WTF?!? Screen Grab from 1999 movie Deterrence

goosebeans

Veteran Member
Just settling in to watch this movie on Amazon Prime. I'd never heard of it before. Son walking by, looking over my shoulder yells STOP, go back!

:eek:





Short blurb about the movie

:The President of the United States finds himself snowed in at a Colorado diner. The President must confront a national crisis and impending war when Iraq invades Kuwait. Trapped in the snowbound diner, faced with the prospect of a two-front war, the President has less than two hours to decide whether to deploy the ultimate weapon.
 

Attachments

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tech

Veteran Member
Ditto...

Invalid Attachment specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator
 

goosebeans

Veteran Member
Gee, it shows when I click on the Attachment.

At 0:05:23 in the movie there's a shot of a tv screen showing the Connecticut Primary results. It has TRUMP: 2,660,987 and Emerson 2,470,478!!!!

Hope someone can grab it and post it here.
 

bw

Fringe Ranger
Gee, it shows when I click on the Attachment.

Sounds like you've got it saved on your PC, or it's in an account that needs a signon to see it.

<ATTACH>134138</ATTACH>

Yeah, that looks local to you.

ETA: I take it back. Maybe that's a TB2K attachment number that's returned to you when you upload, and you're linking to it wrong. Check with Dennis.
 
Last edited:

goosebeans

Veteran Member
I saved it as a JPEG and tried to upload it from a folder on my PC but obviously it didn't work. Maybe someone more tech savvy can upload a screen shot - or tell me how to do it.
 

Satanta

Stone Cold Crazy
_______________
Fixed it. Looks likeyou tried to attach it using the image link at the top of the screen which only works for images online. To attach from your PC you have to use the 'Upload image" button below the form field to upload the image from your PC.
 

bev

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I wonder which Trump it's referring to. In the movie. Which I've never seen. What time period is it? Could be one of Donald's sons.

Prophetic?
 

EastWest

Senior Member
Great Catch.. I have seen this stuff in so many movies predating events, esp 911 stuff like the perps birthday is 9-11 bla bla
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Looked up the plot. (It's on Wikipedia).

I find this QUITE SCARY.

The "PRESIDENT" in question is NOT the "elected" President---the ELECTED PRESIDENT DIED (doesn't say how).

THIS "PRESIDENT" is the "appointed VICE-PRESIDENT" (don't know what they mean by "appointed"---UNLESS it means the PRESIDENT-ELECT had not yet TAKEN OFFICE when he was killed, so the VICE-PRESIDENT had not yet been "officially" sworn in as such???

The summary states that this Vice-President DOES go ahead and order a nuclear strike on a rogue Iraq, but then announces to the US and the world that Iraq's retaliatory bombs didn't go off because of a previous plot between the US and France to sell Iraq defective weapons. THEN-- "Already reeling from the shocks of the past few minutes, the President's aides are further astounded when he announces his immediate withdrawal from the election campaign. He did what he felt it necessary to do, but believes that someone else should be the one to carry on."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deterrence_(film)
Deterrence (film)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Deterrence
DeterrenceDVDCover.jpg
DVD Cover
Directed by Rod Lurie
Produced by Marc Frydman
James Spies
Maurice Leblond
Screenplay by Rod Lurie
Starring Kevin Pollak
Timothy Hutton
Sheryl Lee Ralph
Clotilde Courau
Sean Astin
Music by Larry Groupé
Cinematography Frank Perl
Edited by Alan Roberts
Distributed by Paramount Classics
Release dates


March 10, 2000 (United States)

Running time
104 minutes
Country France
United States
Language English
Budget $800,000
Box office $145,071

Deterrence is a 1999 French/American dramatic film written and directed by Rod Lurie, depicting fictional events about nuclear brinkmanship. It marks the feature directorial debut of Lurie, who was previously a film critic for the New York Daily News, Premiere Magazine, Entertainment Weekly and Movieline, among others. Kevin Pollak, Timothy Hutton, Sheryl Lee Ralph and Sean Astin star. The entire story takes place in a single location, a diner.[1]

Contents

1 Plot
2 Cast
3 Reception
3.1 Critical reaction
3.2 Box office
4 References
5 External links

Plot

Set in 2008, President Walter Emerson, formerly an appointed Vice President and elevated by the death of the previous (unseen) commander-in-chief, is crossing the country on a campaign tour when a freak snowstorm traps him in a remote Colorado diner with members of his staff plus a group of ordinary citizens.

