GOV/MIL Gov/Mil/Pol/Intl: Say, why are House Dems calling on Biden to give up full control of nuclear weapons?

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
Well this ought to get interesting if it picks up any steam......

Posted for fair use.....

Say, why are House Dems calling on Biden to give up full control of nuclear weapons?

Ed Morrissey
Posted at 6:01 pm on February 23, 2021

Which answer do you want first — the fun answer, or the better answer? Let’s start off with the fun answer, but first, let’s specify precisely what House Democrats want from Joe Biden. A letter signed by three dozen of his party’s caucus urges the new president to relinquish full control over the country’s nuclear weapons in favor of a committee approach:

See Also: Who’s ready for Hillary Clinton’s new book… a political thriller?

Nearly three dozen House Democrats on Monday called on Biden to relinquish his sole authority to launch nuclear weapons, in the latest appeal to reform the command-and-control structure so that no single person can initiate a nuclear war.
“…Vesting one person with this authority entails real risks,” states the letter spearheaded by Rep. Jimmy Panetta of California. “Past presidents have threatened to attack other countries with nuclear weapons or exhibited behavior that caused other officials to express concern about the president’s judgment.“
“While any president would presumably consult with advisors before ordering a nuclear attack, there is no requirement to do so,” the letter adds. “The military is obligated to carry out the order if they assess it is legal under the laws of war. Under the current posture of U.S. nuclear forces, that attack would happen in minutes.”

So what’s the fun explanation? Via Twitchy and Twitter pal Aaron Walker, Democrats are worried that Biden’s mentis is too non compos to trust with the football:

View: https://twitter.com/AaronWorthing/status/1364257385070661633?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1364257385070661633%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fhotair.com%2Farchives%2Fed-morrissey%2F2021%2F02%2F23%2Fsay-house-dems-calling-biden-give-full-control-nuclear-weapons%2F


Weeeellllll, that’s good for a laugh. The letter puts it quite differently, however. The reference to “past presidents” is obviously a veiled reference to Donald Trump. And that veil doesn’t even extend as far as the footnotes, where a link to Trump’s supposed “threat” to nuke North Korea matches up with a recollection from former SecDef James Schlesinger about his concerns over Richard Nixon’s stability in the final days of his doomed presidency. There’s also a reference to Nancy Pelosi’s demand to remove the football from Trump after the January 6 Capitol riot, a demand which went nowhere in large part because Pelosi didn’t intend it as anything more than a stunt.

As an attempt to fix a problem before it arises (arguably, again), it’s not a bad idea, considering both the massive consequences of leaving control of the nuclear stockpile in one person’s hands and the constitutional requirement for Congress to authorize war. What happens when that one person turns out to be unstable, either as a permanent feature of his/her personality or as the result of some physical or mental crisis? Just because that hasn’t become an acute problem so far doesn’t mean that it won’t be at some point. Asking for more consensus around that decision seems to be a reasonable request, especially since the retaliatory strike will have its disincentivizing impact on a nuclear aggressor no matter when those missiles launch. Asking a Democratic president to resolve this risk makes more sense for fellow Democrats, as it doesn’t imply any partisan hostilities as a motive.

However, why does Congress need to ask? Congress doesn’t exist as an advisory board to the executive — it passes its own laws and negotiates with the executive on a co-equal basis. Congress could solve this problem by passing a law that requires the president to get that kind of approval for nuclear launches, and challenging Biden to sign it rather than veto it. That makes more sense if one is concerned not just about one particular president but all presidents. If all that this letter produces is an internal policy change requiring three fingers on the button, it might only last as long as this particular presidency does. The very kind of president that creates this concern would be the least likely to adopt that as a voluntary restriction, in fact.

The idea is probably long overdue. The letter itself, with its pleading for Biden to “install additional checks and balances into the system,” only serves to remind us how flabby and inconsequential Congress has made itself, a status for which both parties are to blame. Congress is supposed to be the checks and balances for the executive itself. Instead, its members spend their time avoiding any consequential votes, engaging instead in performance-art stunts, while begging the executive and the courts to do the jobs assigned to them by the Constitution. This is an excellent time and opportunity for Congress to put aside the clown show and get back to its place as a co-equal branch in governance.
 

db cooper

Resident Secret Squirrel
The committee approach, as in group think, which is typical lib. So a group of three or more people are to get together and decide if there should be a retaliation against incoming missiles that were just launched, and to be in Wash DC in 20 minutes? If they live in the targeted area they will all be dead before they get together, even if by secure phone there could be issues.

