dairy products...back to basics

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breezyhill

Veteran Member
hi

we've cooked from scratch for many years and years ago we used to buy soooo many dairy products from the grocery store. if you think about it as a category, there's a lot of stuff under that heading.

milk...butter...buttermilk...sour cream...cottage cheese...yogurt...cheese...half&half...kefir...cream

about five years ago we found neighbors who have dairy cows and goats and started buying raw milk. taking things one at a time we learned how to make our own dairy products from the raw cow and goats milk. i have to say that making the butter is the only one that really interests my husband, he likes the "manuel" part of the manual separator, ... :) ...although he will lend a hand if asked for the other things.

we started by learning how to make butter. we bought a manual cream separator off ebay for 99 dollars...and it has an attachment for making butter, too.

then i bought a yogurt maker for 4 dollars at a flea market.

then i bought a cheese press at the flea market for 2 dollars.

so on and so on...

anyway, it's been five years now and I have to say that it's been enjoyable learning how to make all of these things. mostly we have learned by trial and error...and the stories about the errors, well, there are some things that the chickens even looked at funny... :)

has anyone else been on a similar quest? by the way, these things are really enjoyable if you liked to play with your food when you were little. :)

breezyhill
 
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Deena in GA

Administrator
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Oh, how I envy you! We would LOVE to be able to buy raw milk and make the things you do. Congratulations!! Can't even find raw milk around here to drink, which would be wonderful.
 
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breezyhill

Veteran Member
deana,

sometimes raw milk is hard to find because it's not really kosher to sell it. all milk, according to some stupid law, has to be pasteurized.

if you have a health food store near you, they might know of a source. it's almost like, you have to know someone that trusts you before they will tell you a source. some states you can buy raw milk, but it's done under the guise of "pet food".

if you are in a rural area, or near a rural area, check and see if there are any amish or mennonite communities. they are most likely to have goats and dairy cows.

it's there, you just have to find it.

have you ever made butter?

breezyhill
 
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Gingergirl

Veteran Member
Breezy,
I too envy your source. We've not been here long enough to get "connected" beyond our suburb. However, I have pressed on, and begun making cheese. With the gardening and canning, I leave the dairy work till winter.

For the most part, I make cheese. (Yogurt has almost become a given, brain dead kinda thing.) The flavor is very different from store-bought and very addictive. The texture is also very different. I really like it. It is very time comsuming, as I have to watch the temps in the process like a mother hen. Prehaps with time and experience, I'll get better at it.

What kind of cheese do you make?
 
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breezyhill

Veteran Member
gingergirl

the cheeses i started out with were plain, what you would call farmer's cheese, out of the goat and cow milks. then i went on to cheddar and colby. i have ordered some starters from Hoeggers to be able to try motzerella and some of the more exotic cheeses, but some of that involves coating the cheese with paraffin wax, and that's just a bit too much, right now. maybe in the winter when the garden and canning isn't so demanding. :)

the cheese made with goat milk is always stronger in taste. there's something about heating the goat milk that does it. but i prefer to drink goat milk. it's easier to digest.

when you make yogurt, do you raise the temp to 150...or some number up there...and then bring it down to 110? if you do you can eliminate that first step and just heat the milk to 110 before adding your starter or previousy made yogurt. i think the initial first step is to pasteurize the milk, which would be redundant if you are starting with pasteurized milk in the first place.

how do you do yours? also, do you do yours in the oven, or do you have a yogurt maker?

breezyhill

p.s.: i'm taking my computer into the shop tomorrow and might not have it back for a week or so. i'll look up this thread when I get it back.
 
F

Freeholdfarm

Inactive
If you are interested in raw milk, check the RealMilk website. They have a list of state regs and also some producers listed. Some states DO allow sales of raw milk, if you can find a producer. New Hampshire (where I used to live) allows sales of up to five gallons a day, no advertising and customer must pick up at the farm and use his own container. Same here in Oregon except you are allowed to sell milk from up to nine milking does or two cows -- which could add up to a lot more milk than NH allows, if you have good milkers. There are other states with similar regulations. So it may just be a matter of finding a producer.

