EBOLA What the HELL is going on?

[Sleeping Cobra]

I think it was an Executive Order on any respiratory diseases.

 

[Limner]

I can only come up with two excuses with this whole Ebola issue:

1: Either we are the most STUPID people / government on the planet.....

or

2: This whole outbreak and the spread of this disease is INTENTIONAL (deliberate, calculated, conscious, intended, planned, meant, studied, knowing, willful, purposeful, purposive, done on purpose, premeditated, preplanned, preconceived) and being directed by some one(s) towards some nefarious goal.

I'll take INTENTIONAL for 100, Alex.

 

[Scotto]

but the researchers say that the virus survives longer, the colder it gets (outside of a live host, that is). At extremely cold temperatures, the virus lives almost indefinitely.

And would this be the same researchers that are currently "handling" the ebola outbreak now?

The same "researchers" who stated it could only be caught by coming into direct contact with an ebola victim - and we now know it is also "droplet" contagion - and just as easy to catch as the common cold?

The same "researchers" who set up the protocols in Dallas Presbyterian - so the nurses and healthcare workers there couldn't be infected by it?

The same "researchers" who are keeping info from the public so they can't better educate and guard themselves?

The same "researchers" who say it's fine and dandy for those people (who cared for the Dallas man who died of this and with infected co-workers) to get on public airplanes and jet around the country?

And how would keeping infected people in congested areas such as Dallas and Bethesda be an improvement over a remote area in Alaska? Is that being "too proactive?" Playing it "too smart?"

 

[R.Tist]

a bit late at arriving at the wrong conclusion...

this is entirely intentional, and the culmination of decades of work to make it happen. that you reached the wrong conclusion indicates that you missed a big part of the picture. the dumbed-down, epidemic of tv-induced, and public "education"-induced stupidity of the masses merely allows the masses to reach the wrong conclusion, much as you have. no offense intended. but this tragic epidemic arriving on our shores is, absolutely pre-planned.

and furthermore...

all indications from on high indicate that God has had enough of rebellion on Earth and has released the Scourge to clean the land, punish the wicked, and prepare the Way of the Lord.

Well, I hope you're right about the full establishment of God's Kingdom, Jed, but on balance, I think I would have preferred to die in the flood. This disease is horrible! (I've nearly drowned twice in my life, and it wasn't that bad.) Oh, well, our Father knows what He is doing!

Thy Will be Done, Lord.

Artie.

 

[AlaskaSue]

I just have a hard time believing there is no intent, when it would have been pretty straight-forward to keep it out from US at the get go by denying incoming flights from affected countries. As far as putting folks in remote Alaska, well, we do have a lot of remote...I am not sure how it would fall out though if, as I have read, the virus survives long in cold temps. I recall some years back that live Spanish flu virus was found in a remote area up here, preserved from 1918-19 in bodies in the permafrost. I appreciate all the info and opinions here.

 

[geoffs]

Survey in my local NY papers website;

Do you support a travel ban into and out of Ebola-infected countries?

Yes (223) 93%

No (17) 7%

 

[TerryK]

Kris and Doomer Doug are right.
I spent almost all my life working for the government at the federal and state level.
Three things: Arrogance, Political Correctness, and Stupidity.
The government and the medical establishment are arrogant in the firm belief in political correctness. Couple this with the stupidity that is built in to any large bureaucracy. Raise it exponentially because it's the government we're dealing with, and you need nothing else to explain the incredible actions we have seen so far.
The same idiotic mindset that kicks a first grader out of school for eating his pop tart into a "gun" shape, is what is running this whole show now.
I'm just amazed that things aren't worse.... And YES, they could be worse, a lot worse.

Keep in mind this thing started off like each of the other previous 20 Ebola outbreaks in Africa. A single infection arising from contact with Ebola infected bush meat in West Africa. December 2013.

The initial progression was exactly like all previous Ebola outbreaks. But the WHO budget had been greatly slashed and redirected to dealing with cancer and heart disease rather than tropical diseases. They were slow to react. They didn't even get totally engaged until late March of 2014. By that point there were already 117 infections and 75 deaths. It was already the 6th largest outbreak in history before WHO ever engaged.

They attempted to handle this outbreak like all prior outbreaks: identify, isolate and contain. Except there was one problem. This outbreak wasn't relegated to some remote, backwater village of a few hundred people...like ALL prior outbreaks. This one had now reached large cities of 10's of thousands of people.

By early June, this outbreak became the largest outbreak in history, ending the month at over 700 infected, and was now ravaging the Liberian city of Monrovia, population 1 million. Identify, isolate and contain was not working in the large cities. At this point the healthcare facilities, such as they are, were all overwhelmed. They are turning away more people than they are taking in. They are only tracking/counting the ones they are taking in.

