DISASTER Amtrak train derails in Montana, at least three dead

jward

jward

passin' thru
Amtrak train derails in Montana
Jordan Jordan

1-2 minutes


September 25, 2021 / 9:29 PM / CBS News
An Amtrak passenger train derailed near Joplin, Montana, on Saturday, the company announced. There are at least three confirmed fatalities, according to the Liberty County Sheriff.

"At approximately 4 p.m. MT, Empire Builder train 7/27 derailed five cars near Joplin, MT. There are approximately 147 passengers and 13 crew members onboard, with injuries reported. Amtrak is working with the local authorities to transport injured passengers, and safely evacuate all other passengers," Amtrak said in a statement.

The Empire Builder operates between Chicago and Seattle.
This is a developing story and will be updated as more information becomes available.

Posted for fair use
www.cbsnews.com

At least 3 killed when Amtrak train derails in Montana

As of Sunday evening, five people were still hospitalized in stable condition.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
 
The Snack Artist

The Snack Artist

Membership Revoked
Amtrack used Union station in the congo. I would see the passengers de-training. They were the Greyhound crowd. That doesn't make them bad. The trains were always dirty as could be on the outside. Just disgusting. The folks getting off reminded me of that street in philly with the walking dead on it. Same look.

I was a lemming commuter at the time. Shuffle, shuffle, mooo! Hated that damned commute. 1 1/2 hours each way.
 
Squib

Squib

Veteran Member
That’s a pretty sparsely populated place!

Used to live east of there a ways…

Unlike big cities, folks there are used to being on their own (don’t think the passengers are though!) and make do during emergencies.

Fly over country and all that!
 
ltd

ltd

Higher Ground
"The folks getting off reminded me of that street in philly with the walking dead on it. Same look."
..that wasn't just a street, that was MOST of North Philly, from Broad St. to Roosevelt Blvd. ( Rt. 1)...:shkr:
 
West

West

Senior
Looks like the last car, that tipped over?

Note to self...never ride in the last cars, if I'm ever on a train again.
 
jward

jward

passin' thru
I used to do the hour plus commute, not fun -

I didn't expect this to have so many passengers, and at first
sight, didn't look like it'd cause so many deaths. : (

Hope it proves to be just a very tragic accident!

..n I've always wanted to ride a train- maybe not so much right at this moment, though
 
V

vestige

Deceased
I rode trains in Europe but only an antique train here in the states.

Amtrak must have routes other than in this area and adjoining states.

The last passenger train I saw in this area (Kentucky) was the George Washington when I was a kid.

Plenty of freight trains here and in adjoining states.
 
jward

jward

passin' thru
I wondered too- I started a thread re: where they were supposed to be sent,
but too tired to look it up. Also wondered about the domestic monkey wrenchers..
 
D

Delta

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I realize track conditions change rapidly through time, but the roughest track I ever road a train on was the Empire Builder through part of Montana about 40 years ago.
 
Jackpine Savage

Jackpine Savage

Veteran Member
Yikes, that's what you call bad luck.

I rode the Empire Builder in 1973 going to the Boy Scout Jamboree in Idaho. Fun time. Beautiful country out there.
 
V

vestige

Deceased
P

Pinecone

Has No Life - Lives on TB
DH and I would like to take that route. Tracks go through incredible scenery you can't see going by car. I have to say, we saw tracks way too close to the edge of a mountain with a river below. Beautiful, but cringeworthy!
 
TerriHaute

TerriHaute

Hoosier Gardener
DH and I travelled on the Empire Builder, round trip to Seattle to visit DD who lives there, and it was one of our favorite vacations. The food was good, the other passengers were interesting, and the scenery was amazing. We had a small sleeper compartment, so it was private. I'd be interested in knowing the cause of the derailment, no one is saying much about that yet.
 
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M

Matt

Veteran Member
It's the rear of the train and in a straight away section of the tracks.

My vote is mechanical failure of the car. I am sure the parts and labor issues are hitting Amtrak just like everyone else in industry.

I will never know, but I wonder if a few of the competent mechanics have retired or other wise gone Galt due to the looming vaxx mandate. Amtrak being a quasi federal outfit like the postal service, I am sure the mandates are in their face right now.
 
