MORON Just fired another Client today..... Don't yell at my Mother edition.

20Gauge

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Everyone gets those clients who are difficult and seem to be so on purpose. Today we had one such client.

He decided last year that he was a hot shot day trader who would make his millions by day trading. Yet he didn't do the basic homework on the possible ramifications of day trading vs buying and holding when it comes to taxes.

What the heck are you talking about?????

It is called "wash sales". These are sales......

A wash sale occurs when an investor sells or trades a security at a loss, and within 30 days before or after, buys another one that is substantially similar. It also happens if the individual sells the security at a loss, and their spouse or a company they control buys a substantially similar security within 30 days.

The tax result of a wash sale is that you can not use the loss. The client had $40k in wash sales that he could not use. This frankly pissed him off and he started yelling at my mother that she didn't know what she was doing. After calming him down, he was asked if he knew what a wash sale was? Reply, "NO! I don't need to either, you are stupid!!"

These are fighting words! I start to get up, but at that point he decides he is done and leaves, so I don't have the opportunity to deal with him. (I am not going to jump a table and start a fight with my mother between us).

The wife finishes up the paperwork, pays and leaves knowing that they are not going to be able to come back.

They were FIRED!

Granted it was income, but I really don't need the money that bad. I will also enjoy it when he calls us next year to try and come back. Why? He will find his 26 pages of stock transactions anywhere else will cost him over $1500 in fees. I can't wait to tell to bugger off.....lol
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
Y'know< I don't tell Lawyers they don't know what they're doing because i go to them because **I** don't know what THEY're doing.
Same with Doctors (though I may have specific fact based discussions with them in which case sometimes I DO know more than they do).
I don't tell engineers they are dumb (though on occasion we may have Physics and Thermodynamics discussions).
Accountants, same-same, except that the MBA carries a bunch of Accounting knowledge.

LOTS of folks are damn fools.
 

teneo

Contributing Member
Sounds like you did good; some customers need firing!

Just curious about the wash sale - the definition includes the descriptor "substantially similar". So I understand the concept that (for example) - if I own some Intel stock and it goes down and I sell it for a loss. Then within 30 days I reconsider and buy it back. That is a wash sale and I can't claim the original loss anymore - got it.

But, does the "substantially similar" concept include this example: I sell some Intel stock for a loss but within 30 days I buy some AMD. They are a competitor to Intel, same industry and probably do meet the intent of "substantially similar". So is that also considered a wash sale too, if I buy a competitor's stock that is in the same industry as the first one on which I took the loss? So in this case I also won't be able to claim the loss on the first Intel sale?

Sorry if this is a work question but I've always wondered and thanks for your expertise!
 

Cardinal

Snark: a higher form of communication
_______________
I suspect, with the economy and our country in general sliding down the hill towards the drain, that this will increase.
People are gonna be on edge whether they are aware of it or not.
I'm lucky, I have a good friend who does my taxes for free.
Of course, I don't give him a hard time about anything, I just say Thank you!!
 

Meemur

Voice on the Prairie
I'm sorry you're having these problems, 20Gauge.

Even though it's an extended season this year, we are almost finished. I will have some data to input next week
and that will probably be it, at least for my part. Most of the clients did what they were supposed to and also got
everything in by April 10th or so. There is that one guy who always wait until the last minute, but he keeps good electronic records. I generally don't deal with him.
 

Texican

Live Free & Die Free.... God Freedom Country....
20,

Could it be the SE Georgia swamp gas causing all the problems with your clients? :hof:

Texican....
 

Squid

Veteran Member
Everybody is looking at bitcoin and other rapid pump and dump and thinking finding these at the beginning is Easy and then projecting price rises to ‘infinite and beyond’

I have made some and lost some. I can also count some early painful mistakes that I count as life tuition. With flyers you average it out and if you win more than lose and beat the S&P you count yourself lucky. I watched a show about the stock crash and the lead-up at the end of the roaring 20’s and see lots of similarities. Only now people expect the .gov to bail them out for ignorance and stupidity. When stupid isn’t painful there is more stupid...
 

KMR58

Veteran Member
Everyone gets those clients who are difficult and seem to be so on purpose. Today we had one such client.

He decided last year that he was a hot shot day trader who would make his millions by day trading. Yet he didn't do the basic homework on the possible ramifications of day trading vs buying and holding when it comes to taxes.

What the heck are you talking about?????

It is called "wash sales". These are sales......

A wash sale occurs when an investor sells or trades a security at a loss, and within 30 days before or after, buys another one that is substantially similar. It also happens if the individual sells the security at a loss, and their spouse or a company they control buys a substantially similar security within 30 days.

