PREP BIG ANNOUNCEMENT: AS OF January 1st, No Berkey Products can be shipped to California

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
(We have received permission to post this in the Public Thread from HeliumAvid)

BIG ANNOUNCEMENT: AS OF January 1st, No Berkey Products can be shipped to California

The details are forthcoming, but as of the 1st of the year, None of the Berkey Water Purification Systems or Filters can be shipped to a California address.

New Laws are taking affect on the first of the year, and an official Statement from New Mellenium Concepts is coming any day now, that will outline the specific details. I have talked with them, but the official statement will explain the changes clearly.

Check back here and I will post the official statement when i receive it via email.

Feel free to call us with any questions.

Our website is: www.goberkey.com or http://www.directive21.com

theberkeyguy
 

Lone Wolf

Lives on TB
I have had a Big Berkey in service for several years now.

Berkey Guy.

Please post a result when you get one.

lw
 

Red Baron

Paleo-Conservative
_______________
Details on CA water treatment device certification

Certified Water Treatment Devices - Frequently Asked Questions

There are hundreds of California-certified drinking water treatment devices. Carbon filters are the most common type of device, typically sold in the form of counter top, faucet-mount or under counter models. Other types of technologies available include distillation, reverse-osmosis, ion-exchange, ceramic filter, and ultraviolet light.
When a manufacturer claims that a drinking water treatment device will reduce toxic chemicals or makes other health related performance claims, the device must be certified by the California Department of Public (CDPH) [Health & Safety Code Section 116830].


What does California Certification mean?

CDPH certification means that the device has been tested by an independent, state-approved laboratory (1) to verify the manufacturer's health-related performance claims, and (2) to ensure that materials within the device do not add contaminants to the treated water.


CDPH certifies devices for specific health claims such as:
  • "Reduces THMs, 2,4-D, DBCP, lindane, TCE, PCE" (examples of organic chemicals)
  • "Reduces lead, copper, mercury" (examples of heavy metals)
  • "Reduces bacteria, cysts, Giardia, Cryptosporidium, viruses" (examples of microbiological contaminants)
What does California Certification not cover?


All CDPH-certified water treatment devices are intended as supplemental treatment for municipally treated water. They are not intended for use on raw water, such as ditch water, lake or river water; nor are they intended to treat elevated levels of dangerous chemicals in ground water. CDPH does not regulate shower filters, sports bottles or outdoor recreation water filters. CDPH also does not regulate water softeners or water filters that make only aesthetic claims. Examples of aesthetic claims are claims to reduce taste and odor, including chlorine.
Independent and nationally recognized testing organizations National Sanitation Foundation (NSF), Water Quality Association (WQA) and Underwriter Laboratories (UL) evaluate and certify water treatment devices that meet minimum criteria for aesthetics claims under ANSI/NSF Standard 42.
Do I need a water treatment device?




You should consider the following when deciding if you need or want a home water treatment device:
  • Does anyone in your household have a compromised immune system (chemotherapy, transplant patient, HIV) that would require drinking water of a higher quality than is required by the general public? For more information, call the EPA Hotline 1-800-426-4791.
  • Are you concerned with taste, odor, appearance, chlorine content, high mineral content (total dissolved solids, TDS), or hardness only? These devices are not regulated by CDPH. However, NSF International, Water Quality Association and Underwriter Laboratories (independent testing organizations) do certify the performance of water treatment devices for aesthetic claims. Look for the NSF, UL or WQA mark on packaging, advertising and the Performance Data Sheet.
  • Are you concerned about contaminants that might affect your health? You can obtain information about your water quality (see below). If you believe that your water needs additional treatment, CDPH maintains a list of certified Water Treatment Devices in its directory.
How do I obtain information about my water quality?


The easiest place to get this information is from the annual report (Consumer Confidence Report) published by your water utility (usually included with your water bill). State regulations require each community water system to provide specific information on water quality to their customers.
If you are on a private well, ask your county environmental health department if it can provide any water quality information for your area. Your can also have your water tested by a private laboratory.

