CORONA Main Coronavirus thread

rafter

rafter

Since 1999
Pence: Deepest condolences for the family of the lady that died, as well as those that continue to struggle with the disease.

Trump began at the beginning with restrictions on travel... Starting now: Travel restrictions from Iran, expanding any foreign national that has visited Iran. Going to Level 4 travel advisory to Italy and S. Korea where the virus is the worse. Wanting those countries to screen everyone coming to the US.

Everyone like CDC and others doing a great job....<roll eyes> (my thoughts not Pence)

Masks: Avg person doesn't need to go out and buy a mask. 40+ million masks today and ordered another 35 million from 3M
Wanting to get masks to healthcare workers...and high risk.
 
LoupGarou

LoupGarou

Ancient Fuzzball
Troke said:
Really? I constantly read here that the gov knows but is not telling us. Only somebody]y who believes in the efficiency of gov would believe that. My position is that the gov does not know. They may think they do but they don't. Which is why they seem to do stupid things. They just plain don't know.
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Some governments are located at the intersection of Apathy and Stupidity. Others are spread out in areas of Malice and Greed.

I believe that the US is doing a LOT of things behind the scenes. I have been hearing that there have been an uptick in use of the NIFOG and NIRSC frequencies in certain parts of the country. Another interesting source of info is the Hospital's own internal radio systems (a lot have gone to DMR or P25 digital/trunked systems, but many are still analog and easy to monitor). I know that EPIC, Allscripts and PMD are being used to track both symptoms and "syndromic surveillance events". They are getting data in. I am very sure that they know what is happening here and are in the constant update stream. That being said, they also know that as a nation, we don't have the supply stocks to cover a grocery store (or any other store) "run" to cover everybody's "needs" for three to four weeks on short notice, so they are trying to buy us time and wake the masses up slowly to the fact that they need to be partially prepped for being independent and self sufficient for a few weeks while being isolated to slow the spread. They have seen the results of what other countries have done, and done wrong, they don't want to make the same mistakes. China, having opened pandora's Conex box up over there and thrown their own country into chaos a month and a half ahead of ours seeing the first few cases has given OUR country a few good weeks to monitor there, as well as start working on a plan to have half (or more) of our workforce out of commission (whether in self isolation, or in the ER) for at least a few weeks. There is no "Good" plan or even decent approach now that COVID19 is here, there is just the fluid situation and the rather dynamic series of responses and actions that are going to drive us through this minefield that we are in the middle of now. The US is in about as good a set of hands as possible.

That being said, I don't see china only having 1000-2000 deaths when they have had Covid19 for three times as long as iran, which is claiming over 500 dead by some sources. I'm still thinking china has lost hundreds of thousands, but the world will probably never know the truth, on that, or where COVID19 really came from (BSL4 in Wuhan via BSL in Canada). China, being commie thru and thru, is definitely in the Malice and Greed part of the world. They know that their time is short with all of the protestors and external forces. Could they have used COVID to knock out a good chunk of their rebellious population? Sure. Could they have been playing with things that they should not have? Definitely. NK is even more ruthless, in that nobody in NK is really dropping dead of COVID19 if they catch it, they are dropping dead of high speed lead poisoning. The problem is that not even that will stop the spread as even the dead carriers of this virus will spread it for a while.

I don't trust china or iran to be coming clean on any of the data, but we have the eyes in the sky to see enough of what is going on over there to know that it is bad, very bad. And while we aren't "third world" like they are, which is multiplying the effects and numbers that they are seeing, we still do not have the number of emergency care centers that can handle NBC BSL-4 level bio-hazards like COVID that will be needed if we don't start isolating soon. And yes, this means that the majority of the populace will have to stay home, stay put, and deal with not going to work. This means that many employers will have to deal with not keeping up operations and output. This means that most stores will have to close for a while. Basically keep a few grocery stores open in each area, get "home deliveries" going to take care of last mile shipping of goods to the customers in need. Orders could be placed as needed and paid for electronically, and for the people that "don't have it in the account", a temporary loan could be made to cover the basic needs. And considering that a few trillion dollars spend taking care of the self-isolated people at home while this burns out is a LOT cheaper than the Financial Tsar Boomba of it killing our economy, workforce, and populace like it seems to be doing in China.

  • Shut the Freaking borders down, both directions, NOW!
  • Get out people home and get as many of the people that shouldn't be here OUT, YESTERDAY!
  • Stop the plane traffic, completely, as soon as the last foreigner leaves the country.
  • Tell everyone to self Isolate at home except for the people that HAVE to go to work (EMS, Doctors and Nurses, Utility operators, and a few other groups).
  • Keep the communications going, both P2P, as well as G2P (Government to People). Don't BS anyone, just let us all know the facts and the plan(s).
  • Freeze all of the bank accounts from any withdrawls outside of the people that own that account (no automatic withdrawls), dismantle the FedRes, and remove the possibilities of any Bail-Ins sucking everybody dry when the banks start complaining of "hurting" because of the pandemic.

Loup
 
ainitfunny

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
Hfcomms said:
What the Coronavirus End Game Will Look Like

David Fickling
Bloomberg

(Bloomberg Opinion) -- Pandemics come and pandemics go.

