HEALTH New York mayor plans to hospitalize mentally ill people involuntarily

smokin

Veteran Member


The mayor of New York City announced on Tuesday that he is ordering police and emergency services to more aggressively hospitalize those with mental illness who are on the streets, even if the hospitalization is involuntary and they pose no threat to other people.

Mayor Eric Adams’ directive would give outreach workers, city hospitals and first responders, including police, discretion to forcibly hospitalize anyone they deem as not “meeting their basic human needs, causing them to be a danger to themselves”, Adams told a news conference.


The mayor called the directive an attempt to clear up a “gray area where policy, law and accountability have not been clear”, adding that the mandate is “a moral obligation to act” in light of “a crisis we see all around us”.


“These New Yorkers and hundreds of others like them are in urgent need of treatment, yet often refuse it when offered,” said Adams.

“The very nature of their illnesses keeps them from realizing they need intervention and support. Without that intervention, they remain lost and isolated from society, tormented by delusions and disordered thinking. They cycle in and out of hospitals and jails.”

The Adams administration did not provide evidence that forced treatment is effective in treating mental illness or preventing crime.

Advocacy groups for civil rights groups and the homeless criticized the mayor’s mandate.

“The mayor is playing fast and loose with the legal rights of New Yorkers and is not dedicating the resources necessary to address the mental health crises that affect our communities,“ said Donna Lieberman, executive director the New York Civil Liberties Union.

“Forcing people into treatment is a failed strategy for connecting people to long-term treatment and care.”

The Coalition for the Homeless also denounced the mayor’s plan, saying the city should focus on expanding access to voluntary psychiatric treatment.

“Mayor Adams continues to get it wrong when it comes to his reliance on ineffective surveillance, policing and involuntary transport and treatment of people with mental illness,” said the coalition’s executive director, Jacquelyn Simone.

State law also generally limits the ability of authorities to force someone into a mental health facility unless they pose a danger to themselves or others.

But Adams called such limitations a “myth”, stating that the law does not require a person to be behaving in an “outrageously dangerous” or suicidal way before a police officer or medical worker could take action.

As part of its initiative, the city said it would open a phone line to allow police officers to consult with clinicians.

The mayor has also announced a subway safety plan and vowed to expand outreach teams, made up of clinicians and police officers. But critics called the plan a crackdown on the mentally ill and the homeless.

A spokesperson for the New York governor, Kathy Hochul, said the city’s plan builds on mutual efforts to increase capacity at psychiatric hospitals, as well as expand outreach teams in subways.
 

Milkweed Host

Veteran Member
There may be something going around as the local police are also advising
people and family members in crisis to get help.. Posting a phone number and
the name of the mental health agency.
 

ChicagoMan74

ULTRA MAGA
“Forcing people into treatment is a failed strategy for connecting people to long-term treatment and care.”
Long term care? You mean like giving out prescriptions for daily oral anti-psychotics and letting the truly mentally ill walk the streets because its their right and the 72 hour hold was enough?

Yeah...that's worked out SO WELL.
 
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et2

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Many clinic or doctor office questioneers they make you fill out before your visit probe your personal life.
Are you depressed? Have you considered suicide? Do you drink? Are there guns in your home?

You see where it’s going.

Red Flag Laws
 

jward

passin' thru
I've been torn on this story for a few days now. Of course, it is completely illegal, ill-advised and will be misused to punish their political enemies.

..on the other hand. NY. More meds n MH tx can only do em good, ya know? :: shrug ::
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
We've come full-circle--and Full-On COMMUNIST.

The LIBERALS SHUT DOWN all the mental institutions in the 80s', as being "cruel" to "keep people against their will.

So now the laws are that a person can only be kept involuntarily for 72 hours for "observation"--then, unless they've actually committed a crime spurred on by their mental illness (like the young paranoid-schizophrenic Asian woman a few years ago here in my area who stabbed her mother to death, thinking she was trying to poison her)---they can go free.

And the NATURAL RESULT of that? SO MANY MENTALLY-ILL PEOPLE ON THE STREETS (our "homeless") or in our prisons that people are beginning to demand the govt "DO something!"

So they BRING BACK mental institutions and involuntary confinement within them.