Do I need to test my water?

Generally not, as testing can be expensive. However, having your water tested will tell you whether there are unacceptably high levels of any tested contaminant. Laboratories that test water samples are listed in the Yellow Pages under "Laboratories - Analytical". The lab you choose should be certified by CDPH's Environmental Laboratory Accreditation Program -- be sure to ask.
Sometimes household plumbing fixtures and materials can contribute contaminants such as lead or copper to the water. If you think that you may have a lead problem, have your water tested. If the test results show lead in your water, purchase a unit certified for lead reduction and remember to change the filter cartridges. Also, caution household members, especially children, to flush the tap before use.

How can I tell if a water treatment device is certified?



  • The device must have a label that includes the CDPH certification number.
  • A copy of the CDPH issued certificate must accompany the device. The certificate lists the contaminants that the filter has proven to effectively reduce. The certificate can be on the Product Data Sheet, separately inserted into the packaging, or a part of the owners manual.
Do I need to be concerned about non-certified devices?




Yes, many fraudulent water treatment devices are being marketed. If a device is being sold on the basis of health claims and is not certified, there are two problems: (1) there is no reason to believe that it works as advertised and the product warranty and replacement parts will not solve the problem, and (2) the device is being sold illegally in California. Here are some questions to ask about any water treatment device that is being sold on the basis of health claims:
  • Is it certified by the State of California?
  • What specific contaminants does the device reduce? (Verify that they are listed on the certificate.)
  • What is the rated capacity of the device? (Also verify this on the certificate. Note: Some devices do not have a capacity.)You can protect yourself by not buying an illegal and unproven device.
How do I report fraudulent devices?


To report a suspected uncertified device, send the written material you received (containing health claims and the name of the device) along with the salesperson's business card to CDPH at the address below for follow-up investigation.

For More Information

For more information about certification of residential water treatment devices, contact us at:
California Department of Public Health
DDWEM-Technical Operations Section,
Device Certification Unit
P.O. Box 997377, MS 7417
1616 Capitol Avenue
Sacramento, CA 95899-7377
(916) 449-5600 (phone)
(916) 449-5656 (fax)
Water Treatment Devices - Main Page

Drinking Water Program

Division of Drinking Water & Environmental Management



http://www.cdph.ca.gov/CERTLIC/DEVICE/Pages/WTD-FAQ.aspx
 
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denfoote

Inactive
Gott im Himmel!!!

Kalifornication moronic gun laws applied to drinking water!!!

My advice is to flee that God forsaken state like Lot fled Sodom!!!
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
Red Baron,

California also would classify berkey's as "home water filtration systems" if they hold 4 or more elements in them. The berkey's are sold as outdoor emergency filters, which is not a home system. That is why the Big Berkey and other systems cannot currently sold in CA.

theberkeyguy
 

CountryboyinGA

Inactive
NOT CALIFORNIA APPROVED!!

Someone at berkey needs to put that on a big sticker on their berkey stuff and use it as a sales promotion.

Either that or this one;

"This product is approved for use in the 49 free states"

CB
 

Bad Hand

Veteran Member
I make tipis but I will not make and send any tipis to Kalifornia because they have to be made of fire retardant material. I made one but I will never do that again. The chemical they use to make it fire proof is a powder that leaves a metallic taste in my mouth when I sewed it, this was even with a dust mask. My dogs usually try to lay down on the canvas when I am sewing but with this stuff they wouldn't even come close to it.
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
NOT CALIFORNIA APPROVED!!

Someone at berkey needs to put that on a big sticker on their berkey stuff and use it as a sales promotion.

Either that or this one;

"This product is approved for use in the 49 free states"

CB

Just an FYI, add IA to the list of states also, so it would say 48 free states. :)

theberkeyguy
 

eXe

Techno Junkie
Man its stuff like this that makes me so glad I moved away from Nannyfornia.

