CRISIS Grim Ebola prediction: Outbreak is unstoppable for now, doc says

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
Posted under Fair Use....



Grim Ebola prediction: Outbreak is unstoppable for now, doc says
LiveScience

By Rachael Rettner
Published September 04, 2014


A doctor who just returned from treating Ebola patients in West Africa predicts the current Ebola outbreak will go on for more than a year, and will continue to spread unless a vaccine or other drugs that prevent or treat the disease are developed.

Dr. Daniel Lucey, an expert on viral outbreaks and an adjunct professor at Georgetown University Medical Center, recently spent three weeks in Sierra Leone, one of the countries affected by the Ebola outbreak. While there, Lucey evaluated and treated Ebola patients, and trained other doctors and nurses on how to use protective equipment.

The current Ebola outbreak, which is mainly in Guinea, Sierra Leone and Liberia, has so far killed at least 1,552 of the more than 3,000 people infected, making it the largest and deadliest Ebola outbreak in history. It is also the first outbreak to spread from rural areas to cities. Strategies that have worked in the past to stop Ebola outbreaks in rural areas may not, by themselves, be enough to halt this outbreak, Lucey said.

"I don't believe that our traditional methods of being able to control and stop outbreaks in rural areas … is going to be effective in most of the cities," Lucey said yesterday (Sept. 3) in a discussion held at Georgetown University Law Center that was streamed online. While the World Health Organization has released a plan to stop Ebola transmission within six to nine months, "I think that this outbreak is going to go on even longer than a year," Lucey said. [5 Things You Should Know About Ebola]

In addition, without vaccines or drugs for Ebola, "I'm not confident we will be able to stop it," Lucey said. There are a few studies of Ebola treatments and prevention methods under way, but more research is needed to show whether they are safe and effective against the disease.

One strategy that could help with the current outbreak is to implement public health "command centers" whose job it is to make sure that tools and equipment sent to the affected regions are properly distributed to places that need them, Lucey said.

When Lucey was in Sierra Leone, protective equipmentfor health care workers made its way to the capital city, but not to the hospital where he was working, he said. "We did not have gloves that I felt safe with," Lucey said, noting that the gloves would tear easily. "We didn't have face shields. We had goggles that had been washed so many times you couldn't see through them," Lucey said.

Another important factor in stemming the outbreak will be community engagement and education to help people in the region understand the behaviors that spread the disease, said Dr. Marty Cetron, director of Global Migration and Quarantine at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. It is also important to understand the culture of an area so that control strategies are culturally acceptable, Cetron said.

This large Ebola outbreak could have been prevented with an effective public health response at the beginning, said Lawrence Gostin, director of the O'Neill Institute for National and Global Health Law at Georgetown University. But the weak health systems of the affected countries left them unprepared to respond to the outbreak, Gostin said.

The international community should have been more generous in supporting poorer countries so they could develop the response capacities needed to contain the outbreak, Gostin and colleagues wrote in a recent briefing for the O'Neill Institute.

To help with the current outbreak, and prevent future ones, Gostin called for the establishment of an international "health systems fund," which would be supported by high-resource countries. The money would be used to strengthen the health systems in those countries, he said.

"We want to avoid leaving these countries in the same kind of fragile health condition" that they are in now, and that is being worsened, Gostin said.

7 Devastating Infectious Diseases
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http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/...unstoppable-for-now-doc-says/?intcmp=obinsite
 

Doomer Doug

TB Fanatic
You are assuming, Dennis the 2.5 rate doesn't increase further in September from August. If it remains at 2.5 Ebola will be unstoppable, but if it increases to 3, 4, or 5 Ebola will go to the next level.

At this point, we are going to see 100,000 dead West Africans by Christmas. After that, the gates will open.
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
Somewhere in the long Ebola thread (I think- WAY too much reading the past couple of weeks!) a doctor reported that the R0 of this new Ebola is now a little GREATER than that of the pandemic influenza in 1918. God help us...

Summerthyme
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
Posted under Fair Use....
Grim Ebola prediction: Outbreak is unstoppable for now, doc says
LiveScience

By Rachael Rettner
Published September 04, 2014

A doctor who just returned from treating Ebola patients in West Africa predicts the current Ebola outbreak will go on for more than a year, and will continue to spread unless a vaccine or other drugs that prevent or treat the disease are developed.

If it doesn't get worse and the "rates" we have been tracking stay the same...in a year we will only have 2 Billion infected and 1 Billion dead. But that is where the hockey stick goes vertical for 3 months and then "game over" dude.
 