Suddenly, word arrives that Uday Hussein, who in the film is the leader of Iraq, has invaded Kuwait. Using a television cameraman who is following his campaign, Emerson notifies the world that unless Hussein orders an immediate retreat and personally surrenders, he will bomb Baghdad with a nuclear weapon.

Hussein, through his United Nations envoy, refuses to back down and cuts off telephone negotiations, claiming Emerson is a non-elected leader and also a Jew. He threatens to fire Iraq's black-market nuclear missiles at several global locations including Emerson's own, near NORAD in Colorado, if his country comes under attack.

It is learned that Iraq purchased these weapons from France. Despite being a U.S. ally, the French president appears to be cavalier in confirming this with Emerson and his entourage. The sites of the missile launchers include Libya and North Korea.

Emerson is counseled by his chief of staff, Marshall Thompson, a former university classmate, and by his national security adviser, Gayle Redford. Once his ultimatum is made and the countdown to his deadline begins, the President and his staff are confronted with the opinions of the diner's customers, including its angry owner and cook, Harvey, and a young bigot named Ralph.

Emerson is not only adamant in his beliefs, he seems every bit as willing as Hussein to trigger a nuclear war. He orders a B-2 bomber to cross Iraq's borders despite the threats of the Iraqi ambassador that this would constitute an act of war. In retaliation, the Iraqis aims 23 nuclear I.C.B.M.s against various countries of the world, including Australia, Japan, France and other targets.

The President argues with advisers while appearing totally confident in his own actions. A tragedy occurs inside the diner when Harvey brandishes a gun and shoots the military officer carrying the briefcase that contains the launch codes. Emerson's security guards kill the cook.

To the horror of all, the President carries out his threat. He authorizes the dropping of a 100 megaton bomb on Baghdad, resulting in the complete destruction of that city.

Iraq's retaliation begins. A bomb lands in Athens, but it does not detonate. Neither does a device that lands in Hiroshima. A majority of the other missiles have been intercepted.

A short time later, the President addresses the world on TV. He explains that in order to prevent the Iraqi regime from developing its own nuclear devices through other channels, the U.S. sold it nuclear weapons via the French, whilst ensuring that they would never be able to function properly.

Already reeling from the shocks of the past few minutes, the President's aides are further astounded when he announces his immediate withdrawal from the election campaign. He did what he felt it necessary to do, but believes that someone else should be the one to carry on.

One version of the movie has WWE wrestler Droz's bare feet (with painted toenails) covering the faces of all of the actors and actresses in Deterrence for the whole entire movie. This version was released on October 5 2009 to coincide with the 10 year anniversary of Droz's paralyzing injury.
 

goosebeans

Veteran Member
Excellent movie! Filled with suspense! Don't know if the sound was just poor or if it was meant to make you feel confused. Lots of people talking over each other so you really have to listen to catch it all.

Strange though, I only heard Trump's name mentioned once and it was muffled and cut off by the news anchor. There was mention of Bush and Clinton and I swear I heard "Secretary Clinton" mentioned but again it was clipped. I've seen this kind of "Woo" posted before too but it's the first time I've ever come across it with my own eyes.

I'd recommend that you all watch it and see if you pick up more than I did.
 

TammyinWI

Talk is cheap
Deterrence theory (*fair use)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to: navigation, search

This article is about deterrent theories of war and nuclear weapons. For legal theory of justice, see Deterrence (legal).