Is there nothing they will not control.. and is ANYTHING legal in California anymore?

I heard they even banned big screen TVs today.. ugh.. lol

Come on over to Nevada and buy some nice "Pre ban Assault water filters" and while you are at it .. shop for a home.
 

Double_A

TB Fanatic
Sad Sad Sad. Over-regulation will be the end of us.

I sent this to a friend of mine with the Big one, she is hopping MAD!
 

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
FOLKS, The California government and agencies EXEMPT THEMSELVES FROM THE CONSTRAINTS OF THIS LAW.....SO....

NO, What Berkley water filters need to do is FORBID IT'S OWN DEALERS FROM SENDING ANY BERKLEY FILTERS, SYSTEMS OR PRODUCTS.............................

to ANY California agency, department, emergency response team, disaster response agency, BACK COUNTRY FOREST FIRE Agencies , or any CALIFORNIA GOVERNMENT paid use of their great Berkley filters UNTIL THE PEOPLE ARE ALSO ALLOWED TO USE AND BUY THEM.


That will put enough pressure on the legislature and that regulatory agency to get them to say OOPS, we made a mistake.
 
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theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
Sad Sad Sad. Over-regulation will be the end of us.

I sent this to a friend of mine with the Big one, she is hopping MAD!

Thanks for passing this onto your friend, I was looking forward to the official statement today, but i know they are really busy, so i hope it comes out tomorrow.

theberkeyguy
 

Barry Natchitoches

Has No Life - Lives on TB
NOT CALIFORNIA APPROVED!!

Someone at berkey needs to put that on a big sticker on their berkey stuff and use it as a sales promotion.

Either that or this one;

"This product is approved for use in the 49 free states"

CB


Yup. That would be enough to persuade me to buy Berkey!


I really feel for the two dozen or so decent folks still left over there in Kalifornia...
 

Barry Natchitoches

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Is there nothing they will not control.. and is ANYTHING legal in California anymore?


Yeah, quite a few things are still legal:


Theft by taxation;

Hospital emergency rooms that have closed down due to the burden of non-paying illegals;

Public schools that are completely dysfunctional in whatever language the classroom instruction is given in;

State issued IOUs instead of real money at tax refund time;

Wacked out juries who cannot figure out when a person is guilty of murder;

Political insanity both in and outside of Sacramento...


just to name a few...


BTW, is speaking the English language still legal in Kalifornia????
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
Rifle manufacturer Ronnie Barrett set the example for dealing with California several years ago. Here's the letter:

June 30, 2003

Chairman, Public Safety Committee
State of California
Sen. Bruce McPherson

Via: Fax (916) 445-4688

Dear Senator McPherson,

United States defense contractors such as Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc., Murfreesboro, TN USA rely on orders from the US Military as a primary source of income but this government income for most contractors is only part of the necessary income for long term survival. Commercial or civilian product sales are also a main source of income that makes payroll and for good working conditions for their employees. We must support these defense contractors in both peace and war and allow them to operate, market and sell their products under the rules, regulations and law of the Federal Government. There is a balance of customers among defense contractors that is necessary for sound, long term business and by eliminating commercial sales in California this balance is disrupted. To vote against .50 cal rifles puts jobs of your constituents as risk, the lives of your police at risk, and in the end the safety of the State of California at risk. Are you willing to jeopardize this?

The defense industrial base in America is at risk of being unable to fully support our country in time of need without adequate opportunity for commercial sales of various products. In the Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc situation the civilian legal Barrett .50 cal rifle is at risk in the state of California. The attempt to ban a legal firearm not only violates the basic principals of the US Constitution but sets a precedence that endangers many vital defense contractors. In the Barrett case it also endangers California law enforcement agencies from having a proven and important tool in the fight against terrorism.

