OP-ED How much should a smartphone cost?

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
For links see article source.....
Posted for fair use.....
http://pocketnow.com/2016/04/03/smartphone-costs

How much should a smartphone cost?

By Adam Doud | April 3, 2016 10:00 AM
Comments 70

There’s an old saying that goes, “it’s only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.” And if that was going to be the crux of my argument, this article would already be over. But the fact remains that you and I have a pretty expensive hobby in smartphones and especially flagships. So, if it’s only worth what someone will pay, then we’re clearly all willing to pay quite a bit.

But then these tear-downs come out and we find out just how much it actually costs to build these phones from a physical component perspective. Often the cost is 1/3 of the retail price of these units, or even less. This begs the question – where does the rest of that money go? Straight into the vault at Cupertino? It’s not a question of how much we’re willing to pay for these devices, it’s a question of how much should we pay.

What the heck?!

On the face of it, it looks like we, the consumers, are getting screwed. Charging three times the amount it takes to build these phones seems like a touch much, doesn’t it? I mean if you can build a phone for $230-$250, and sell it for $400 or even $450, I think a lot of us would be pretty stoked about that, and leave ~100% of the cost for profit. But smartphones have set a standard at which pricing starts which is generally accepted to be in the $650-$700 area, but who made that number up?

There comes a time when we have to ask ourselves why these companies are making so much money. Is it just because they’re selling a phone with such a high markup? Well that’s just fresh off the ridiculous farm, being sold in baskets by the side of the road. But perhaps the answer is that we just have decided that $650 is what we’re willing to pay for the latest and greatest, but there should be a way to un-decide that. But the fact of the matter is, if flagships only cost $230 to make, $650 as a retail price is just too much.

And yet…

If building materials were the only thing that went into these phones, there might be a point there. But the reality is, it’s not. From a physical standpoint there are numerous other costs to take into consideration. Manufacturing, shipping, distribution – none of these things are going to pay for themselves. Add to that other overhead costs – employees, marketing, office space, complimentary mugs for the employee of the month and it costs a lot to put out a smartphone.

Plus, let’s not forget ongoing costs like support for your device and R&D for the next big thing. All this can cost a ton of money to put together. Call centers alone are not cheap to properly maintain and staff. So if your phone breaks, and you need help getting it fixed, who are you going to call? That’s your extra dollars at work, right there.

Because we can

At the end of the day, consumers have three things going against them when it comes to smartphone costs – overhead, demand, and “because we can”. “Because we can” is probably the hardest to overcome because consumers vote with their wallets, and these days, a lot of them a voting for the $650 price point. Some companies use that extra money to set up Taylor swift treadmill accidents for advertising. Some use it to build better phones of tomorrow. And yes, some of it ends up in a vault in Cupertino – not as much as you probably think, but some.

But what do you think? It’s easy to say, “Ah! Smartphones should be cheaper, grr!” and it’s also easy to agree that $650 is what we’re all paying, so why not charge $650? But we here at the weekend debate don’t go for easy, so let’s dig into some hard areas – do OEMs advertise too much? Do some not justify the services like support we are presumably paying for? I want to hear what you think and I want you to back up what you’re saying with some solid facts and figures, or at least some anecdotal evidence because this is not a simple, straightforward question. So let’s all see if we can figure this out.
 

Dreamer

Veteran Member
Yes comrade, prices must be set by the factors of production.

How about the price is set where people are willing to pay?



I was shopping new iPhones, and nearly puked when I saw the price. Of course, when my inner dialog that was already marveling at the fact that the phone really is a powerful little computer with always on capabilities and minimal lag caught up to my eyeballs, it made sense.

---
Of course on rereading the OP I think that was a clever article to get people arguing why the current prices are good prices.
 

WFK

Senior Something
This or similar articles come up like spring flowers,
every year, same theme.
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
As I see it, the utility of these devices are such that they can be as much of a societal "game changer" as a candy crunch time burner.

I only acquired a smart phone myself last year when the amount of communications I was receiving from friends on them went through the roof and a lot of it I couldn't easily access or respond to on my old Nokia flip phone (which I've still got as a back up). The last straw was a buddy broke down late at night on the freeway and sent me a map of his location to my flip phone. It came out as an illegible thumbnail.

In my mind a better question might be for what most people use them for, how much of a "smart phone" do you really need? Considering how they're continually improving, this is a real moving target.
 

WalknTrot

Veteran Member
Tracfone usually sells their best and newest Android smartphones for about $100.00 and the price goes down to 75-80.00 in a couple of months. That's got to be the bottom line, as there are no other strings (contracts) attached.
 

billet

Veteran Member
I'd love to see the price go to 100K, and watch the DGI's take out 2nd mortgages to buy them.
 

