BRKG Ukraine's separatist regions of Donetsk, Luhansk to hold votes from Friday to become part of Russia

somewherepress

Has No Life - Lives on TB

somewherepress

Has No Life - Lives on TB

Series Of Occupied Ukraine Regions Set Referendums As 'National Mobilization' Being Pushed Through Russia's Duma​

BY TYLER DURDEN
TUESDAY, SEP 20, 2022 - 07:23 AM
Multiple pro-Moscow officials in Ukraine on Tuesday announced their intent to stage referendums on joining Russia, including the head of the Donetsk People's Republic Denis Pushilin, as well as the Russia-installed official over the southern Kherson region, Vladimir Saldo. "I think that people have long been waiting for a referendum here and it will probably be a political move that will help ensure the safety of civilians," Pushillin said Tuesday.

The neighboring Luhansk People's Republic, where fierce battles took place ahead of and into the summer wherein Russia definitively gobbled up most territory, has also adopted a law on holding a vote, now announced for September 23-27.
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Bloomberg in reporting the announcement suggests that Ukraine's counteroffensive in the east may have actually hastened Moscow's timeline on annexation:
The Kremlin is moving hastily to stage sham votes on annexing the regions of Ukraine its forces still control, after Kyiv’s military drove Russian troops from large areas of territory taken in their seven-month-old invasion. The so-called Luhansk People’s Republic may hold its vote as soon as this weekend, Interfax quoted a senior legislator as saying Tuesday.
Kherson region's Vladimir Saldo too said that "the leadership of the Kherson region administration decided to prepare and hold a referendum" after what he described as a public appeal, saying in a video message:
"We have set a course for reunification, a return to Russia. And we will not turn away from it."
As for the two self-proclaimed republics in the Donbas, this has long been seen as perhaps inevitable since the war began, but even partially Russian-controlled Zaporizhzhia region has seen pro-Russian officials already talking about a referendum, based on the "We are together with Russia" movement.

Kremlin officials have long been on record as saying Ukrainian regions which hold a referendum vote in the affirmative will be recognized and granted admission to the Russian Federation. At the same time Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has vowed his forces will not stop fighting until every inch of Ukraine territory is liberated, including even the Crimea - under Russian control since 2014. The hardening of resolve on both sides have made negotiations essentially impossible at this point.

Referendums in occupied territory will further ensure the warring sides deem direct talks as not a real option. Bloomberg notes further of how the referendums are likely to change the battlefield dynamic:
By making the occupied zones formally part of Russia under the country’s laws, the votes may also allow the Kremlin to deploy conscript troops there, in addition to the current force of contract soldiers and military contractors.
Dmitry Medvedev, the deputy head of Russia's Security Council, said that the referendums will result in greater protection of residents from Ukrainian attacks. "Encroachment onto the territory of Russia is a crime which allows you to use all self-defense forces," he said on Telegram.

So far in the Donbas - in the DPR and LPR regions - the main fighting forces have been the pro-Russian separatist militias. Making these Russian territory opens the door for 'legal' (in Moscow's eyes) entry of regular conscripts and even permanent military bases.

Meanwhile, amid reported devastating losses and a general pullback from positions near Kharkiv, Russia is believed to be on the brink of major escalation...

Throughout this month there have been persisting rumors that Putin could be ready to formally declare a state of war against Ukraine. State media sources are on Tuesday reporting that Russian parliament appears to be taking legal steps to pave the way for national mobilization of forces:
The State Duma immediately in the second and third readings unanimously approved the amendments, including the introduction of the concepts of "mobilization" and "wartime" into the Criminal Code, as well as establishing responsibility for looting and voluntary surrender.
Given the series of occupied Ukraine regions now declaring intent to hold referendums, coming just as news of these key changes being pushed through the State Duma emerge on Tuesday, it does seem Russia is about to quickly "answer" the ongoing Ukraine counteroffensive in a dramatic way.

Margarita Simonyan, the Editor-in-chief of state-funded RT news, made the following ominous prediction: "By what is happening and still about to happen, this week marks either the eve of our imminent victory, or the eve of nuclear war. I can't see anything third."
 

Dobbin

Faithful Steed
No wait - call on "populist forces" (i.e. democracy) to determine who will rule populists?

This is VERY averse to a "New World Order."

There are no borders now. And every government pledges fealty to the World Economic Forum/Davos crowd and abides by their rules and dictates. And NATO (i.e. US Taxpayers) is their beck and call defense against those who insist on being outside the WEF/NWO.

Free elections simply CAN'T be allowed to occur!


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Dobbin
 

mecoastie

Veteran Member
No wait - call on "populist forces" (i.e. democracy) to determine who will rule populists?

This is VERY averse to a "New World Order."

There are no borders now. And every government pledges fealty to the World Economic Forum/Davos crowd and abides by their rules and dictates. And NATO (i.e. US Taxpayers) is their beck and call defense against those who insist on being outside the WEF/NWO.