* W. Hays Parks, Special Assistant to the Judge Advocate of the US Army wrote: "The M82A1 Barrett... are manifestations of the important historic cooperation played by private citizens and small business in the United States in the development of weapons and munitions necessary for the US Armed Forces to perform their mission to protect the national security interests of the United States by fighting and winning, with as few friendly casualties as possible." This statement sums up the vital role both government and commercial business play in the sound business practices of various defense contractors of which Barrett is one.

The Barrett .50 cal rifle was ascertained by the troops on the front lines in Iraq as the best performing small arm and they have the private defense contractor to thank for that weapon. Ban .50 cal rifles in California and you take this tool from your police also. The war on terror is not over! The Barrett .50 cal rifle has been in the hands of competitive shooters, hunters, and collectors for over 20 years and is a mainstay of the long range competitive shooters matches. It also serves on Police SWAT teams as the primary long range anti-sniper weapon.

It is the Barrett position that we choose not to support in anyway state or local governments who are against the US Constitution and the safety and security of this nation. If California were to ban the sale of the Barrett .50 cal rifle we will stop the sale and service of all Barrett products to all State Law Enforcement agencies of the state of California immediately and ask all small arms manufactures to consider similar action. Re-classify the .50 cal rifle and you align yourself and the State of California as being part of the very terrorists who are attempting to destroy this great nation of ours.

Please vote against banning or re-classifying .50 cal rifles.

Respectively,

Ronnie G. Barrett
President
Barrett Firearms Mfg., Inc.
Murfreesboro, TN USA

* Quoted from: Memorandum for Staff Judge Advocate, US Army Special Forces Command, (Airborne), Fort Bragg, NC Sept 7, 1999

== http://calnra.com/caspecial/barrett/
==========================

California banned Barretts, and Ronnie Barrett commenced a boycot on the sale and support of Barrett rifles owned by official bodies in the state of California.

Go thou and do likewise...

dd
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
I have also heard that some bullet manufacturers are going to stop sending bullets to CA in 2011 or so. There are some news laws that go into effect in 2011 that have to do with serial numbers and bullets.

theberkeyguy

Rifle manufacturer Ronnie Barrett set the example for dealing with California several years ago. Here's the letter:

June 30, 2003

Chairman, Public Safety Committee
State of California
Sen. Bruce McPherson

Via: Fax (916) 445-4688

Dear Senator McPherson,

United States defense contractors such as Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc., Murfreesboro, TN USA rely on orders from the US Military as a primary source of income but this government income for most contractors is only part of the necessary income for long term survival. Commercial or civilian product sales are also a main source of income that makes payroll and for good working conditions for their employees. We must support these defense contractors in both peace and war and allow them to operate, market and sell their products under the rules, regulations and law of the Federal Government. There is a balance of customers among defense contractors that is necessary for sound, long term business and by eliminating commercial sales in California this balance is disrupted. To vote against .50 cal rifles puts jobs of your constituents as risk, the lives of your police at risk, and in the end the safety of the State of California at risk. Are you willing to jeopardize this?

The defense industrial base in America is at risk of being unable to fully support our country in time of need without adequate opportunity for commercial sales of various products. In the Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc situation the civilian legal Barrett .50 cal rifle is at risk in the state of California. The attempt to ban a legal firearm not only violates the basic principals of the US Constitution but sets a precedence that endangers many vital defense contractors. In the Barrett case it also endangers California law enforcement agencies from having a proven and important tool in the fight against terrorism.

* W. Hays Parks, Special Assistant to the Judge Advocate of the US Army wrote: "The M82A1 Barrett... are manifestations of the important historic cooperation played by private citizens and small business in the United States in the development of weapons and munitions necessary for the US Armed Forces to perform their mission to protect the national security interests of the United States by fighting and winning, with as few friendly casualties as possible." This statement sums up the vital role both government and commercial business play in the sound business practices of various defense contractors of which Barrett is one.

