TECH Google Creations "AI" to Distribute Wealth in America

Melodi

Disaster Cat
I wasn't sure if this should go under Tech or WTF? But I put it in tech anyway. This is disturbing, because several commentators I follow, including Catherin Austin Fitz, have been wondering for some time if one reason for the "Elites" wackier policies is because they have been listening to an AI Computer and trying to implement its program suggestions? I have no idea, but this article does not give me the warm fuzzies. (note: one illustration is included because it seems important to the article).

Google’s ‘Democratic AI’ Is Better at Redistributing Wealth Than America
Researchers built an AI that gives out money based on who started with less resources—and humans preferred it.
Janus Rose
By Janus Rose
NEW YORK, US
07 July 2022, 2:00pm


It’s no secret that the overwhelming majority of wealth in the United States is concentrated at the very top, creating staggering levels of poverty and inequality that vastly outpace other supposedly “wealthy” nations. But while the current political system ensures that this upward extraction of wealth continues, AI researchers have begun playing with a fascinating question: is machine learning better equipped than humans to create a society that divides resources more equitably?

The answer, according to a recent paper published in Nature from researchers at Google’s DeepMind, seems to be yes—at least, as far as the study’s participants are concerned.

The paper describes a series of experiments where a deep neural network was tasked with divvying up resources in a more equitable way that humans preferred. The humans participated in an online economic game—called a “public goods game” in economics—where each round they would choose whether to keep a monetary endowment, or contribute a chosen amount of coins into a collective fund. These funds would then be returned to the players under three different redistribution schemes based on different human economic systems—and one additional scheme created entirely by the AI, called the Human Centered Redistribution Mechanism (HCRM). The humans would then vote to decide which system they preferred.

It turns out, the distribution scheme created by the AI was the one preferred by the majority of participants. While strict libertarian and egalitarian systems split the returns based on things like how much each player contributed, the AI’s system redistributed wealth in a way that specifically addressed the advantages and disadvantages players had at the start of the game—and ultimately won them over as the preferred method in a majoritarian vote.

“Pursuing a broadly liberal egalitarian policy, [HCRM] sought to reduce pre-existing income disparities by compensating players in proportion to their contribution relative to endowment,” the paper’s authors wrote. “In other words, rather than simply maximizing efficiency, the mechanism was progressive: it promoted enfranchisement of those who began the game at a wealth disadvantage, at the expense of those with higher initial endowment.”
1657134494886-4156220221383fig1html.jpeg

Figures from Google's research paper illustrating an economics game where players contribute coins into a public fund.
FIGURES FROM GOOGLE'S RESEARCH PAPER ILLUSTRATING AN ECONOMICS GAME WHERE PLAYERS CONTRIBUTE COINS INTO A PUBLIC FUND.

The methods differ from a lot of AI projects, which focus on establishing an authoritative “ground truth” model of reality that is used to make decisions—and in doing so, firmly embeds the bias of its creators.

“In AI research, there is a growing realization that to build human-compatible systems, we need new research methods in which humans and agents interact, and an increased effort to learn values directly from humans to build value-aligned AI,” the researchers wrote. “Instead of imbuing our agents with purportedly human values a priori, and thus potentially biasing systems towards the preferences of AI researchers, we train them to maximize a democratic objective: to design policies that humans prefer and thus will vote to implement in a majoritarian election.”

Of course, we don’t need an AI to show us that more sustainable ways of living are possible. On a smaller scale, mutual aid and community organizations that redistribute resources have existed forever. So has scientific evidence showing that—contrary to the dogma of hyper-competitive capitalism—human beings are naturally predisposed toward cooperation, sharing, and collective prosperity.

While the AI’s system was preferred by human participants, that doesn’t necessarily mean it would equitably satisfy the needs of humans on a larger scale. The researchers are also quick to point out that the experiments are not a radical proposal for AI-based governance, but a framework for future research on how AI could intervene in public policy.

