sjhenderson
Senior Member
Where can I get two handheld Ham radios, no I don't have a license but pretty soon I doubt folks are going to be checking that, Also distance on them? Thanks.
COMM Handheld Ham Radio
- Thread starter sjhenderson
- Start date
I have several of the Baefung models from Amazon to supplement my Yeasus and Kenwood's. Cheap and they work for local coms.
Learn what you are doing or when you think you are just talking to your cousin Jeb out back you are hitting the input frequency of a repeater transmitting to the world, who won't be happy and will find you.
Distance on any handheld is not great due to antenna height. It is terrain dependent. In Fl on the ground, flat lands with the trees and houses 2-3 miles is the best any will do. Line of sight hill top to hill top in NC may get you 30 miles.
Learn what you are doing or when you think you are just talking to your cousin Jeb out back you are hitting the input frequency of a repeater transmitting to the world, who won't be happy and will find you.
Distance on any handheld is not great due to antenna height. It is terrain dependent. In Fl on the ground, flat lands with the trees and houses 2-3 miles is the best any will do. Line of sight hill top to hill top in NC may get you 30 miles.
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Plenty of discussion here...
www.timebomb2000.com
Run the forum search, more info sprinkled around.
COMM/TECH/PC HELP
This is a multi-purpose SIG, and is for Communications, Technical issues in general, and PC help. All the "propellor-heads" hang out here!
Run the forum search, more info sprinkled around.
WFK
Senior Something
We have seen truckers with ham amplifiers and CBers polluting the 10m band. WE don't need any non licensed ppl to mess up the VHF bands, thinking nobody cares. Thank you!
You risk a $10,000 fine from the FCC who does aggressively track illegal activity. There are many amateur radio "Fox Hunter" clubs out there that love to locate and report unlicensed operators.
There are other radio bands that will serve your purpose without running afoul of the government.
Bob the Builder
Contributing Member
Second the Baofengs.
Then get the book The Guerrilla's Guide to the Baofeng Radio - Mass Market Verison. Only $20 and very much worth the money.
Small book, has just the info you need for your purpose and very little more. Shows how to manually program them (which can be somewhat confusing)
Paused to add that I am a ham (Extra class) but not a butt.
Edited to add, The older UV5R can be used to transmit outside the ham bands which will alleviate some of the noted concerns. BUT---as noted you may be transmitting on military, aviation, law enforcement, three letter salad etc.
Even the new ones can be user unlocked to do the same.
It will be to your benefit to understand the frequencies on which you can depend.
Then get the book The Guerrilla's Guide to the Baofeng Radio - Mass Market Verison. Only $20 and very much worth the money.
Small book, has just the info you need for your purpose and very little more. Shows how to manually program them (which can be somewhat confusing)
Paused to add that I am a ham (Extra class) but not a butt.
Edited to add, The older UV5R can be used to transmit outside the ham bands which will alleviate some of the noted concerns. BUT---as noted you may be transmitting on military, aviation, law enforcement, three letter salad etc.
Even the new ones can be user unlocked to do the same.
It will be to your benefit to understand the frequencies on which you can depend.
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Raggedyman
Res ipsa loquitur
What PO’s hams is unlicensed people operating withn the UHF/VHF spectrum dedicated to amature radio . . . There are other frequencies available to use in these ares that are not assigned to us. Then you have the hunters out here using our repeaters - which are privately owned as well as EXPENSIVE. Want to have an issue with people? there’s a great way to start having real and potentially costly problems for yourself. there are also repeaters in the GMRS and Business frequencies as well - ALSO private.
its a VERY SIMPLE THING to take a test that requires not only minimal effort and time as well as negligible to non existent cost. Look on line - the questions are there -easy easy to MEMORIZE THE ANSWERS and GET your tech ticket. There are “other things“ to know about radio - not only are those things important they will help you understand how your own personal commas can and should be working - making them not only SAFER but very much BETTER for Y O U
LoupGarou
Ancient Fuzzball
Distance on almost any handheld to any other handheld is going to be based on antenna HEIGHT and frequency used. If you are talking VHF and UHF, which travel Line of Sight, then you are limited to what they call the "Radio Horizon" is, which is usually less than 3 miles unless you and the person you want to talk to are on hills or mountains.