Baloo

Veteran Member
I'm still not in Camp Fooked.
Have you seen the photos of West Point--its worse than anything you can imagine--the perfect breeding ground to spread a virus.
If that whole area is not infected in the next week or so (which is the time it would peak after the raid on the clinic there) I don't see this being a huge deal to people in the US--meaning its as contagious as the CDC/WHO is saying--not that much.
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
I'm still not in Camp Fooked.
Have you seen the photos of West Point--its worse than anything you can imagine--the perfect breeding ground to spread a virus.
If that whole area is not infected in the next week or so (which is the time it would peak after the raid on the clinic there) I don't see this being a huge deal to people in the US--meaning its as contagious as the CDC/WHO is saying--not that much.

So where/when/why do YOU think it will drop (not stay the same or increase) from its current trajectory of an R0 of 2.785 and a CFR of 50%?
 

Txkstew

Veteran Member
My Son just took his Nephew (both about the same age, 20 yo) to the emergency room in Beaumont, Tx. The Nephew has been puking non stop for 4 days and is dehydrated and wilting. My Son dropped him off and left, because the place is packed with people looking sick as hell and lots of loud yelling. All the medical people are wearing masks and so are many of the people in the waiting room. Great. This just happened in the last hour or so.
 

BadMedicine

Would *I* Lie???
I wonder how many flights a day are coming in to the US from those countries.. any directly?

I wonder what major INTL hub they fly in to? How many thousands of people a day are there?
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
A search shows lots of flights from Lagos, Nigeria to JFK, LaGuardia and Newark. It is an easy thing to search. Just pick a city over there and New York, Miami or Atlanta over here.

I just searched for lagos to new york flights and one of the entries showed the available flights.
 

parsonswife

Veteran Member
makes me nostalgic for the good ol days when all we had to worry over was nuclear melt down in Japan and the mortage melt down causing another great depression. My, how things have accelerated.
 

Kris Gandillon

The Other Curmudgeon
_______________
Lets wait and see what happens in West Point in a couple of weeks.

Does ANYONE have a link to information regarding HOW MANY are infected with and/or died from Ebola in West Point specifically at this moment or anytime over the last 2 months?

I want to crank that number into a spreadsheet and see the projection through the end of 2014 for just that specific area.
 

VesperSparrow

Goin' where the lonely go
My Son just took his Nephew (both about the same age, 20 yo) to the emergency room in Beaumont, Tx. The Nephew has been puking non stop for 4 days and is dehydrated and wilting. My Son dropped him off and left, because the place is packed with people looking sick as hell and lots of loud yelling. All the medical people are wearing masks and so are many of the people in the waiting room. Great. This just happened in the last hour or so.
Keep us updated? TIA.
 

Hfcomms

EN66iq
makes me nostalgic for the good ol days when all we had to worry over was nuclear melt down in Japan and the mortage melt down causing another great depression. My, how things have accelerated.


When we can call recent history the good ole days you know things are starting to get pretty nasty. Almost makes me pine for the days of Shrub Jr.

:lkick: :lkick: :lkick:
 

Txkstew

Veteran Member
Keep us updated? TIA.

Grandson called and said to come get him. They told him he's dehydrated and to drink Pedialyte and eat Popsicles, or wait 10 hours for a room. Sounds like they are swamped. He can't keep anything down. He's been drinking Gatorade which is like Pedialyte and it all comes right back up. I've been going to the ER in Beaumont for a long time, and I've never heard of them wearing mask in the waiting room. I'm not saying it's an Ebola outbreak, but it shows the health system is freaked out if they are wearing mask at the ER intake area because the room is full of puking people. I'll go over to talk to Grandson later to see how he's doing and ask more questions on what was really going on there.
 

R.Tist

Membership Revoked
Of course all travel to and from all infected areas should be stopped and the areas - isolated/quarantined. Drop shipments of food and medical supplies can continue without spreading the virus further, naturally.

HOWEVER, that would be a common-sense approach to dealing with this or any other international viral threat, and since when has the U.S. government (along with other governments) done anything that would qualify as sensible of late?