“This is fundamental research asking questions about how an AI can be aligned with a whole group of humans and how to model and represent humans in simulations, explored in a toy domain,” Jan Balaguer, a DeepMind researcher who co-authored the paper, told Motherboard. “Many of the problems that humans face are not merely technological but require us to coordinate in society and in our economies for the greater good. For AI to be able to help, it needs to learn directly about human values.”
 

coalcracker

Veteran Member
There is that word again, “sustainable.” It sounds so nice, doesn’t it? They want to save Mother Earth by killing off us human vermin.

Oh, Georgia Guidestones? No such thing. That is a conspiracy theory, fake news. Where are these big granite stones? Right! They don’t exist. You can’t prove it. Those photo shopped images? Ha, ha, ha!

You can only trust Google, you dumb little Earth vermin! Listen to your AI overlords!

Welcome to the Machine. AI is running the “How to destroy 7.5 BILLION humans” program.
 

LoupGarou

Ancient Fuzzball
Or, "We are going communist, and if it doesn't work out well, we can now blame it on a computer running AI". After all, if billions die and THEY are left owning everything (wink wink), THEY can just blame the computer instead of themselves and pull the plug on it and keep going with their plans... And they get away free and clear because it was "voted on" (remember Dominion?...).
 

raven

TB Fanatic
when you start with the wrong question, you get communism every time.

to create a society that divides resources more equitably

one should notice that society itself is the mechanism that creates inequity to begin with.

and the methodology?

they would choose whether to keep a monetary endowment, or contribute a chosen amount of coins into a collective fund.

what, pray tell, is this "monetary endowment"? Is this your paycheck?
and the collective fund . . . would be the IRS through taxes perhaps?
and whom is making the decision on the "chosen amount"? Joe Biden, Soros, Schwab, Pelosi
who is going to choose to give up part of their "endowment" over bying a new boat? that is just crazy talk.

these kinds of questions is how we got men thinking they could be women -
 

Dobbin

Faithful Steed
the AI’s system redistributed wealth in a way that specifically addressed the advantages and disadvantages players had at the start of the game
Um. So some machine "weighed" one's advantage against another? How is this possible without first identifying advantages and separating them from disadvantages (the distinction may be VERY close or non-existent) and then estimating the "degree" of the two each participant embodied.

What is an advantage to you MIGHT be a disadvantage to another - and how can the machine possibly know one from another?

One considers the "small print" often contained in financial analysis: "This analysis contains 'forward looking statements' and is not considered to be definitive or all inclusive." But they do any anyway.

It sounds VERY arbitrary - and well prone to the programmers inherent value system. Those start with "0" and "1" and draw distinctions in ever widening logical circles apparently to the point of telling you what you should be or what you should want in this case.

It all sounds VERY human and not "artificial intelligence" at all.

Yunno - that "domination" thing.

Dobbin
 

PghPanther

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Give everyone fish.......don't bother to have anyone learn how to fish.

No more fish for anyone.........

Instead teach everyone to fish..........................then no more fish left to fish.

Humanity as a problem no matter how you look at it............

AI has a solution...................

Human extinction.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
There is that word again, “sustainable.” It sounds so nice, doesn’t it? They want to save Mother Earth by killing off us human vermin.

Oh, Georgia Guidestones? No such thing. That is a conspiracy theory, fake news. Where are these big granite stones? Right! They don’t exist. You can’t prove it. Those photo shopped images? Ha, ha, ha!

You can only trust Google, you dumb little Earth vermin! Listen to your AI overlords!

Welcome to the Machine. AI is running the “How to destroy 7.5 BILLION humans” program.
There were a couple of TV shows/series on that theme - the one I remember best was "After People" showing the Earth healing itself & gradually pulling down structures - pretty much everything man-made - and regenerating forests & prairies. Oddly there was a resurgence of predator & prey animals mixed in.

The clear suggestion was 4-500 years without the infestation known as mankind would see Mother Earth on a clear path to total recovery, probably attainable in a couple of millennia.

I thought all living bleeding things were God's creation. Granted, we have not always been on the right path but that's that annoying free will thing.
 

Bps1691

Veteran Member
when you start with the wrong question, you get communism every time.

what, pray tell, is this "monetary endowment"? Is this your paycheck?
and the collective fund . . . would be the IRS through taxes perhaps?
and whom is making the decision on the "chosen amount"? Joe Biden, Soros, Schwab, Pelosi
who is going to choose to give up part of their "endowment" over bying a new boat? that is just crazy talk.

these kinds of questions is how we got men thinking they could be women -

You hit the nail square on the head.