In the grip of a new infection spreading around a planet with no natural immunity, it can feel like the sky is falling. Over the coming months, it’s likely that a significant share of the world’s population will experience some of the dread of the Covid-19 coronavirus that people in China have suffered over the past few months. Many will die.

Still, the likely end-point of this outbreak will see it settle down as an endemic disease — one of the suite of respiratory viruses like influenza and the common cold that travel around the world year after year, with most of us regarding them as little more than a nuisance.

The great unknown is what will happen along the way. Doing the sums can produce alarming figures. The best estimates so far suggest that Covid-19 kills about 1% of people it infects. That number may go up somewhat or fall significantly; either way it could add up to a dreadful toll.

If 60% of the world’s population is ultimately infected, as suggested by Gabriel Leung, chair of public health medicine at Hong Kong University, a 1% fatality rate would kill almost 50 million people — similar to the 1918 Spanish flu. If that falls to 0.1%, it could still be roughly 10 times more fatal than the 2009 H1N1 influenza outbreak, which killed several hundred thousand in its first year.

A better comparison might be the influenza pandemics that emerged from China in the 1950s and 1960s, according to Benjamin Cowie, a professor of epidemiology at the University of Melbourne — but the differences are still significant. While our health systems are far better than they were 50 years ago, the channels of infection are more open, too.

“We’re in a very different world now, our world is much more interconnected,” he said. “What happens in one place is much more likely to be on the other side of the world in 24 hours.”

Attempts to contain this infection in existing hot spots in Asia, the Middle East and Europe appear to be failing. If that’s the case, expect to see low-level movement restrictions spread elsewhere. Such measures don’t serve so much to eliminate as to slow down a highly contagious infection like Covid-19. Still, that will spread out the burden of sickness over a longer period, putting less pressure on the health system.

The biggest impact is likely to be on the young and old. Children are less able to carry out the basic hygiene and touch-avoidance measures that help slow infections, so school closures like those imposed in Hong Kong and now in Japan could crop up elsewhere.

Aged care homes may see even more serious restrictions. Covid-19 seems to particularly target the elderly and those with other existing conditions. One recent study of more than 72,000 cases in China found a fatality rate of 2.3% across all age groups, rising to 8% for people in their 70s and 15% for people above 80. Minimizing the risks to older people will probably put significant pressure on aged care facilities, especially if staff are infected themselves, or called away to look after children sent home from shuttered schools.

Fortunately, the most severe period of initial infection could soon be fading. Respiratory diseases flourish in the cold season and taper off as the weather warms up. That should cause infection rates to slow in the northern hemisphere, while continuing at a lower level in tropical regions and spiking in temperate parts of the southern hemisphere where winter will be setting in. When a new year rolls around, the bulk of the disease will shift back to the northern hemisphere, to begin the cycle again.

Subsequent Covid-19 seasons probably won’t be as serious. Those who survive viruses should be immune from reinfection (though there have been reports of people being diagnosed with Covid-19 for a second time), and as the share of survivors in the population rises, it gets harder for a disease to spread.

“Most influenza pandemics last two to three years,” said Peter White, a professor of virology at the University of New South Wales. “That’s how long it takes before herd immunity is built up.”


In a best-case scenario, it’s even possible that vaccines may be available in not much more than a year. On top of that, doctors and nurses will get better at treating the condition and preventing severe illness, both through improved clinical knowledge; use of antiviral medicines like Kaletra, if they’re found to be effective; and because they’ll be much better-equipped to handle the crisis when infection rates are lower and fewer people are crowding into hospitals and clinics.
There’s no cause for complacency. Epidemics often move in waves, so that an apparent early peak in infections can be followed by further surges. That’s reason to maintain vigilance around measures like hand-washing and touch-avoidance, even if the pandemic seems to be on the ebb.

All of this will affect society in ways hard to predict. A global economy that’s off sick will struggle to grow in the manner previously expected. A disease that so aggressively targets older people may even shift the demographic structure of populations. The large number of men who died in the 1918 Spanish flu and the First World War has often been cited as one reason why the social and economic position of women improved so much in the 1920s.

We’re not on the brink of doom. As we’ve written, taking modest and sensible precautions should keep most people safe. In time, Covid-19 may be remembered not so much with dread as with historical curiosity. But the coming months, and years, will change us.


