CORONA NEW YORK, Massachusetts are All in the same boat!! Thousand of ventilators stockpiled!!

wab54

Veteran Member


Cuomo calls Trump 'incorrect and grossly uninformed' about New York's ventilator situation as fight escalates
By Shimon Prokupecz and Caroline Kelly, CNN 21 hrs ago



Cuomo argued that the ventilators were stored in preparation for when New York hospitals exceed their capacity as the state has become the epicenter of the American coronavirus outbreak. Cuomo told CNN on Friday that Trump's assessment of the situation was "incorrect and grossly uninformed."



"Of course we didn't -- that's the whole point," Cuomo said. "The hospitals don't need them yet. The hospitals aren't at their apex. The hospitals have enough ventilators today, but their numbers are going up."
Cuomo added that his office was planning for a peak in cases "in about 21 days -- that's when we need the 30,000 ventilators, not today."
"So the point is, 'well they're in a stockpile, you must not need them' is just ignorant -- of course you don't need them today!" Cuomo continued. "You need them when you hit the apex, which is 30,000. We're not there yet."
Trump had earlier tweeted that New York should distribute the ventilators immediately. That statement came hours after Trump said in a Fox News interview that he doubted states calling for tens of thousands of ventilators would need them.
"Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage," Trump tweeted Friday. "N.Y. must distribute NOW!"
Trump and Cuomo, two Queens natives prone to shifting quickly between approval and antagonism, have known each other for years. But coordinating the federal and state response to New York's outbreak, which saw a running total of at least 44,635 cases and 519 deaths on Friday, has put a spotlight on their alternately frosty and supportive working relationship.
A White House official told CNN that Cuomo's pressers have become mandatory viewing in the West Wing, with the New York governor's command and directness driving Trump's own desire to use the briefing room every day to drive coverage of the coronavirus. The two men are interacting multiple times each day, according to sources familiar with their interactions, with the duo speaking upwards of three or four times on some days.
Trump's comments Friday suggested that his stance had taken a turn with regards to the ventilators since Thursday night, when the President told Sean Hannity on Fox News that he was "getting along" with Cuomo but slammed the governor for wanting tens of thousands of ventilators, which the President doubts are necessary.
"And they say, like Governor Cuomo and others, that say we want 30,000 of them. 30,000. Think of this," Trump told Hannity. "You go to hospitals who have, don't even have one, in a hospital and all of a sudden everybody is asking for vast numbers."

He added later, "But generally speaking, I'm getting along very well with Governor Cuomo."
When asked about Trump's dismissal of his projected ventilator needs later Friday, Cuomo told CNN's Erin Burnett, "I hope the President's right. I'll go better than what the President said -- I hope I don't need any ventilators."
"But I can't govern that way -- I govern on the data and on the numbers and on the science," he said, adding that if "you count the numbers and the trajectory, we're looking at 40,000 possible ventilators, 140,000 possible hospital beds -- those are the numbers."
Cuomo highlighted his and Trump's working relationship, stressing that "this is no time for politics -- this is a time for exquisite coordination between the federal government and the state governments, because we need each other."
He also praised Trump for invoking the Defense Production Act, because it "gives him the muscle of the law to get companies to actually respond to the production of ventilators, which is exactly what we want," Cuomo said, later adding that Trump "needs (accelerated production) and he's right -- these ventilators are going to be the matter of life and death."
But the New York governor also got in one jab, when asked about Trump's assertion during Friday's coronavirus briefing that the federal government sent ventilators for New York to a New Jersey warehouse "at the time they were complaining about it."
"First I've heard that the warehouse was in New Jersey, funny way of delivering it to New York," he said. "But I knew very well that the federal government has delivered 4,000 ventilators."
This story has been updated with additional information.



Cuomo calls Trump 'incorrect and grossly uninformed' about New York's ventilator situation as fight escalates
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wab54

Veteran Member
Your headline is SERIOUSLY misleading. NOWHERE in the article is Puerto Rico mentioned. Or even obliquely alluded to.
I didnt say the Puetro Rico was on the article. They found all the disaster supplies in the warehouses in Puerto Rico afetr the Governor said they didnt get then. Just like Cuomo and Massecusettes


WAB
 

medic38572

TB Fanatic


Cuomo calls Trump 'incorrect and grossly uninformed' about New York's ventilator situation as fight escalates
By Shimon Prokupecz and Caroline Kelly, CNN 21 hrs ago



Cuomo argued that the ventilators were stored in preparation for when New York hospitals exceed their capacity as the state has become the epicenter of the American coronavirus outbreak. Cuomo told CNN on Friday that Trump's assessment of the situation was "incorrect and grossly uninformed."