Artie.
 

ginnie6

Veteran Member
I must be dumb.....I just don't understand HOW they think they're going to stop the spread of this. I keep hearing about a roadmap to stop it but.....They're not closing borders, they're not quarantining....unless you count 4 days. Does anyone really think 4 days is going to make a difference? So what are they doing? It seems like they're just sitting there on their hands hoping it will burn itself out.
I feel for these people I really do but at some point they need to actually do something to stop it spreading elsewhere. How bad does it have to get? How many continents does it need to hit first?
 

naturallysweet

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Grandson called and said to come get him. They told him he's dehydrated and to drink Pedialyte and eat Popsicles, or wait 10 hours for a room. Sounds like they are swamped. He can't keep anything down. He's been drinking Gatorade which is like Pedialyte and it all comes right back up. I've been going to the ER in Beaumont for a long time, and I've never heard of them wearing mask in the waiting room. I'm not saying it's an Ebola outbreak, but it shows the health system is freaked out if they are wearing mask at the ER intake area because the room is full of puking people. I'll go over to talk to Grandson later to see how he's doing and ask more questions on what was really going on there.

Gatorade has to much sugar and will be rejected faster by the stomach and not help enough with rehydration. He really needs to be sipping Pediayte or make one of the rehydration recipes available online (or on the ebola thread for tb2k).

He needs to take sips only until he can keep it down. Tell him to try to squeeze his left thumb to hold the gag reflex down.

He probably won't want to hear it. But worse comes to worse, it's possible to rehydrate someone with an enema.
 

Tennessee gal

Veteran Member
I must be dumb.....I just don't understand HOW they think they're going to stop the spread of this. I keep hearing about a roadmap to stop it but.....They're not closing borders, they're not quarantining....unless you count 4 days. Does anyone really think 4 days is going to make a difference? So what are they doing? It seems like they're just sitting there on their hands hoping it will burn itself out.
I feel for these people I really do but at some point they need to actually do something to stop it spreading elsewhere. How bad does it have to get? How many continents does it need to hit first?

I thought the 4 day quarantine was a joke !!!
 

SheWoff

Southern by choice
I can't get past this point in the op without thinking and wondering how long ago was he treating active ebola patients and is now at a large crowded University?

When Lucey was in Sierra Leone, protective equipmentfor health care workers made its way to the capital city, but not to the hospital where he was working, he said. "We did not have gloves that I felt safe with," Lucey said, noting that the gloves would tear easily. "We didn't have face shields. We had goggles that had been washed so many times you couldn't see through them," Lucey said.

Praying it was over 21-29 days ago? All it is going to take is one person just like this with contacts all over the place from the moment he got on an airliner bound for the US.....not saying it will be him exactly but someone with the best intention just like it. Gives me the willies....

She
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
Gatorade has to much sugar and will be rejected faster by the stomach and not help enough with rehydration. He really needs to be sipping Pediayte or make one of the rehydration recipes available online (or on the ebola thread for tb2k).

He needs to take sips only until he can keep it down. Tell him to try to squeeze his left thumb to hold the gag reflex down.

He probably won't want to hear it. But worse comes to worse, it's possible to rehydrate someone with an enema.

True, but only SMALL amounts at a time. Anything more than about 250 cc's (a cup) at a time will trigger the "enema effect", which is the opposite of what you want! If he's dehydrated enough that his lips look dry, the skin on his wrist will stay pinched up for more than a couple of seconds when pinched, or he has a severe headache, he NEEDS to head to another ER for an IV. Even young people can develop heart arrythmyias from electrolyte imbalance.

For me, stuff like ginger ale, Gatorade, etc, only makes me worse. What will stay down for me when nothing else will (although not always- if you've got a nasty norovirus, you're better off simply not trying to ingest anything for at least 12 hours, but if you're already dehydrated, you may not have that choice) is warm chicken boullion. When I'm healthy, the stuff tastes way too salty, but if I'm nauseous, it's perfect.

Summerthyme
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
Grandson called and said to come get him. They told him he's dehydrated and to drink Pedialyte and eat Popsicles, or wait 10 hours for a room. Sounds like they are swamped. He can't keep anything down. He's been drinking Gatorade which is like Pedialyte and it all comes right back up. I've been going to the ER in Beaumont for a long time, and I've never heard of them wearing mask in the waiting room. I'm not saying it's an Ebola outbreak, but it shows the health system is freaked out if they are wearing mask at the ER intake area because the room is full of puking people. I'll go over to talk to Grandson later to see how he's doing and ask more questions on what was really going on there.


"Outbreak" - Dustin Hoffman
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
My Son just took his Nephew (both about the same age, 20 yo) to the emergency room in Beaumont, Tx. The Nephew has been puking non stop for 4 days and is dehydrated and wilting. My Son dropped him off and left, because the place is packed with people looking sick as hell and lots of loud yelling. All the medical people are wearing masks and so are many of the people in the waiting room. Great. This just happened in the last hour or so.


oh.........shoot............
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Grandson called and said to come get him. They told him he's dehydrated and to drink Pedialyte and eat Popsicles, or wait 10 hours for a room. Sounds like they are swamped. He can't keep anything down. He's been drinking Gatorade which is like Pedialyte and it all comes right back up. I've been going to the ER in Beaumont for a long time, and I've never heard of them wearing mask in the waiting room. I'm not saying it's an Ebola outbreak, but it shows the health system is freaked out if they are wearing mask at the ER intake area because the room is full of puking people. I'll go over to talk to Grandson later to see how he's doing and ask more questions on what was really going on there.

