nomifyle
TB Fanatic
you'd think that anyone who has been around this forum for awhile would have a clue. If I had to start from scratch now it might not be doable to the extent that I have already prepped. But do what you can with what you have.
VIDEO You Need 2 Years of Food – Martin Armstrong
- Thread starter Plain Jane
- Start date
tnphil
Don't screw with an engineer
It's bad from the date of manufacture.
In all seriousness, the #10 can of Honeyville beef-flavored TVP says "10-20 years". However, we have a can in the pantry that's been open for likely over 10 years and it's still "good".
Seeker22
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Two years of food laid by is not silly at all. It is The Alpha Strategy (read the book) and is a certain hedge on inflation.
Two years of food as preps already in the larder means that if volcanic activity increases and we have a Year Without a Summer, or some other weather related thing like drought or flood, you could skip a year. Over predation by prey species because they see your garden as a food source, and poor security watching and protecting it, might mean losing a crop? If we go to war, marauders, or patrols may commandeer your crops. That two years is a gift horse, I'd not be looking in the mouth.
What is silly is not thinking absolute worst case and planning back from that.
20Gauge
TB Fanatic
Not intending to offend, but for 90+% who have stored 2 years, they waste quite a bit of it. Yes, there are those who don't, but most do.....
Additionally, you have to survive 2 years in order to use it....
Lastly, 99% of all issues will be done in far less than 1 year.... though there are exceptions of course.
Depending on where you live and when you start using it your kids and grandkids will starve before they can bring in a harvest
nomifyle
TB Fanatic
I'm curious how you came to this conclusion.
Seeker22
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Not as long as my ammo holds out.
Hfcomms
EN66iq
And even at this late a date you can still put a lot of calories away for not all that much money. When I started out I bought #500 of wheat, got up to #500 of white rice in buckets and bags and about #250 of dried beans and then squirreled away a lot of spice packages and gravy packages.
I have a nice electric grinder for the wheat to bake bread with but also a cheap hand grinder which works for bread if you make two or three passes with it. A lot of dense calories in the grains if you know how to use them and still relatively inexpensive to buy. I wouldn't want that to be my only food source but if you use the beans/rice as a base you can add in some freeze dried entrees and put a ladle of that over the rice and beans and you'll be stuffed.
It isn't too late until there is nothing to buy in the stores or they won't take the money anymore.
nomifyle
TB Fanatic
I started out the same way only I bought 300# of several things.
I normally agree with most of Armstrong’s stuff but here I deeply disagree you need some stored food to get past the inital disruptions
More importantly you need tribe to protect your area and seeds and tools for farming
you can’t effectivly store enough food for x years
you can store seeds and enough food to survive the time it takes to grow your farm
milk cows or goats are going to be at a preimum
storing milk is a bear and powdered milk tastes
yuk
r
More importantly you need tribe to protect your area and seeds and tools for farming
you can’t effectivly store enough food for x years
you can store seeds and enough food to survive the time it takes to grow your farm
milk cows or goats are going to be at a preimum
storing milk is a bear and powdered milk tastes
yuk
r
attilla
Contributing Member
We are well situated for a multigenerational event but we certainly did not get here overnight.
(Keeping in mind NO plan survives first contact.)
Two years of stuff for 1 family becomes a few months if/when my brother and co. shows up late to the party.
Having enough on hand until the next garden season means the garden either produces as planned or we starve?
THAT is not part of our plan. (Planning for crop failure is.)
It took us 20 years and a LOT of work/fun to get here.....Now I'm off to band a new bull calf and collect eggs...
(Keeping in mind NO plan survives first contact.)
Two years of stuff for 1 family becomes a few months if/when my brother and co. shows up late to the party.
Having enough on hand until the next garden season means the garden either produces as planned or we starve?
THAT is not part of our plan. (Planning for crop failure is.)
It took us 20 years and a LOT of work/fun to get here.....Now I'm off to band a new bull calf and collect eggs...
Greenspode
Veteran Member
So having two years worth of food is silly because some of it might be "wasted" (not really sure what that means), so having only 3 months worth is a good idea? Not sure how that logic works. If I "waste" some of my 2 years worth, I still likely have 18 months worth, which is still much better than 3 months worth.
