Ragnarok
On and On, South of Heaven
Yes... Little tidbit in the Bomb Shelter re-enforced my view...
CORONA Main Coronavirus thread
- Thread starter Heliobas Disciple
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Yes... Little tidbit in the Bomb Shelter re-enforced my view...
Ragnarok
On and On, South of Heaven
If your glasses fog up the fit is not right...
Doomer Doug
TB Fanatic
Damn, it is a good thing that Doomer Doug bought all the socks, t-shirts, underpants, shoes, coats, shirts, handkerchiefs, Jean's, baseball hats, lightbulbs, etc etc I will need for most of 2020. Not to have underpants is as bad as no toilet paper.
Walmart, Costco, Target are barred from selling 'nonessential' items such as clothing and electronics in parts of the US
The only way that customers can shop for these nonessential items is by using online delivery services or curbside pickup.www.businessinsider.com
Walmart, Costco, Target are barred from selling 'nonessential' items such as clothing and electronics in parts of the US
Mary Hanbury
Shoppers wearing masks and gloves at Walmart. Photo by Al Bello/Getty Images
Local governments around the US are taking more draconian measures to prevent the spread of the coronavirus by barring "essential" stores such as grocery chains or big-box retailers from selling "nonessential" items such as clothing and electronics.
- Big-box stores and grocery chains in certain areas of the US are being barred from selling nonessential items to customers to reduce foot traffic and prevent the spread of the coronavirus.
- Certain local governments have directed stores to empty areas with nonessential items such as clothing and electronics or rope off these items from customers.
- Some shoppers have applauded the new restrictions and encouraged other local governments to implement them.
These stores, which have been allowed to stay open during state lockdowns because they sell groceries or offer pharmacy services, for example, are now required in some parts of the US to remove nonessential items or rope off areas of the store so customers can't access these products.
Vermont is among those clamping down on this. At the end of March, the state's Agency of Commerce and Community Development directed essential big-box stores including Walmart, Costco, and Target to stop selling nonessential items not listed in the governor's executive order outlining essential services.
"Large 'big box' retailers generate significant shopping traffic by virtue of their size and the variety of goods offered in a single location," Lindsay Kurrle, the secretary of the agency, said in a statement at the time.
She added: "This volume of shopping traffic significantly increases the risk of further spread of this dangerous virus to Vermonters and the viability of Vermont's health care system. We are directing these stores to put public health first and help us reduce the number of shoppers."
Customers can shop for these nonessential items using online delivery services or curbside pickup, Kurrle said.
The Board of Commissioners in Howard County, Indiana, enforced a similar rule earlier in March, preventing businesses in the area that were deemed essential from selling nonessential items.
The board said it had received complaints from businesses that were forced to close because they sold mostly nonessential items saying it was unfair for other stores to continue selling these products.
Retail workers in the area also complained that customers were congregating in stores and browsing nonessential goods because they were "bored at home," thus filling up the aisles and putting workers at greater risk, the board said.
There have been reports elsewhere of other counties putting similar rules into play. While some people said they disliked the new restrictions, others applauded the change and encouraged other local governments to do the same.
marsh
On TB every waking moment
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted | The College Fix
Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease.'
www.thecollegefix.com
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
‘Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease’
A veteran scholar of epidemiology has warned that the ongoing lockdowns throughout the United States and the rest of the world are almost certainly just prolonging the coronavirus outbreak rather than doing anything to truly mitigate it.
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
“[W]hat people are trying to do is flatten the curve. I don’t really know why. But, what happens is if you flatten the curve, you also prolong, to widen it, and it takes more time. And I don’t see a good reason for a respiratory disease to stay in the population longer than necessary,” he said.
“With all respiratory diseases, the only thing that stops the disease is herd immunity. About 80% of the people need to have had contact with the virus, and the majority of them won’t even have recognized that they were infected, or they had very, very mild symptoms, especially if they are children. So, it’s very important to keep the schools open and kids mingling to spread the virus to get herd immunity as fast as possible, and then the elderly people, who should be separated, and the nursing homes should be closed during that time, can come back and meet their children and grandchildren after about 4 weeks when the virus has been exterminated,” he added.
Wittkowski argued that the standard cycle of respiratory diseases is a two-week outbreak, including a peak, after which “it’s gone.” He pointed out that even in a regime of “social distancing,” the virus will still find ways to spread, just more slowly:
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
marsh
On TB every waking moment
PATTERNS - Google Drive
drive.google.com
Jacksonville company creates isolation hospital bed to treat patients, protect healthcare workers
PUBLISHED DATE:APRIL 8, 2020
video at website 02:11
JACKSONVILLE, Fla. — Pedicraft, a company based in Jacksonville, has developed an isolation hospital bed to help treat coronavirus patients while protecting health care workers.