The biggest "endowment" for me when I started the real game of life was a family tribe that loved me and worked their asses off to not only ensure their basic needs through hard work and interactions among the family "tribe" members but to push the next generation up the ladder.

My tribe had started poor and each generation raised the next up at least one step on the ladder.

All of my grand parents only finished 8th grade. An improvement over the previous generation who ended school when they were old enough to work and make income for the family. My male grand parents all started by getting full time jobs when they were 14-15 years old. My female grand parents also were put into useful work within the tribal families. Both sets were married by 18. They worked hard and by the time my parents came along, pushed them and funded them to the point they graduated High School.

Please note that all of the previous generation went through the great depression and world war II. All of them worked hard and made their own advantages. None got rich but each of the generations had built the base one or more steps up the ladder and had made good choices. None of them blamed the things the world threw at them as "not fair" and demanded someone else pay their way. None ever took nor needed public welfare, got pregnant out of wedlock, were addicts, or ever got into trouble with the law.

I was the first in my entire tribe to graduate from college. Granted I worked full time as I worked my way through my initial degree. My tribe members helped and it was a group effort. All of my siblings and cousins went into the trades. All of my generation were supported and brought up with a strong work ethic, as saved Christians with a moral compass and made good life choices. None became drug addicts or drunks. None got into trouble with the law. None got anyone pregnant or got pregnant until after they reached adulthood and were making their way through the world.

So now, my generation became what used to be thought off as middle class. We've pushed our own children up the ladder one more step (almost all graduated college with honest to goodness in demand degrees, the rest went into the skilled trades). None had college debt. Between what their parents supplied, by their working all through school and in several cases scholarships in academics and sports, they ended up free in clear with job offers at graduation.

So here we are now, with those who push this "re-distribution" crap trying to destroy the strong family tribes and put us all back into the past's Master and serfs dictatorship model.

Look at who is pushing this crap, its the politicos, the ubber-rich and those from life long academia. They have never lived in the real world or faced the day to day struggles to not only earn the basic needs but to expand opportunities for their children.

They create the underclasses and have destroyed the structures of a strong family unit, hard work and even have turned a good education into indoctrination in the time proven failed leftist mantra.

It's really simple, they hate us and are demon driven to destroy it all for the sake of their true master.
 

raven

TB Fanatic
If AI were to redistribute wealth, they would start with the Rockefellers and Heinz and work their way down the ladder to Zuckerberg and Musk and Kerry and Pelosi . . . redistributing wealth to the homeless.

Instead, you see the redistribution starting in the Middle class, redistributing wealth to the rich.

Do not listen to what they say, listen to what they do.
They do not need AI to do what they say they want to do.
They don't even need laws.
They have they money - they could simply DO IT - no one is stopping them.
 

ktrapper

Veteran Member
You hit the nail square on the head.

The biggest "endowment" for me when I started the real game of life was a family tribe that loved me and worked their asses off to not only ensure their basic needs through hard work and interactions among the family "tribe" members but to push the next generation up the ladder.

My tribe had started poor and each generation raised the next up at least one step on the ladder.

All of my grand parents only finished 8th grade. An improvement over the previous generation who ended school when they were old enough to work and make income for the family. My male grand parents all started by getting full time jobs when they were 14-15 years old. My female grand parents also were put into useful work within the tribal families. Both sets were married by 18. They worked hard and by the time my parents came along, pushed them and funded them to the point they graduated High School.

Please note that all of the previous generation went through the great depression and world war II. All of them worked hard and made their own advantages. None got rich but each of the generations had built the base one or more steps up the ladder and had made good choices. None of them blamed the things the world threw at them as "not fair" and demanded someone else pay their way. None ever took nor needed public welfare, got pregnant out of wedlock, were addicts, or ever got into trouble with the law.