And where you getting that 90% number from? I've been prepping for 25 years, and most of the people I interact and associate with have been doing it a long time as well, and I don't know anyone whose "waste" is notable enough to make them change tactics. Was there a survey or study of some sort that I am missing? Same with the "99% of issues will be done in far less than a year" number. Statistics are not just numbers pulled out of the air....you need to explain how those numbers came to be.
Yes, there is waste to a degree. This past fall I did an inventory, and separated out about 200 cans of various sizes and content, which were over 15 years old, and whose can was iffy looking. Those cans went straight to the barn, and I open a few every week for the chickens to eat. Of the over 100 I have opened so far (mostly corn, beans, fruit cocktail, peaches, etc.) only 8 or so were actually bad, and most of those were carrots! (Canned carrots have a horrible shelf life, in my experience!) The rest I would have eaten, no problem. The chickens are an important part of our preps, so I don't consider rotating older stuff to feed them as "waste".
I also have stuff in the freezers that I know needs to go. Much of that will go to chickens as well.
I "lost" about 200 lbs. of "scotch broth" mix around 10 years ago. I had mixed it all up and stored it in 2 liter soda bottles. Something chewed up those bottles and it was contaminated enough that it too went to the chickens. That truly was a loss, because I worked hard to put that together, but it still isn't enough of a loss to stop me going forward.
Honestly, I have thrown away more "bad" food from my weekly grocery shopping trips than I have of my storage food over the years.
I guess prepping this way isn't for everyone, but please don't discourage others from doing it simply because you are not able to do it.
Marseydoats
Veteran Member
Rotate, rotate, rotate! And don't buy things that you know you won't eat.
No matter how careful you are, you're going to lose some product, because can seals don't hold --- or in my case, because husband insists on rotating the wrong way --- but I actually feed very little to the chickens.
Grounded Idealist
Hope Always
delete
Hfcomms
EN66iq
There are things that I bought years ago that I wouldn't buy now as I'm a little more nutrition conscious than I was when I was 40 years old. I bought several cases of pancake mix I never opened. Still have many bottles of pancake 'syrup' whose major component is corn sugar. I bought bottles of liquid drink mix (all sugar) for making large batches of punch. Most of that stuff is still good but 25 years later don't have much use for.
But, when you start out with this lifestyle there is a lot of learning along the way and that takes time. I've been blessed as I've never been unemployed more than a few months, never had a health crisis where I couldn't work, never had a disaster where I'd have to be on my own for months on end but I was ready for all that and more.
I don't regret a single purchase or a single prep. The stuff that I bought or never used or like the pancake mix and syrup which is terrible from a nutritional and health angle was simply educational dues paid to the university of learning. If I had to do things over knowing what I know now like most of you I'd do some things different but we start working with the knowledge we have at the time.
But, when you start out with this lifestyle there is a lot of learning along the way and that takes time. I've been blessed as I've never been unemployed more than a few months, never had a health crisis where I couldn't work, never had a disaster where I'd have to be on my own for months on end but I was ready for all that and more.
I don't regret a single purchase or a single prep. The stuff that I bought or never used or like the pancake mix and syrup which is terrible from a nutritional and health angle was simply educational dues paid to the university of learning. If I had to do things over knowing what I know now like most of you I'd do some things different but we start working with the knowledge we have at the time.
Tristan
Has No Life - Lives on TB
My thinking is a dozen goats, 30 chickens, and feed for them for at least 6 months.
And a full pantry or so....
What's wrong with both?
Faced with starvation, you'll be surprised at what you'll eat.
school marm
Veteran Member
We've been doing it for 35 years. Family is all incredibly healthy, except for the one who did some internal damage to nerves while on some crazy exercise routine.
That's the grossly undeserved reputation powdered milk has. I've stored powdered milk for 35 years and admittedly threw away quite a bit the first 20 years. However, the past seven years have included a lot of research on this topic.
Taste varies by manufacturer.
There are many tweaks for improving the flavor. The best flavor varies from one person to the next, even within families. We did several blind taste tests with various manufacturers and various tweaks. In a family of eight (including in-laws now), most everyone had a different favorite. DH liked one that used honey. I loved the one using powdered (pasteurized!) eggs. (Yeah, that was a shocker.) Just as shocking--that nonfat powdered milk was made to taste just like whole milk to me.