Doug Maynard, the president of Pedicraft, said they started working on the concept in early March when they saw projections that hospitals could run out of bed space.
“It just helps hospitals and health care workers deal with an influx of patients — a fast, large influx of patients,” Maynard said.
Maynard said the company worked with physicians at local hospitals to create the design.
The isolation hospital bed uses vinyl covers meant to contain droplets and prevent the patient from spreading the virus.
The vinyl covers are attached with Velcro, so the nurse can easily remove the panel to tend to the patient.
The covers can be washed or disposed of. The bed dimensions are 76 inches long, 39 1/2 inches wide, 76 inches high and has a 350 pound weight capacity.
Maynard said they have made 200 beds so far. He said the isolation beds are not being used in local hospitals yet.
dioptase
Veteran Member
Our county just issued a requirement for individuals or companies/businesses holding more than X (X varies with the item) of certain items to disclose that fact. Items include N95 masks, surgical masks, vinyl or nitrile gloves, eye goggles, face shields, and on and on, down to/including ventilators. Most of those items X varies from 500-5000, but if you have even 1 ventilator, you are required to disclose that. (The only people I can think of who would have ventilators would be veterinarians, and I recall reading an article yesterday about some vet clinic giving up their ventilator to a hospital.)
What is a little disconcerting is the hint that these items may be necessary for a potential surge, yet I think that our state is supposed to peak in about a week, so how much of a surge are they expecting? Supposedly nobody is required to donate anything, yet on the other hand this "one time only" inventory is to assess what is "available" in the county, which suggests to me that mandatory "donations" may be in the offing.
FYI, possibly coming soon to a county near you.
What is a little disconcerting is the hint that these items may be necessary for a potential surge, yet I think that our state is supposed to peak in about a week, so how much of a surge are they expecting? Supposedly nobody is required to donate anything, yet on the other hand this "one time only" inventory is to assess what is "available" in the county, which suggests to me that mandatory "donations" may be in the offing.
FYI, possibly coming soon to a county near you.
Last edited:
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Exactly! Which is what I pointed out to the woman taking the poll. The questions were leading and designed to plant (false) ideas into people's heads. Really biased. I'm guessing that most people don't take the survey, I never used to, I only said yes because i was in the mood to support POTUS. But she wasn't going to get the answers the pollster wanted from me
HD
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Two-thirds of Chinese infections in past week had no symptoms
Of the 885 infections reported between March 31 and April 7, 601 people showed no visible signs, National Health Commission says.
www.scmp.com
Coronavirus: 68 per cent of cases confirmed in China in past eight days had no symptoms
Kinling Lo
Published: 5:11pm, 8 Apr, 2020 | Updated: 11:55pm, 8 Apr, 2020
- Of the 885 infections reported between March 31 and April 7, 601 people showed no visible signs, National Health Commission says
- But scientists say data set is too small to draw any conclusions about how Covid-19 spreads
While the ratio might appear high, the small data set meant it was too early to make any conclusions, according to Leo Poon Lit-man, head of the public health laboratory sciences division at the University of Hong Kong.
“We don’t know what these figures mean without having the same data [on asymptomatic patients] for the past three months,” he said.
“But what we do know, is that these asymptomatic patients could be pre-symptomatic and infectious despite not displaying symptoms.
“Therefore the virus is still being transmitted inside the country … and these patients should be treated in isolation and put under close observation.”
The NHC only began releasing the number of symptom-free cases last Wednesday, starting with figures for March 31 in a move it said was necessary to “address public concerns”.
Of the 885 cases reported in the eight-day period, 601, or 68 per cent, were asymptomatic, the NHC said. Of the 601, almost half – 279 – were reported in Hubei, the central China province at the heart of the initial coronavirus epidemic when it began at the end of last year.
Since the beginning of the outbreak in China, the total number of confirmed cases – all symptomatic – across the country was 82,000 as of Wednesday, with more than 3,300 deaths.
A total of 199 new cases were reported in mainland China on Tuesday, of which 137 were asymptomatic. Of those, 107 were imported cases, while 59 of the 62 symptomatic cases were also imported.
Poon said that widespread serological testing was necessary to determine the true proportion of asymptomatic patients. These tests look for antibodies in the blood, which usually develop within three to four weeks after infection.
Whether to include asymptomatic cases in official numbers has been a moot point around the world. South Korea counts everyone who tests positive for the virus in its national total, while the United States and Britain include only those who show symptoms of Covid-19.
According to a report published by a team from the World Health Organisation after visiting China at the end of February, the proportion of asymptomatic infections was only about 1 to 3 per cent of cases.
However, Dr Robert Redfield, director of the US Centres for Disease Control and Prevention, said last week that as many as 25 per cent of infected people were asymptomatic.