By early August 2014, hearings are being held on Capitol Hill. WHO admits they are likely only counting and assisting about 25% of the total number of cases.

By September 2014, this Ebola outbreak is now three times larger than ALL previous outbreaks combined and has lasted over twice as long as any of the previous outbreaks had lasted. And there is still no end in site. Over 850 new cases per week are being logged during September, up from just over 500 cases per week in August. We're now on track to average over 1,700 new cases per week during October. And of course, Liberian Thomas Duncan makes his fateful journey to Dallas in late September and then dies from Ebola on October 8th.

Confusion, chaos, ineptness and yes, STUPIDITY reigns during the handling of the Thomas Duncan situation and the aftermath which we are all now living through.

No conspiracy. None needed. Stupidity, typical government bungling and human hubris in various positions of authority has got it covered.

Napoleon Bonaparte: "Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence."

Kris, I am seeing a staggering level of incompetence from Day one of this Ebola epidemic. Choices were made that turned out to be catastrophic in their results. Things were not done at all, or they were done too little and too late. In West Africa we have seen system failure at all levels of their political, economic and medical systems. In the USA we have seen a series of bad decisions made from the second Mr. Duncan was allowed to fly to the USA.

I do not personally see a grand conspiracy here, Kris. What Doomer Doug sees is a lack of resources, training, equipment and most importantly the same type of mindset we saw at Pearl Harbor in December of 1941. The critical system failure, in my opinion, is the fact that the powers that be in the USA, political and medical simply refused to accept the IDEA Ebola would get to the USA and when it did, the chaos it would cause.

We are dealing with fools, shills and political hacks here. It is like Forest Gump said in the movie: "Stupid is as stupid does."

I think people want to see conspiracy when all that is happening is blind arrogance and stupid choices and decisions.

Friedman is a political hack of truly astounding ability to make bad choices consistently. I also think Obama has made an entire series of bad decisions based solely on his liberal mindset. These people are not going to give up their PC open border mindset until the American people force them to, or remove them from office.

 

[VesperSparrow]

IMO TPTB (WHOEVER THEY ARE) have been doing their utmost DAMNNEST to suspend our Constitution. This crap gets too much further out of hand and we will see just that.
It'll start off by putting a few in quarantine here and there....then a few more....then LEO (or Obola-SWAT) standing outside your door to make SURE you don't break it...then it'll eventually get so out of hand they'll HAVE to put those little FEMA farms to good use....question is though, will they put the infected in them or the non-infected?

 

[OldArcher]

Well Old Archer, you conspiracy crank<G> I think my mention of Pearl Harbor is exactly why this is happening. I have read several books about why Pearl Harbor happened, leaving out the conspiracy ones, the general consensus is that NOBODY, not the military people, the diplomatic people, the political people ever considered the possibility that Japan would attack Pearl Harbor. They thought Japan might attack the British in Malaysia, or Subic Bay, but not Pearl Harbor. This feeling was despite the fact Japan launched a brilliant surprise attack on the Czar's Navy at Port Arthur, now Vladavostok, and despite the fact the British attacked the Italian fleet by air in 1940 I think.

Where others see conspiracy, I see the exact same mindset that simply ruled out the IDEA Ebola would ever get to the USA at all. The mindset refused to prepare, refused to take serious action because the mindset FELT THERE WAS NO POSSIBILITY OF AN ATTACK ON PEARL HARBOR OR EBOLA GETTING TO THE USA.

Old Archer, the current political, economic and military elite is composed of all the PC butt lickers that are left. Any person of personal integrity, honor and ethics has either left the government, or been kicked out in PC purges. THESE PEOPLE ARE STUPID, ARROGANT, POWER MAD AND BLIND, OLD ARCHER. Their actions are also stupid, arrogant, blind and done with a short term, how can I personally benefit mindset.

Napoleon, who had a lot of experience dealing with people like this is correct. There is no malice here, other than the obscene desire for personal power, but there is STUPIDITY AND ARROGANCE ON A GRAND SCALE.

Yep, Old Archer, you are underestimating the stupidity and arrogance of Obama and Dr. Friedman. KISS means the simple explanation of stupidity is accurate. <G>

In the 1930's the US Navy did a war game, where "Japan" would attack the locks of the Panama Canal. USS Saratoga was used to launch the attack. The "attack" was successful beyond belief.

At that time, Isoroku Yamamoto was a very close watcher of US Navy, especially Naval Air...
He knew about the war game, and used it in planning for the attack on Pearl Harbor, years later...