Deterrence theory gained increased prominence as a military strategy during the Cold War with regard to the use of nuclear weapons. It took on a unique connotation during this time as an inferior nuclear force, by virtue of its extreme destructive power, could deter a more powerful adversary, provided that this force could be protected against destruction by a surprise attack. Deterrence is a strategy intended to dissuade an adversary from taking an action not yet started, or to prevent them from doing something that another state desires. A credible nuclear deterrent, Bernard Brodie wrote in 1959, must be always at the ready, yet never used.[1][a]

In Thomas Schelling's (1966) classic work on deterrence, the concept that military strategy can no longer be defined as the science of military victory is presented. Instead, it is argued that military strategy was now equally, if not more, the art of coercion, of intimidation and deterrence.[2] Schelling says the capacity to harm another state is now used as a motivating factor for other states to avoid it and influence another state's behavior. To be coercive or deter another state, violence must be anticipated and avoidable by accommodation. It can therefore be summarized that the use of the power to hurt as bargaining power is the foundation of deterrence theory, and is most successful when it is held in reserve.[2]

In 2004 Frank C. Zagare made the case that deterrence theory is logically inconsistent, not empirically accurate, and that it is deficient as a theory. In place of classical deterrence, rational choice scholars have argued for perfect deterrence, which assumes that states may vary in their internal characteristics and especially in the credibility of their threats of retaliation.[3]

In a January 2007 article in the Wall Street Journal, veteran cold-war policy makers Henry Kissinger, Bill Perry, George Shultz, and Sam Nunn reversed their previous position and asserted that far from making the world safer, nuclear weapons had become a source of extreme risk.[4] "Senior European statesmen and women" called for further action in 2010 in addressing problems of nuclear weapons proliferation. They said: "Nuclear deterrence is a far less persuasive strategic response to a world of potential regional nuclear arms races and nuclear terrorism than it was to the cold war".[5]

The concept of deterrence[edit]

The use of military threats as a means to deter international crises and war has been a central topic of international security research for decades. Research has predominantly focused on the theory of rational deterrence to analyze the conditions under which conventional deterrence is likely to succeed or fail. Alternative theories however have challenged the rational deterrence theory and have focused on organizational theory and cognitive psychology.

The concept of deterrence can be defined as the use of threats by one party to convince another party to refrain from initiating some course of action.[6] A threat serves as a deterrent to the extent that it convinces its target not to carry out the intended action because of the costs and losses that target would incur. In international security, a policy of deterrence generally refers to threats of military retaliation directed by the leaders of one state to the leaders of another in an attempt to prevent the other state from resorting to the threat of use of military force in pursuit of its foreign policy goals.

As outlined by Huth,[6] a policy of deterrence can fit into two broad categories being (i) preventing an armed attack against a state’s own territory (known as direct deterrence); or (ii) preventing an armed attack against another state (known as extended deterrence). Situations of direct deterrence often occur when there is a territorial dispute between neighboring states in which major powers like the United States do not directly intervene. On the other hand, situations of extended deterrence often occur when a great power becomes involved. It is the latter that has generated the majority of interest in academic literature. Building on these two broad categories, Huth goes on to outline that deterrence policies may be implemented in response to a pressing short-term threat (known as immediate deterrence) or as strategy to prevent a military conflict or short term threat from arising (known as general deterrence).

A successful deterrence policy must be considered in not only military terms, but also in political terms. In military terms, deterrence success refers to preventing state leaders from issuing military threats and actions that escalate peacetime diplomatic and military cooperation into a crisis or militarized confrontation which threatens armed conflict and possibly war. The prevention of crises of wars however is not the only aim of deterrence. In addition, defending states must be able to resist the political and military demands of a potential attacking nation. If armed conflict is avoided at the price of diplomatic concessions to the maximum demands of the potential attacking nation under the threat of war, then it cannot be claimed that deterrence has succeeded.