Similarly, in Hong Kong, of the 936 cases reported as of Tuesday, 155, or more than 16 per cent, were symptom-free, the city’s Centre for Health Protection said.
Benjamin Cowling, head of the epidemiology and biostatistics division at the University of Hong Kong, said the centre’s figures were about what he expected.
“In a large group of say 100 infections, it would be very unlikely to have fewer than 10 or more than 30 asymptomatic cases based on our current understanding of the characteristics of Covid-19 infections,” he said.
A report published on Friday by Chen Shen and Yaneer Bar-Yam from the New England Complex Systems Institute in Massachusetts, said it was important to calculate the proportions of asymptomatic cases within different groups, such as imported cases, those that have had close contact with people in quarantine, and the general public as a whole.
Based on the data available, they said “many of the current reported asymptomatic cases from overseas are pre-symptomatic”.
“[This] makes sense due to the presence of long-term asymptomatic cases that continue to test positive, remaining as a residual from the larger number of cases in China,” the report said.
Professor Yang Jiong, from the pulmonary and critical care medicine division at the Zhongnan Hospital of Wuhan University, warned about the risk posed by “silent carriers” with the lifting of the lockdown on Wuhan.
In an interview with Health Times, a newspaper under the Communist Party mouthpiece People’s Daily, on Monday, he said there were probably between 10,000 and 20,000 asymptomatic cases in the city.
“Although right now it seems that asymptomatic cases have relatively low infectivity, they are contagious after all, and [we] should still be on guard,” he said.
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Symptom-free Covid-19 patients must be reported within two hours: China
New guidelines aim to limit risk posed by healthy carriers to virus containment even as China insists their transmission rate is low.
www.scmp.com
Symptom-free Covid-19 patients must be reported within two hours: Chinese government
Kinling Lo
Published: 1:51pm, 9 Apr, 2020 | Updated: 2:39pm, 9 Apr, 2020
- New guidelines aim to limit risk posed by healthy carriers to virus containment
- Some cases may be pre-symptomatic and will go on to show symptoms later
Symptom-free Covid-19 patients are contagious and must be reported within two hours of confirmed diagnosis, the Chinese government said in its latest announcement.
In a document published on Wednesday night, the Chinese State Council has issued official guidelines, particularly for managing asymptomatic patients, those who tested positive for coronavirus but have yet to develop symptoms such as cough, fever and pneumonia.
The move came as official Covid-19 numbers have shown a daily increase in the number of asymptomatic patients from within China and from overseas.
On Wednesday, an additional 56 asymptomatic patients were found in the country, with 28 being imported cases, bringing the total asymptomatic cases under medical surveillance in the country to 1,104. The 56 patients without symptoms reported is not far short of the 63 new infections with symptoms on the same day.
“Asymptomatic patients are infectious, and have risk of infecting others,” the guidelines said, adding that some of the cases were pre-symptomatic, meaning they would show symptoms later in the course of the infection.
“[We should] strengthen the scope of testing and surveillance for asymptomatic patients …[and] standardise the reporting system of asymptomatic patients.”
The guidelines recommended that local health institutions should report these cases within two hours of receiving positive test results. Then, within 24 hours, county-level health authorities needed to report through the central communicable disease report system.
The issuing of the guidelines highlighted the increasing importance for Chinese authorities to manage and assess the risks posed by asymptomatic patients. Asymptomatic cases threaten Beijing’s efforts to contain the virus despite having drastically brought numbers of symptomatic patients down since January.
Scientific research into asymptomatic patients and their transmission rates around the world has been controversial.
Chinese authorities insist that patients without symptoms are not likely to trigger another major outbreak of the coronavirus and that their transmission rates are low.
Yet, after citing the need to “address public concerns”, the Chinese National Health Commission began releasing the number of symptom-free cases last Wednesday, starting with figures for March 31. The national total of 81,865 confirmed cases in China is therefore an underestimate of Covid-19 infections as it only records those showing symptoms.
To assess the impact of asymptomatic patients, the latest guidelines have said the government will back scientific research related to the topic.
Meanwhile, identified asymptomatic patients can only leave the health facility after testing negative for the virus twice after 14 days. They also must return for tests in the second and fourth week after being sent home, much like symptomatic patients discharged from hospitals.
Once they displayed symptoms they would immediately be sent for medical treatment.
All close contacts of asymptomatic patients must also be isolated and observed.