WWII in the Pacific, according to studies by the US Naval War College, done in the 1950's, revealed what came to be the accepted reason for the war. Cutting-off Japan's access to critical supplies, as Japan, since industrialization, has been an importing nation, not having necessary natural resources. Military build-up since WWI made significant strains on a young, burgeoning economy... Something had to give, and war was the only way out, as far as the militarists were concerned...

Now, as far as conspiracy versus Olympian stupidity, one can only believe that our government, and perhaps others elsewhere, are complicit, or totally led around by the nose, by others... Our government, alas, is so incredibly inept, as to beggar the imagination... "Jackass goes to Washington" may be the Queer Muslim Murderer In Chief's biopic... Satan's Meat Puppet can't do it on his own... He needs "help" for all but the most mundane of tasks... Now do you see, conspiracy? Even the players in his administration, are vile, evil, corrupt, and invariably, incompetent...

Stupid, yes. Corrupt, yes. Directed from below, by those with more than two brain cells connected, yes...

No matter how you slice it, this excrement sandwich that The Meat Puppet is serving, wasn't created by his minions, but Satan's...

Maranatha

OldArcher

 

[Nowski]

After a sleepless night, got up very early and it was doom about
that cruise ship. So, instead of the morning cup of java, had a very
large glass of red wine.

Passed out, and got several hours of needed sleep.

Well now, I get up refreshed and login, and kaboom, its freaking
even worse!

Holy cow batman.

My take on the ebola outbreak in the ole USA is the following:

1. without doubt, Africa is a hellhole. All the money in the entire universe
could be poured into that hellhole continent, and it would not make one
bit of difference.

2. ITS THE PEOPLE that inhabit that continent that make it the hellhole that
it is. Sure there are the few that can stand with any other race of people,
but for the vast majority, forget about it.

3. Ebola is here on purpose. Regardless of how it got here, if our own federal government
gave a damn about the people that are in THIS country, secure borders would have
prevented the infected Liberian from even leaving the airport where he came in.

4. There would then have been no Dallas, no infected nurses, and the virus would not be
out in the wild like it is now in this country, amongst the general population.

5. The current federal government, at the very top, hates our guts, our European/white guts.

6. Now there is news that they are going to expedite visas from west Africa.
How insane is this? Its like cutting your own throat.

7. They are going to do everything that they can, to make sure that the ebola epidemic
envelopes this country. It is not a coincidence that this is happening right now before
a very important mid term election cycle.

8. The damacrat/socialist/communist in this country are going to election fraud like
this country has never seen. It will take a massive, and I mean massive turnout
by people who want this country back, in order to counter the election fraud.

9. My feeling is that if ebola was coming from Western Europe, the borders would have been
sealed tight as a drum.

May The Most High God have mercy on our souls.

Be well everyone.

Regards to all,
Nowski

 

[Dennis Olson]

Survey in my local NY papers website;

Do you support a travel ban into and out of Ebola-infected countries?

Yes (223) 93%

No (17) 7%

U.S. President Barack Obama announced that he disagrees with a travel ban to and from Ebola-stricken nations and told reporters that “a flat-out travel ban is not the way to go.”

And remember kids, Obama is ALWAYS the Smartest Man In The Room™


We're doomed....

 

[Adino]

... And YES, they could be worse, a lot worse.

yeah

the oligarchy could've told them to put ebola right in baby formula

that would've been worse than letting it appear to spread naturally

 

[Doat]

Well by 2016 presidential elections, martial law should be in full swing and the elections will be cancelled.

 

[nomifyle]

JK is a stupid idiotic POS and is a prime example of the administration he serves in.

Judy

 

[marsh]

A conspiracy would likely turn around to bite the favored minority populations of the PC crowd. The spread of fear is likely to be far more viral than the Ebola. If it disrupts the economic JIT chain, it is likely to be the most heavily populated and most personally unprepared and government dependent segments of the population who find themselves with their basic needs for food, water and heat to be unfulfilled. These areas will likely be the first to be looted as well. This is why I think it is more a motive of political considerations plus incompetence, an unwieldy bureaucracy and institutional profit motive than a conspiracy.

 

[Rastech]

There is a kind of inherent 'conspiracy of stupid' in circles of influence, that cannot be avoided.

Stupid people that make it way past their pay grade, are terrified of having 'underlings' that are obviously way smarter than they are. So to protect themselves, the beyond pay grade stupid surround themselves with people even more stupid than they are, to make them look good and shine their ego's.

As this goes on, the culture of an entire section (political, business, whatever) acquires the position of being literally "dumber than a box of rocks", that is way stupider as the sum of the whole.