The Barrett .50 cal rifle was ascertained by the troops on the front lines in Iraq as the best performing small arm and they have the private defense contractor to thank for that weapon. Ban .50 cal rifles in California and you take this tool from your police also. The war on terror is not over! The Barrett .50 cal rifle has been in the hands of competitive shooters, hunters, and collectors for over 20 years and is a mainstay of the long range competitive shooters matches. It also serves on Police SWAT teams as the primary long range anti-sniper weapon.

It is the Barrett position that we choose not to support in anyway state or local governments who are against the US Constitution and the safety and security of this nation. If California were to ban the sale of the Barrett .50 cal rifle we will stop the sale and service of all Barrett products to all State Law Enforcement agencies of the state of California immediately and ask all small arms manufactures to consider similar action. Re-classify the .50 cal rifle and you align yourself and the State of California as being part of the very terrorists who are attempting to destroy this great nation of ours.

Please vote against banning or re-classifying .50 cal rifles.

Respectively,

Ronnie G. Barrett
President
Barrett Firearms Mfg., Inc.
Murfreesboro, TN USA

* Quoted from: Memorandum for Staff Judge Advocate, US Army Special Forces Command, (Airborne), Fort Bragg, NC Sept 7, 1999

== http://calnra.com/caspecial/barrett/
==========================

California banned Barretts, and Ronnie Barrett commenced a boycot on the sale and support of Barrett rifles owned by official bodies in the state of California.

Go thou and do likewise...

dd
 

jsmalone1

Membership Revoked
thoughts?

I can't waste any more of our precious time with this nonsense--whatever "they" do we can defeat--get the filter out of state, have a relative buy it and ship to you, buy the specific things they don't want you to have, patronize true American companies--we don't have to starve the beast--we have to kill it. CA will collapse, sadly. This great correction will usher in a time of peace and simple prosperity but it will be tough getting there for all of us. This seemingly innocent story of a water filter is in fact important bc while CA collapses "they" still grasp for more power and intrusion. The difference this time is that this is a huge cycle and there is no money---NONE--it's all an illusion---CA's not broke---we are the USA!!
 

Double_A

TB Fanatic
I may have to re-budget to get a filter. I already have smaller ones of other manufacturers but they do not fill the same need.

My only hope is that California is the first state to crash and first reborn as it should be. I have too much invested here to abandon ship, I must remain behind to pick up the pieces.
 

Lone Wolf

Lives on TB
I may have to re-budget to get a filter. I already have smaller ones of other manufacturers but they do not fill the same need.

My only hope is that California is the first state to crash and first reborn as it should be. I have too much invested here to abandon ship, I must remain behind to pick up the pieces.



There are a lot of good folks in Cal.

Just not enough to make a difference at the polls come voting time.

Same situation here in MAINE. Just not enough votes to make a difference.

NW ARK. is starting to look real good.

lw
 

HDC

Contributing Member
There are a lot of good folks in Cal.

Just not enough to make a difference at the polls come voting time.

Same situation here in MAINE. Just not enough votes to make a difference.

NW ARK. is starting to look real good.

lw

you are right on about that. Here in the northern part of Calif, the Vote always goes to the conservitve side, but the Southern Part of the state, San Fran, etc always negates our votes because the liberals out number us.

:mad:
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
Here is the OFFICIAL Statement

You can view it here: www.directive21.com/california.html

Official Statement:
Suspension of Sales To California
Residents Begining January 1, 2010
California, has adopted AB 1953 / SB 1334 & 1395 / HSC Section 116875. This revised “no lead law” as it’s commonly known, goes into effect January 1, 2010. The law stipulates that any “end-use device intended to convey or dispense water for human consumption through drinking or cooking,” as well as each of their individual components, materials and “pipe, pipe or plumbing fittings, or fixtures,” or flux, must be “lead free” as defined by California law. Under SB 1334, certification MUST be performed by an “independent ANSI-approved third party testing organization.” It appears that even if a product and each component of that product has no metal alloys and if a purification system actually reduces lead, under Section 116875, it must be be certified. An example of this is our sport water purification bottle; each of its components as well as raw materials utilized will have to be certified.