Shadow
Swift, Silent,...Sleepy
This makes me hope we do not develop a vaccine for this. God knows what they will do with it!Anthony Fauci sets stage for mandatory -- lucrative! -- vaccine
Anthony Fauci sets stage for mandatory — lucrative! — vaccine
“Vaccines are miracles,” said Pedro Alonso, the director for the Institute for Global Health of Barcelona, and another stakeholder in the “Decade of Vaccines” program. Yes. And for certain folk, certain insider folk, vaccines are also great economic and political investments.www.washingtontimes.com
Never, that is, Fauci suggested, until a vaccine is developed. And by logical extension, that’s to say — never, until a vaccine is developed that must then be included on the required list of shots for all children to attend school.
What great news for Big Pharma.
What great news for Bill Gates who just announced his foundation is going to spend billions of dollars to help build factories for seven possible coronavirus vaccine makers. “Spend” is probably the wrong word here. Invest is more like it.
After all, Gates, first and foremost, is a businessman. A billionaire businessman who made his billions in Microsoft and who just left his billion-dollar Microsoft enterprise to pursue other matters — specifically, to “serve humanity,” is how the Economic Times put it, in a March headline.
And for certain folk, certain insider folk, vaccines are also great economic and political investments. Especially when they come as saving grace solutions to wildly spread fears — especially when they come as required, mandated protections for global populations.
Shadow
Old Gray Mare
TB Fanatic
This could be incredibly helpful if it works and they can get enough people tested. Imagine how it could facilitate triage, care and improve infectious model projections by area/population tested. This could potentially help alleviate shortages of resources by allocated what is needed where it would more likely be needed. Either that or get at risk patients to the medical help or treatment most appropriate for them
Fair use.
Blood test could determine immunity response to COVID-19
•Apr 8, 2020
KHON2 News
Blood test could determine immunity response to COVID-19
Link to source:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgPvA2UAgB0
Run time 2:29
Fair use.
Blood test could determine immunity response to COVID-19
•Apr 8, 2020
KHON2 News
Blood test could determine immunity response to COVID-19
Link to source:
Run time 2:29
Watching the political leanings of these asymptomatic carriers would be interesting. Their close contacts too.(fair use applies)Symptom-free Covid-19 patients must be reported within two hours: China
New guidelines aim to limit risk posed by healthy carriers to virus containment even as China insists their transmission rate is low.
Symptom-free Covid-19 patients must be reported within two hours: Chinese government
Kinling Lo
Published: 1:51pm, 9 Apr, 2020 | Updated: 2:39pm, 9 Apr, 2020
- New guidelines aim to limit risk posed by healthy carriers to virus containment
- Some cases may be pre-symptomatic and will go on to show symptoms later
Symptom-free Covid-19 patients are contagious and must be reported within two hours of confirmed diagnosis, the Chinese government said in its latest announcement.
In a document published on Wednesday night, the Chinese State Council has issued official guidelines, particularly for managing asymptomatic patients, those who tested positive for coronavirus but have yet to develop symptoms such as cough, fever and pneumonia.
The move came as official Covid-19 numbers have shown a daily increase in the number of asymptomatic patients from within China and from overseas.
On Wednesday, an additional 56 asymptomatic patients were found in the country, with 28 being imported cases, bringing the total asymptomatic cases under medical surveillance in the country to 1,104. The 56 patients without symptoms reported is not far short of the 63 new infections with symptoms on the same day.
“Asymptomatic patients are infectious, and have risk of infecting others,” the guidelines said, adding that some of the cases were pre-symptomatic, meaning they would show symptoms later in the course of the infection.
“[We should] strengthen the scope of testing and surveillance for asymptomatic patients …[and] standardise the reporting system of asymptomatic patients.”
The guidelines recommended that local health institutions should report these cases within two hours of receiving positive test results. Then, within 24 hours, county-level health authorities needed to report through the central communicable disease report system.
The issuing of the guidelines highlighted the increasing importance for Chinese authorities to manage and assess the risks posed by asymptomatic patients. Asymptomatic cases threaten Beijing’s efforts to contain the virus despite having drastically brought numbers of symptomatic patients down since January.
Scientific research into asymptomatic patients and their transmission rates around the world has been controversial.
Chinese authorities insist that patients without symptoms are not likely to trigger another major outbreak of the coronavirus and that their transmission rates are low.
Yet, after citing the need to “address public concerns”, the Chinese National Health Commission began releasing the number of symptom-free cases last Wednesday, starting with figures for March 31. The national total of 81,865 confirmed cases in China is therefore an underestimate of Covid-19 infections as it only records those showing symptoms.
To assess the impact of asymptomatic patients, the latest guidelines have said the government will back scientific research related to the topic.
Meanwhile, identified asymptomatic patients can only leave the health facility after testing negative for the virus twice after 14 days. They also must return for tests in the second and fourth week after being sent home, much like symptomatic patients discharged from hospitals.
Once they displayed symptoms they would immediately be sent for medical treatment.