Even if you don't want to use it for drinking, that powdered milk can be used to make cream of chicken/mushroom/celery/tomato soups. It makes fantastic yogurt, even Greek yogurt, and cream cheese. Pudding. No-bake cheesecake. Sweetened condensed milk. Evaporated milk. Use it in baking bread. Hot chocolate mix. The list goes on.
I use it to feed my family every day. And I have among my children both the King and the Queen of the Picky Eaters. And their dad.
You can read all about it on my blog for free (use the search bar on the right) or in my book on the topic (where everything is nicely organized).
Prep School Daily
Good Eats at the TEOTWAWKI Cafe, Using Powdered Milk
subnet
Boot
Eating like we normally do, intake will have to adjust and the picky type will not be pleased no more crap snax
West
Senior
Yeah, hungry enough, I might consider even eating TVP with Zombie meat. Draw the line though with TVP and dog meat, never!!
school marm
Veteran Member
It all depends on what you are storing. Freeze-dried and canned products only? I guess that's possible. When DD got married last month, one of their wedding gifts was a year's supply of food for two. I think it didn't even occupy 20 square feet of our entryway. Of course, our focus is on long-term storage--wheat, rice, and whole grains; beans; sugars; powdered milk; salt; oil. On top of that there were plenty of canned goods. Since they only plan to be away at school for 8 months while DD finishes her degree, they opted to leave here the freeze-dried foods, because they take more space.
subnet
Boot
It seems he is pulling his data from the collapse of the Soviets, where we are told 1989-1991 but the effects started before and lasted past those dates.
I have read they lost around 9% of their population but those numbers change depending on who is writing ths articles.
That 2 years gets you through a bad harvest or two. How many people here can honestly say they would be able to grow and harvest 100% of their calories after only 3 to 6 months. Once you have burned thru that then what? If I had the funds and time I would store 4 or 5 years of things like whole grains, sugar etc. Just to get me or the family thru a rough harvest. We don’t starve anymore because when one area has a bad harvest , it is cheap and easy to buy and transport food from a different area. If it all goes south there won’t be other areas to import from.
Dux
Veteran Member
Definitely a renewable resource. We have 6 sheep, 13 ducks, and so far 1/8 acre veggie garden that can easily expand. No more ducks though. There are 10 dozen eggs in the frig, we're getting about 10 a day, and outside demand has dropped off. I'm starting to freeze them. Not sure why, as we have no shortage even in winter.My thinking is a dozen goats, 30 chickens, and feed for them for at least 6 months.
And a full pantry or so....
von Koehler
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Armstrong said that 7 May will be the start of the festivities, so we don't have long to wait and see what happens.
packyderms_wife
Neither here nor there.
I'd say people need to be in shape and be ready for the long march, rather than have two years worth of food at this point. the communists are in control and it's only a matter of time before they decide that those who oppose them need to be offed, or imprisoned.
Seeker22
Has No Life - Lives on TB
What some people call stored food, I call the everyday working Pantry.
What tribe? Tell me exactly whom I can trust in these times? Who here has planned on Dementia, Schizophrenia, Bi-polar, etc. in their "Tribe"?
My tools and seeds are stored so they will be fresh and new when I need them. It takes me between 60-90 days to get a crop to harvest. I've got that much food already laid in.
My powdered milk is in a five gallon bucket with Gamma Seal lid and lives in my indoor pantry. No rancid milk for me. Even if it is, use it as binder for Sausage making.
My Clarified Butter and Ghee live in Wide Mouth Pints. Not seeing as I need a cow or a goat much? There's just me and the dog, so I'm able to make things last longer than if I had twenty people to feed.
Greenspode
Veteran Member
Greenspode
Veteran Member
Why not do both? Preparing for one scenario, and not another, when none of us knows for sure how this is going to play out, doesn't make sense. It's not a "this" rather than "that" situation. Some might not be able to do it all, for various reasons, but to make a choice to forgo one type of preparedness to focus on another isn't really being prepared....imho.
You can have three years' of food and still fail. What people need is a change in lifestyle.
Prepping is a way of life, not a hobby or one time action.
Prepping is a way of life, not a hobby or one time action.