Our research indicates that there are at least two different certification standards available, but there seems to be disagreement as to which standards will be acceptable to the state of California’s review Department of Toxic Substances Control (DTSC), the agency in charge of reviewing products and their certification. There is further confusion regarding testing protocols. While DTSC has issued an outline, it appears that the final protocols have yet to be settled upon. Throughout our ongoing research on this issue, we were unable to get clarification on the above requirements, instead it was suggested that “lawyers review the wording of the law to determine” how “they interpret the scope of the mandatory certification...” in what already appears to be a muddy mess. Unfortunately, many questions being asked simply can’t be answered by the January 1st deadline and as such, “strict compliance with the law” is recommended. In addition, should we desire to change any of our suppliers after certification, it appears that permission must be obtained by the certifying organization and that re-certification is mandatory, all at our own expense. At the end of this letter are just a few of the requirements needed to be certified, under this revised law.

We will continue to monitor the situation and as we get clarification on the issues for which we currently are unable to obtain answers, we will be able to make a further determination as to whether it will be in our best interest to pursue the matter further.

Sincerely:

The Folks at New Millennium Concepts, Ltd.

A SAMPLING OF CERTIFICATION COMPLIANCE REQUIREMENTS
…Applicant agrees to furnish all necessary drawings, test data, laboratory reports and product samples required by the Certification Company (CC). The CC is not responsible for loss or damage to any materials submitted…

…Listee shall promptly furnish to CC, in writing, the street address, hours of operation, anticipated dates when plants will be temporarily closed or shut down, anticipated dates when plants will temporarily cease production and all local or state holidays of each plant where the listed product is being manufactured or to be manufactured by or on behalf of Listee, and each location where the listed product is warehoused or stored by or on behalf of Listee. Listee shall also provide the name and telephone number of a contact person for each such plant or storage location, both at the time of application for evaluation and in the event of any changes in this information. Listee shall provide such information for all plants and storage locations, whether foreign or domestic. If the product is imported or to be imported, Listee shall also provide the name, street address, telephone number and contact person of the importer and the consignee…

…Listee shall maintain the product design, quality and workmanship in accordance with the current applicable standards recognized by CC, or as such standards may be changed, and as incorporated in the samples and documents submitted for evaluation and inspection by the CC. In addition, Listee shall make no substantial change in material, manufacturing process, marking or design of the product without prior written approval of the CC. Listee acknowledges and agrees that (a) new drawings, tests and product samples may be required as a result of any such substantial changes; (b) any substantial change in the original product after acceptance and listing by CC which is not authorized by CC will automatically result in delisting of the product until such written approval is received; and (c) a new application, additional fees and test reports may be required in the event of any such delisting…

…Listee consents to the review of listee’s products by CC or its subcontractor and Listee shall permit CC or its subcontractor to make up to four (4) announced or unannounced continuous compliance inspections of; (a) each of Listee’s domestic and foreign manufacturing or storage facilities; (b) Listee’s records relating to quality control, production, quantity of inventory and shipping of listed products (collectively, “Records”); and (c) Listee’s products themselves during each listing year; provided, however, that in the event CC reasonably believes in good faith that Listee is not in compliance with the terms and conditions of this Listing Agreement, CC may make a reasonable number of additional announced or unannounced inspections of such facilities, records and products as it shall deem necessary or appropriate to protect its rights hereunder and to the Certification Marks. CC maintains the right to make inspections to any domestic or foreign manufacturing or storage facilities, which are owned or operated by Listee..

…At the time of each inspection, the inspector shall have the right of immediate entry to all manufacturing and other areas, the right to require appropriate personnel to accompany the inspector, full access to all records, production and products, the right to take random samples, and the right to any other service the inspector reasonably deems to be necessary or appropriate to the proper completion of the inspection. Such inspections may be made at any time during normal business hours….