All close contacts of asymptomatic patients must also be isolated and observed.
Commies gotta commie.
marsh
On TB every waking moment
I meant proprophylactically in the sense of early stages to prevent the stage where o2 saturation declines and things go bad. From many stories, that is a rapid deterioration that occurs within hours. I don't believe the treatment is effective after one has reached the point of a ventilator. They may have to dispense it when they are triaging and people are being sent home to continue to monitor their o2 - perhaps with supplemental oxygen. Germany seems to have great success by getting people to come in at an earlier stage, sending them home and having a paramedic check on them once or twice daily.
Melodi
Disaster Cat
That is not the reports I'm seeing out of Sweden, some places are OK but the cities are having a sudden rush of cases to the point where even the locals are questioning their government.Looks like the U.S. crushing its economy was a VERY expensive failure; Brazil and Sweden did not lockdown, and are no worse off WRT Coronavirus than we are:
UPDATE: Data Shows US Efforts to Combat China Coronavirus Crushed Economy -- But Brazil and Sweden Have Similar Fatality Numbers With Open Economies | The Gateway Pundit | by Jim Hoft
While the US shuts down all commerce for weeks and destroys the economy, other countries like Sweden and Brazil are doing the opposite and allowing the China coronavirus to run its course. Data indicates there no material differences in fatalities between the three countries leading the casual...www.thegatewaypundit.com
In Brazil, we don't know yet as a huge portion of the population lives in terrible slums (surrounding the cities) and it is early days yet to see if (like Equador) they end up piling bodies at the end of the streets or not.
Now if in another four weeks nothing else has happened in either Sweden or Brazil then I'd say they may have called it correctly but Sweden is swiftly changing their protocols (even unofficially, no one likes to lose face) because their caseload is skyrocketing.
Infectious diseases don't care about economies, rates of poverty (Brazil vs. Sweden) or political values (again Brazil vs. Sweden) they only care about how they can infect their host, multiply and move on.
As I said in another thread, it all depends on just how bad, bad is and we don't really know for certain yet and part of that is China's fault (also different strains may have different RO's and outcomes).
marsh
On TB every waking moment
I think this is the test being administered to a sample study of volunteers in CA to determine whether COVID 19 has already visited us back to Nov 2019 and was hiding among the several flu strains we experienced this horrendous flu season. E.G. if it shows many already have antibodies, we can go back to a more normal lifestyle.
Old Gray Mare
TB Fanatic
That would be nice. The sooner the better.
dstraito
TB Fanatic
Does not seem too smart to pack in that densely
I wonder if things will ever go back to normal in the US. More likely everyone will act like Monk or Sheldon
Last edited:
dstraito
TB Fanatic
I am a little.concerned about everyone that is pushing for a vaccine. I am thinking follow the money.
What political agenda is being filled or who is getting rich like a vaccine maker? Who has already run simulations a year ago and has invested heavily in vaccine technology?
I do not trust the WHO organization. I do not trust him he UN. I do not trust the CCP. I do not trust people.associated with charitable foundations when the foundation gives only small percentage of contributions to help those it was created to help.
I do not trust anyone with TDS as they would betray the.country to get rid of one political opponent.
I do not trust anyone backing and voting for people that have TDS, guilt by association.
Melodi
Disaster Cat
This is a very good site to look for Swedish News in English
Some of it is behind a paywall and some of it isn't, but from what I could gather skimming the articles today while there is some good news and some bad news; the Swedish parliament is voting this week to extend the powers of the Central Government TO BE ABLE to shut things down (which I gather they can't do right now).
That doesn't mean they will, but they can if they see the need, some areas of Stockhome are hitting a leveling of cases but other areas (especially immigrant areas like North Stockholm) are still expanding.
No one is sure if things are really slow down or not, of if this is just a lull for a couple of days; time will tell but it is interesting that the government didn't have the power to shut things down but is voting themselves into being able to do it.
Some of it is behind a paywall and some of it isn't, but from what I could gather skimming the articles today while there is some good news and some bad news; the Swedish parliament is voting this week to extend the powers of the Central Government TO BE ABLE to shut things down (which I gather they can't do right now).
That doesn't mean they will, but they can if they see the need, some areas of Stockhome are hitting a leveling of cases but other areas (especially immigrant areas like North Stockholm) are still expanding.
No one is sure if things are really slow down or not, of if this is just a lull for a couple of days; time will tell but it is interesting that the government didn't have the power to shut things down but is voting themselves into being able to do it.
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted | The College Fix
Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease.'
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
‘Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease’
A veteran scholar of epidemiology has warned that the ongoing lockdowns throughout the United States and the rest of the world are almost certainly just prolonging the coronavirus outbreak rather than doing anything to truly mitigate it.