But it WON'T be the truly "mentally ill" who will be kept there.

It will be ANYONE "DECLARED" mentally ill by the govt--
as it was in COMMUNIST USSR:
  • Christians
  • Political dissidents
  • Pastors, church workers, Bible-study leaders
  • Parents who tried to counter the state-mandated school propaganda by teaching their kids after school at home about the Bible and God
What's that old formula? Something about CREATING a problem so as then to present the "solution"?
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
New York State once had some really big psychiatric hospitals the whole system was dismantled in the 1970s,
It was found people were being abused and they were cut off from the outside world where they could get legal help.
The state political system was also found to have used these hospitals as something of a weapon against people they did not like, this is something Joe Biden is guilty of as Vice President under 0bama, but beyond making it stop nothing was ever done about it.
 

Murt

Veteran Member
Even if this plan has no nefarious intent I have to wonder how many inpatients the city's health system can realistically handle?
and how much is it expected to cost

before you implement your plan you better have a plan

It has been years since I worked in healthcare but IIRC when we had a 10-13 patient (requires psychiatric evaluation) that patient had to stay in the hospital until they were "cleared" to go or a "place" was found for them
there were times when we had patients that would be in the hospital for days before they could be discharged

If there is no plan on final disposition of the patients I can see this quickly becoming a BIG problem for area hospitals
and it is possible that one or two specific hospitals will get more than their share of the burden
 

naegling62

Veteran Member
This from the folks that pushed Vaccine ID cards? Vaxxing kids? Forced nursing home vaxx? No thanks. It's time for folks to really move this time.
 

Melodi

Disaster Cat
Yeah, the real problem is those horrific old warehouses they used to throw people in (I saw them with my own eyes) have been torn down and the "community treatment facilities" were never established or built because they cost money. And, almost no one wants them next door and voters simply did not approve (note, I don't want to live next to an open-door center for really deeply mentally damaged and potentially dangerous people either).

For many years, a lot of them got by living in "no-tell/motels" aka "flop houses" in urban areas and scattered about in old trailers, basements, or cabins in rural ones. Today huge numbers live on the streets of major Western Urban centers, especially in the United States.

I know what New York is trying to do, having realized that only about one-quarter to at most one-half of severely homeless people can be helped simply by housing them. But without a plan for where they are going to go, these people will simply be released again unless they've committed a felony and end up in the prison medical system.

Then there are all the other issues about the potential for abuse with a system like this - do you have an alternative opinion on vaccinations, you must be mentally ill and the judge will now order you confined and vaccinated. In order to "treat" your "mental illness" of course.
 

LightEcho

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Their definition of mentally ill:
election deniers
vaccine hesitant
conspiracy theorists
christians
bible believers
homophobes
pronoun illiterate
white pride racists (anyone who is not BLM supporter)
MAGA/Trump supporters
constitution supporters
climate change deniers

So, the only normal people are the 20% who still think CNN is a news station.
 

Ractivist

Pride comes before the fall.....Pride month ended.
Euthanasia will be the follow up card for the mentally ill useless eaters.....won't be the first time. Guillotines come to mind.
 

TFergeson

Non Solum Simul Stare
Their definition of mentally ill:
election deniers
vaccine hesitant
conspiracy theorists
christians
bible believers
homophobes
pronoun illiterate
white pride racists (anyone who is not BLM supporter)
MAGA/Trump supporters
constitution supporters
climate change deniers

So, the only normal people are the 20% who still think CNN is a news station.

Ding Ding Ding. Winner!
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
New York State once had some really big psychiatric hospitals the whole system was dismantled in the 1970s,
It was found people were being abused and they were cut off from the outside world where they could get legal help.
The state political system was also found to have used these hospitals as something of a weapon against people they did not like, this is something Joe Biden is guilty of as Vice President under 0bama, but beyond making it stop nothing was ever done about it.
exactly.

The above was used as the EXCUSE to shut down ALL mental health facilities in the 80's.

Like I said in post 10, there is now NO option for families with mentally-ill adult family members of a place to put them for care--which becomes even more problematic if their family members are dangerously insane to the point of posing a threat to others.