"Of course we didn't -- that's the whole point," Cuomo said. "The hospitals don't need them yet. The hospitals aren't at their apex. The hospitals have enough ventilators today, but their numbers are going up."
Cuomo added that his office was planning for a peak in cases "in about 21 days -- that's when we need the 30,000 ventilators, not today."
"So the point is, 'well they're in a stockpile, you must not need them' is just ignorant -- of course you don't need them today!" Cuomo continued. "You need them when you hit the apex, which is 30,000. We're not there yet."
Trump had earlier tweeted that New York should distribute the ventilators immediately. That statement came hours after Trump said in a Fox News interview that he doubted states calling for tens of thousands of ventilators would need them.
"Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage," Trump tweeted Friday. "N.Y. must distribute NOW!"
Trump and Cuomo, two Queens natives prone to shifting quickly between approval and antagonism, have known each other for years. But coordinating the federal and state response to New York's outbreak, which saw a running total of at least 44,635 cases and 519 deaths on Friday, has put a spotlight on their alternately frosty and supportive working relationship.
A White House official told CNN that Cuomo's pressers have become mandatory viewing in the West Wing, with the New York governor's command and directness driving Trump's own desire to use the briefing room every day to drive coverage of the coronavirus. The two men are interacting multiple times each day, according to sources familiar with their interactions, with the duo speaking upwards of three or four times on some days.
Trump's comments Friday suggested that his stance had taken a turn with regards to the ventilators since Thursday night, when the President told Sean Hannity on Fox News that he was "getting along" with Cuomo but slammed the governor for wanting tens of thousands of ventilators, which the President doubts are necessary.
"And they say, like Governor Cuomo and others, that say we want 30,000 of them. 30,000. Think of this," Trump told Hannity. "You go to hospitals who have, don't even have one, in a hospital and all of a sudden everybody is asking for vast numbers."

He added later, "But generally speaking, I'm getting along very well with Governor Cuomo."
When asked about Trump's dismissal of his projected ventilator needs later Friday, Cuomo told CNN's Erin Burnett, "I hope the President's right. I'll go better than what the President said -- I hope I don't need any ventilators."
"But I can't govern that way -- I govern on the data and on the numbers and on the science," he said, adding that if "you count the numbers and the trajectory, we're looking at 40,000 possible ventilators, 140,000 possible hospital beds -- those are the numbers."
Cuomo highlighted his and Trump's working relationship, stressing that "this is no time for politics -- this is a time for exquisite coordination between the federal government and the state governments, because we need each other."
He also praised Trump for invoking the Defense Production Act, because it "gives him the muscle of the law to get companies to actually respond to the production of ventilators, which is exactly what we want," Cuomo said, later adding that Trump "needs (accelerated production) and he's right -- these ventilators are going to be the matter of life and death."
But the New York governor also got in one jab, when asked about Trump's assertion during Friday's coronavirus briefing that the federal government sent ventilators for New York to a New Jersey warehouse "at the time they were complaining about it."
"First I've heard that the warehouse was in New Jersey, funny way of delivering it to New York," he said. "But I knew very well that the federal government has delivered 4,000 ventilators."
This story has been updated with additional information.



Cuomo calls Trump 'incorrect and grossly uninformed' about New York's ventilator situation as fight escalates
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I do not care how many ventilators you have...My question is where are they going to get the trained personel to run 4-6 ventilators at a time. 24/7 for those on the vents for 30,000?
 

medic38572

TB Fanatic
:prfl: You all are not getting it! If you have 30000 people on vents and it takes 1 person per 5 patients and that is stretching it because suction and everything else that goes wrong at the same time. It would take 6000 personnel for this. Granted you then have nurses RN's also assisting in patient care, so that helps alleviate some. But if you walk into a critical care situation and that is what this is. Most do not have a clue unless they are critical care trained. I am just telling you. Fuster cluck.. Oh and buy yhey way that is just 1 shift you will need atleast 12000 people.
 
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kyrsyan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
:prfl: You all are not getting it! If you have 30000 people on vents and it takes 1 person per 5 patients and that is stretching it because suction and everything else that goes wrong at the same time. It would take 6000 personnel for this. Granted you then have nurses RN's also assisting in patient care, so that helps alleviate some. But if you walk into a critical care situation and that is what this is. Most do not have a clue unless they are critical care trained. I am just telling you. Fuster cluck..
But, but, but... we have the ventilators...
 

Squid

Veteran Member
I do not care how many ventilators you have...My question is where are they going to get the trained personel to run 4-6 ventilators at a time. 24/7 for those on the vents for 30,000?
We will retrain the farmers, cause any doofus can farm... (according to some)
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
When he DIDN'T BUY the 15K vents he needed for plans like this we righteously berated him. Now he "finds" a stock of them and we beat him up.
4K is a LOT fewer than he needs. Anyone who rips him for having a mini stock, too small by half, is part of the frellin PROBLEM not the solution.

