packyderms_wife
Neither here nor there.
OC stopped taking his around week five, IIRC. Eight weeks before your fully independent and can drive again, ten since you had both knees done at the same time.
There is an art to bringing patients along their course of recovery exercises… when to push, when to hold back, when to change the plan, how to motivate the individual personality. Very much an art form. And critical for the patient, since it determines their lifestyle for the rest of the lifetime.^^^^
THIS! Have gone through that and have seen therapists torture patients by pushing them beyond the pain threshold.
Fortunately my own therapist did not do that and my outcome was very good without such pain during recovery.
Addressing pain is my career, and you speak truth. Current state of the medical profession totally sux at pain management… contaminated by uninformed laws, unforgivable greed by pharma, and a rapidly-collapsing healthcare systemRant: God gave us poppies. Pain meds at the pharmacy should be available to shoppers without a prescription, in measured doses, without resorting to street drugs made in shady manufacturing venues. Staying "on top" of pain after surgery shouldn't require begging a doctor, not being able to cross state lines to get your medicine if you opted to choose the best surgeon who happens to be in a different state, and other hoops to jump over. When laudanum was freely available at chemist's in the 1800s and 1900's our ancestors didn't turn into addicts. I've had my fair share of surgeries. My prescribed in hospital pain meds for back surgery were taken away by a Muslim doc on call, when my surgical team spent the day away, rebuilding a child's body, pure torture. (when the surgeon and his team returned, they stayed with me until the morphine drink they immediately ordered began to work). I used to follow a website named Bonesmart, there was lots of good advice on hip and knee replacement recovery, I haven't viewed it for some years. IMO requesting pain relief should not make you be labeled a drug seeker. This is a campaign issue. As a senior I never wanted to affect my brain power for years with drugs, but in my seventh decade, proper pain management means one can be a functioning citizen.
Not sure where you got this from but it is untrue. Have you ever seen a Laudanum addict? I have; he was a patient of mine for a bit. And that was under a doctor's care and consent.When laudanum was freely available at chemist's in the 1800s and 1900's our ancestors didn't turn into addicts.
My PT was so impressed by how far along I was, and it is clear that he overestimated my overall bone strength. You see, I am a former ultra marathon runner, so my walking muscles were able to pick up quicker than most folks walking muscles could do.There is an art to bringing patients along their course of recovery exercises… when to push, when to hold back, when to change the plan, how to motivate the individual personality. Very much an art form. And critical for the patient, since it determines their lifestyle for the rest of the lifetime.
Just remember it is your right to stop if it feels too uncomfortable. When you are pushing yourself to up muscle strength it is important to not overdo things and it can take a week or two to recover if you strain things more than they should be strained...My PT was so impressed by how far along I was, and it is clear that he overestimated my overall bone strength. You see, I am a former ultra marathon runner, so my walking muscles were able to pick up quicker than most folks walking muscles could do.
But that would never translate to other leg movements, where my recovery would be more average.
I think he got so impressed with my ability to walk that he forgot I was an ultra marathon runner.
Where this injury took place was when he had me lying on my side, one leg bent and the other leg free to be lifted up in the air. He put the two pound weight on the ankle, then told me to both lift the leg up and also angled backwards some.
And it was just too much, too soon.
I complained about it immediately, but he had me do four of those leg lifts before he realized I really could not handle the 2 pound weights, and switched to the one pound weights.
My right leg never was asked to do that exercise with the two pound weight - only the one poind weight.
And the right leg is doing fine.
But any weight bearing on that left leg causes me pain that was not there before I did that particular exercise Friday.
I am not sure what to do now. I have a PT session scheduled for Tuesday.
Truth is, I am a bit afraid to go.
I appreciate your experience, no I have not seen or known a laudanum addict. I know my family's history, my grandmother was born in 1884, we are a family who bear children into their late ages! And I am not familiar with them becoming addicts back in the day. Some folks may be more susceptible than our family, I still think pain medicine needs to be more readily available to those needing the relief.Not sure where you got this from but it is untrue. Have you ever seen a Laudanum addict? I have; he was a patient of mine for a bit. And that was under a doctor's care and consent.