The tax result of a wash sale is that you can not use the loss. The client had $40k in wash sales that he could not use. This frankly pissed him off and he started yelling at my mother that she didn't know what she was doing. After calming him down, he was asked if he knew what a wash sale was? Reply, "NO! I don't need to either, you are stupid!!"

These are fighting words! I start to get up, but at that point he decides he is done and leaves, so I don't have the opportunity to deal with him. (I am not going to jump a table and start a fight with my mother between us).

The wife finishes up the paperwork, pays and leaves knowing that they are not going to be able to come back.

They were FIRED!

Granted it was income, but I really don't need the money that bad. I will also enjoy it when he calls us next year to try and come back. Why? He will find his 26 pages of stock transactions anywhere else will cost him over $1500 in fees. I can't wait to tell to bugger off.....lol
I quite enjoy your stories. As a business owner I have fired my fair share of incorrigible customers. Good on you!
 

lakemom

Veteran Member
We have a few "discreet" do not service customers. I did get the rare pleasure of telling one woman we would not be returning to her house...EVER. You do not have the freedom to verbally abuse my techs...EVER. If the person being verbally abused had been one of my parents, I don't know that I could have shown the restraint that you did lol.
 

The Snack Artist

Veteran Member
Reminds of the time I was selling a car and the guy showed me his bid. I said, "Ok, I'm out." He was like, what? I said, "The price is now a thousand higher." He said, "You can't do that!" Just did, sucka.
 

Abert

Veteran Member
Yep - lots of "bottom feeders" like this. Ran a service operation back East (CT, RI, MA) and often would get clients like this. Often we would just tell them that we just could not service what they needed - we would then suggest they contact another firm we knew would take them - a total scam operation - would rip off customers right and left!
Some satisfaction in connecting the two - at least they were no longer my problem!
 

Jeff B.

What is left when honor is lost?
Reminds of the time I was selling a car and the guy showed me his bid. I said, "Ok, I'm out." He was like, what? I said, "The price is now a thousand higher." He said, "You can't do that!" Just did, sucka.
I love that... you put something out there fairly priced and note that you are “firm”.

Then some bozo shows up and wants to start wheeling and dealing.

My wife knows the impact of my saying, “we are done here”.

I’ve had to explain that to a couple of people. Including one contractor that we still refer to as the gold standard of dipshittedness.

Jeff B.
 

Cacheman

Veteran Member
Even though it's an extended season this year
Depends what your into, I file a Schedule F (Farm) that makes up over 2/3 of my income and my tax returns had to be finished and postmarked or e-filed by March 1, anyone who earns at least 2/3 of their income from farming or fishing must always file by March 1. You can file for a six month extension but any taxes due still must be paid.
 

adgal

Veteran Member
So - this is not a client - but it's another frustrating people situation. (Thank you for letting me vent.) I am currently a Bishop's wife. My husband is the Bishop of our local ward (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) - so I have the opportunity to help with people who are investigating the church. A couple of weeks ago our missionaries asked me to pick someone up for church - a woman and her son. Pick them up, had a nice conversation, sat with them at church, explained the ropes. During our time together, she told me that she'd just recently got custody of her son, had been in a homeless shelter, was currently unemployed and I picked her up in public housing. But, hey, people often go through hard times and hard things - and I really hoped that she was making some positive changes in her life. In the ensuing weeks, she has messaged me to see if I could drive into town and drive her to a doctor's appt that she hadn't made yet. (I'm about 15 miles out of town and there is public transportation in town.) I actually asked someone (another member) in town if they could help her - they could. She canceled at the last minute. Then she messaged me on Thursday and asked me if I knew of anyone who had a fishing pole to sell. It was her son's birthday and that's what he wanted. So, we have a local church Facebook page and I knew that someone probably had a fishing pole sitting around and asked if they wanted to donate it. One lady - whose kids are all grown and gone - had one in her garage. She said that she would get it and some tackle put together for the boy. I let the Mom know and she replied, "Tell her we need bait too." I told her, "No, she will not have bait because these are things she had in her garage that's she's putting together for you. You'll have to get your own bait." Then she messaged today and asked if anyone could bake a cake for her son. (I know that she has a link card and I know she has money.) What has happened to people? What happened to take care of yourself and your loved ones and don't depend on everyone else?
 

20Gauge

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Sounds like you did good; some customers need firing!

Just curious about the wash sale - the definition includes the descriptor "substantially similar". So I understand the concept that (for example) - if I own some Intel stock and it goes down and I sell it for a loss. Then within 30 days I reconsider and buy it back. That is a wash sale and I can't claim the original loss anymore - got it.