Free elections simply CAN'T be allowed to occur!


intro-1524158360.jpg


Dobbin
Free elections dont occur anywhere anymore.
 

Doc1

Has No Life - Lives on TB
By my lights, the residents of both the Donetsk People's Republic and the Luhansk People's Republic have little rational choice but to join with Russia. The majority of them are both ethnically and linguistically Russian and have suffered under Ukrainian oppression for many years.

Neither of the self-proclaimed republics are really large enough to be viable countries in their own right. As a practical matter, they need to ally with and join a larger political entity. Who could they possibly merge with other than Russia, Lichtenstein?

Despite the lip service the United States (and some members here) pay to so-called 'democracy,' when it comes to Ukraine, democracy isn't given a second thought. Readers should recall that the United States funded and arranged the overthrow of the pro-Russian government elected by the people of Ukraine. Later, the citizens of Crimea voted overwhelmingly (by over 90%) to join Russia.

It's funny how when elections don't go the way the US (read Deep State) wants them to, they are decried as rigged or illegitimate. When actual rigged elections - like the one that put Joe Biden in the White House - are held, the results are considered sacrosanct and anyone who questions them is suddenly an enemy of the state.

Best
Doc
 

Dobbin

Faithful Steed
It's funny how when elections don't go the way the US (read Deep State) wants them to, they are decried as rigged or illegitimate.
Think to the level beyond.

"New World Order" of George Bush's descriptive.

World Economic Forum. They meet bi-annually at various locations, primarily at Davos, Switzerland - otherwise known as a "playground of the rich."


They are into "sustainable", "Green New Deal," Socialist Controlled Economies - and "Bilking" the taxpayers out of MILLIONS dare I say BILLIONS of wealth - and - keeping their spot as your lords and master.

Many world leaders today have been to their conferences and "training." To include Vladmir Putin, Amy Klobuchar, Justin Trudeau, King Charles, Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden (what's left of him.)

Just about any Pol who is "woke" has been to the WEF meetings/training.

Putin is the exception in that he hasn't bought into their game and released Russian national sovereignty to the WEF. And that is why he is being vilified in the world press. And why NATO is being called out against him.

Trump is an exception too. That is why he's now "non-persona grata" in the MEEDIA and politics.

Right now as this horse writes this, the WEF is sponsoring "Sustainable Development Impact Meetings." Here they will develop "consensus" on plans going forward. Note they're not consulting YOU, or anyone who might be adversely affected by their plans.

They know what is "best" for you. Of course they say it is best for you but more likely it is best for THEM.

In a word, the WEF is a "collusion" designed to bilk you of your Maker given rights - and deprive you of your Maker given DESTINY. And impose one of their own.

And it's not a pretty destiny. George Orwell's "Boot" comes to mind.

Dobbin
 
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mecoastie

Veteran Member
By my lights, the residents of both the Donetsk People's Republic and the Luhansk People's Republic have little rational choice but to join with Russia. The majority of them are both ethnically and linguistically Russian and have suffered under Ukrainian oppression for many years.

Neither of the self-proclaimed republics are really large enough to be viable countries in their own right. As a practical matter, they need to ally with and join a larger political entity. Who could they possibly merge with other than Russia, Lichtenstein?

Despite the lip service the United States (and some members here) pay to so-called 'democracy,' when it comes to Ukraine, democracy isn't given a second thought. Readers should recall that the United States funded and arranged the overthrow of the pro-Russian government elected by the people of Ukraine. Later, the citizens of Crimea voted overwhelmingly (by over 90%) to join Russia.

It's funny how when elections don't go the way the US (read Deep State) wants them to, they are decried as rigged or illegitimate. When actual rigged elections - like the one that put Joe Biden in the White House - are held, the results are considered sacrosanct and anyone who questions them is suddenly an enemy of the state.

Best
Doc
It is their only option. If they were to vote no Russia would become an occupier instead of a liberator. With few very small areas in Donetsk and Luhansk and of course all of Crimea, ethnic Ukrainians made up the majority of both Luhansk and Donetsk. Linguistically the Russian language was used over a larger area of that territory but still not a majority overall except for Crimea.

The elections in Ukraine have never been free elections. Russia bought and paid for all those past presidents. What Russia is pissed about is that we overthrew their puppet to install our puppet. They then used the excuse that they needed to protect their people to take the parts of Donetsk, Luhansk and the Crimea. The abuses were rampant on both sides. Neither side can claim any sort of moral high ground in that. The Russians were driven to the Russian side and the Ukrainians to the Ukrainian side. Russia then imported more people to make their areas more Russian and the Ukrainians did the same. If any of the other got stubborn and stayed they were burned out and harassed or forcibly removed.
 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
Without reading the thread, here are the two possibilities that come to mind:

1. Russia is planning to leave the theater, and the Eastern districts are trying to entangle them to stay. Potentially bad for Russia, and maybe everybody.