Only AFTER they actually KILL someone are they usually taken into custody--and then put in PRISON, not a mental institution, because there ARE no more mental institutions, even for the criminally insane.

So the homeless "crisis" was created--as families of the mentally ill either made their mentally ill members leave, abandoned them, or died and left their mentally ill family members alone to fend for themselves.

This grew--and grew--until it's reached the crisis-point we have now.

So public opinion is "beginning" to wake up that there needs to be something in place -- somewhere for the mentally-ill to go.

But now the PTB will "re-define" what mental illness IS, because they don't give a damn about the mentally ill who truly NEED help. If they did, they would have REFORMED mental institutions and commitment laws, instead of just closing the whole thing down and putting people with the minds of 2-year-olds alone on the streets to fend for themselves.

Now they are USING the crisis THEY created, to "re-define" mentally-ill (just as they've already redefined "vaccine" and "immune") -- and YES the ones who will be declared "mentally ill" will be those who are the enemies of (their) State--just as it was in communist Russia and Eastern Europe.
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Yeah, the real problem is those horrific old warehouses they used to throw people in (I saw them with my own eyes) have been torn down and the "community treatment facilities" were never established or built because they cost money. And, almost no one wants them next door and voters simply did not approve (note, I don't want to live next to an open-door center for really deeply mentally damaged and potentially dangerous people either).

For many years, a lot of them got by living in "no-tell/motels" aka "flop houses" in urban areas and scattered about in old trailers, basements, or cabins in rural ones. Today huge numbers live on the streets of major Western Urban centers, especially in the United States.

I know what New York is trying to do, having realized that only about one-quarter to at most one-half of severely homeless people can be helped simply by housing them. But without a plan for where they are going to go, these people will simply be released again unless they've committed a felony and end up in the prison medical system.

Then there are all the other issues about the potential for abuse with a system like this - do you have an alternative opinion on vaccinations, you must be mentally ill and the judge will now order you confined and vaccinated. In order to "treat" your "mental illness" of course.
C S Lewis wrote--in the 1940's--some very farsighted essays about how dangerous it is when a society starts re-defining those who hold alternative opinions as "ill". He mentioned that, while "justice" demands a clearly-defined LIMIT to "punishment" for doing something wrong, redefining behavior or belief as an "illness" puts it under subjective medical assessment as to when someone is now "well"---

IF they ever ARE............
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
exactly.

The above was used as the EXCUSE to shut down ALL mental health facilities in the 80's.

Like I said in post 10, there is now NO option for families with mentally-ill adult family members of a place to put them for care--which becomes even more problematic if their family members are dangerously insane to the point of posing a threat to others.

Only AFTER they actually KILL someone are they usually taken into custody--and then put in PRISON, not a mental institution, because there ARE no more mental institutions, even for the criminally insane.

So the homeless "crisis" was created--as families of the mentally ill either made their mentally ill members leave, abandoned them, or died and left their mentally ill family members alone to fend for themselves.

This grew--and grew--until it's reached the crisis-point we have now.

So public opinion is "beginning" to wake up that there needs to be something in place -- somewhere for the mentally-ill to go.

But now the PTB will "re-define" what mental illness IS, because they don't give a damn about the mentally ill who truly NEED help. If they did, they would have REFORMED mental institutions and commitment laws, instead of just closing the whole thing down and putting people with the minds of 2-year-olds alone on the streets to fend for themselves.

Now they are USING the crisis THEY created, to "re-define" mentally-ill (just as they've already redefined "vaccine" and "immune") -- and YES the ones who will be declared "mentally ill" will be those who are the enemies of (their) State--just as it was in communist Russia and Eastern Europe.

There was Pilgrim State Psychiatric Center located on the western end of Long Island N.Y. in an area called Brentwood and place was built in 1930 and housed about 5000 people, they built the place in a remote location where there was very few homes near by, over the years developers slowly closed in closer and closer to this psychiatric center and they were finding the bones of people and later found it was one of the crazy's that escaped psychiatric center I think in total of 20+ people they found their bones over the years. Lots of horror stories from older people about the place, I have seen this place in passing and that was many years ago and it was a run down bunch of buildings.
 
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