The problem with getting a radio and planning what you are planning to do is that you never get a chance to practice using and learning the radio, as well as learning how radio waves "RF" works in the real world. I do get it that getting everyone in your group to go ahead, study, and everyone get their Amateur license is a hard push. I would still suggest that a few in your group get their Amateur license, even if the rest of the group does not. I WOULD suggest at bare minimum getting your GMRS license, as that covers your whole extended family, not just the person that gets the license. And the GMRS license is just $35 (for 10 years) for all in your family. I have both (and a few others). This way, at least the people in your group can practice and "see what works", before they have to rely on the radios as their only means of "long distance" comms. Get the license, either one, it is WELL worth the effort and the few $$.
The Baofengs are fine for starter radios, I would suggest also getting a 50 foot RG-8x (RG8Mini) cable, AND a good dual band roll-up JPole antenna for each radio you buy. What makes your signal go the most distance is antenna height. A good antenna (like a good dual band J-Pole) up 40 feet in a tree or other tall structure, opens up your range from that 3 miles to your Radio Horizon, to about 10-15 miles. And if the person on the other end, also does that, you can possibly get double that between the two of you.
Again, getting the license(s) and radios NOW, allows you to learn what does and does not work NOW, when you can ask questions and find out what may be needed to get the signals to where they need to go. Yes, planning on running without the license is a bad idea just for the legal reasons, but it also keeps you from the biggest benefits of having the license, which is learning the "how to" parts, as well as making connections on the air so that you have known help later in your area if needed. Even if you don't plan on using your license or callsign later once TSHTF, people that you have talked with over the air will be a LOT more happy to continue talking with you since they already know you.
rhughe13
Heart of Dixie
On ham bands, call signs must be given on voice at the beginning of a call, and every 10 minutes throughout the contact. Get a license or don't risk it. Ham Radio folks are hungry for the unlicensed. But with the Baofung you can program to operate on FRS/GMRS. Getting a tech license is not that difficult and you will meet a lot of your local neighbors that will teach you a lot, for the fun of it.
I second the Baofung UV-5R or better. Also the stub antenna is not really good so grab a tactical antenna to swap out for $10, or buy them with it.
I second the Baofung UV-5R or better. Also the stub antenna is not really good so grab a tactical antenna to swap out for $10, or buy them with it.
Hfcomms
EN66iq
Listen to the advice given and get the license. It’s not so much the piece of government paper but the learning process which is necessary to be a radio operator and technician. Getting equipment and not knowing how to use it and assuming that you can figure it out when you need to is akin to the people that intend to ‘live off the land’ when TSHTF but have never skinned an animal, and the only camping ever done was in a tent at a park with restrooms and showers.
If you don’t want to do this then stay off the ham and public service bands and get some FRS radios that don’t require a license or GMRS where you pay a fee and are ‘legal’ but you don’t have to know anything. Operating pirate on ham bands will get you caught in short order as we know how to spot people doing so. Hams are a knowledgeable and friendly bunch but requires some effort on your part to achieve minimal skills.
If you don’t want to do this then stay off the ham and public service bands and get some FRS radios that don’t require a license or GMRS where you pay a fee and are ‘legal’ but you don’t have to know anything. Operating pirate on ham bands will get you caught in short order as we know how to spot people doing so. Hams are a knowledgeable and friendly bunch but requires some effort on your part to achieve minimal skills.
Heck even on GMRS you need a license and issued a proper call sign to use it and there are people getting into trouble for using GMRS for business like taxi and it's not allowed they have business bands and there are radio service out there and yes you have to pay for it.
I think sjhenderson needs to get the ham license and best get a two meter HT that may get the range they may want and opens up a whole world of people that are willing to help get them started and much more.
Raggedyman
Res ipsa loquitur
There is so much absolute truth in this paragraph that its difficult to state. been in this hobby over 25 years and I am STILL learning and asking questions. People who think they are going to buy an HF rig and use it after SHTF with ZERO prior experience are in for a very rude awakening. It‘s not simply plug and play like your am/fm portable; its not AT ALL “plug it into the wall outlet and I’m good to go.“
Comms are an important aspect of prepping - for your own safety and welfare and that of your group - take the time to do it the RIGHT WAY . . . You won’t be sorry and its just not hard to do.