I see their point, Bai Den is too incompetent.
 
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db cooper

Resident Secret Squirrel
I thought there was a 2 man rule for launching to prevent launching without a reason. Sounds like they want to control it or know Biden is unstable
My understanding is the people that actually do the launching at the launch control center, once given the order, also need permission from a sister launch center. I also believe they need electronic permission from a higher HQ.

I used to do water treatment work at those places and was told how it was done, but that's yeeaaaaars ago. It was interesting learning about that stuff. I learned the reason we had so many missiles is that the initial guidance systems of the 60's was such that a missile would likely land within 10 miles of it's target. Today it's within feet, thus fewer are needed. Also multiple war head missiles, once they get near their target, the war heads are launched and can find their individual targets within a reasonable distance.

We drive by active silos on our way to a major town to shop, and I often think what it would be like to see the door blow off a silo, fire and smoke start to rise, a missile slowly exiting, and then gaining speed with awesome acceleration, heading off into the wild blue yonder. At which point it would be time to kiss my ass goodbye, for the likely hood of incoming would be quite great as in the early days each launch area was a target of the USSR, maybe it still is today. We live 50 miles from the closest launch center, which is far enough to survive, I think.
 

Weps

Veteran Member
My understanding is the people that actually do the launching at the launch control center, once given the order, also need permission from a sister launch center. I also believe they need electronic permission from a higher HQ.

If memory serves launch orders are received in the format of an EAM (Emergency Action Message), transmitted through a slew of means; UHF SATCOM, EHF Milstar, HFGCS, VLF/LF, ect... collectively known as the MEECN (Minimum Essential Emergency Communications Network), orders are confirmed and authenticated by each LCC via alpha numerical OTC cards and by confirming the EAMs electronic signature as having arrived from the proper authority while the system also confirms that sister LCCs have received the same EAM to ensure the orders are authentic, as well as to ensure that sole LCC isn't receiving rouge orders from a malicious source in poccession of authentic codes.

Every EAM contains details of preplanned MAO (Major Attack Options and LAO (Limited Attack Options) as outlined in OPLAN 8044 and that data is loaded into the guidance systems via code.

All cryptocraphic matieral for EAM authentication is secured using a myriad of PALs (Permissive Action Link) to ensure the "two-man rule" is maintained, this requires both LCs to input their lock code or provide their key for the lockbox.

It's physically impossible for a sole LC to launch, even if in possession of the others LCs key and having forced them to authentic; consoles are spaced apart further than is possible for a human to reach and launch keys are required to be turned and held in position as their mechanism is spring loaded or in the case of the press button system required to be held in the depressed position until the launch sequence is underway.
 
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raven

TB Fanatic
What they mean is they want Nancy to initiate a Nuclear War
There has never been a time when so many people failed to realize their imminent need for a fallout shelter.
 

Dobbin

Faithful Steed
If this comes to pass we're gonna need a shiteload of footballs!!
So would this group of decision-makers be called a "huddle?"

And would the huddle include members of the opposite team? And do they get decision input into the play which the Quarter-President will run?

Or maybe as a group they will simply "take a knee" to the American Flag?

"We decided America is simply too "unwoke" to be worth saving and corrupt to its slave holding originator's foundational vision. We discarded American votes in the last election, we're doing what we can to kill the American economic engine, and were suppressing American thought and opinion wherever and however we can. So this play we're going to keep the Hail Mary to ourselves, and let the opponents win because their system is so much more profitable to us."

Dobbin
 
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Daytonabill0001

Wheat or Tare, which are you?
I thought there was a 2 man rule for launching to prevent launching without a reason. Sounds like they want to control it or know Biden is unstable
That was my first thought.
On another point, this would eviscerate the CiC's Constitutional duty for complete control of our defenses as required, future and more destructive weapons included...
Yeah, "groupthink", just another name for two wolves and a lamb deciding what's for dinner...
 

Jeff B.

Don’t let the Piss Ants get you down…
I know the “football”deal came about because of the need for quick and massive retaliation in the days of the USSR.