I'm making kefir and have been making a soft cheese from it which we really like. Kefir has the advantages of: not needing the milk to be pasteurized first (I swap the kefir grains from a 'done' jar to a jar of fresh warm milk when I come in from milking); not needing strict temperature control -- room temp is fine. If it is warm it will work faster, if cool it will work slower, but it always works! My daughter doesn't like straight kefir, but will eat it in a smoothie or vanilla milk (dash of vanilla, spoonfull of sugar in a tall glass of milk or kefir, stir well). It is an acquired taste, and interesting to stir the jar after I've removed the grains and watch the kefir fizz like soda or champagne! :D

To make kefir cheese, you need a quart or two of kefir that is at least 36 hours old, with the grains removed of course. Line a colander or a cheese mold with thin muslin/real cheesecloth (not the gauzy stuff sold at the grocery stores). Set the lined mold into a larger bowl with something under the mold to keep it up out of the whey that will drain off the cheese. I use a small rack that came with Grandma's little rice cooker. (All items need to be VERY clean, of course.) Pour the kefir into the lined mold and gently lay the surplus muslin over the top to keep dust and flies out (we have critters, so we have flies). I leave it sit out on the countertop all day to drain, emptying the whey into a quart jar every so often, as the little rack under the cheese mold isn't very tall. Then I put it in the frig and leave it there for another 12-24 hours to finish draining. It's a tart cheese, good with a little salt and garlic powder mixed in. You can stop the process at any stage if it has gotten to the texture you want. Earlier will be softer, later will be harder. I do have a cheese press, but haven't tried pressing and aging any of this cheese yet -- that will have to wait for cooler weather and a larger milk supply (my little Kinder doe is only giving about a quart and a half a day right now).

I've made ice cream from goat milk before, and it turned out very well. Just used the whole milk. We don't have a cream separator, so all the goat butter I've made was a couple of tablespoons one time. But my father and grandfather had a dairy when I was little, and one of my brothers and my chores was to shake the quart jar half full of cream to make butter. It works just fine, so you don't really need a fancy butter churn. Just make sure the cream is room temperature before you start.

Kathleen
 
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Gingergirl

Veteran Member
Breezy,

I shamefully admit to liking my yogurt thick. Tried milk with powdered milk to thicken (as recommended on some site) but the taste was umpalatable. Then I found a source for powdered WHOLE milk. It makes a great yogurt, and is a standard in our rotated preps. I only bring it up to 110 (not very exact at that), add some from the previous batch, and put it into a warmed thermos. Works like a charm.

I've made cottage, farmers, feta, and cheddar. The feta was not so good. Maybe it needs goats milk. I have purchased the cultures, etc. to try a swiss type this fall.
I never get to age them long enough before we break down and just go ahead and eat them. My equipment has only a two gallon capacity, takes all day, and production is far below consumption. I dream of having enough on hand to actually be able to select a well aged cheese. I've heard its good to dream.

Freehold,

I've never tried kefir...an aquired taste?
I will check out RealMilk. Thanks.
 
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Gingergirl

Veteran Member
Freehold,

I checked out RealMilk and out of 6 places listed for our state, there is a share-a-cow program listed on the other side of town...less than 25 minutes. So, I'll have to give them a call on Monday and see what they have. Thanks and I'll let you know how it turns out.
 
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Freeholdfarm

Inactive
You're welcome, Gingergirl, and I hope it works out for you! I don't know what state you are in, but if someone is in a state that does allow sales of raw milk, but can't find a producer, check with the agricultural extension agents and see if they know of any goat breeders near you (you can look for cow dairies, too). Then call the breeders and see if they know anyone who sells milk off the farm. Goat people, especially, tend to know each other, so you may have the best luck with word of mouth.

There is at least one web site and a couple of lists about kefir if anyone is interested. If you want to try it, get on one of the lists and ask if anyone has kefir grains to sell -- the grains grow and after a while you have enough to share with someone else. A lot of kefir-makers like to share their excess grains rather than dumping them, so will often sell them for the price of postage. I've gotten grains twice this way. Grains from different sources will vary in the flavor of kefir they make (they are kind of like wild yeast sourdoughs), so you might want to try grains from more than one person. I really like the ones I have now, but the ones I had in NH were only so-so. And yes, it is an acquired taste! Tangy, fizzy, yeasty, slightly curdled milk!