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
“[W]hat people are trying to do is flatten the curve. I don’t really know why. But, what happens is if you flatten the curve, you also prolong, to widen it, and it takes more time. And I don’t see a good reason for a respiratory disease to stay in the population longer than necessary,” he said.
“With all respiratory diseases, the only thing that stops the disease is herd immunity. About 80% of the people need to have had contact with the virus, and the majority of them won’t even have recognized that they were infected, or they had very, very mild symptoms, especially if they are children. So, it’s very important to keep the schools open and kids mingling to spread the virus to get herd immunity as fast as possible, and then the elderly people, who should be separated, and the nursing homes should be closed during that time, can come back and meet their children and grandchildren after about 4 weeks when the virus has been exterminated,” he added.
Wittkowski argued that the standard cycle of respiratory diseases is a two-week outbreak, including a peak, after which “it’s gone.” He pointed out that even in a regime of “social distancing,” the virus will still find ways to spread, just more slowly:
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
This is what I've been trying to say, only more lucid.
inskanoot
Veteran Member
Time for Fauci to go?
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
This guy is not a doctor, but rather a scholar and is taking the default position that Covid-19 is like most other respiratory diseases we have experienced and we well know it is much more infectious and has different results than most anything we have experienced. He is simply citing standard text book approach. His opinion is one of many (like all of ours) but in my estimation not worth the time it took to write this response.Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted | The College Fix
Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease.'
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
‘Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease’
A veteran scholar of epidemiology has warned that the ongoing lockdowns throughout the United States and the rest of the world are almost certainly just prolonging the coronavirus outbreak rather than doing anything to truly mitigate it.
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
“[W]hat people are trying to do is flatten the curve. I don’t really know why. But, what happens is if you flatten the curve, you also prolong, to widen it, and it takes more time. And I don’t see a good reason for a respiratory disease to stay in the population longer than necessary,” he said.
“With all respiratory diseases, the only thing that stops the disease is herd immunity. About 80% of the people need to have had contact with the virus, and the majority of them won’t even have recognized that they were infected, or they had very, very mild symptoms, especially if they are children. So, it’s very important to keep the schools open and kids mingling to spread the virus to get herd immunity as fast as possible, and then the elderly people, who should be separated, and the nursing homes should be closed during that time, can come back and meet their children and grandchildren after about 4 weeks when the virus has been exterminated,” he added.
Wittkowski argued that the standard cycle of respiratory diseases is a two-week outbreak, including a peak, after which “it’s gone.” He pointed out that even in a regime of “social distancing,” the virus will still find ways to spread, just more slowly:
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
questionable1
Contributing Member
I took a couple days off tb2k. I had maybe 30 minutes of msm, looked at cfp, an hour or so of radio. Some input from SIL and her boyfriend that spend a lot of time on fb and go out quite a bit.
My impression has been that covid is over, no worse than the flu.
Im not suggesting that is reality. Im reporting the impression from media input. People pay a lot to put out a vibe and that is what i got.
SIL said a lot of people were out and about yesterday.
My impression has been that covid is over, no worse than the flu.
Im not suggesting that is reality. Im reporting the impression from media input. People pay a lot to put out a vibe and that is what i got.
SIL said a lot of people were out and about yesterday.
UH..............is there any solid proof of immunity? I keep reading about people who have had it more than once. Does not sound like immunity to me. And it seems that the UK tried the herd approach only to meet disaster.Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted | The College Fix
Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease.'
Epidemiologist: Coronavirus could be ‘exterminated’ if lockdowns were lifted
DANIEL PAYNE - ASSISTANT EDITORAPRIL 7, 2020
‘Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease’
A veteran scholar of epidemiology has warned that the ongoing lockdowns throughout the United States and the rest of the world are almost certainly just prolonging the coronavirus outbreak rather than doing anything to truly mitigate it.
Knut Wittkowski, previously the longtime head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at the Rockefeller University in New York City, said in an interview with the Press and the Public Project that the coronavirus could be “exterminated” if we permitted most people to lead normal lives and sheltered the most vulnerable parts of society until the danger had passed.
“[W]hat people are trying to do is flatten the curve. I don’t really know why. But, what happens is if you flatten the curve, you also prolong, to widen it, and it takes more time. And I don’t see a good reason for a respiratory disease to stay in the population longer than necessary,” he said.
“With all respiratory diseases, the only thing that stops the disease is herd immunity. About 80% of the people need to have had contact with the virus, and the majority of them won’t even have recognized that they were infected, or they had very, very mild symptoms, especially if they are children. So, it’s very important to keep the schools open and kids mingling to spread the virus to get herd immunity as fast as possible, and then the elderly people, who should be separated, and the nursing homes should be closed during that time, can come back and meet their children and grandchildren after about 4 weeks when the virus has been exterminated,” he added.