Raggedyman
Res ipsa loquitur
Well maybe - but still you’d be better off to have a little background knowledge about RF and how it works - you may easily be very much more disappointed in the results from your CB than you are from those UHF/VHF frequencies . . .
One thing that ALL of us here should have is a GOOD short wave radio and scanner and proper antenna systems for them - as well as a dependable LONG TERM power source for both. In a SHTF situation a good set of ears is going to be way more important than the ability to reach out long distance and talk to people (unless you’re out on watch or patrolling your AO).
TALKING over the air is a really good way to shout HERE I AM!!!
how many realize that there are operating modes and techniques you’d be exposed to in amature radio that considerably restrict the ability for others to hear and understand (copy) what your saying? many of those require very little power to travel great distance. lots to know and learn if your serious about comms in a post SHTF world
bracketquant
Veteran Member
If the SHTF, the airwaves will be a lawless, useless, place. Useless, other than HAM operators, legal and illegal, being easily found, and rounded up for the camps.
The people on this forum are some of the most well-informed people on the planet about the treasonous intentions of the US government. Our government is looking more and more like 1932 Germany every day. The Nazis eventually confiscated ham radio equipment to stop the people from hearing what was really going on. I fear that the US government will eventually try to do the same here. So I have declined to get on the government's list of people who have the equipment and will NOT get a license. My only interest is in hearing uncensored long distance news info over the airwaves. Listening, not transmitting. I currently have thousands of dollars of ham equipment and a decent antenna. I like hearing Israel. Last night Serbia was coming in loud at 5-9 on 20M. 40M gets me every corner of the USA.
So here is my question to all of the licensed hams on this forum: knowing the direction that the government is going, why do you write off the possibility that our government will try to take our equipment at some point? Exchanging call signs and signal reports may be fine for antenna analysis and general fun, but is it worth the future risk of the enemy government coming to your house? Do you really write off that possibility as unrealistic? If so, why so?
If things go south bad enough that ham radio is the only remaining source of info, I will not be concerned about the morality of unlicensed transmitting. But for the moment, I only listen. Less fun, but IMHO safer in the long run.
So here is my question to all of the licensed hams on this forum: knowing the direction that the government is going, why do you write off the possibility that our government will try to take our equipment at some point? Exchanging call signs and signal reports may be fine for antenna analysis and general fun, but is it worth the future risk of the enemy government coming to your house? Do you really write off that possibility as unrealistic? If so, why so?
If things go south bad enough that ham radio is the only remaining source of info, I will not be concerned about the morality of unlicensed transmitting. But for the moment, I only listen. Less fun, but IMHO safer in the long run.
Meemur
Voice on the Prairie / FJB!
We use CB radios out here in Central Iowa. We have dead spots with no cell towers.
No license required.
If you aren't willing to get a ham license, stay off the ham bands, unless it's a life or death emergency.
You really don't want to anger those folks. Some enjoy tracking down violators a wee bit too much.
The bad situation of 7.200 MHz being abused for YEARS by non-hams leads me to believe that current enforcement by the FCC is minimal at best.
Meemur
Voice on the Prairie / FJB!
I have a box of old radio equipment. If some gov't busybody with a warrant visits, I will hand over the box and
say that it belonged to my late boyfriend. Since I'm female and do mostly CW on 160 meters while camping, I might get away with that. When not in use, my portable antenna and other equipment are put away.
I agree: having a skyhook on the roof or a tower in the backyard is not wise in most areas. That said, I wouldn't hesitate to have one in a highly rural area, like N. MN or Alaska.
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Laurane
Canadian Loonie
They used to call my husband Silver Fox
Meemur
Voice on the Prairie / FJB!
It's the fox hunters (often bored retirees), not the FCC, that are the problem.
They are another reason I keep my hobby to myself and only transmit while camping.
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Can an unlicensed person just listen if they don’t talk on the radio?
Yes, but why not just get a scanner?
Don't buy an amateur radio transceiver unless one is properly licensed.
BadMedicine
Would *I* Lie???
tHEsE oUR R ARwEIgHs11!