But, does the "substantially similar" concept include this example: I sell some Intel stock for a loss but within 30 days I buy some AMD. They are a competitor to Intel, same industry and probably do meet the intent of "substantially similar". So is that also considered a wash sale too, if I buy a competitor's stock that is in the same industry as the first one on which I took the loss? So in this case I also won't be able to claim the loss on the first Intel sale?

Sorry if this is a work question but I've always wondered and thanks for your expertise!
That will depend upon the broker being used. We don't make that determination
 

20Gauge

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I'm sorry you're having these problems, 20Gauge.

Even though it's an extended season this year, we are almost finished. I will have some data to input next week
and that will probably be it, at least for my part. Most of the clients did what they were supposed to and also got
everything in by April 10th or so. There is that one guy who always wait until the last minute, but he keeps good electronic records. I generally don't deal with him.
Not really problems as firing them solves things. It has been a long season with last season being all year, we haven't had a break in 17 months
 

20Gauge

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Depends what your into, I file a Schedule F (Farm) that makes up over 2/3 of my income and my tax returns had to be finished and postmarked or e-filed by March 1, anyone who earns at least 2/3 of their income from farming or fishing must always file by March 1. You can file for a six month extension but any taxes due still must be paid.
Yes the extensions were very uneven
 

cyberiot

Workin' the plan.
Everybody is looking at bitcoin and other rapid pump and dump and thinking finding these at the beginning is Easy and then projecting price rises to ‘infinite and beyond’

I have made some and lost some. I can also count some early painful mistakes that I count as life tuition. With flyers you average it out and if you win more than lose and beat the S&P you count yourself lucky. I watched a show about the stock crash and the lead-up at the end of the roaring 20’s and see lots of similarities. Only now people expect the .gov to bail them out for ignorance and stupidity. When stupid isn’t painful there is more stupid...
Day trading and "get-rich-quick" schemes make my stomach flip. I'm a Boglehead and a Buffetthead. Don't have the stones for anything more exciting.
 

Southside

Veteran Member
(I am not going to jump a table and start a fight with my mother between us).
LOL, I did that once! Client followed me around, talkin' shit, I sat down at my desk, he was on the other side. Kept talkin'
I went over the top of the desk, started pounding(Not hard enough, I guess) It gets broken up. I step out for a minute or two, come back in, and ask if he is still a client? He laughs and says, "Ya know, ya ought to eat your Wheaties, of course I'm still a client"

30+ years ago. Thanks for the reminder!
 

hunybee

Veteran Member
I suspect, with the economy and our country in general sliding down the hill towards the drain, that this will increase.
People are gonna be on edge whether they are aware of it or not.
I'm lucky, I have a good friend who does my taxes for free.
Of course, I don't give him a hard time about anything, I just say Thank you!!

this right here!

because of what has happened, and what looks to be fixing to happen, it is gonna get worse. i am concerned for you and your family working there with you. please put some precautions into place.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
Everyone gets those clients who are difficult and seem to be so on purpose. Today we had one such client.

He decided last year that he was a hot shot day trader who would make his millions by day trading. Yet he didn't do the basic homework on the possible ramifications of day trading vs buying and holding when it comes to taxes.

What the heck are you talking about?????

It is called "wash sales". These are sales......

A wash sale occurs when an investor sells or trades a security at a loss, and within 30 days before or after, buys another one that is substantially similar. It also happens if the individual sells the security at a loss, and their spouse or a company they control buys a substantially similar security within 30 days.

The tax result of a wash sale is that you can not use the loss. The client had $40k in wash sales that he could not use. This frankly pissed him off and he started yelling at my mother that she didn't know what she was doing. After calming him down, he was asked if he knew what a wash sale was? Reply, "NO! I don't need to either, you are stupid!!"

These are fighting words! I start to get up, but at that point he decides he is done and leaves, so I don't have the opportunity to deal with him. (I am not going to jump a table and start a fight with my mother between us).

The wife finishes up the paperwork, pays and leaves knowing that they are not going to be able to come back.

They were FIRED!

Granted it was income, but I really don't need the money that bad. I will also enjoy it when he calls us next year to try and come back. Why? He will find his 26 pages of stock transactions anywhere else will cost him over $1500 in fees. I can't wait to tell to bugger off.....lol
The sequence I'd suggest is:
1. Take the call but you're new policy is a healthy deposit up front: cash is KING.
2. Complete the contract.
3. Collect the balance of the fees.
4. THEN, show him the door.

The other alternative is too run a fees-based seminar to explain such fundamentals and that the more work you do, the more you charge. I used to regularly assess additional fees & surcharges based on poor or rude behaviour.