Wittkowski argued that the standard cycle of respiratory diseases is a two-week outbreak, including a peak, after which “it’s gone.” He pointed out that even in a regime of “social distancing,” the virus will still find ways to spread, just more slowly:
Asked about Anthony Fauci, the White House medical expert who for weeks has been predicting significant numbers of COVID-19 deaths in America as well as major ongoing disruptions to daily life possibly for years, Wittkowski replied: “Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science.”
Well, we could go Venezuela and let the gov do........oh wait.Anthony Fauci sets stage for mandatory -- lucrative! -- vaccineAnthony Fauci sets stage for mandatory — lucrative! — vaccine
“Vaccines are miracles,” said Pedro Alonso, the director for the Institute for Global Health of Barcelona, and another stakeholder in the “Decade of Vaccines” program. Yes. And for certain folk, certain insider folk, vaccines are also great economic and political investments.
Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, listens during a briefing about the coronavirus in the James Brady Press Briefing Room of the White House, Tuesday, April 7, 2020, in Washington. (AP Photo/Alex Brandon) more >
By Cheryl K. Chumley - The Washington Times - Wednesday, April 8, 2020
ANALYSIS/OPINION:
Anthony Fauci, America’s most-listened-to medical professional on the coronavirus, and apparently on all the political, economic, cultural and social precautions every man, woman and child in the nation should take on the coronavirus, has just warned what cooler-head coronavirus watchers have suspected all along: that this country may never, no never, go back to normal.
Never, that is, Fauci suggested, until a vaccine is developed. And by logical extension, that’s to say — never, until a vaccine is developed that must then be included on the required list of shots for all children to attend school.
What great news for Big Pharma.
What great news for Bill Gates who just announced his foundation is going to spend billions of dollars to help build factories for seven possible coronavirus vaccine makers. “Spend” is probably the wrong word here. Invest is more like it.
After all, Gates, first and foremost, is a businessman. A billionaire businessman who made his billions in Microsoft and who just left his billion-dollar Microsoft enterprise to pursue other matters — specifically, to “serve humanity,” is how the Economic Times put it, in a March headline.
For a taste of how he’s already served humanity, one need only look to the disastrous Common Core one-size-fits-all, top-down education plan that his foundation bankrolled.
From education to vaccinations — the service to humanity never ends.
But this is what Fauci just warned, at a White House briefing with reporters: “When we get back to normal, we will go back to the point where we can function as a society. But … f you want to get back to pre-coronavirus, that might not ever happen in the sense that the threat is there. But I believe that with the therapies that will be coming online, and the fact that I feel confident that over a period of time we will get a good vaccine, that we will never have to get back to where we are right now.”
He also said this: “If back to normal means acting like there never was a coronavirus problem, I don’t think that’s going to happen until we do have a situation where you can completely protect the population.”
This — as the dire, dark, deathly numbers that sent America into coronavirus panic in the first place were just revised downward.
“America’s most influential coronavirus model just revised its estimates downward,” The Washington Post reported.
This — as Gates, the guy who has been the face of warning about the “nightmare scenario” of the coronavirus outbreak, just said the predicted death toll may not be as high as, well, predicted. Yes, viruses are, after all, seasonal.
This — as deaths due to the coronavirus are wildly open to interpretation, wildly speculative, wildly unscientific.
“The lack of widespread, systematic testing in most countries is the main source of discrepancies in death rates internationally,” BBC reported.
What do doctors consider a coronavirus death?
In the United Kingdom, health officials give daily counts of deaths of those who tested positive for the coronavirus, but who might have actually died from other medical conditions. In the United States, doctor discretion reigns.
“In the US,” BBC reported, “doctors … are asked to record whether the patient dies ‘as a result of this illness’ when reporting Covid-19 deaths to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.”
So some patients may have underlying conditions that lead to death; others may not. Some hospitals may have policies that mandate the U.K. model — to chalk up any patient who died with the coronavirus to be reported to the CDC as a coronavirus fatality; other hospitals may let the doctor determine. It’s a toss-up, hardly fact-based.
And for all this, America may never see a return to pre-coronavirus normalcy?
We’re focused on fear.
We should be focused on this: the money trail.
The money and power trail.
The Global Vaccine Action Plan, for instance.
“The World Health Organization, UNICEF, the National institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases and the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation have announced a collaboration to increase coordination across the international vaccine community and create a Global Vaccine Action Plan,” the Gates Foundation reported in a press release. “The collaboration follows the January 2010 call by Bill ad Melinda Gates for the next ten years to be the Decade of Vaccines.”
The “Decade of Vaccines?”