RR
Are you kidding??? Laudanum was highly addictive. And yes, a huge problem in that era with addiction.Rant: God gave us poppies. Pain meds at the pharmacy should be available to shoppers without a prescription, in measured doses, without resorting to street drugs made in shady manufacturing venues. Staying "on top" of pain after surgery shouldn't require begging a doctor, not being able to cross state lines to get your medicine if you opted to choose the best surgeon who happens to be in a different state, and other hoops to jump over. When laudanum was freely available at chemist's in the 1800s and 1900's our ancestors didn't turn into addicts. I've had my fair share of surgeries. My prescribed in hospital pain meds for back surgery were taken away by a Muslim doc on call, when my surgical team spent the day away, rebuilding a child's body, pure torture. (when the surgeon and his team returned, they stayed with me until the morphine drink they immediately ordered began to work). I used to follow a website named Bonesmart, there was lots of good advice on hip and knee replacement recovery, I haven't viewed it for some years. IMO requesting pain relief should not make you be labeled a drug seeker. This is a campaign issue. As a senior I never wanted to affect my brain power for years with drugs, but in my seventh decade, proper pain management means one can be a functioning citizen.
You need to go get x-rayed and tomorrow!!! Your joint may have been damaged!My PT was so impressed by how far along I was, and it is clear that he overestimated my overall bone strength. You see, I am a former ultra marathon runner, so my walking muscles were able to pick up quicker than most folks walking muscles could do.
But that would never translate to other leg movements, where my recovery would be more average.
I think he got so impressed with my ability to walk that he forgot I was an ultra marathon runner.
Where this injury took place was when he had me lying on my side, one leg bent and the other leg free to be lifted up in the air. He put the two pound weight on the ankle, then told me to both lift the leg up and also angled backwards some.
And it was just too much, too soon.
I complained about it immediately, but he had me do four of those leg lifts before he realized I really could not handle the 2 pound weights, and switched to the one pound weights.
My right leg never was asked to do that exercise with the two pound weight - only the one poind weight.
And the right leg is doing fine.
But any weight bearing on that left leg causes me pain that was not there before I did that particular exercise Friday.
I am not sure what to do now. I have a PT session scheduled for Tuesday.
Truth is, I am a bit afraid to go.
YES....Back a 100 years or so you could go into a corner drug store and get what you needed without hassle. I wish I could right now, my mouth is killing me.Rant: God gave us poppies. Pain meds at the pharmacy should be available to shoppers without a prescription, in measured doses, without resorting to street drugs made in shady manufacturing venues.
Fixed it for ya. Smells like a soft tissue injury, for which MRI is the investigational mode of choice.You need to go get MRI'd and tomorrow!!! Your joint may have been damaged!
No argument there. But making narcotics available OTC isn't the answer, just as cracking down and making everyone fit into one narrow therapy window isn't either. We will always have abusers, and responsible users, and some for whom the available meds just won't work, hence the need for spinal surgeries, etc.I still think pain medicine needs to be more readily available to those needing the relief.
Kathy, I’m sorry you’re still having to deal with the wound vac! It’s been a long time.
Now about your lack of sleep, you’ve definitely been posting more since you got home, so maybe that’s not such a bad thing, for us anyway.
It could work either way though - can’t sleep, so you’re on the computer and posting more. OR, you’re posting more and the content is upsetting, so you can’t sleep.
I hope you find some help soon.
True dat, insurance will demand x-rays first though.Fixed it for ya. Smells like a soft tissue injury, for which MRI is the investigational mode of choice.
They you go; more & better info. He was strengthening your gluteus medius, located on the outside of the hip. It is needed to stabilize the inner ligaments of the knee when you step on the leg, by keeping your pelvis level and your balance upright. I usually start this exercise with an empty leg, no weights, because an empty leg is plenty heavy enough. 2 pounds can be a significant load due to the length of the leg being lifted by a short muscle near the pivot point of the hip. Sounds like a sprain to lateral ligament of knee, painful, heels well. May need to rest that for week. Doesn’t need massive strength, more like endurance needed, so little to no weight exercises will suffice.My PT was so impressed by how far along I was, and it is clear that he overestimated my overall bone strength. You see, I am a former ultra marathon runner, so my walking muscles were able to pick up quicker than most folks walking muscles could do.
But that would never translate to other leg movements, where my recovery would be more average.