Merit, ability, genuine qualifications, and such, become as bad as garlic to a vampire, and their only response can be "Wasn't me, musta been someone else".

Now imagine how frightening it is, to have somebody say "Why didn't you follow the protocols in Paper XYZ Section II?"

"Paper XYZ Section II? What Paper XYZ Section II? Nobody told me about any Paper XYZ Section II? It's his fault, he eats bacon! SQUIRREL!"

 

[Possible Impact]

I just have a hard time believing there is no intent, when it would have been pretty straight-forward to keep it out from US at the get go by denying incoming flights from affected countries. As far as putting folks in remote Alaska, well, we do have a lot of remote...I am not sure how it would fall out though if, as I have read, the virus survives long in cold temps. I recall some years back that live Spanish flu virus was found in a remote area up here, preserved from 1918-19 in bodies in the permafrost. I appreciate all the info and opinions here.

Almost all the Fur animals trapped in Alaska make good reservoirs for Ebola...
Martin, wolf, lynx, wolverine, beaver, fox, mink, red fox, otter, coyote, ermine (weasel) and muskrat.

 

[raven]

There is a kind of inherent 'conspiracy of stupid' in circles of influence, that cannot be avoided.

Stupid people that make it way past their pay grade, are terrified of having 'underlings' that are obviously way smarter than they are. So to protect themselves, the beyond pay grade stupid surround themselves with people even more stupid than they are, to make them look good and shine their ego's.

As this goes on, the culture of an entire section (political, business, whatever) acquires the position of being literally "dumber than a box of rocks", that is way stupider as the sum of the whole.

Merit, ability, genuine qualifications, and such, become as bad as garlic to a vampire, and their only response can be "Wasn't me, musta been someone else".

Now imagine how frightening it is, to have somebody say "Why didn't you follow the protocols in Paper XYZ Section II?"

"Paper XYZ Section II? What Paper XYZ Section II? Nobody told me about any Paper XYZ Section II? It's his fault, he eats bacon! SQUIRREL!"

I am just now coming to the realization that I must be a member of a small group that is getting smaller all the time.
the intelligent

 

[Betty_Rose]

Survey in my local NY papers website;

Do you support a travel ban into and out of Ebola-infected countries?

Yes (223) 93%

No (17) 7%

That's what I would suspect, but Fox News keeps running a poll that says 65-70% want a travel ban. That's a puzzle because EVERYONE I've been talking to wants a travel ban - IMMEDIATELY!!!

 

[Betty_Rose]

Well by 2016 presidential elections, martial law should be in full swing and the elections will be cancelled.

I've been hearing that on these boards for years and years, however...

This time, I see it's a definite possibility.

 

[Night Owl]

. Oooops. This was cropped and can't retrieve again...it is a picture of a patient in a hospital bed & the 3 stooges are over patient saying, we are from the CDC and here to cure you.

THE ONE THING I AM POSITIVE ABOUT:
EXPERTS ARE NOT EXPERTS!!!!!
Whatever study you have that saids this is the way, there is another study that says it is the worse way...and they are both written by experts!

 

[changed]

Stupidity or incompetence, the result is the same. The question is, can we do about it?

 

[Songbird7777777]

View attachment 112641. Oooops. This was cropped and can't retrieve again...it is a picture of a patient in a hospital bed & the 3 stooges are over patient saying, we are from the CDC and here to cure you.

THE ONE THING I AM POSITIVE ABOUT:
EXPERTS ARE NOT EXPERTS!!!!!
Whatever study you have that saids this is the way, there is another study that says it is the worse way...and they are both written by experts!

 

[CELLO]

I don't think Governments matter anymore it is the elites.

and yes it is intentional, how else are they going to get rid of over six and a half billion people. Make the Mao/Stalin/Lenin/Hitler look like child's play.

^^^this^^^

 

[PyratePrincess]

i'm totally certain it is an intentional thing. i'm in the minority here that believe that an occult cabal is behind it.

which i would think was crazy if i hadn't had certain memorable personal encounter .

I'm with you (other than a memorable encounter). When in doubt...follow the money. Bill Gates foundation funded(bio weapons lab)/Kenemah/patient 0/. No accident.

 

[Sacajawea]

Question for Kris:

You did an excellent job predicting the numbers we're seeing now in W. Africa of new cases/week/month. How quickly would you estimate that we will have multiple cities with (growing) outbreaks in them? By the numbers, that is... since almost anything could happen to slow/speed it up.