4bears

Inactive
I bought a no contract android smart phone on sale at a grocery store for ten dollars.
Regular price was forty.
 

WalknTrot

Veteran Member
It seems pretty clear that unless you simply must to have the "latest and greatest" you can pick up a decent phone for a lot less than $650.00. Like computers, the tech is not taking major leaps anymore, so usability isn't the issue - "fashion" is the issue.

People will sell their own mother for fashion, but that's their problem, and I fail to feel a lot of sympathy for their empty bank accounts.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
On the face of it, it looks like we, the consumers, are getting screwed. Charging three times the amount it takes to build these phones seems like a touch much, doesn’t it? I mean if you can build a phone for $230-$250, and sell it for $400 or even $450, I think a lot of us would be pretty stoked about that, and leave ~100% of the cost for profit. But smartphones have set a standard at which pricing starts which is generally accepted to be in the $650-$700 area, but who made that number up?

There comes a time when we have to ask ourselves why these companies are making so much money. Is it just because they’re selling a phone with such a high markup? Well that’s just fresh off the ridiculous farm, being sold in baskets by the side of the road. But perhaps the answer is that we just have decided that $650 is what we’re willing to pay for the latest and greatest, but there should be a way to un-decide that. But the fact of the matter is, if flagships only cost $230 to make, $650 as a retail price is just too much.

I bought a no contract android smart phone on sale at a grocery store for ten dollars.
Regular price was forty
.

Herein lies the problem. Flagships do NOT cost $230-250 to make. Their costs are less than $50 a pop, and this was per some interview via 60 minutes when they visited the apple factory in China. Androids cost even less to make per unit. So why the hell are they charging US citizens so much money for their product? 1.Because they can. 2. Advertising, an insane amount of money is spent to persuade americans to buy the latest greatest bauble. 3. we're paying for every other person on the planet to be able to own a cell phone for what they're really worth $10-75 USD.
 

Calfisher

Veteran Member
I just traded out my 12 year old flip phone that was $100 for a new LG G5 Android that was on sale one day only for $99. $157 after taxes. No monthly payment. 32GB with a 16 mega pixel camera.
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
And PDW entirely misses the point (actually raised in the OP article):


Manufacturing costs are NOT the only costs involved. There is research, development of new technologies, integration efforts of those technologies into new products, labor (scientists and engineers are not cheep), software development, and all the overhead of a major company.

I tell you what PDW, I'll buy you a box of components that make up an iPhone and ship them to you. You can pour them out on the table and build one from those parts. And while you're at it, you can write the software that runs it.

Be sure to let us all know how that works out for you... :rolleyes:
 

Redcat

Veteran Member
I just traded out my 12 year old flip phone that was $100 for a new LG G5 Android that was on sale one day only for $99. $157 after taxes. No monthly payment. 32GB with a 16 mega pixel camera.

That's a great price. Which carrier is it ??
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
And PDW entirely misses the point (actually raised in the OP article):


Manufacturing costs are NOT the only costs involved. There is research, development of new technologies, integration efforts of those technologies into new products, labor (scientists and engineers are not cheep), software development, and all the overhead of a major company.

I tell you what PDW, I'll buy you a box of components that make up an iPhone and ship them to you. You can pour them out on the table and build one from those parts. And while you're at it, you can write the software that runs it.

Be sure to let us all know how that works out for you... :rolleyes:

Why not distribute these R&D costs evenly? Instead the US market pays the bulk of these costs.

One could argue that people living in third world countries do not have easy access to cell phones but this is far from the truth, not only do they have easy access to cell phones, due to their being oober cheap there, but they also have access to solar chargers for said cell phones long before they were available on the US market.

As for me putting the components together I don't have to, I'll just knock on the neighbors door and have her Chinese slave laborers put them together for me! ;) (yes this really is going on in my neighborhood).
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
Again, you may feel free to contact Samsung, Apple and the other manufacturers and offer your corporate expertise to them.


Voting for Bernie are ya...?
 

Bicycle Junkie

Resident dissident and troll
And PDW entirely misses the point (actually raised in the OP article):


Manufacturing costs are NOT the only costs involved. There is research, development of new technologies, integration efforts of those technologies into new products, labor (scientists and engineers are not cheep), software development, and all the overhead of a major company.

I tell you what PDW, I'll buy you a box of components that make up an iPhone and ship them to you. You can pour them out on the table and build one from those parts. And while you're at it, you can write the software that runs it.

Be sure to let us all know how that works out for you... :rolleyes:

Can I get that from Heathkit?
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
Again, you may feel free to contact Samsung, Apple and the other manufacturers and offer your corporate expertise to them.