I think he got so impressed with my ability to walk that he forgot I was an ultra marathon runner.
Where this injury took place was when he had me lying on my side, one leg bent and the other leg free to be lifted up in the air. He put the two pound weight on the ankle, then told me to both lift the leg up and also angled backwards some.
And it was just too much, too soon.
I complained about it immediately, but he had me do four of those leg lifts before he realized I really could not handle the 2 pound weights, and switched to the one pound weights.
My right leg never was asked to do that exercise with the two pound weight - only the one poind weight.
And the right leg is doing fine.
But any weight bearing on that left leg causes me pain that was not there before I did that particular exercise Friday.
I am not sure what to do now. I have a PT session scheduled for Tuesday.
Truth is, I am a bit afraid to go.
Actually, studies seem to show that the addiction rate when *everything * (including morphine) was available OTC, the addiction rate was almost exactly the same as it is now.Not sure where you got this from but it is untrue. Have you ever seen a Laudanum addict? I have; he was a patient of mine for a bit. And that was under a doctor's care and consent.
RR
I have been taking oxcycocet for about 4 yrs now, for knee painSince I don’t know what PRN means, I can’t answer you. However, depending on the dose, one can take them a very long time as long as one doesn't take more than the recommended dose, or more often than the recommended frequency. But one will get physically dependent on the med, and go through withdrawals when trying to quit.
As some who has gone through a total hip replacement,Lets just say that a friend recently had total knee replacement on both knees at the same time.
This guy has NO history of any kind of drug abuse or addiction. None whatsoever. Or alcohol use either, for that matter.
He would like to keep it that way.
He is now three weeks out of surgery. Everything went well as could be expected, but physical therapy is still exceptionally painful, even three weeks out.
How long can he expect therapy to be so painful?
The doc is still giving him narcotic meds, to use along with extra strength tylenol, aleve, and meloxicam. (And seno cot laxative, as narcotic meds can slow up the processing of stool).
He is also using PLENTY OF ICE.
At the moment, he considers ice to be his best friend.
Since his narcotic meds are now PRN, he has cut the dosage in half and even puts off his exercise for several hours at a time, to put more hours in between when he feels he must take a narcotic med dose.
But sometimes, putting lots of extra hours between doses is really huting him alot.
His wife still has a sister there to help her with her own health problems, and the sister has kindly taken to trying to help him out a bit too. But he needs to get himself fully independent of her assistance ASAP. Then, as soon as possible, he needs to take over his normal activities, including maintaining his own home, and taking care of the health needs of his wife.
He is concerned at this point, however, because he cannot do his exercises without alot of pain. His surgery was three weeks ago, tomorrow (making this day 20).
How long can he safely take aa strong narcotic pain killer PRN?
And is it better at this point to put off the exercise for several hours to prolong time between pain pills, or would it be better to take the pain pills sooner, to get his legs in better physical shape?
(Please note that he would NEVER exceed the recommended dosage, nor increase the time interval to less than the six hour interval that the doctor was giving it to him while he was in the Rehab Unit. This question is about how he can safely REDUCE his pain med load and still get in enough exercise for his long term recovery).
Any insights you might offer him will be considered just that — personal insights. Educated opinions. NOT any formal dispensing of medical advice.
Anyway, do you have any insights that you might be able to offer a guy that is in a bit of pain right now?
Asking for a friend, of course…
When I had my orthoscopic knee surgery to fix my torn ACL I had to use narcotics for a month or two. Come to find out during things I was allergic to NSAIDs as they give me heart issues. Plus allergic to sulphur, benedryl as well.
It should not hurt like he is describing so something may have gotten messed up...