Zahra
Veteran Member
Food - yes
But think about resiliency beyond food alone.
Do you have alternative means of cooking if the gas or power is out?
Do you have water or a way to get water and a way to filter it?
Do you have gardens or are you building raised beds now? You should in case you haven't already.
Alternative ways to heat your home?
Ways to protect yourself and harden your dwelling against the rising crime that's bound to happen if gov't social services, pensions, and benefits stop flowing?
Studying the collapse of the soviet union is a good way to prepare for what's ahead here.
But think about resiliency beyond food alone.
Do you have alternative means of cooking if the gas or power is out?
Do you have water or a way to get water and a way to filter it?
Do you have gardens or are you building raised beds now? You should in case you haven't already.
Alternative ways to heat your home?
Ways to protect yourself and harden your dwelling against the rising crime that's bound to happen if gov't social services, pensions, and benefits stop flowing?
Studying the collapse of the soviet union is a good way to prepare for what's ahead here.
Greenspode
Veteran Member
I like to think that anyone involved in prepping to the point that they have beyond a couple months worth of food put aside, has these bases all covered. I can't imagine anyone with 6+ month food supply hasn't stumbled upon some thought addressing all your good points, but the stupid is strong out there, so anything is possible! Great apocalyptic reality show....follow the family that has all the food, but no water, heat, or ability to cook! lol.
The Cub
Behold, I am coming soon.
I chose to stash a little bit of everything vis a vis a lot of anything in particular.
Complete with alternative lighting, cooking facilities, water, etc.
Complete with alternative lighting, cooking facilities, water, etc.
packyderms_wife
Neither here nor there.
This and in spades!
packyderms_wife
Neither here nor there.
And also study how many of those old russians were forced out of their homes, apartments, etc., by the soviets, and death marched to the gulags, or turned into forced labor on various farms to feed the proliat (sp?) or whatever they called themselves... aka the elite.
And if that's impossible to envision then you may want to look up the Trail of Tears and the reservation system here in the US, cause it's coming!
I'm not saying not to stock up on food, etc., but most people don't have the skill set or knowledge to cook most foods from absolute scratch, and are reliant on electricity for everything.
Anti-Liberal
Veteran Member
Remember, the guv says they have a right to take all you have and put your ass to work while they separate you from the rest of your family. IF you live past that and repel the guv then you have raiders to deal with. If you have cows, goats, and chickens and have vegetables growing that means you have to have 24-7 security and get some sleep all while dodging snipers and people trying to burn you out of your house. You have to be a part of a large group and for that you will have to give up some of what you have to be a team player.
Zahra
Veteran Member
I was referring to the economic crash and societal upheaval that took place in the 90's when the Soviet Union fell, not the Bolshevik revolution of 1917. Russia lost an estimated 9% of the population post collapse because of the cessation of income (gov't couldn't pay its military retirees or other pensioners any longer), foreign trade collapse, lack of goods (and the ability to purchase them), rampant crime, depression, alcohol abuse etc...
I am currently putting the roof on a 12x20 concrete block building that I am going to use for food storage since the 20x24 fallout shelter is to full of food to house my extended family if the nukes pop. I mostly store rice, beans, sugar, salt, and rotate out many, many cans of chicken and spam. I have many cases of freeze dried stuff from big names in the business plus about 12 cases MREs someone recently gave me. I live in a wooded area and can catch a raccoon every night just using one of my many traps. One buddy caught a raccoon every day for something like 300 days in ONE trap left in ONE spot in the FL swampland that he owns. A good hunter starves while a average trapper gets fat.
I am going DEEP re food once the building is done. I am a little heavy on my ammo and firepower compared to food so I need to balance that out.
If I don't eat one grain of my stored food, I will call that a win because if I ever have to, things have gone really bad.
I am going DEEP re food once the building is done. I am a little heavy on my ammo and firepower compared to food so I need to balance that out.
If I don't eat one grain of my stored food, I will call that a win because if I ever have to, things have gone really bad.
Profit of Doom
Dismember
Has anyone tried Humanitarian Daily Rations?
Reviews are either good or really bad. Like Meals Rejected by Homeless bad.
Reviews are either good or really bad. Like Meals Rejected by Homeless bad.