…Listee shall pay to CC an inspection fee for any inspection conducted under the provisions of agreement. All costs of inspection, including laboratory fees if outside laboratory testing is required by CC, shall be borne by Listee…
 
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Red Baron

Paleo-Conservative
_______________
OK the elephant is in the room and I'll ask the following questions,

- Are all water purification companies pulling out of California?

- How many water purification companies actually meet the California standards?

- How is it that some water purification devices can still be sold in California, but not Berkey after January 1, 2010?

- Since California is the largest consumer market in the USA, Why is Berkey -not- making every attempt to be cetified there?

- What is the domestic content of Berkey products?

- Do any Berkey components originate in China?

- Of course the burden of proof is upon the manufacturer, who else would it be?

- What is the estimated cost of compliance for Berkey?

- When does Berkey anticipate compliance with California standards?
 

Milk-maid

Girls with Guns Member
NOT CALIFORNIA APPROVED!!

Someone at berkey needs to put that on a big sticker on their berkey stuff and use it as a sales promotion.

Either that or this one;

"This product is approved for use in the 49 free states"

CB

Good quote!

However, this kind of evil always spreads from California. Look at the school books that can't use the words mother or father anymore because of their laws. Or the large screen TV's being outlawed there. It starts there and then spreads
 

Double_A

TB Fanatic
I kinda had a suspicion that Lead standards may have something to do with this.

Berkey needs to be provided with some regulatory clarification by the DTSC before they can obtain certification to continue to sell in California. THIS IS NOT CHEAP!

Nice try with a sticker. You can't offer for sale something that you may or may not meet legal requirements. It's not like you can offer something "as is" buy at your own risk without legally jeopardizing yourself.

Not strictly related issue...
Back a few years ago the Fed EPA lowered the Report filing threshold for manufacturers using lead in products or production of products. They dropped it from 10000 pounds to 100 pounds. Yes a tenfold decrease. If your company uses more than 100 pounds per year you need to file a Form R, Toxic Release Inventory. IIRC it's part of the community Right-to-Know act which says communities have a right to know when hazardous or toxic materials above a certain amount are being used.

The intent was to prevent a situation where there is a huge accidental release of toxic materials and the community at large is surprised that these toxic or hazardous materials are being used or stored nearby. Lead was classified as a Persistent Bio-accumulative Toxin. Meaning it doesn't just go away over time and it builds up over time in the body.

All these electronic companies are going to lead free solder. Problem is the lead slows down the growth of "tin-whiskers" (google it) which can short out and disable micro-chips used in almost everything electronic these days.


Bottom line here can be summed up as this... the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
Double A,

I really appreciate your comment, as you highlighted the fact that it was not cheap to do. Also, confidential information is also not guaranteed.

theberkeyguy

I kinda had a suspicion that Lead standards may have something to do with this.

Berkey needs to be provided with some regulatory clarification by the DTSC before they can obtain certification to continue to sell in California. THIS IS NOT CHEAP!

Nice try with a sticker. You can't offer for sale something that you may or may not meet legal requirements. It's not like you can offer something "as is" buy at your own risk without legally jeopardizing yourself.

Not strictly related issue...
Back a few years ago the Fed EPA lowered the Report filing threshold for manufacturers using lead in products or production of products. They dropped it from 10000 pounds to 100 pounds. Yes a tenfold decrease. If your company uses more than 100 pounds per year you need to file a Form R, Toxic Release Inventory. IIRC it's part of the community Right-to-Know act which says communities have a right to know when hazardous or toxic materials above a certain amount are being used.

The intent was to prevent a situation where there is a huge accidental release of toxic materials and the community at large is surprised that these toxic or hazardous materials are being used or stored nearby. Lead was classified as a Persistent Bio-accumulative Toxin. Meaning it doesn't just go away over time and it builds up over time in the body.