Get him to another ER stat.

If he's already weak from loss of electrolytes, and can't keep anything down, that advice is WORTHLESS.

He sounds like he's ALREADY in trouble, and he NEEDS IV-fluids NOW.

I had a son who got in that shape when we all had a bad stomach virus that ran through our family a few years ago--it was at New Year's, and it was a 3-day kind (seems to me most 'normal' stomach viruses are either the 24-hour kind or the 3-day kind). This one was AWFUL---none of us could keep even water down for 3 days and were going at both ends. At the end of it, we were finally able to keep gingerale down, then proceeded to broth and lite starchies, then to regular food--but my littlest (about 4 years old at the time) didn't 'snap back' to his normal tornado-energy-level self---he was pale as a ghost and would get up out of bed only to lie down on the den rug and not move---and even though he was no longer puking, he didn't WANT to drink or eat, so I couldn't get fluids into him that way. I had to take him to a children's hospital---one bag of IV fluid and he was immediately visibly better.

But you can get in trouble QUICK once your electrolytes are out of balance, and you say your grandson is STILL throwing up---so the advice to "drink" something is useless.

Get him to another ER---STAT.
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Does ANYONE have a link to information regarding HOW MANY are infected with and/or died from Ebola in West Point specifically at this moment or anytime over the last 2 months?

I want to crank that number into a spreadsheet and see the projection through the end of 2014 for just that specific area.

The only "on the ground" info I'm getting now is from tweets (https://twitter.com/search?q=#Ebola&f=realtime)--that is how I found out about the Nancy Writebol interview (the one where she let slip that she longed to "hold my children and grandchildren"---implying she had NOT done so since arriving in America---so in other words, after pronouncing her "cured" and perfectly fine and no longer contagious, apparently the CDC had TOLD her to remain under quarantine for a time before coming in close contact with others----a little factual tidbit they have HIDDEN and DENIED publicly is part of the protocol.)


As many predicted, the MSM and "leading" medical news sources seem to have dried up on the ebola coverage...
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Since I'm not all that familiar with the geography of Texas, I did a Google on Beaumont, TX hospitals--the "A" is where Beaumont is.

if they are wearing masks in the ER, THIS FAR FROM THE MEXICAN BORDER-----then WHAT does that say about the medical community's fear of ebola and how far it may already be spreading into the US?
 

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Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Grandson called and said to come get him. They told him he's dehydrated and to drink Pedialyte and eat Popsicles, or wait 10 hours for a room. Sounds like they are swamped. He can't keep anything down. He's been drinking Gatorade which is like Pedialyte and it all comes right back up. I've been going to the ER in Beaumont for a long time, and I've never heard of them wearing mask in the waiting room. I'm not saying it's an Ebola outbreak, but it shows the health system is freaked out if they are wearing mask at the ER intake area because the room is full of puking people. I'll go over to talk to Grandson later to see how he's doing and ask more questions on what was really going on there.

Please give us an update when you can and let us know how he is & what the situation at the hospital is. This is very concerning.
 

Mysty

Veteran Member
We would all love an update on this, but I think its more likely hes gotten something like Chikungunya or one of the other imported illegal immigrant things that are spreading like wildfire around the US.

I had a late night waiting up for my daughter to get home for a date so am a little slow today. Adding him to my prayers. May God watch over your Grandson, and keep him safe.
 
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Baloo

Veteran Member
We would all love an update on this, but I think its more likely hes gotten something like Chikungunya or one of the other imported illegal immigrant things that are spreading like wildfire around the US.

I had a late night waiting up for my daughter to get home for a date so am a little slow today. Adding him to my prayers. May God watch over your Grandson, and keep him safe.

One of my favorite illegal immigrant imports is BED BUGS. I always search the web sites about hotels/bed bug reports when I travel for work as I don't want them in my house.
Its getting harder and harder to find places to stay that are not infested.

I read recently they are even infesting public transportation. Gotta love our brave new world.
 

pirate9933

Veteran Member
I live very rural. I very rarely go into the city.
Maybe this will eradicate many of our domestic city dwelling blacks.
 
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