 

[Doomer Doug]

The general consensus is Japan attacked the Allied powers, Britain, France, Holland and the USA as a direct result of the strategic material cutoff. Japan responded by invading French Indochina/Vietnam in July 1941. They had an invasion convoy headed towards northern Malaysia sequential to the attack on Pearl Harbor. It attacked about the same time the Pearl Harbor attack happened. Like the case with Ebola, the powers that be saw what they wanted to see, Old Archer. The US Navy did a war drill where the attacked Pearl Harbor, as well as the Panama Canal one. They knew the British had slaughtered the Italian Navy at anchor. They knew Japan launched a surprise attack against the Czar's Pacific Fleet at Vladavostok/Port Arthur in 1905. They knew Japan would never withdraw from China. Like Ebola, they made the assumption Japan would never attack, just like Obama et al made the PC based decision Ebola would never get to the USA.

I do not think the failure to ban air travel from West Africa is due to a "conspiracy." It is due to a PC based mindset that will go down in flames before it admits the basic PC and free trade assumptions are wrong and dangerous. Old Archer, Obama CANNOT stop believing in his entire PC based, marxist ideology and therefore can't, and won't admit he is wrong, anymore than FDR could admit even the possibility of Japan attacking Pearl Harbor. FDR moved the battleships from San Diego to Pearl Harbor to bully Japan, and was completely incapable of realizing they would not back down.

Old Archer, you are forgetting all the time, effort and money invested in the PC IDEOLOGY. You are correct that Obama will let us all die before he admits his ideology is wrong. That doesn't make it a conspiracy in my opinion. It just is another example of stupid, arrogant, true believers who will fight to defend what they truly believe to the/our death.

Obama is a clown, a fool and a puppet, but he is not really trying to kill off his PC and minority based support base.

 

[FREEBIRD]

"Where others see conspiracy, I see the exact same mindset that simply ruled out the IDEA Ebola would ever get to the USA at all. The mindset refused to prepare, refused to take serious action because the mindset FELT THERE WAS NO POSSIBILITY OF AN ATTACK ON PEARL HARBOR OR EBOLA GETTING TO THE USA."

There is such a thing as "normalcy bias". The mind cannot grasp the thought that what it knows as "normal" has changed radically or is not what they thought it was. I agree that O and his administration & supporters see their PC views as necessary, and not only necessary but as absolute reality---like normalcy bias on steroids. O isn't the only one who would die before they could admit they were wrong. Progressive True Believers are very difficult to dissuade, because they are so profoundly invested in their own superiority---it IS who they ARE, in their view.

 

[Doomer Doug]

I think the Obamabots are now like SS officers in Berlin as the Russian close in. They can defend their ideas to the end, and die, or they can try to flee, or surrender and face almost certain death.

People are underestimating just how much energy the liberal PC crowd has invested in the open border ideology. So yes, they will let Ebola rage unchecked before they admit they were wrong not to ban air travel from West Africa. If the Obamabots admit even one single mistake, their entire PC ideology comes crashing down. The free trade crowd is in the same boat.

We have the uber liberals refusing to take Ebola seriously since it will undermine their PC mindset. We have the free trade crowd refusing to deal with Ebola due to the economic chaos transit bans would cause.

The result is Ebola is going to spread unchecked until the local American sheeple overwhelm the system powers and open border/free trade support foundation.

Yep, machine guns on the border are happening soon, HE. <G>

 

[Border Guns]

Expert= ex is a has been and a spert is a dribble under pressure, I rest my case now.

 

[Medical Maven]

I think the Obamabots are now like SS officers in Berlin as the Russian close in. They can defend their ideas to the end, and die, or they can try to flee, or surrender and face almost certain death.

These people would never have been kept in power if a test for competency were required in order to vote, if the legitimate vote had not been suppressed, and if widespread vote fraud had not been conducted. Why should the competent, principled, productive near majority be led around the nose by the Free Shit Army and the Progressives?

It is time to stop playing by the rules, because the rules have been overturned. We need a palace coup and soon.

It is LIFE AND DEATH now. That is no exaggeration.

 

[Warthog]

Is it about bug out time Or not?

 

[OldArcher]

The general consensus is Japan attacked the Allied powers, Britain, France, Holland and the USA as a direct result of the strategic material cutoff. Japan responded by invading French Indochina/Vietnam in July 1941. They had an invasion convoy headed towards northern Malaysia sequential to the attack on Pearl Harbor. It attacked about the same time the Pearl Harbor attack happened. Like the case with Ebola, the powers that be saw what they wanted to see, Old Archer. The US Navy did a war drill where the attacked Pearl Harbor, as well as the Panama Canal one. They knew the British had slaughtered the Italian Navy at anchor. They knew Japan launched a surprise attack against the Czar's Pacific Fleet at Vladavostok/Port Arthur in 1905. They knew Japan would never withdraw from China. Like Ebola, they made the assumption Japan would never attack, just like Obama et al made the PC based decision Ebola would never get to the USA.