Voting for Bernie are ya...?
.
Tell me something, how do you feel about the extremely high costs of pharmacuticals, medical supplies, etc., in comparison to say how Canada or even England pays for these same exact products? Do you think it's wrong? Do you think it's unfair? Do you think these costs should be distributed globally? I mean why should a Dalit in a third world shit hole be able to afford a cell phone and cell phone service, that I'm paying for (cause we are via our TAXES) and yet I cannot afford to own a cell phone of my own? Maybe a Dalit doesn't strike a cord in your heart, how about a Mexican or someone in Africa??? How do you feel about your taxes and monthly cell phone usage paying for them to have damn near free service/phones? What about all of those Obamaphones, which happen to be iPhones

No, I'm not voting for Bernie, even Trump has stated that this is one of the problems in America that's driving jobs away. We need to quit paying for the rest of the world it's about damned time they stopped making excuses and paid for the products, and if they cannot afford them then too damned bad. This is what I've been told, cannot afford a smart phone with 4G service, then too bad. And yet my TAXES pay for someone else to have a smart phone/service. My taxes also paid for that R&D to be done... and beyond... follow the money.
 

kittyknits

Veteran Member
Wow. Sounds like something important to have. And here I've never even had a cell phone. Have a phone in the house that works just fine and when I'm out, I don't want to be answering a phone.

Also, I'm trying to spend less time on the computer, not more. The internet is getting pretty boring. Facebook is extremely boring.
 

cuz1961

Membership Revoked
.
Tell me something, how do you feel about the extremely high costs of pharmacuticals, medical supplies, etc., in comparison to say how Canada or even England pays for these same exact products? Do you think it's wrong? Do you think it's unfair? Do you think these costs should be distributed globally? I mean why should a Dalit in a third world shit hole be able to afford a cell phone and cell phone service, that I'm paying for (cause we are via our TAXES) and yet I cannot afford to own a cell phone of my own? Maybe a Dalit doesn't strike a cord in your heart, how about a Mexican or someone in Africa??? How do you feel about your taxes and monthly cell phone usage paying for them to have damn near free service/phones? What about all of those Obamaphones, which happen to be iPhones

No, I'm not voting for Bernie, even Trump has stated that this is one of the problems in America that's driving jobs away. We need to quit paying for the rest of the world it's about damned time they stopped making excuses and paid for the products, and if they cannot afford them then too damned bad. This is what I've been told, cannot afford a smart phone with 4G service, then too bad. And yet my TAXES pay for someone else to have a smart phone/service. My taxes also paid for that R&D to be done... and beyond... follow the money.



Bernie,,,trump,,,

6,,to a half dozen ?

If PDW. is upset now over the high cost,,,,just wait till the don puts a 45% "fair " tarriff on top of that !!

Ya,,,,that will make America great again ,,,,not.

.
.
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
First, Trump has stated that one of his goals would be to pull iPhone production back into the US. (Apple has actually been planning to do just that for some time now.) So the tariff issue wouldn't apply. Second, the medical industry OWNS the government. Smartphone manufacturers do not. That's why we pay what we do for medicine and medical care. Third, places like Japan and China actually pay MORE for iPhones than we do in the US. That has been documented here on the forum more than once.

So PDW, your premise is basically erroneous. Unless you have some proof that latest-generation iPhones are priced at $25 in Hunkamunkajoojoo in darkest Africa.

You have any proof of that...?
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
First, Trump has stated that one of his goals would be to pull iPhone production back into the US. (Apple has actually been planning to do just that for some time now.) So the tariff issue wouldn't apply. Second, the medical industry OWNS the government. Smartphone manufacturers do not. That's why we pay what we do for medicine and medical care. Third, places like Japan and China actually pay MORE for iPhones than we do in the US. That has been documented here on the forum more than once.

So PDW, your premise is basically erroneous. Unless you have some proof that latest-generation iPhones are priced at $25 in Hunkamunkajoojoo in darkest Africa.

You have any proof of that...?

Only what the dumbass African & Indian students bitch about when they get here and their precious iPhone 6 ended up broken and they're now faced with paying $500+ for a new iPhone 6. When I asked how much the paid for their original phone it comes out to being less than $75 USD.
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
But the question that begs answering is, was that the RETAIL cost of the phone in their respective Turd Whirled countries, or is that a government subsidized cost? We'd have to know that first.
 

Tex88

Veteran Member
Why not distribute these R&D costs evenly? Instead the US market pays the bulk of these costs.

Electronics of all kinds are usually a whole lot more expensive in Europe.

And Dennis, people will never understand the difference between carrier-subsidized pricing and paying full retail in exchange for a much lower monthly bill.
 
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