Furthermore, as Jentleson et al.[7] argue, two key sets of factors for successful deterrence are important being (i) a defending state strategy that firstly balances credible coercion and deft diplomacy consistent with the three criteria of proportionality, reciprocity, and coercive credibility, and secondly minimizes international and domestic constraints; and (ii) the extent of an attacking state's vulnerability as shaped by its domestic political and economic conditions. In broad terms, a state wishing to implement a strategy of deterrence is most likely to succeed if the costs of non-compliance it can impose on, and the benefits of compliance it can offer to, another state are greater than the benefits of noncompliance and the costs of compliance.

Deterrence theory holds that nuclear weapons are intended to deter other states from attacking with their nuclear weapons, through the promise of retaliation and possibly mutually assured destruction (MAD). Nuclear deterrence can also be applied to an attack by conventional forces; for example, the doctrine of massive retaliation threatened to launch US nuclear weapons in response to Soviet attacks.

A successful nuclear deterrent requires that a country preserve its ability to retaliate, either by responding before its own weapons are destroyed or by ensuring a second strike capability. A nuclear deterrent is sometimes composed of a nuclear triad, as in the case of the nuclear weapons owned by the United States, Russia and the People's Republic of China. Other countries, such as the United Kingdom and France, have only sea- and air-based nuclear weapons.

Proportionality[edit]

Jentleson et al. provide further detail in relation to these factors.[7] Firstly, proportionality refers to the relationship between the defending state's scope and nature of the objectives being pursued, and the instruments available for use to pursue this. The more the defending state demands of another state, the higher that state's costs of compliance and the greater need for the defending state’s strategy to increase the costs of noncompliance and the benefits of compliance. This is a challenge, as deterrence is, by definition, a strategy of limited means. George (1991) goes on to explain that deterrence may, but is not required to, go beyond threats to the actual use of military force; but if force is actually used, it must be limited and fall short of full-scale use or war otherwise it fails.[8] The main source of disproportionality is an objective that goes beyond policy change to regime change. This has been seen in the cases of Libya, Iraq, and North Korea where defending states have sought to change the leadership of a state in addition to policy changes relating primarily to their nuclear weapons programs.

Continued here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deterrence_theory
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
Just settling in to watch this movie on Amazon Prime. I'd never heard of it before. Son walking by, looking over my shoulder yells STOP, go back!

:eek:





Short blurb about the movie

:The President of the United States finds himself snowed in at a Colorado diner. The President must confront a national crisis and impending war when Iraq invades Kuwait. Trapped in the snowbound diner, faced with the prospect of a two-front war, the President has less than two hours to decide whether to deploy the ultimate weapon.

Some how I missed this during the election period, thank you for posting this now I'll have to watch the movie.
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Interesting to see this again. I'd forgotten I'd posted to the thread (the plot for the movie, post 16).

The thing that doesn't make sense about the plot summary / movie plot (and if someone here has seen it recently please straighten us out on this) is--

does President Emerson (already fully a President, after having risen to that position after the death of the previous President, who is un-named in the summary)--actually quit DURING the election itself?

He must have--because of this screen-shot showing they are already tallying up the vote count, for Emerson against Trump?

That raises all kinds of Constitutional connundrums---

Was he resigning from being President, during an election? (which would mean whoever "his" VP was, would become President for the 2.75 month remainder of his term, but would he automatically become his party's representative in place of President Emerson? BOTH would have to have been already approved by Congress to be holding their current seats)?

Or was he merely pulling out of an election, in the middle of the actual election, which again raises Constitutional crises questions, as it would leave his PARTY (and was his party ever specified in the movie?)without a candidate to represent it in the election? It would seem to me that if such were the case---if one party "lost" (for whatever reason---death, incapacity, or withdrawal) its prime and only candidate in the middle of an election, that this would severely if not completely invalidate the election results----if the candidate who remains won, he'd be winning "by default" because he essentially has no one to run against, and if the candidate who withdrew won (though it doesn't look like he "is" winning, by this screenshot) -- Who would serve?-- since the party with the winning candidate no longer HAS a candidate to fill that slot?

Interesting Constitutional conundrum----what would be done in such a case?