I was the first in my entire tribe to graduate from college. Granted I worked full time as I worked my way through my initial degree. My tribe members helped and it was a group effort. All of my siblings and cousins went into the trades. All of my generation were supported and brought up with a strong work ethic, as saved Christians with a moral compass and made good life choices. None became drug addicts or drunks. None got into trouble with the law. None got anyone pregnant or got pregnant until after they reached adulthood and were making their way through the world.

So now, my generation became what used to be thought off as middle class. We've pushed our own children up the ladder one more step (almost all graduated college with honest to goodness in demand degrees, the rest went into the skilled trades). None had college debt. Between what their parents supplied, by their working all through school and in several cases scholarships in academics and sports, they ended up free in clear with job offers at graduation.

So here we are now, with those who push this "re-distribution" crap trying to destroy the strong family tribes and put us all back into the past's Master and serfs dictatorship model.

Look at who is pushing this crap, its the politicos, the ubber-rich and those from life long academia. They have never lived in the real world or faced the day to day struggles to not only earn the basic needs but to expand opportunities for their children.

They create the underclasses and have destroyed the structures of a strong family unit, hard work and even have turned a good education into indoctrination in the time proven failed leftist mantra.

It's really simple, they hate us and are demon driven to destroy it all for the sake of their true master.
That’s a tribe right there you can hang your hat on.

The times that are upon us now is not for the lone wolf type. They might make it for a while until they dont. You need your tribe to be able to resist. A tribe has each other’s back.
 

drafter

Veteran Member
Problem is it’s focused on how to allocate resources but not very focused on how well those resources are managed after the fact. It may be racist but the AI needs to understand that giving a white guy 10k and a black guy 10k is going to result in two very different outcomes in terms of benefits to society.
 

LoupGarou

Ancient Fuzzball
...
Look at who is pushing this crap, its the politicos, the ubber-rich and those from life long academia. They have never lived in the real world or faced the day to day struggles to not only earn the basic needs but to expand opportunities for their children.
...

If you look at what the 90% of the top politicians in the country have done, they have definitely "expanded the opportunities for their children" (Hunter for example)...
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
I can tell you having very wealthy people building large pricy estates on eastern Long Island N.Y. and greatly effect what you pay in taxes on the small postal stamp sized parcel of land with a home you have.
These estates keep going up in asking price and it effects all the working class that live in eastern Suffolk county on the island. Buying land or real estate on the eastern Long Island is a bad investment it will cost you a lot in taxes and today you get very little in return for what's paid out in taxes.
 

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
WHO DO YOU THINK BUILT THE EMPIRE STATE BUILDING? The Trump towers, The RAILROADS? THE AUTOMOBILE COMPANIES? The Huge Hotels? The Casinos? Skyscrapers? Tbe Walmarts? The Krogers.? Private money, Lots of it, From RICH PEOPLE WILLING TO TAKE A RISK WITH IT!
When everything is distributed "eqitably" who tthe hell is going to build the Disneylands? The government?

YOU DUMMIES, , YOU CAN TAKE ALL THE MONEY FROM THE RICH AND THEN WHAT.? YOU LIVE LIKE A KING FOR A YEAR OR TWO THEN YOU GO BACK TO BEING POOR WHEN THAT MONEY RUNS OUT? Then there's no rich people, nobody with money to build anything big, or even keep it running!

The government has no money except what it steals from the citizens in ever increasing taxes!
 
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Heliobas Disciple

TB Fanatic
There already is an AI in existence that is controlling wealth. But it's mostly a secret. Don't let the article about a theoretical AI distract you from what's already out there and being used. The one is use though is making the rich richer. It most definitely is not a communist program, quite the contrary. It's called Aladdin. And it controls 21 TRILLION DOLLARS of the global economy.

Here's a video to get you started if you want to learn more

This Robot Already Owns Everything (And it's just getting started) : Blackrock Aladdin
7 min 54 sec

Blackrock has a secret weapon that has made it the most powerful company in the world: Aladdin. If you're ever wondered how Artificial Intelligence could impact our lives, here's the answer. Aladdin is the brainchild of Larry Fink, and it already controls more assets than the GDP than the US. It's growing by $1 trillion to $2 trillion new assets in its control each year. This is the story of Aladdin, and how it - and Blackrock - took over Wall Street.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWBRldjVzuM
 
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