Meemur
Voice on the Prairie / FJB!
Reader, it's fine to listen! You can even go down to your local radio club and listen on their equipment.
Just don't key up the mike and transmit unlicensed, unless there is a life or death emergency.
Added: you can listen to broadcastify for free if you're wondering about scanners.
www.broadcastify.com
Just don't key up the mike and transmit unlicensed, unless there is a life or death emergency.
Added: you can listen to broadcastify for free if you're wondering about scanners.
Westcom Police Dispatch Live Audio Feed
Westcom Police Dispatch Live Audio Feed on Broadcastify.com
www.broadcastify.com
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Just go get your license. They literally give you the answers to the test questions in the study materials, so all you need to do is memorize. I got my General in about 10 minutes.
As to the anonymity concern, the age of the average Ham is likely well north of 60 at this point. You're not going to be on any lists just because you got an amateur radio license. It's unlikely that the Deep State gives any thoughts to what by all appearances is a dying hobby populated by basement-dwellers in assisted living homes.
Old Reliable
Veteran Member
You risk a $10,000 fine Get a license. is not hard to get,
Hfcomms
EN66iq
The current government is the most incompetent and corrupt set of boobs we've ever had and they are a lot more afraid of us than we are of them and you can see that by the reaction to the Jan 6th protestors. The government is not all knowing and all powerful even with their A.I. Look at how they failed in Afghanistan even though they had all the military might and look last week at what Hamas was able to do against one of the most primary military powers in the world.
I say the same thing to people who are concerned about martial law. There is not enough military in the U.S. to put boots on the ground and control the people. And I say this as someone who was familiar with the plans for mass civil disturbances in the U.S. Our State plan was to deploy a brigade or two to the hot spot (assuming it would be Detroit, Flint or maybe Grand Rapids) and to hold out until the Federal calvary came to save the day. And that was back when the military was at full strength. Today they can't even meet their recruiting goals.
What the government is going to do when TSHTF is to hunker down and protect what they consider to be critical infrastructure and wait it out as they will be totally overwhelmed. Same way that when disaster hits people are on their own and FEMA is no where to be seen.
You can even see that with the Katrina response. The only way the government was able to meet the demand was to strip forces from all over the nation and shovel them into the gulf region and that was a massive charlie foxtrot. And this was with the rest of the country up and running. What happens in a full blown collapse when the whole nation is in chaos? The illusion of an all powerful federal government is just that....an illusion.
To bring this down to a landing your not going to have to worry about someone trying to find your ham radios or try to round you up because you have a license. Currently under a faux normalcy they can take any of us out anytime they want as a show of force or to make a statement. When the crap really comes down they will be taking care of themselves and the police, military and civilian federal employees will be no where to be seen.
Your primary threat will be hungry and desperate locals along with anyone else looking to loot or profit from the distress or the invaders coming across the border so no, I'm not worried about the government trying to take my radios or to hunt me down because I oppose Washington's dictates as our enemies will be a lot closer to home.
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kyrsyan
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Dad got his license renewed last year. He used to be really heavily into it when I was a kid. None of us kids ever got the licenses. Dad says the testing now is nowhere near as hard as it was 50+ years ago.
His lapsed because of life stuff. He renewed it because they have found themselves in areas where no other form of communication works. So there's a base in the RV and he carries the handheld. That's about the extent of their equipment now.
I should probably see if anyone I am acquainted with locally has a license. Just in case I ever need to send a "Hey, we are alive." message. But that's about all I'd consider doing. Family is over the mountains. If all other forms of communication fail permanently, we are lost to them anyways.
His lapsed because of life stuff. He renewed it because they have found themselves in areas where no other form of communication works. So there's a base in the RV and he carries the handheld. That's about the extent of their equipment now.
I should probably see if anyone I am acquainted with locally has a license. Just in case I ever need to send a "Hey, we are alive." message. But that's about all I'd consider doing. Family is over the mountains. If all other forms of communication fail permanently, we are lost to them anyways.