All these electronic companies are going to lead free solder. Problem is the lead slows down the growth of "tin-whiskers" (google it) which can short out and disable micro-chips used in almost everything electronic these days.


Bottom line here can be summed up as this... the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
 

Double_A

TB Fanatic
Double A,

I really appreciate your comment, as you highlighted the fact that it was not cheap to do. Also, confidential information is also not guaranteed.

theberkeyguy



Yes the costs for this kind of testing and certification can be in certain circumstances staggering, in the many tens of thousands of dollars.

It's not just a matter of telling the state that there is no lead or lead amount is so small it wouldn't matter. They want it tested using specific approved testing methods, in specific certified labs.

And if you test to the wrong standard, then they come out and say oops we wanted you to certify to the other standard your screwed start over again.
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
Mr Berkey Guy

Does this filter remove

chlorine
flouride
cloramine


thank you for you answer

Susan,

It does remove Chlorine, and reduce fluoride when using the PF2 fluoride filters with the system. Chloramine has not been tested, as only recently have cities started using it. I hope sometime in 2010 that a test will show that it is removed. Currently, i cannot say that it is removed.

theberkeyguy
 

NC Susan

Deceased
Susan,

It does remove Chlorine, and reduce fluoride when using the PF2 fluoride filters with the system. Chloramine has not been tested, as only recently have cities started using it. I hope sometime in 2010 that a test will show that it is removed. Currently, i cannot say that it is removed.

theberkeyguy


well the chlorine disolves toilet parts, which have to be replaced every few years, and kills fish in fish tanks. Flouride is a brain injury, and we now have chloramine added to our water to keep the chlorine stabilized longer !!??.

I noticed this summer, when i watered the one gallon size baby azaleas, that they water spotted gray stains on their leaves. They dont seem to be strong enough to handle all the chemicals in our city drinking water without showing that sign of stress!!

So what does that do to humans and pets for the long term!
 

Lone Wolf

Lives on TB
Looks like a fist fight aboard the Titanic, about WHO will rearrange the deck chairs.

I hope that Berkey is OK when this flap is over. I would hate to see them put in a position of re-fitting all of or some of their products in order to stay alive.

In a general sense, I hope Berkey doesn't get hit with the ills of every day usage because of some stupid fitting or something.

The world is rife with problems. The Ca., government wants to make it's problem every one's problem.

Does this make any sense? This post I mean.

Nutz to them.

lw
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
well the chlorine disolves toilet parts, which have to be replaced every few years, and kills fish in fish tanks. Flouride is a brain injury, and we now have chloramine added to our water to keep the chlorine stabilized longer !!??.

I noticed this summer, when i watered the one gallon size baby azaleas, that they water spotted gray stains on their leaves. They dont seem to be strong enough to handle all the chemicals in our city drinking water without showing that sign of stress!!

So what does that do to humans and pets for the long term!

I am also amazed by what they add also, and now they add chloramine because it lasts longer when just chlorine tends to dissipate in the pipes.

Great points!

theberkeyguy
 

cjoi

Veteran Member
So what does that do to humans and pets for the long term!


A few years ago, when our water district shifted to chloramines, they sent notices that the tap water had to be further treated to neutralize the chloramines or pet fish would die. Don't recall about other small pets such as parakeets or hamsters... makes one wonder, if chloramines kill little swimmers, what the effect might be on the male reproductive system...
 

theberkeyguy

Contributing Member
A few years ago, when our water district shifted to chloramines, they sent notices that the tap water had to be further treated to neutralize the chloramines or pet fish would die. Don't recall about other small pets such as parakeets or hamsters... makes one wonder, if chloramines kill little swimmers, what the effect might be on the male reproductive system...

It is amazing how they go from putting large amounts of chlorine in the water, to now adding in chloramine to the water. I understand some water sources may have to be treated, but there are tons of municipalities that do not add either to their water supplies, and no one is dieing or getting sick. Their health is probably better because they aren't drinking all the chlorine and chloramine.

theberkeyguy
 
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