I do not think the failure to ban air travel from West Africa is due to a "conspiracy." It is due to a PC based mindset that will go down in flames before it admits the basic PC and free trade assumptions are wrong and dangerous. Old Archer, Obama CANNOT stop believing in his entire PC based, marxist ideology and therefore can't, and won't admit he is wrong, anymore than FDR could admit even the possibility of Japan attacking Pearl Harbor. FDR moved the battleships from San Diego to Pearl Harbor to bully Japan, and was completely incapable of realizing they would not back down.

Old Archer, you are forgetting all the time, effort and money invested in the PC IDEOLOGY. You are correct that Obama will let us all die before he admits his ideology is wrong. That doesn't make it a conspiracy in my opinion. It just is another example of stupid, arrogant, true believers who will fight to defend what they truly believe to the/our death.

Obama is a clown, a fool and a puppet, but he is not really trying to kill off his PC and minority based support base.

Doug, Obama is Satan's Meat Puppet. We all know that Obama doesn't have the skills to run anything that requires an IQ of more than 60. Without his teleprompter, he cannot communicate effectively, for he cannot keep his lies straight, even though he really doesn't bother.

Shear incompetence cannot explain the chaos of this ongoing catastrophe. The dots don't connect, if we just look at "luck." NOTHING leads one to believe that there is anything but design or intent in what is going on... That Satan's Meat Puppet is not calling the shots, is a "given." Just exactly who is calling the shots, we don't know, but if Obama is not, then we have a conspiracy...

To believe all that is happening is coincidence, beggars the imagination.

Maranatha

OldArcher

 

[shane]

It's beyond stupid that CDC rolled out with BSL-2 for a BSL-4 threat.

The greatest danger from Ebola are the criminally negligent deficient CDC protocols.

Incredibly, according to CDC Director, you 'absolutely' don't need any head/hair/footwear
protection when treating an Ebola patient...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK6WosNHQ3g

Why, only now, are they finally begin to upgrade the protocol?!?



This was infection control basics101, and CDC had our healthcare way less protected
than the Africans! And, people are going to die from it!

- Shane

 

[Kris Gandillon]

And would this be the same researchers that are currently "handling" the ebola outbreak now?

The same "researchers" who stated it could only be caught by coming into direct contact with an ebola victim - and we now know it is also "droplet" contagion - and just as easy to catch as the common cold?

The same "researchers" who set up the protocols in Dallas Presbyterian - so the nurses and healthcare workers there couldn't be infected by it?

The same "researchers" who are keeping info from the public so they can't better educate and guard themselves?

The same "researchers" who say it's fine and dandy for those people (who cared for the Dallas man who died of this and with infected co-workers) to get on public airplanes and jet around the country?

And how would keeping infected people in congested areas such as Dallas and Bethesda be an improvement over a remote area in Alaska? Is that being "too proactive?" Playing it "too smart?"

No, actually the researchers that DO say it is likely communicable via airborne aerosols are the ones who discovered how long it survives on surfaces, which surfaces it prefers and determined that "the colder the better"...USAMRIID...the DoD researchers.

What we have here is the same disconnect between the CDC and USAMRIID as we had between the CIA and the FBI before 9/11. They each have parts of the puzzle but they are not talking to each other with a coordinated sharing of data and findings that would allow one to connect the dots and establish and communicate correct and consistent protocols to properly deal with this thing.

 

[Kris Gandillon]

Survey in my local NY papers website;

Do you support a travel ban into and out of Ebola-infected countries?

Yes (223) 93%

No (17) 7%

NewsMax had a similar poll today. When I checked it there were like 20,000+ YES and only 215 NO.

 

[Kris Gandillon]

Question for Kris:

You did an excellent job predicting the numbers we're seeing now in W. Africa of new cases/week/month. How quickly would you estimate that we will have multiple cities with (growing) outbreaks in them? By the numbers, that is... since almost anything could happen to slow/speed it up.

You CANNOT even BEGIN to accurately run the numbers until you have:

1) An initial random infection in a specific area. (like we have in Dallas)
2) At least 1 month worth of initial, documented, infections directly related to the initial infection.