I have been on low dose extended release oxycontin for years for an autoimmune disease. I refused to take pain meds for years because of the stigma surrounding them. I may go a week or more without taking any and then a start up again when I find myself sitting in a recliner all day because the pain creeps up on me and I can’t move. Am I addicted to Oxytocin? I don’t believe so, I have no withdrawal symptoms. But I guess I am addicted to living a normal life with little or no pain. If States like Washington spent as much time and money keeping fentanyl off our streets as they do keeping pain meds out of our medicine cabinet our society would be much better off. IMHORant: God gave us poppies. Pain meds at the pharmacy should be available to shoppers without a prescription, in measured doses, without resorting to street drugs made in shady manufacturing venues. Staying "on top" of pain after surgery shouldn't require begging a doctor, not being able to cross state lines to get your medicine if you opted to choose the best surgeon who happens to be in a different state, and other hoops to jump over. When laudanum was freely available at chemist's in the 1800s and 1900's our ancestors didn't turn into addicts. I've had my fair share of surgeries. My prescribed in hospital pain meds for back surgery were taken away by a Muslim doc on call, when my surgical team spent the day away, rebuilding a child's body, pure torture. (when the surgeon and his team returned, they stayed with me until the morphine drink they immediately ordered began to work). I used to follow a website named Bonesmart, there was lots of good advice on hip and knee replacement recovery, I haven't viewed it for some years. IMO requesting pain relief should not make you be labeled a drug seeker. This is a campaign issue. As a senior I never wanted to affect my brain power for years with drugs, but in my seventh decade, proper pain management means one can be a functioning citizen.
the floating, is why I never take more than prescribed.ONLY as long has he has REAL PAIN!! Remember that some pain is good in that it's "SELF LIMITING"....goes back to the old adage :"Doc, it hurts when I do this." Doctor's answer: "Then don't do THAT." Better to have a little self limiting pain than to have NO PAIN at all. Then you might be taking too much of a good thing and that's when addiction gets started.
The real purpose of pain medication is to take the "SHARP EDGE" off the pain....not to float you into euphoria. That's when people get into trouble.
This right here! Very good points. Laudanum was very addictive, and it was over the counter. However, how often did one actually hear of addicted Cowboys? Not very often. Yes, it happened But frequency is not near what one would think. Hence further proof that prohibition does not work. Ever. Not with Drugs, not with Pot, not with Alcohol.Actually, studies seem to show that the addiction rate when *everything * (including morphine) was available OTC, the addiction rate was almost exactly the same as it is now.
IOW, a certain, small percentage of the population *is* going to find something that feeds their personal need for "whatever", and they will become addicted.
*Everyone* who takes an opiate, benzodiazipine, or other addictive substance (alcohol) on a frequent, regular basis (essentially often enough and in sufficient quantities that the brain receptors are never "empty") WILL become physically dependent on the substance.
But only a small subset of those will become actual "addicts".
"Addiction" causes actual changes in brain structure and chemistry. It creates a severely dysfunctional thinking pattern, and for most, once developed, is a lifetime battle. Physical tolerance/dependency lasts until withdrawal is complete. And this is where many abusers end up ODing... they "get clean" during a fairly short jail stint (a few weeks, or even less). When they get out, they decide to party with their drug of choice, and use their "usual" dose. Many don't wake up.
But of course, there were laudanum addicts... incant remember which famous writer or playwright was well known for drinking a PINT of laudanum a day! Given that an ounce will kill most "opiate naive" folks, that's an almost unbelievable tolerance! Of course, you had to be financially well off to support that type of habit!
As free human beings, we either have dominion over our own bodies, or we don't. If we don't... we're not free. Period.
Now... that doesn't mean you're free to drive while impaired, or to neglect your children, or any of the other intrinsically wrong behaviors that drug use can lead to. By all means, hammer those abuses, hard!
But telling an 87 year old grandmother, in a wheelchair, with bone on bone knees and hips (along with severe arthritis in her spine and other joints) that she can only take Tylenol... and only twice a day... is absolutely wrong!
The funny thing is, we'll get access to assisted suicide and euthanasia before they ever let pain relief be between the doctor and patient again.
Summerthyme
My wife was scheduled for knee replacement next week, but it was cancelled. She is suffering from joint inflammation, and until they can figure out what the cause is, no surgery.Two knee replacements at the same time is a very brave person. But they will be glad they got it over with
I am doing just this later this month. Am done with the bone on bone.
Haha...I felt better the moment they got me out of bed the afternoon of the replacement. I had been in that much pain from the end of bones grinding a new displaced socket in my knee joint. Surgical pain is nothing compared to grinding, nauseating bone-on-bone joint pain that I'd been living with for at least a year..haha...working 60 hours/week on cement floors.Most people I know who have gone through this stop questioning their decision of having had the surgery by around six months. By a year out, they ask themselves why they didn’t do it sooner.