Water purification questions???

[Ravekid]

First off, you may see this question in another forum, so if you answered it there...no need to answer it here.

Currently, I have always stored some Potable Aqua tabs, some Katadyn tabs, and a Katadyn Pocket Filter. These things are for storage only because I not hunt, camp, hike, etc.. After reading through some various magazines (US Cav, Cheaper Than Dirt), I have some questions about water purification.

For starters, I know that it would be great to have something that does it all. Potable Aqua and the pocket filter never were effective against viruses. A year or so ago, I found Katadyn made tabs that were much better than Potable Aqua. As such, once my Potable Aqua tabs expire, I will only buy Katadyn from here on out. Katadyn tabs are effective against viruses and cryptosporidium, which Potable Aqua is not. Anyone have anything to add to the tablet side of things? Is there a reason to keep re-supplying myself with Potable Aqua?

Now lets look at filters/purifiers. About five years ago, I purchased this Katadyn pocket filter. I know back then it was one of the best, as I reasearched this on-line. I have never used it and am wondering if the ceramic cartridge ever goes bad during non-use (I store it in a plastic tub with other camping type stuff)? A few years ago, I noticed some surplus type stores selling items that have claimed they also kill viruses, which is the only downfall to my pocket filter. These include:

SteriPEN Water Purifier--Uses UV light to destroy DNA of bacteria, viruses and parasitic protozoa.

Katadyn Exstream Bottle Purifiers--Removes all types of organisms, including viruses.

Survival Water Purifer--Removes viruses. (Sold by uscav.com, no name brand that I can tell of.).

MIOX Portable Emergency Water Purifer--You basically use a small amount of water and salt solution, shock it, then dump it into a larger container. After a few hours or something, it inactivates all viruses, bacteria, Giardia, and Cryptosporidium.

Any suggestions on what to get?

 

[Worrier King]

Wasn't aware of the Katadyn tabs, thanks for that info. How do they affect the water taste?

Are you ruling out Aquarain or Berkey gravity water filters which can provide more than enough pure water every day with minimum effort on your part?

http://www.aquarain.com/

http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/be...ilter_british_berkefeld_portable_purifier.asp

 

[Rex Jackson]

Well, it depends on what you plan on filtering. To filter radiation out of the water should be another concern. I dont believe you will get a 'do it all' filter. Filtering should be done in stages because the first stage will need to be cleaned regularly with secondary and third stages cleaned less regularly.

I made my own filter system. For a primary filter I used two 5 gallon pails. Pail 2 is the collector. In pail 1 I drill 1" holes in the bottom then I placed stones in the bottom. I then followed by placing a pillow case filled with a sandy/soil mix. Let the pillow cases fold over the outside of the pail. I fill the pail 2/3 with this mix. Then I place another pillow case over that mix fill that is fine sand. Some gues even make a 5 stage with sand and soil but its up to you. All sand, soil and stones I bake in the sun for a day. I have 3 piles of this stuff I leave in the open sun then store in pails. The radiation from the sun kills jerms, plants and insects. I bake it all on a 4'X4' piece of thin aluminum.

This pail will filter radioactive charge particles according to the army survival manual. It will also collect swamp greens, insects, microbs, etc. Also, you can change layer one every 20 gallons of water, layer two every 40, and finally the entire pail should be cleaned every 60. I believe there has been controversy regarding how many times it should be cleaned when running radioactive charged particles. Some guys say every 5gallons. I guess I would try some, then wave my rad meters over the water? I dont think it would register on the meters but I would try it anyway. Some guys make two identical filters. One for rads, then dump that through the next filter.

Next, I would boil all the water from that filter. From there it would go into storage into large 55gal, plastic drums.

When I finally need to use that water, I would run it through a british berkfield filter.

I have made electric water filters using UV/IR lights and charcoal filters but 1) you need power for it to work and 2) the charcoal still needs to be cleaned/replaced. Eventually you would need to boil the water anyway. I would never run dirty water through a British Berksfield filter because all you would do is clog the filters way sooner than later.

 

[Safecastle]

The Katadyn Exstream XR would be an excellent addition to your preps, Ravekid. For those who aren't familiar with it, it's the only EPA-registered portable water bottle (think the size of a Nalgene). It offers instant filtration/purification as you sip the water through an attached straw. It removes viruses, as well as cysts, bacteria, and chemicals.