So Dallas is all we have to go on at the moment and I have posted those numbers on several threads but will post them again here:

September 2014 - 1 Infected, 0 Dead (Duncan)
October 2014 - 3 Infected, 1 Dead (Duncan dead, Pham and Vinson confirmed infected)
November 2014 - 6 Infected, 4 Dead (Duncan and 3 others dead)
December 2014 - 16 Infected, 9 Dead (Duncan and 8 others dead)

Keep in mind the above numbers are cumulative since Duncan became patient zero in late September.

Because we were only half-way through the first full month (October) when Pham and Vinson were confirmed with Ebola, that sets the initial R0 (infection rate) at a factor of 2.5. If we get 1 more before the end of October the factor goes up to 3.5. If we get 2 more before the end of the month the factor goes up to 4.5.

If the R0 factor goes up then all of the above monthly numbers go up.

The thing that will keep the R0 factor from going up is if they indeed successfully "Identify, Isolate and Contain" this thing. In the Dallas area, they use the "42 day" cycle (two "normal" 21 day cycles) where there are no new cases since the last known possible exposure, last Ebola death or since the last Ebola patient blood tested "clear" of the Ebola virus, whichever occurs last. After 42 days of "no new cases", the Dallas Outbreak would be declared "over".

There are officially no more Ebola cases in the Dallas area at this time since Pham and Vinson were both transferred to other facilities. Pham was the last to leave Dallas on Thursday, October 16th. Assuming October 17 would be Day 1 of the 42 day countdown to "End of Outbreak", Day 42 would be Thanksgiving Day, Thursday, November 27th.

 

[Countrymouse]

A conspiracy would likely turn around to bite the favored minority populations of the PC crowd. The spread of fear is likely to be far more viral than the Ebola. If it disrupts the economic JIT chain, it is likely to be the most heavily populated and most personally unprepared and government dependent segments of the population who find themselves with their basic needs for food, water and heat to be unfulfilled. These areas will likely be the first to be looted as well. This is why I think it is more a motive of political considerations plus incompetence, an unwieldy bureaucracy and institutional profit motive than a conspiracy.

They may be the "favored minority of the PC crowd", but don't fool yourself that there's any love lost there;

the PC crowd values the "rabble" for ONE reason and one ONLY: their VOTES keep the "PC crowd" in POWER.


Beyond that, the great unwashed can go hang for all they care----and they'd say good riddance.......

 

[shane]

You CANNOT even BEGIN to accurately run the numbers until you have:

1) An initial random infection in a specific area. (like we have in Dallas)
2) At least 1 month worth of initial, documented, infections directly related to the initial infection.

So Dallas is all we have to go on at the moment and I have posted those numbers on several threads but will post them again here:

September 2014 - 1 Infected, 0 Dead (Duncan)
October 2014 - 3 Infected, 1 Dead (Duncan dead, Pham and Vinson confirmed infected)
November 2014 - 6 Infected, 4 Dead (Duncan and 3 others dead)
December 2014 - 16 Infected, 9 Dead (Duncan and 8 others dead)

Keep in mind the above numbers are cumulative since Duncan became patient zero in late September.

Because we were only half-way through the first full month (October) when Pham and Vinson were confirmed with Ebola, that sets the initial R0 (infection rate) at a factor of 2.5. If we get 1 more before the end of October the factor goes up to 3.5. If we get 2 more before the end of the month the factor goes up to 4.5.

If the R0 factor goes up then all of the above monthly numbers go up.

The thing that will keep the R0 factor from going up is if they indeed successfully "Identify, Isolate and Contain" this thing. In the Dallas area, they use the "42 day" cycle (two "normal" 21 day cycles) where there are no new cases since the last known possible exposure, last Ebola death or since the last Ebola patient blood tested "clear" of the Ebola virus, whichever occurs last. After 42 days of "no new cases", the Dallas Outbreak would be declared "over".

There are officially no more Ebola cases in the Dallas area at this time since Pham and Vinson were both transferred to other facilities. Pham was the last to leave Dallas on Thursday, October 16th. Assuming October 17 would be Day 1 of the 42 day countdown to "End of Outbreak", Day 42 would be Thanksgiving Day, Thursday, November 27th.

Couple things to keep in mind that would skew projections going forward...

#1 - It could mutate.

#2 - According to http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/ebola/14-october-2014/en/

"Recent studies conducted in West Africa have demonstrated that 95% of confirmed cases have an incubation period in the range of 1 to 21 days; 98% have an incubation period that falls within the 1 to 42 day interval."

Here's the point: 5% have incubation in EXCESS of 21 days, AND 2% apparently have an incubation period in EXCESS of 42 days.

So, out of 100 infected people, we'd of let five go free after 21 days symptom free, to start infecting others later!

#3 - It's been drilled into every one's head how unlike Ebola is to the Flu, but that could blindside us to not look for any similarities.