As I expect another 2 weeks will show in stark relief.
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
And just for the record, that 4K "HOARD" being "hoarded" is 11K SHORT of what his study said he would need statewide.

Some folks need to keep their eye on the ball. Which the OP and the follow through on the thread manages to do a FANTASTIC job of losing sight of.
 

Kathy in FL

Administrator
_______________
:prfl: You all are not getting it! If you have 30000 people on vents and it takes 1 person per 5 patients and that is stretching it because suction and everything else that goes wrong at the same time. It would take 6000 personnel for this. Granted you then have nurses RN's also assisting in patient care, so that helps alleviate some. But if you walk into a critical care situation and that is what this is. Most do not have a clue unless they are critical care trained. I am just telling you. Fuster cluck.. Oh and buy yhey way that is just 1 shift you will need atleast 12000 people.

The acute care where my son works has already been training all personnel to assist if necessary. My son is a health sciences major and has basic first aid and CPR but did not go to medical or nursing school. All of his training is from his supervisors at the center. I am sure that my son's small acute care facility is not the only one. They are a member of Advent and my understanding is that they are cross training all personnel and having been for a while.
 

turtlegent

Contributing Member
Ok, perhaps they have the ventilators, but how about the drugs it take to induce the artificial coma, they need? I cannot imagine being on one of those devices, and not asleep.
 
:prfl: You all are not getting it! If you have 30000 people on vents and it takes 1 person per 5 patients and that is stretching it because suction and everything else that goes wrong at the same time. It would take 6000 personnel for this. Granted you then have nurses RN's also assisting in patient care, so that helps alleviate some. But if you walk into a critical care situation and that is what this is. Most do not have a clue unless they are critical care trained. I am just telling you. Fuster cluck.. Oh and buy yhey way that is just 1 shift you will need atleast 12000 people.
Nothing like OJT - and NOW would be the time - if, indeed, trained vent operators are in short supply.

Or, pull retired medical personnel into vent operator duty.

Or, CNA students in training.

Or, . . .

THOSE are ALL potential correct answers.

Why the hand-wringing about it?

Get 'r done.


intothegoodnight
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
Ok, perhaps they have the ventilators, but how about the drugs it take to induce the artificial coma, they need? I cannot imagine being on one of those devices, and not asleep.
When we wake them up to ween them OFF the Vent, they are awake for a couple days plus.
 

kyrsyan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Be careful on 'forced sharing'. This board is filled with people who have 'prepped'... which now translates to 'hoarding'. :ecrz:
Not forced sharing. He can keep what he has. But he can't have the rest of what is available through Fed gov services just because he thinks he should be first in line. Nope. Has to share and Fed gov gets to divvy the cake. Unless, of course, he wants to pay for them and can find somewhere to buy them.
 

medic38572

TB Fanatic
Nothing like OJT - and NOW would be the time - if, indeed, trained vent operators are in short supply.

Or, pull retired medical personnel into vent operator duty.

Or, CNA students in training.

Or, . . .

THOSE are ALL potential correct answers.

Why the hand-wringing about it?

Get 'r done.


intothegoodnight

It is not as simple as that! You just cannot turn people loose. The training is not something you get over night or in a week. It takes a while to understand peep volume rate and other settings that correlate its use. O2 sat and how to maintain. etc etc etc Deep trach suctioning is something that could trained to anyone and taught fairly easy. But you all are grasping at straws now understanding the functions and how they work. It is not just intubate hook up the ventilator and watch it work. There are so many different components to this and if you do not know what your doing you cause injury or death. On the simple models we took classes on we still had to go to the hospital ICU's and learned proficiency and were checked off as we did things on real patients with a preceptor. We already had intubation down and had been doing it for years and critical airways for years. So this was new for us as transporting patients on a vent from one hospital to another had to be done by someone vent trained and the hospitals could not afford to send a RT with us every time and call someone in to back them up while they were gone.
 
It is not as simple as that! You just cannot turn people loose. The training is not something you get over night or in a week. It takes a while to understand peep volume rate and other settings that correlate its use. O2 sat and how to maintain. etc etc etc Deep trach suctioning is something that could trained to anyone and taught fairly easy. But you all are grasping at straws now understanding the functions and how they work. It is not just intubate hook up the ventilator and watch it work. There are so many different components to this and if you do not know what your doing you cause injury or death. On the simple models we took classes on we still had to go to the hospital ICU's and learned proficiency and were checked off as we did things on real patients with a preceptor. We already had intubation down and had been doing it for years and critical airways for years. So this was new for us as transporting patients on a vent from one hospital to another had to be done by someone vent trained and the hospitals could not afford to send a RT with us every time and call someone in to back them up while they were gone.
We have one of two choices, in this situation.