LoupGarou
Ancient Fuzzball
+1000000
If you want to use comms efficiently post TSHTF, you need to know how to use them efficiently when times are good and practice often enough so that your muscle and brain memory has it down perfectly (just like a few other prep processes). After TSHTF our govt is not going to be the main group that is targeting you, especially if all you have is a handheld radio. Corporations may, especially with things like HawkEye360 and the others. Paramilitary and "other" military groups, including anyone who has invaded our country may also be a MUCH bigger aggressor and looking for your signals. If they shut down the internet and cellphones, you can almost guarantee that they will be monitoring as much as they can over wide areas since radios will be the "go to" for most people to stay in touch. This "sheep herding though the pens" action makes it so that they have far less to monitor in any one local area, and something as simple as a $100 Tiny SA Ultra with 200' of 9913 coax and a discone antenna hung up under a local cell tower platform will let whoever wants to find the radio users in an area, to trace down the signals and then start triangulating them. THIS is why you need to not only know exactly how to use a radio, but also when to use it, and when NOT to use it. Not having a license prevents a lot of that learning, as well as prevents a lot of the RF spectrum out there from being used. Even getting books like the "The Guerrilla's Guide to the Baofeng Radio" will teach you a lot, BUT without having the licnese(s) and practicing, you are in the same boat as having a pistol and just dry fire practicing at a target 50 feet away.
If you still do not want to get either the Amateur or GMRS license (and you can use a POBox instead of your address), then I would suggest getting a standard set of "bubble pack" FRS radios and learning on them before moving forward. There are some nice "GMRS" handheld radios that don't cost an arm and a leg out there, and just getting your GMRS license would open a LOT of doors in most areas for your whole extended family. I bought a bunch of the "Radioddity GM-30 GMRS Radio 2 Packs" ( https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09T3KBD4F ) for my family (and extended family), and I have yet to see anything bad about them. They handle all of the GMRS and some FRS channels, as well as GMRS repeaters, and will monitor a good chunk of the VHF and UHF bands as well, all for around $30 each.
Think seriously on the licenses (definitely on the GMRS for each family, and at least one or two Amateur licenses for the more "technically capable" members of your group). Having the equipment without the experience is going to more harm than good, and you can't get the experience without practicing with others. You can get some with the FRS radios and no license, just don't expect a lot of distance unless you can use hills and other high spots effectively (a 2W FRS radio WILL go dozens, or even 100+ miles IF both stations are in "Line of Sight" by using tall objects or buildings, or hills/mountains to get above anything that may block that "Line of Sight"). And if you can guarantee that you can "get to high ground" when needed, then FRS may be all you need, just remember that while you may get the signal to the other party, you are also getting that signal out pretty far to anyone else. Again, something that experience, practice and testing will show you all about ahead of time...
Is there a scanner for ham radio?
LoupGarou
Ancient Fuzzball
Almost any scanner can scan the Amateur VHF and UHF bands. Just have it search through:
50-54MHz for 6 Meter signals
144-148MHz for 2 Meter signals
420-450MHz for 70cm signals
There are other Amateur bands, but those will be the most active as there are the most radios out there that support those frequencies.
For the HF frequencies, you will want to "dial" through those frequencies as they may be "piled up" more than a search or scan will permit.
What kind of scanner would recommend for this? Thank you.
LoupGarou
Ancient Fuzzball
Any VHF/UHF capable scanner out there should be able to pick up those bands. Keep an eye out on Yard Sales and used equipment. That being said, a handheld would probably serve anyone the best, as they are portable, more sensitive to weaker signals (they are designed to be used with the crappy small rubber duck antenna that they come with, so if you hook them up to a Discone or J-Pole, they REALLY work well).
Personal favorite: Uniden Bearcat BC125AT Handheld Scanner
500 channels
it will monitor most of the VHF and UHF military bands as well (250-400MHz)
It WILL connect to your laptop as well as an android phone and become a LOT more usable for COMINT/SIGINT.
They cost around $100, so you aren't blowing your wallet apart when you get one.
Yes, the 125AT will not pick up the 800-900MHz band, but with most of those signals going encrypted, you would be better served by just getting a nice Tiny SA Ultra Spectrum Analyzer, which WILL demodulate all of the signals it can receive (20MHz to 6GHz) into audio (it won't decrypt, but not much short of the original radios for those signals, AND the right HexCode will).