Even though the circumstances have changed, moving to a “committee” basis would leave us vulnerable to attack, and once the “committee” hashed out the response, it could well be no response depending on where we’d been hit.

Maybe some change is needed, but not change that will make us incapable of a quick response.

Jeff B.
 

20Gauge

TB Fanatic
I thought there was a 2 man rule for launching to prevent launching without a reason. Sounds like they want to control it or know Biden is unstable
One man at the Presidential level to order the launch, but 2 man to actually launch. At least that was what we were taught when I was younger.
 

db cooper

Resident Secret Squirrel
Just who do they think he is gonna nuke? China?
Wouldn't it just be terrible if Bai Den's masters told him to "Nuke The Red States, NOW!"
And Bai Den got confused and gave the order to nuke Red China instead.
 

db cooper

Resident Secret Squirrel
If memory serves launch orders are received in the format of an EAM (Emergency Action Message), transmitted through a slew of means; UHF SATCOM, EHF Milstar, HFGCS, VLF/LF, ect... collectively known as the MEECN (Minimum Essential Emergency Communications Network), orders are confirmed and authenticated by each LCC via alpha numerical OTC cards and by confirming the EAMs electronic signature as having arrived from the proper authority while the system also confirms that sister LCCs have received the same EAM to ensure the orders are authentic, as well as to ensure that sole LCC isn't receiving rouge orders from a malicious source in poccession of authentic codes.

Every EAM contains details of preplanned MAO (Major Attack Options and LAO (Limited Attack Options) as outlined in OPLAN 8044 and that data is loaded into the guidance systems via code.

All cryptocraphic matieral for EAM authentication is secured using a myriad of PALs (Permissive Action Link) to ensure the "two-man rule" is maintained, this requires both LCs to input their lock code or provide their key for the lockbox.

It's physically impossible for a sole LC to launch, even if in possession of the others LCs key and having forced them to authentic; consoles are spaced apart further than is possible for a human to reach and launch keys are required to be turned and held in position as their mechanism is spring loaded or in the case of the press button system required to be held in the depressed position until the launch sequence is underway.
I would say your memory account is much closer to accurate than mine.
 

db cooper

Resident Secret Squirrel
The next war will be over before most even know it started.
The TV show "Jericho" comes to mind. So does the movie "Omega Man". The various zombie shows too. All with regards to surviving the unsurvivable when people come around trying to kill you for your stash.

When I tell people where we live, many say "I never heard of that place before". I'm always pleased to hear that.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
So what’s the fun explanation? Via Twitchy and Twitter pal Aaron Walker, Democrats are worried that Biden’s mentis is too non compos to trust with the football:

yeah things are going to get real interesting, hence all of the EO's right now cause camel toe may have to fight to push EO's through.
 

SSTemplar

Veteran Member
Doesn't matter. If anyone was foolish enough to push the button. 75% of the bombs would not get in the air. 75% of those would not get to there target and 80% of those would not go boom. I'm being conservative. The rest of the nuclear countries are worse off then us. The propaganda is what's killing you.
 

AlfaMan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Well this ought to get interesting if it picks up any steam......

Posted for fair use.....

Say, why are House Dems calling on Biden to give up full control of nuclear weapons?

Ed Morrissey
Posted at 6:01 pm on February 23, 2021

Which answer do you want first — the fun answer, or the better answer? Let’s start off with the fun answer, but first, let’s specify precisely what House Democrats want from Joe Biden. A letter signed by three dozen of his party’s caucus urges the new president to relinquish full control over the country’s nuclear weapons in favor of a committee approach:

See Also: Who’s ready for Hillary Clinton’s new book… a political thriller?



So what’s the fun explanation? Via Twitchy and Twitter pal Aaron Walker, Democrats are worried that Biden’s mentis is too non compos to trust with the football:

View: https://twitter.com/AaronWorthing/status/1364257385070661633?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1364257385070661633%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fhotair.com%2Farchives%2Fed-morrissey%2F2021%2F02%2F23%2Fsay-house-dems-calling-biden-give-full-control-nuclear-weapons%2F


Weeeellllll
, that’s good for a laugh. The letter puts it quite differently, however. The reference to “past presidents” is obviously a veiled reference to Donald Trump. And that veil doesn’t even extend as far as the footnotes, where a link to Trump’s supposed “threat” to nuke North Korea matches up with a recollection from former SecDef James Schlesinger about his concerns over Richard Nixon’s stability in the final days of his doomed presidency. There’s also a reference to Nancy Pelosi’s demand to remove the football from Trump after the January 6 Capitol riot, a demand which went nowhere in large part because Pelosi didn’t intend it as anything more than a stunt.