Start the immediate training/resourcing of needed vent personnel, or WALK AWAY.

There is no magic fairy dust to sprinkle onto this culture-changing event, in order to make it "all better."

Make the choice that chooses LIFE - even if those that are trying to give their BEST life-giving effort are imperfect and attempting to learn on-the-fly/OJT.

Work with what you have, not what you wish you had.

Really IS that simple.

The world-renowned American "attitude" is ALL ABOUT get 'r done - authentic Americans simply do not know any other way.

Our hearts and prayers are with you during this time, medic38572 - you should know this.

Improvise. Adapt. Overcome.


intothegoodnight
 

Chicken Mama

Veteran Member
I think his lying about it is the problem. What else is NY hoarding that the rest of the country needs? Trump should reroute the USS Mercy (or is it Comfort?) elsewhere. It's not like they're going to vote for him anyway.
 
I think his lying about it is the problem. What else is NY hoarding that the rest of the country needs? Trump should reroute the USS Mercy (or is it Comfort?) elsewhere. It's not like they're going to vote for him anyway.
If the State of New York is hoarding much needed supplies, shouldn't be any problem to send in a Federal audit team backed by the DoJ to document and confirm the problem.


intothegoodnight
 

medic38572

TB Fanatic
I understand your point, but training is key in everything. Thanks for your prayers I no longer as of last year am active. Could they call me back? Anythings posible but do to my own illness I cannot work on a truck anymore and let my license go. But would gladly help out somewhere if I could.
 

medic38572

TB Fanatic
I think his lying about it is the problem. What else is NY hoarding that the rest of the country needs? Trump should reroute the USS Mercy (or is it Comfort?) elsewhere. It's not like they're going to vote for him anyway.

Does it matter if they vote for him or not? They are American Citizens well most of them and deserve the same care as you or I in respect for no matter who they vote for. When 911 happened people from all over this country responded to help. Even members from my own lil volunteer fire department. We found the time sent them off with our money and our food to help feed them. We asked for nothing in return. This is who we are...Americans. We didn't care who they voted for.
 

Snyper

Veteran Member
You all are not getting it! If you have 30000 people on vents and it takes 1 person per 5 patients and that is stretching it because suction and everything else that goes wrong at the same time.
There won't be that many on ventilators at once.

Only about 5% of those infected will need one, and one machine can handle 2 patients.

Opinion | Too Many Ventilators?

Aaron Carroll of Indiana University notes in The Upshot that the United States now has about 160,000 ventilators available in hospitals. If this pandemic resembles the 1918 Spanish flu in its severity, “we would need more than 740,000,” he writes.
From Christopher Rowland of The Washington Post:

Hospitals are holding back from ordering more medical ventilators because of the high cost for what may be only a short-term spike in demand from the coronavirus epidemic, supply chain experts and health researchers say, intensifying an anticipated shortage of lifesaving equipment for patients who become critically ill.
 

Knoxville's Joker

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I find it odd that Trump says we are going after hoarders and if you have a ware house and you are not sharing or price gouging, you will get a knock and you will have a discussion. He more or less gave a warning stating we know where the stuff is and we will get our hands on it. I think he more or less has the list of democrat storage depots and is going through them one by one and telling them either fess up or we will take it and it will not end well.
 

Freeholder

This too shall pass.
Won’t PPE be an issue for all of the people needed to work with the additional ventilators?

Kathleen
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
And just for the record, that 4K "HOARD" being "hoarded" is 11K SHORT of what his study said he would need statewide.

Some folks need to keep their eye on the ball. Which the OP and the follow through on the thread manages to do a FANTASTIC job of losing sight of.
No, Chuck..

We're berating him for HIDING what he had, in order to winkle as much "stuff" he could from the Feds, in a situation where there are nowhere near enough to go around. He was afraid the Fed's would (rightly) say, "hey, you're asking for 30,000 vents, but you have xxxxx vents in a warehouse. So, your "need" is xxxxx vents. We can help with xxxx, but no more because there are 50 other states and multiple other huge dense cities where we know they'll be needed before this is over"

He's a lying communist, who believes his wants and wishes are the only ones that count.

Summerthyme
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
No more than for all the additional nurses and Patient Care Techs needed.

Ask Doz how long his CNA course was and then add 6 months to that for the 2 or 3 other courses that MIGHT get a person up to speed on not killing their patient. Won't make you a Critical Care RN but you MIGHT do more good than harm.

I know a fair number of CCRNs and when NOT in public I'll now and then bow to them because of what they know and DO regularly...and I have been known as something of a cowboy when in the field/on the street...

===============================================================================

Ah, no disagreement there. I hadn't come in from there...
 
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