David Fickling is a Bloomberg Opinion columnist covering commodities, as well as industrial and consumer companies. He has been a reporter for Bloomberg News, Dow Jones, the Wall Street Journal, the Financial Times and the Guardian.

finance.yahoo.com

What the Coronavirus End Game Will Look Like

(Bloomberg Opinion) -- Pandemics come and pandemics go.In the grip of a new infection spreading around a planet with no natural immunity, it can feel like the sky is falling. Over the coming months, it’s likely that a significant share of the world’s population will experience some of the dread...
finance.yahoo.com finance.yahoo.com
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I really think he is looking at this just a little TOO OBJECTIVELY. When one has any personal fear of the possibility of personally being treated and suffering like the people he is speaking about, he would not look back and be glad he reacted to the threat "Modestly, and sensibly", nor would he want to be treated with medical workers not exceeding what is "modest and sensible" treatment, all things considered. I guess it is a matter of whether or not one is able to view the situation from the victims point of' view, or the medical worker's, or the authority's heavy burden of responsibility. It is a difficult problem with no "right" or easy answers for every situation,

If some nation , before the disease arrived in their country, warned that they were going to EXECUTE rather than treat all persons found to test positive for the disease and subsequently had few or NO cases beyond the first few, would that have been wrong, in hindsight? They would miss the suffering, the deaths from the disease and from others denied regular medical care during the pandemic, but it would seem they would also miss their citizens acquiring of "herd immunity" which would just postpone their citizens having to face the music and dance with Corona virus later (unless a vaccine is developed in the interim}. Now how is that for looking at it too objectively.
 
Repairman-Jack

Repairman-Jack

Veteran Member
TxGal said:
Folks who are wanting/considering an Amazon order for ANYTHING, might want to get it done soonest. I've been trying to place an order for the last half hour, and they're having issues with the website....guessing too many people doing the same thing.

This isn't a big order, a few puzzles, some mixes, etc. Good luck!!
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Wonder if they had a spike in orders or if there was a "cloud glitch", ordered more cat food and 2 more POE IP varifocal cameras around lunch time (East Coast time) and had zero issues but I do fully expect for things to get a little sporty with online orders/shipping.
 
ainitfunny

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
LoupGarou said:
What Trump should be talking about now is how to help get our manufacturing supply chains back in the country. Maybe a 5 year tax break for both the companies that start up making the base chemicals, electronic parts, and other pieces, AND massive federal tax breaks for all of the people they employ for more than 3 years (this keeps the system from being abused so much).

It would keep OUR economy working better, keep more people employed, and give us a manufacturing base for all of the parts and pieces for everything else we "make". It would also help other companies decide to move their operations back to the US as well.

For that matter, we could go back to what the founding fathers wanted and not have any corporate or personal taxes and just use tariffs on external trade (further pushing the companies to "bring it back home".
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TOO SOON.
Once the outbreak shows some signs of winding up there will be NO NEED FOR INCENTIVES to resume trade!
 
ainitfunny

ainitfunny

Saved, to glorify God.
raven said:
at some point either Trump or the Deep State will have to reveal the truth and when they do, the shit will hit the fan.
We all know there is a huge disconnect between the reaction of the Chinese and the reaction of our government.

The Chinese either locked down or quarantined vast areas of the population and have been burning bodies like . . .
I dunno . . . hot dogs on the 4th of July . . . I know, pretty morbid, but really.

The US has gone to great effort to actually import people having this highly contagious disease and have been lackadaisical in the administration of testing. Faulty test kits? Only testing people from China get tested (that's racist BTW)? Not preparing hospital staff for personal protection? The CDC has been acting like a food truck selling Chinese food on the side of the road - you really have no idea what the mystery meat is. How will YOU ever be able to trust them again?

We are close to the point where the truth must begin to emerge.
Either this virus is an Extinction Level Event - because only an extinction level event warrants the extreme measures that have been reported out of China and the CDC has dropped the ball.

Or the Chinese have used the virus as an opportunity to quell dissent or maybe to step up the trade war (or both) and the Deep State is using the fear and panic to crash the world economy, install a global currency, bring down Trump, and put the Deplorables in their place.

Happy Thoughts
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Way back when this first started CDC was talking about the test kits and they admitted they only had A FEW HUNDRED and were shipping like 20 to pretty good sized cities and wanted them to ONLY TEST people when it was absolutely necessary because there were no more tests coming till they could manufacture more!! THAT IS WHY THEY DID NOT TEST EVERY ONE THAT THEY MAYBE SHOULD HAVE. They simply DID NOT HAVE THE TEST KITS!
 
JMG91

JMG91

Veteran Member
Cacheman said:
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1233726563881029632
View: https://twitter.com/Surgeon_General/status/1233726563881029632?s=20
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So, wait, the U.S. Surgeon General is screaming at people to "STOP BUYING MASKS" because they won't keep us from getting sick, and the medical folks need them to stay safe! Uhhh...What an idiot.

"Seriously people- STOP BUYING MASKS! They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can’t get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!"
 
Capt. Eddie

Capt. Eddie

Veteran Member
Trump is now advocating negative interest rates and quantative easing. Wants to refinance debt at negative rate. WTF he's either full of shit or getting really bad economic advice.
 
R

rondaben

Veteran Member
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helen

helen

Panic Sex Lady
Don Quixote said:
Cant help but wonder how many of these friendly and familial freeloaders will be bringing the dreaded virus into your home with them?
Since it seems to lie dormant for a couple of weeks before symptoms appear, by the time you realize that you've invited pestilence into your quarters, it will be too late.
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I'm exposed anyway. I'll die or not. Most people who get a positive response relax and listen to preparation tips in case they can't make it. Once they feel like they can have control, they start taking care of themselves. Address the first fear - do I have a safe place in case I mess up? Once that is addressed, they can be taught. Training wheels, if you will.
 
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