The MSRP is $50. As always, and as with all my products, TB2Kers get substantial discounts just for the asking (don't purchase thru the store).

The Micropur tabs are a fairly recent advance and you are right, they are the best such tabs or chemical treatment available. Note that they do not remove chemical contamination from water. And that they require 30 minutes to 4 hours to do their thing. They add no unpleasant aftertaste, and in fact, most people say the water tastes better.

The ceramic filters do not have a shelf life. As they are used, they do require cleaning.

Carbon filters are good for about six months after first use.

Micropur tabs do have a shelf life and they need to be rotated out every few years.

 

[Dennis Olson]

JCR - I'd like to get a couple of those (as well as a couple virus filter replacements). Any chance on a TB group buy for these things? Also, what's the capacity of the container? (32 ozs?)

 

[Safecastle]

JCR - I'd like to get a couple of those (as well as a couple virus filter replacements). Any chance on a TB group buy for these things? Also, what's the capacity of the container? (32 ozs?)

Dennis, the bottle capacity is 34 oz., actual water volume, after cartridge displacement, is 28 oz. Each cartridge is good for about 26 gallons of water treatment.

I think we could do a buy on these. I'll post a new thread with pricing, etc.

 

[Dennis Olson]

I'll be looking forward to it. A VERY handy BoB / emergency filtration device. Portable AND filters viruses! (I'm surprised I never noticed these things available before...)

 

[Hermit]

Virus filters aren't really needed at this time in this country, viruses are more a problem in third world countries where people crap into the water that people downstream are drinking, or where a lot of people are slobbering all over a single town water pump. Viruses need regular cells to live.

However if there's a really bad SHTF situation, public sanitation might suffer and so a virus filter might become useful.

My approach is to know where the springs in my area are, as it's hard for them to become contaminated as long as they're above the level of human habitation. Of course if there are no clean springs in your area you need to find another way. My alternative would simply be to filter through cloth and then boil water in a large stockpot over a wood fire.

I also intend to get another MSR filter, but more for backpacking and very short term use.

 

[Dennis Olson]

Hermit - if you go HUNTING, and need a clean drink of water, these bottles would allow you to dip right into a stream. One that animals had "occupied" (if you get my meaning). Lots of virus potential. These bottles have 1001 uses IMO. I am really shummed about getting a pair!

 

[Bird Guano]

I use a MIOX pen and then filter it for taste, but that's just me.

I like redundancy in my preps.

I'm REALLY happy with this setup:

For basecamp, I have this (Style C and A), with the doulton ceramic
cartridge (same as a Berkey) and a Heavy metal resin/charcoal block
filter instead of the plain carbon filter as the second stage.

I can purify pond, puddle and pool water with this setup. CHEAP.

Edited to add: I forgot to mention that I chemicaly pre-treat for viruses, then purify with this setup. The carbon block removes ALL of the residual chlorine from either a bleach treatment or the MIOX pen.

 

[Bird Guano]

Virus filters aren't really needed at this time in this country, viruses are more a problem in third world countries

That situation will probably change come fall with the bird migrations, and the projected introduction of the H5N1 avian influenza virus into N. America.

Plan ahead.

 

[night driver]

WE took First Needs and Seagul V's (IIRC) to Paki. First Need was a team (2 or 3 person) item, and the Seagull was a general team item.

BOTH of these PURIFIERS are good for Viri as well as all the usual nasty bacteria. I had ORIGINALLY planned on using my Mini-Works but that is NOT a Viri capable Purifier.....

The new 2 part Potable Aqua which IIRC id Iodine should handle viri, just get the 2 part version, and use the neutralizer tabs AFTER the CONTACT TIME HAS ELAPSED.

OR you can use the single part and use some citric acid containing kool aid to neutralize the iodine, again AFTER the CONTACT TIME HAS ELAPSED...


c

 

[Hermit]

Hermit - if you go HUNTING, and need a clean drink of water, these bottles would allow you to dip right into a stream. One that animals had "occupied" (if you get my meaning). Lots of virus potential. These bottles have 1001 uses IMO. I am really shummed about getting a pair!

Yes, I suppose that some animal viruses could cross over, as Bird Guano appropriately warned bird ... well, guano ... could carry bird flu. If the device draws easily and you only take a sip or two at a time, it might be as good as or bettter than using a pump.

 

[A.T.Hagan]

Moved to Preps.

.....Alan.