2. Russia is driving these requests, beginning the establishment of a neo-Soviet, or perhaps a return to Warsaw pact sorts of spheres of influence.

Of course, other possibilities may exist, this is just my initial view of this development.
 
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Dobbin

Faithful Steed
I will put my oats on Putin declaring an "impasse" and taking the Russian speaking genetic regions as "consolation prize."

The vote (such as it is) will be FOR unification with Russia.

And Putin can go home having established PART of what he came to accomplish.

And having poked the US/New World Order in the eye.

Dobbin
 

von Koehler

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Martin Armstrong's computer AI program Socrates has predicted use of nuclear weapons in Ukraine.

I was hoping Putin was smarter than that, but with mounting Russian losses, his choices are rapidly diminishing.

Either he admits this Ukrainian invasion was a serious blunder and exit OR resorts to nukes.

Politicians don't like to admit to mistakes, especially when weak dictators lose support.

2023 is going to be the year from hell.
 

von Koehler

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I will put my oats on Putin declaring an "impasse" and taking the Russian speaking genetic regions as "consolation prize."

The vote (such as it is) will be FOR unification with Russia.

And Putin can go home having established PART of what he came to accomplish.

And having poked the US/New World Order in the eye.

Dobbin

This might be what Putin WANTS to do, but the Ukainians want their land back.

They will not accept the sham results of a staged election. They will just keep on fighting.
 
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von Koehler

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Um... Oh shit?


Important indicator. The smart money senses something very bad is about to happen and they are running away.

ETA: the US stock market is not immune either. It's about 1 percent down today.
 
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SmithJ

Veteran Member
I find it hilarious that all the media sources that said Putin was dying, had Parkinson's, couldn't sit straight, couldn't walk - they all sure are quiet after his appearance at the summit last week. They just disappeared.
 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
Some behind the curtain power struggles?
Maybe so. Perhaps some of the Duma does not wish to stumble into a fireball.

Maybe Putin, as Russia's CinC, is placing forces at ready if the annexation comes to pass.

It's also possible that the breakaway Ukrainian regions are not as in favor of this as portrayed to the world.

It's also possible that Euro backchannels are screaming VERY loudly over this.
 

Infoscout

The Dude Abides
Putin wants full and total war, he wants full mobilization and martial law to lock
His country down. He is going to war with NATO, and China has given this their blessing. The US is weak, and will not be able to reinforce Europe if war starts, it won’t matter as this will go nuclear soon enough.
 

von Koehler

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Maybe so. Perhaps some of the Duma does not wish to stumble into a fireball.

It's also possible that the breakaway Ukrainian regions are not as in favor of this as portrayed to the world.

It's also possible that Euro backchannels are screaming VERY loudly over this.

All very possible scenarios, and there are probably even more players then we know about.
 

psychgirl

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Putin wants full and total war, he wants full mobilization and martial law to lock
His country down. He is going to war with NATO, and China has given this their blessing. The US is weak, and will not be able to reinforce Europe if war starts, it won’t matter as this will go nuclear soon enough.
Do you felt this is just another one of Putins chain and sabor rattling??

I’m not bashing, just trying to remain balanced over something I/we…have no control over.
 

mecoastie

Veteran Member
Maybe so. Perhaps some of the Duma does not wish to stumble into a fireball.

Maybe Putin, as Russia's CinC, is placing forces at ready if the annexation comes to pass.

It's also possible that the breakaway Ukrainian regions are not as in favor of this as portrayed to the world.

It's also possible that Euro backchannels are screaming VERY loudly over this.
The Duma doesnt have a choice. They do what Putin wants or they get the penthouse at a hospital.

The occupied regiions are only going to be given one box to check on the ballot, if there is even a ballot, and that is yes.
 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
The Duma doesnt have a choice. They do what Putin wants or they get the penthouse at a hospital.

The occupied regiions are only going to be given one box to check on the ballot, if there is even a ballot, and that is yes.
You may be right, but considering their own mouthpieces are saying "we win this or we have WWIII" it may be that some of the Duma may be willing to risk the personal political fallout from obstructing this.

But the regions in question, they'll be given the same choices as the Crimean Parliament was, with armed political advisors over their shoulders, if need be.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
This should help calm things down....


https://twitter.com/TheInsiderPaper/status/1572198603527188481
Insider Paper
@TheInsiderPaper


JUST IN Ukraine's separatist regions of Donetsk, Luhansk to hold votes from Friday to become part of Russia. - AP


7:18 AM · Sep 20, 2022
Given how the tide seems to be turning, it might be all for naught.

Putin's a long ways from done here and I can't remember him backing down; tactical realignments perhaps, maybe a new strategy but I don't see any quit in that dog.
 
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