W

WalknTrot

Veteran Member
The Snack Artist said:
Amtrack used Union station in the congo. I would see the passengers de-training. They were the Greyhound crowd. That doesn't make them bad. The trains were always dirty as could be on the outside. Just disgusting. The folks getting off reminded me of that street in philly with the walking dead on it. Same look.

I was a lemming commuter at the time. Shuffle, shuffle, mooo! Hated that damned commute. 1 1/2 hours each way.
Click to expand...
These cross country runs attract a different clientele than the shithole urban commuter drone/ghetto scumbag lines. For proof, check out the ticket prices...as or more expensive than flying. Slower, more relaxed, better food, room to move, stretch, sleep, and a lot better scenery.
 
CTFIREBATTCHIEF

CTFIREBATTCHIEF

Veteran Member
wife and I rode the empire builder a few years ago on a cross country trip from New Haven to seattle. Amtrak regional to DC, Capitol limited to Chicago and switch to Empire builder for the rest of the run. We had a bedroom with it's own bathroom and shower. It was a fantastic trip, met a lot of nice people in the dining car (you are seated railroad style with other people if you don't have four in your party). You ARE out there along part of that route, no doubt about it. There was a lot of freight rail traffic on the line back a few years ago, not sure how it is now.

Glad we did it before everything out there went to crap.
 
Red Baron

Red Baron

Paleo-Conservative
_______________
I've driven on US Route 2 to Glacier National Park from the Upper Midwest.

Route 2 is mostly two lane and is extremely rural. It was an interesting change from driving the interstates. Man is it flat prairie out there. You understand why Montana is called "Big Sky Country".

The derailment is immediately west of the tiny town of Joplin, MT.

Imagine driving this through Montana and North Dakota on this road. Joplin is to the right.

Joplin MT.PNG
 
W

WalknTrot

Veteran Member
Red Baron said:
I've driven on US Route 2 to Glacier National Park from the Upper Midwest.

Route 2 is mostly two lane and is extremely rural. It was an interesting change from driving the interstates. Man is it flat prairie out there. You understand why Montana is called "Big Sky Country".

The derailment is immediately west of the tiny town of Joplin, MT.

Imagine driving this through Montana and North Dakota on this road. Joplin is to the right.

View attachment 292075
Click to expand...
For me, this type of scenery always gives me an over-wash of security/safety. Can't get enough of it.
We grow food here. More than anywhere else in the world. The country is chock-ful of this landscape, and thank God for it.
It's home to me.
 
M

mikeabn

Finally not a lurker!
ltd said:
"The folks getting off reminded me of that street in philly with the walking dead on it. Same look."
..that wasn't just a street, that was MOST of North Philly, from Broad St. to Roosevelt Blvd. ( Rt. 1)...:shkr:
Click to expand...
Kensington in Philly has its own daily you tube video. The place is hell on earth. To call it a third world country type area would probably triple the property values.
 
E

ellsworth848

Contributing Member
Have gone Amtrak from downtown DC to Richmond, Va and Richmond to Tampa many times. Great ride with comfortable seats, good food, friendly and pleasant staff. Price is about the same as Allegiant Air but it is a very nice escape from the world if you have the time. I haven't seen their Amtrak's safety stats but I'm sure it is safer than driving.
 
Melodi

Melodi

Disaster Cat
The problem is for about 50 years the US has mostly ignored their trains and more importantly their infrastructure. When we looked into taking a train to World Con in 1984 from Denver to Los Angeles (we had a group of about 8 people and a huge cargo truck of costumes) the cost would have been about the same as taking an Ocean Cruz. We ended up carpooling and driving there and back.

Fast forward to the 1990s, and I often ended up taking a version of the train that has derailed, only the one that went to San Francisco - it would often be up to three hours later as I waited for it to go through Sacramento. They were old, creaky, and smelled, I couldn't imagine taking one cross country.

The last time I was in California (about 4 years ago) this has been replaced by a more locally built system of clean, fast, efficient rail cars going between Sacramento and The Bay Area.

I point out this was built AFTER the Amtrack system dumped the route (around 1993) despite it being one of the most popular and crowded routes, beloved of commuters - faced with traffic jams hours long between Sacramento and San Francisco; The State of California was forced to take over that part of the route and run their trains.

The "Amtrack" pseudo-private business model did not include routes because they made money (because that route was carrying hundreds if not thousands of passengers a week) it was being determined on what worked best for freight or some other model I can't quite figure out.