It might surprise you, even though Ebola is not airborne like flu, just how many of the seasonal influences that unleash flu every fall and winter could also enhance Ebola contagiousness then, too!

According to..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flu_season

The exact mechanism behind the seasonal nature of influenza outbreaks is unclear. Some proposed explanations are:

- People are indoors more often during the winter, they are in close contact more often, and this promotes transmission from person to person.
- A seasonal decline in the amount of ultraviolet radiation may reduce the likelihood of the virus being damaged or killed by direct radiation damage or indirect effects (i. e. ozone concentration) increasing the probability of infection.
- Cold temperatures lead to drier air, which may dehydrate mucous membranes, preventing the body from effectively defending against respiratory virus infections.[6][7][8]
- The virus may linger longer on exposed surfaces (doorknobs, countertops, etc.) in colder temperatures.
- In nations where children do not go to school in the summer, there is a more pronounced beginning to flu season, coinciding with the start of public school. It is thought that the creche environment is perfect for the spread of illness.
- Vitamin D production from Ultraviolet-B in the skin changes with the seasons and affects the immune system.[9][10][11]
- Research in guinea pigs has shown that the aerosol transmission of the virus is enhanced when the air is cold and dry.[6]

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/05/health/research/05flu.html?_r=0 says...

- The virus was transmitted best at a low humidity, 20 percent, and not transmitted at all when the humidity reached 80 percent.
- Flu viruses are more stable in cold air, and low humidity also helps the virus particles remain in the air. That is because the viruses float in the air in little respiratory droplets, Dr. Palese said. When the air is humid, those droplets pick up water, grow larger and fall to the ground.

Seems to me, even though Ebola is not supposed to be airborne, every one of those same mechanisms above should make Ebola much more contagious then, too.

Especially as we already know Ebola in the lab when subjected to cooler temperatures, stays viable much longer on surfaces, weeks longer, in fact. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20553340

And, we know that Ebola aerosol transmission is well documented. http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-pers...ers-need-optimal-respiratory-protection-ebola

We've never seen Ebola, that I'm aware of, infection rates in an environment outside of African heat and humidity.

It's possible that whatever contagion risk level Ebola is today, while warmer, for surface, aerosol or airborne ability to infect others, come this fall and winter colder weather, it could become a whole different ballgame! Surface and aerosol infection risks will most certainly go up and, who knows, but it might just be the right environment then for limited airborne transmission, too.

- Shane

 

[R.Tist]

You CANNOT even BEGIN to accurately run the numbers until you have:

1) An initial random infection in a specific area. (like we have in Dallas)
2) At least 1 month worth of initial, documented, infections directly related to the initial infection.

So Dallas is all we have to go on at the moment and I have posted those numbers on several threads but will post them again here:

September 2014 - 1 Infected, 0 Dead (Duncan)
October 2014 - 3 Infected, 1 Dead (Duncan dead, Pham and Vinson confirmed infected)
November 2014 - 6 Infected, 4 Dead (Duncan and 3 others dead)
December 2014 - 16 Infected, 9 Dead (Duncan and 8 others dead)

Keep in mind the above numbers are cumulative since Duncan became patient zero in late September.

Because we were only half-way through the first full month (October) when Pham and Vinson were confirmed with Ebola, that sets the initial R0 (infection rate) at a factor of 2.5. If we get 1 more before the end of October the factor goes up to 3.5. If we get 2 more before the end of the month the factor goes up to 4.5.

If the R0 factor goes up then all of the above monthly numbers go up.

The thing that will keep the R0 factor from going up is if they indeed successfully "Identify, Isolate and Contain" this thing. In the Dallas area, they use the "42 day" cycle (two "normal" 21 day cycles) where there are no new cases since the last known possible exposure, last Ebola death or since the last Ebola patient blood tested "clear" of the Ebola virus, whichever occurs last. After 42 days of "no new cases", the Dallas Outbreak would be declared "over".

There are officially no more Ebola cases in the Dallas area at this time since Pham and Vinson were both transferred to other facilities. Pham was the last to leave Dallas on Thursday, October 16th. Assuming October 17 would be Day 1 of the 42 day countdown to "End of Outbreak", Day 42 would be Thanksgiving Day, Thursday, November 27th.

Thanks, Kris.

While, I find your math skills reassuring, I can't help but think about the 'expedited visas' being processed in West Africa as we speak. I imagine we'll see radically different numbers then. I hope not, but I think so.

Canada won't be much help, since our government doesn't appear to have any more sense than yours does.

Thank you again for your level-headed analyses.


Artie.