Trust me, if thats his standard MO, he'll be reduced to only dealing with those who can tolerate his crap although, like you, I'd be out if my chair the moment he got ugly with my janitor, let alone family.
 

hammerhead

Veteran Member
Robinhood trading is going to bone a lot of people.

I should be surprised that they don't know what they're doing, but actually no. This kind of thing is to be expected.
 

Old Gringo

Senior Member
So - this is not a client - but it's another frustrating people situation. (Thank you for letting me vent.) I am currently a Bishop's wife. My husband is the Bishop of our local ward (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) - so I have the opportunity to help with people who are investigating the church. A couple of weeks ago our missionaries asked me to pick someone up for church - a woman and her son. Pick them up, had a nice conversation, sat with them at church, explained the ropes. During our time together, she told me that she'd just recently got custody of her son, had been in a homeless shelter, was currently unemployed and I picked her up in public housing. But, hey, people often go through hard times and hard things - and I really hoped that she was making some positive changes in her life. In the ensuing weeks, she has messaged me to see if I could drive into town and drive her to a doctor's appt that she hadn't made yet. (I'm about 15 miles out of town and there is public transportation in town.) I actually asked someone (another member) in town if they could help her - they could. She canceled at the last minute. Then she messaged me on Thursday and asked me if I knew of anyone who had a fishing pole to sell. It was her son's birthday and that's what he wanted. So, we have a local church Facebook page and I knew that someone probably had a fishing pole sitting around and asked if they wanted to donate it. One lady - whose kids are all grown and gone - had one in her garage. She said that she would get it and some tackle put together for the boy. I let the Mom know and she replied, "Tell her we need bait too." I told her, "No, she will not have bait because these are things she had in her garage that's she's putting together for you. You'll have to get your own bait." Then she messaged today and asked if anyone could bake a cake for her son. (I know that she has a link card and I know she has money.) What has happened to people? What happened to take care of yourself and your loved ones and don't depend on everyone else?
Water.......always water.

If you give them milk they will want cookies.

(stolen from some movie somewhere)
 

cyberiot

Workin' the plan.
Robinhood trading is going to bone a lot of people.

I should be surprised that they don't know what they're doing, but actually no. This kind of thing is to be expected.
I've never understood that siren song. I know of a fellow who was awarded several hundred thousand dollars in a medical malpractice suit. He lost it all day trading. Every. Single. Penny. Here's the kicker--the guy teaches economics at the community college.
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
So - this is not a client - but it's another frustrating people situation. (Thank you for letting me vent.) I am currently a Bishop's wife. My husband is the Bishop of our local ward (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) - so I have the opportunity to help with people who are investigating the church. A couple of weeks ago our missionaries asked me to pick someone up for church - a woman and her son. Pick them up, had a nice conversation, sat with them at church, explained the ropes.
{SNIP}
What has happened to people? What happened to take care of yourself and your loved ones and don't depend on everyone else?
My Asst Pastor/Minister of Music has a catagorization for people like that. He calls them "EGRs".

"EGRs" are "Extra Grace Requireds"

MY term is slightly earthier and CERTAINLY less Christian...
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
So - this is not a client - but it's another frustrating people situation. (Thank you for letting me vent.) I am currently a Bishop's wife. My husband is the Bishop of our local ward (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) - so I have the opportunity to help with people who are investigating the church. A couple of weeks ago our missionaries asked me to pick someone up for church - a woman and her son. Pick them up, had a nice conversation, sat with them at church, explained the ropes. During our time together, she told me that she'd just recently got custody of her son, had been in a homeless shelter, was currently unemployed and I picked her up in public housing. But, hey, people often go through hard times and hard things - and I really hoped that she was making some positive changes in her life. In the ensuing weeks, she has messaged me to see if I could drive into town and drive her to a doctor's appt that she hadn't made yet. (I'm about 15 miles out of town and there is public transportation in town.) I actually asked someone (another member) in town if they could help her - they could. She canceled at the last minute. Then she messaged me on Thursday and asked me if I knew of anyone who had a fishing pole to sell. It was her son's birthday and that's what he wanted. So, we have a local church Facebook page and I knew that someone probably had a fishing pole sitting around and asked if they wanted to donate it. One lady - whose kids are all grown and gone - had one in her garage. She said that she would get it and some tackle put together for the boy. I let the Mom know and she replied, "Tell her we need bait too." I told her, "No, she will not have bait because these are things she had in her garage that's she's putting together for you. You'll have to get your own bait." Then she messaged today and asked if anyone could bake a cake for her son. (I know that she has a link card and I know she has money.) What has happened to people? What happened to take care of yourself and your loved ones and don't depend on everyone else?

LBJ
 
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