2 auss/heeler/BC are perfect. Takes the edge of the bathsh*tness, and sometime adds a little hound, retriever, lab or other great family dog, and-you've got you a duel-sport!

 

[Rayku]

Filas are NOT recommended for people who have regular visitors to their home, transient children coming and going, or who entertain guests.

Filas have a marked propensity to want to ATTACK AND KILL intruders. Everyone not in their world at the puppy stage will be an intruder. They also will want to attack anyone who approaches you when you take them out in the world. You CANNOT train that out of them. I consider myself a VERY experienced GSD owner and pack Alpha, and I would NEVER have a Fila. And I have NO ONE coming into my home.

Filas are best for people who never have outside visitors, and never take the dogs off the property. These are basically naturally-bred attack dogs.

Thanks, that's the kind of thing I need to know.