Anyway, to sum up, unlike trains in Europe where most countries pride themselves in having reasonably comfortable and up-to-date systems (Ireland is way behind the times there, but is working on it), the US has just let things go downhill until it will be extremely expensive to retrofit and repair everything.

The UK found out the hard way (including several horrific accidents) that just turning everything over to "private companies" lock, stock, and the barrel doesn't work either. Their focus is on making a profit, not repairing tracks and trains, nor is it to get people from point A to point B in timing and reasonably priced manor.

The UK is gradually renationalizing its train system even under a conservative government, the traffic jams were just getting too large and the accidents too frequent. As were the shutdowns of business in London when the commuter trains would be hours late, sometimes for weeks.
 
Sandune

Sandune

Veteran Member
Looks to me like the rear two cars derailed and disconnected from the train which forced the train to go into emergency stop. That is probably 70 mph plus track so it would take at least 800 yards to stop. The engines had stopped on the other side of the control point. It's possible the detached cars derailed at the switch, but could have gone on the ground before they entered the control point. I see one rail turned on its side but that's likely due to the derailment and not the cause. Right now I suspect something wrong on the last two cars. Track problems affect the head end of the train.
 
WildDaisy

WildDaisy

God has a plan, Trust it!
vestige said:
I haven't heard of Amtrak in years. I thought they were long gone.

Who rides trains now?
Click to expand...

Millions of people every day. It is the main form of transportation between major New England cities for commuting (DC, NY, Boston). And long-distance Amtrak is probably a better idea for traveling long distances than flying since you can have your own compartments and be isolated from people. Don't need to be packed in like a sardine on an Amtrak.

Perhaps, since Amtrak and trains are more popular in New England, the trains are better maintained. They are quite nice and clean and they keep adding updated ones that have some nice interiors.

This is how you travel long distance, in your own compartment with a closing door
600x400.jpg


This is the new commuter Acela trains that go between DC/NY/Boston
Interior-3-First-Class.jpg
 
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Wildweasel

Wildweasel

F-4 Phantoms Phorever
Matt said:
It's the rear of the train and in a straight away section of the tracks.

My vote is mechanical failure of the car. I am sure the parts and labor issues are hitting Amtrak just like everyone else in industry.

I will never know, but I wonder if a few of the competent mechanics have retired or other wise gone Galt due to the looming vaxx mandate. Amtrak being a quasi federal outfit like the postal service, I am sure the mandates are in their face right now.
Click to expand...

Straight section of track but the signals in the photo tell me they were passing over a set of switches when the accident happened. That makes me think the problem happened as one of the front cars went over a switch and due to wear a wheel slipped onto the closed portion the the switch, forcing the switch to shift and forcing following cars off the track.

The rails pushed aside indicate one of the cars shoved the rails apart and the following cars were bouncing along on the ties until one car quit tracking straight and moved away from the tracks. Then cars began uncoupling, triggering an emergency brake application. The front cars stopped more quickly than the rear cars and the rear cars jackknifed, with the last car going over the side of the track embankment and rolling over.
 
The Snack Artist

The Snack Artist

Membership Revoked
West said:
Looks like the last car, that tipped over?

Note to self...never ride in the last cars, if I'm ever on a train again.
Click to expand...
My conductor, see I was just like President Stupid, I rode a train to work, said, "Don't sit in the last car as they fold up like an accordion in an accident. Sit in the first car after the locomotive as they will drive through anything!" Note to self is a good one.
 
M

Matt

Veteran Member
Wildweasel said:
Straight section of track but the signals in the photo tell me they were passing over a set of switches when the accident happened. That makes me think the problem happened as one of the front cars went over a switch and due to wear a wheel slipped onto the closed portion the the switch, forcing the switch to shift and forcing following cars off the track.

The rails pushed aside indicate one of the cars shoved the rails apart and the following cars were bouncing along on the ties until one car quit tracking straight and moved away from the tracks. Then cars began uncoupling, triggering an emergency brake application. The front cars stopped more quickly than the rear cars and the rear cars jackknifed, with the last car going over the side of the track embankment and rolling over.
Click to expand...
Good point. What type of maintenance cycle is there on switches? Seems kind of odd that a relatively light weight passenger train would overload the switch on a freight rail line.
 
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