It’s a structured campaign. It includes a Leadership Council, a Steering Committee, an International Advisory Committee — and other bureaucratic so forths and so ons. But here’s an interesting link.
The Leadership Council “is comprised of … Dr. Anthony S. Fauci,” the Gates Foundation reported.
Fauci, the same guy who just set the stage for the dire need for a protective coronavirus vaccine, has a vested interest in seeing this vaccine come to fruition — come to widely administered fruition.
“Vaccines are miracles,” said Pedro Alonso, the director for the Institute for Global Health of Barcelona, and another stakeholder in the “Decade of Vaccines” program.
Yes.
And for certain folk, certain insider folk, vaccines are also great economic and political investments. Especially when they come as saving grace solutions to wildly spread fears — especially when they come as required, mandated protections for global populations.
tno5
Senior Member
my question is, in my neighborhood we have a lot of cats and kittens that go from house to house, hanging out - can cats be carriers of it? do I need to worry when I have three of them hanging out on my front porch or yard. I haven't petted any of them, but all my neighbors do - feed them and pet them.Cats can become infected with the new coronavirus but dogs appear not to be vulnerable, according to a study published on Wednesday, prompting the WHO to say it will take a closer look at transmission of the virus between humans and pets, Reuters reports.
A cat – not infected with coronavirus. Photograph: Ed Jones/AFP via Getty Images
The study, published on the website of the journal Science, found that ferrets can also become infected with SARS-CoV-2, the scientific term for the virus that causes the Covid-19 disease.
Dogs, chickens, pigs and ducks are not likely to catch the virus, however, the researchers found.
The study was aimed at identifying which animals are vulnerable to the virus so they can be used to test experimental vaccines to fight the pandemic.
The study, based on research conducted in China in January and February, found cats and ferrets highly susceptible to the virus when researchers attempted to infect the animals by introducing viral particles via the nose.
They also found cats can infect each other via respiratory droplets. Infected cats had virus in the mouth, nose and small intestine. Kittens exposed to the virus had massive lesions in their lungs, nose and throat.
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And the second wave will hit harder than the first wave. We will either shut down again or go for herd immunity and let people die.
We can debate and pontificate all day but until the PTB admit to themselves that this "flu" is actually a diabolically purposely fiendishly cleverly designed bioweapon then there can be no normal. It has characteristics of 4 different organisms, carefully spliced into a genetic code that recreates itself at the expense of the organism it infects, it hides stealthily for weeks creating asymptomatic carriers, attacks different parts of the body for multiphase destruction, and is persistent, armored against vaccination, mutates in the field eliminating timely countermeasures, and re-infects the recovered who had the immune system integrity to fight it off the first time. MERS, SARS, HIV, and Malaria all rolled onto one lethal package. You can't fight or win a war when you can't see the invisible combatants, you take the enemy's word about his intentions, and you put blinders on and ignore the reality of your situation. This is a bioweapon and we are under attack.
Haybails
When In Doubt, Throttle Out!
There's a funny meme that I've seen a couple times the last week or so . . . says something like, "One thing I'm liking about this COVID Quarantine is my vehicle getting 2 weeks per gallon"....wonder what my peak oil buds are makin' of these gluts we've had...
EndGameWW3
@EndGameWW3
3m
Petroleum stockpiles surge as demand collapses with coronavirus shutdowns
View: https://twitter.com/EndGameWW3/status/1248031761667444739?s=20
HB
coalcracker
Veteran Member
In reference to Trump's reluctance for prophylactic use of hydroxychloroquine, etc.
I love what you did here with three small words. You used the word "literally" in a non-literal sense. It conveys a slang sense of intensification, such as "really " or "greatly" sucks.
Imagine the poor soul learning English as a second language.
Your three words would cause so much trouble.
How would we tell such a person that the word literally is not to be taken literally?!?
Blacknarwhal
Let's Go Brandon!
I keep wondering, what is with the lag? Some of these coronavirus cases seem like people have just "had it" for weeks, with neither recovery nor death. What aren't we being told?
mzkitty
I give up.
For a newbie you jumped right in!!!! I can't disagree with a single word you said. To add to your statement, however, I don't know that we can even fight this is we do recognize it as a bioweapon. All we can hope is that the creators have a kill switch built into it that will shut it off in the future. I personally believe that nano-technology was used as well as CRSPR and AI. You won't beat that combination.
MinnesotaSmith
Membership Revoked
You don't own a garden hose or BB gun?
MinnesotaSmith
Membership Revoked
By some of those criteria, Lyme is a bioweapon, too.
bw
Fringe Ranger
The default position is that "literal" means figurative. It's almost never used correctly.
Trivium Pursuit
Has No Life - Lives on TB
A "vaccine" will be developed, and they will call it the vaccine. It does not need to work, for their purposes.