And everything would point to the "Trump" candidate--whoever he is--being disqualified as "illegitimate", since there would be so much confusion surrounding his election.....which is also 'interesting', given current efforts to force our President Trump out as "illegitimately elected" (due to some supposed "Russian" connection)
 

Vtshooter

Veteran Member
Actually, the idea of feeding a country (Iran) a bunch of non functional nukes, to keep them from making their own, has potential. Imagine a back door into the system that causes them to detonate 10 seconds after launch.
 

TerryK

TB Fanatic
Just finished watching the movie. Excellent.

In addition to the Trump candidate, they had a Secretary of State Clinton.

Yes in the end Emerson withdraws from the race.

Gotta admit that it was a damn good movie for being shot almost entirely in an old country diner.
 

Thomas Paine

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Great movie and good move by the President who wasn't elected for the job. people need to be reminded America will F#ck you up if you push us too far.
 

The "PRESIDENT" in question is NOT the "elected" President---the ELECTED PRESIDENT DIED (doesn't say how).

THIS "PRESIDENT" is the "appointed VICE-PRESIDENT" (don't know what they mean by "appointed"---UNLESS it means the PRESIDENT-ELECT had not yet TAKEN OFFICE when he was killed, so the VICE-PRESIDENT had not yet been "officially" sworn in as such???



Sounds like the Ford administration.

1. The duly elected VP, Spiro Agnew, resigns for malfeasance as a governor.

2. Jerry Ford is selected as a replacement VP by President Nixon.

3. Nixon is assured of impeachment. Being guilty of the charges, he decides to resign instead of face a trial.

4. Jerry Ford, as VP, is sworn in as the Constitutional successor to the Presidency.

5. Now Ford needs a VP and chooses Nelson Rockefeller. At this point, we have a POTUS and a VPOTUS, neither of whom has been elected to those positions by the American voters.

6. Ford then pardons Nixon, angering the American people and paving the way for Jimmy Carter to win in '76.

7. Americans are once again reminded that actions have consequences and in 1980 elect Reagan.
 

goosebeans

Veteran Member
Just finished watching the movie. Excellent.

In addition to the Trump candidate, they had a Secretary of State Clinton.

Yes in the end Emerson withdraws from the race.

Gotta admit that it was a damn good movie for being shot almost entirely in an old country diner.

Thanks TerryK, I'm glad you caught the mention of Secretary Clinton, too. I wasn't sure if I'd heard correctly or not. It was all very subliminal what with Clinton's name obfuscated by other noise and no mention of Trump, outright. Just the quick shot of the TV screen. Yes, I thought it was a very good movie

For what it's worth, the population of CT in 1999 was 3.386 million. was wondering if the vote numbers on the screen might have had any significance.
 

TerryK

TB Fanatic
Thanks TerryK, I'm glad you caught the mention of Secretary Clinton, too. I wasn't sure if I'd heard correctly or not. It was all very subliminal what with Clinton's name obfuscated by other noise and no mention of Trump, outright. Just the quick shot of the TV screen. Yes, I thought it was a very good movie

For what it's worth, the population of CT in 1999 was 3.386 million. was wondering if the vote numbers on the screen might have had any significance.

They actually had a voice on the phone that sounded like her, telling the President, "Will do sir" about telling the Iraqis that they were going to lose Baghdad and there was nothing they could do about it except begin withdrawing from Kuwait and Saudi within the hour.
The idea of the 100 megaton bomb was a stretch though. :lol:
 

rmomaha

The Wise Man Prepares
The Illuminati broadcasting their intent. The deck is stacked my friends. There is nothing we can do to stop it.
 

shane

Has No Life - Lives on TB
The Illuminati broadcasting their intent. The deck is stacked my friends. There is nothing we can do to stop it.

Their job is a lot easier when more think so, they are counting on it and need it, but if last election proved anything, we all got a
glimpse behind the curtain, as their claims of coming undeniable overwhelming victory were shattered, it was just smoke & mirrors.

- Shane
 
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