As an attempt to fix a problem before it arises (arguably, again), it’s not a bad idea, considering both the massive consequences of leaving control of the nuclear stockpile in one person’s hands and the constitutional requirement for Congress to authorize war. What happens when that one person turns out to be unstable, either as a permanent feature of his/her personality or as the result of some physical or mental crisis? Just because that hasn’t become an acute problem so far doesn’t mean that it won’t be at some point. Asking for more consensus around that decision seems to be a reasonable request, especially since the retaliatory strike will have its disincentivizing impact on a nuclear aggressor no matter when those missiles launch. Asking a Democratic president to resolve this risk makes more sense for fellow Democrats, as it doesn’t imply any partisan hostilities as a motive.

However, why does Congress need to ask? Congress doesn’t exist as an advisory board to the executive — it passes its own laws and negotiates with the executive on a co-equal basis. Congress could solve this problem by passing a law that requires the president to get that kind of approval for nuclear launches, and challenging Biden to sign it rather than veto it. That makes more sense if one is concerned not just about one particular president but all presidents. If all that this letter produces is an internal policy change requiring three fingers on the button, it might only last as long as this particular presidency does. The very kind of president that creates this concern would be the least likely to adopt that as a voluntary restriction, in fact.

The idea is probably long overdue. The letter itself, with its pleading for Biden to “install additional checks and balances into the system,” only serves to remind us how flabby and inconsequential Congress has made itself, a status for which both parties are to blame. Congress is supposed to be the checks and balances for the executive itself. Instead, its members spend their time avoiding any consequential votes, engaging instead in performance-art stunts, while begging the executive and the courts to do the jobs assigned to them by the Constitution. This is an excellent time and opportunity for Congress to put aside the clown show and get back to its place as a co-equal branch in governance.


Thank you for possibly putting a puzzle piece together.
 

Grumphau

Veteran Member
Hm, this should seriously cripple the retaliatory capability of the US nuclear forces should the need ever arise. I'm sure this kinder, gentler approach will dissuade our enemies from a first strike for sire. Meanwhile our enemies are getting more and more dangerous, strengthening their militaries and perhaps even shortening decision loops.

I'm reminded of a WW2 manual on sabotage that mentioned one technique for an agent to hobble to an enemy from the inside: have every decision referred to a committee.

Not only that, but if this really is about Trump, he was more of am isolationist than any Democrat I can remember. How many wars did he start again? Oh yeah, zero.
 

MinnesotaSmith

Membership Revoked
Maybe what the behind-the-scenes HNICs really want is for Harris to be way farther away from the red button? I recall one particularly devastating argument against Hillary becoming President was who would want a person with a life history of decades of PMS having control over nuclear weapons. Add in her being a women who's had sex with large enough numbers of men to have contempt for or even hate them all, and Harris + the suitcase starts to look like a VERY scary combination.
 

ShadowMan

Designated Grumpy Old Fart
IF he can't be trusted with the Football then he should be sitting in the Oval Office. And the last thing we need is a bunch of demon-O-CRAPTIC MORONS wanting to debate what to do when missiles are inbound. That's all we need is a bunch of communist liberal second guessing shitte in an emergency situation......."Oh how to we FEEL about launching a retaliatory strike.....after we're all dead?"
 

AlfaMan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Maybe what the behind-the-scenes HNICs really want is for Harris to be way farther away from the red button? I recall one particularly devastating argument against Hillary becoming President was who would want a person with a life history of decades of PMS having control over nuclear weapons. Add in her being a women who's had sex with large enough numbers of men to have contempt for or even hate them all, and Harris + the suitcase starts to look like a VERY scary combination.

Is the whore menopausal, or post menopausal? Her and the suitcase and the emotional roller coaster of the change of life....
That takes scary to a whole other level.

:hof:
 
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