Kathleen
 
S

Shep

Contributing Member
breezyhill said:
gingergirl



when you make yogurt, do you raise the temp to 150...or some number up there...and then bring it down to 110? if you do you can eliminate that first step and just heat the milk to 110 before adding your starter or previousy made yogurt. i think the initial first step is to pasteurize the milk, which would be redundant if you are starting with pasteurized milk in the first place.

how do you do yours? also, do you do yours in the oven, or do you have a yogurt maker?

breezyhill

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Click to expand...


Breezyhill,

You HAVE to raise the milk temperature to at least 160 degrees for 10 minutes to pasturize the milk, OR you can raise it to 185 for just a second or two to flash pasturize it. This is done to kill any existing bacteria in the milk so that the lacto-bacteria of the yogurt can work and not conflict with any other bacteria. In other words, you are killing ALL bacteria in the milk and then re-adding the bacteria you want.

I use a yogurt maker to incubate the yogurt, but have incubated it in a warm wide-mouth thermos also.

Hope this helps.

Shep
 
B

breezyhill

Veteran Member
freehold farm,

about your kefir.....

i have tried several times to make kefir and only have succeeded a couple. the grains i got were from Hoeggers. this is what i've done...

activated the grains, per instructions

used fresh goat milk, dropped in kefir container thingy, and then...when i put it on top of refrigerator it gets too thick, almost like sour cream thick, and it doesn't fizz; or i put it in the cuboard where it doesn't do anything but sour.

is it just me? maybe the grains?

you mentioned sharing excess grains...would you be willing to do that, if you think that's the problem?

i'm taking my computer in for some work this afternoon. i'll check back before i unplug it.

thank you

breezyhill
 
F

Freeholdfarm

Inactive
Hi, breezyhill. I would be glad to share grains, but it will take a little while -- I just got these a couple of weeks ago. It will be maybe three or four months before they grow enough to split. If you want to try grains before then, you might want to ask on one of the kefir lists.

What size were the grains you got from Hoeggers? What I got (both times I've gotten grains from private parties) were lumps the size of a grape or bigger, with a cauliflower-like appearance. They came in milk, in insulated packages, and worked as soon as I put them in milk. Package arrived, put contents in fresh milk, in 24 hours had kefir. I have heard (but don't know first-hand) that commercially sold grains are more like dried, powdered grains, and they don't produce the same product. Store-bought kefir is made with those as they are more controllable and uniform.

I'm off to do chores and head for town.

Kathleen
 
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Dorema

Contributing Member
Ok Gang,
I need some help with aging cheeses.
I've made mozzarella, chevre' , and feta from goat milk and I am going to give gouda a try. What I really want is to get some cheddar going. I have made it before but it doesn't age well. usually molds under the wax OR my kids "sample" it until it is gone.
Any body got any tips for fixing a place with the proper temp and humidy to age cheese?

Dorema
 
juco

juco

Veteran Member
Dorema, I've heard that an old refridgerator can be used to age the hard cheeses. You can control the humidity somewhat by placing a bowl of water on the bottom shelf. This is just hear-say, I haven't tried it yet. Like you, I've processed other cheeses successfully (haven't tried gouda yet) but the whold thing of "aging" has held me back on the hard cheeses. The simple farmstead cheeses, I've kept in the bottom drawer of the fridge, but never longer than a month (they always get consumed :rolleyes: )
 
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Gingergirl

Veteran Member
Dorema,

I've also heard that a frig works fine. I've used the old one in the laundry room, but there isn't much room and we eat it before it really gets to age. I plan to get a cheap dorm size frig this winter.

For the mold,
Are you air drying the cheese so that a rind forms before waxing. While drying, wipe it once or twice a day with a barely damp cloth that was dipped in vinegar. I've also read that salt water will work too. This is to prevent the mold. Should be wiped again just before waxing. Also make sure there is good air flow around the cheese while it is drying. A rack works fine for me. I hope this helps. After all the sork to make the cheese its a disappointment to have it mold. (Although many are not upset with the mold and just cut it away.)
 
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