King Samson
I'm Here
LOL..
My position has been stated here, over and over...
Have you not been paying attention?
ECON So What Happened To Silver??
- Thread starter King Samson
- Start date
My position has been stated here, over and over...
Have you not been paying attention?
King Samson
I'm Here
So, what's the alternative??
Accepting blind assertions by anonymous posters here?
Actually no, not that that invalidates your opinion.
Of the five I mentioned above, the papiermark was only ever back by the German gov; the pongo started out backed by gold but the economical fall out from the Great Depression and gold creating inflation, they dropped it and then mismanagement of payment for imposed war reparations made the inflation even worse. The Zimbabwean dollar was backed by foreign currency reserves. The Venezuelan bolivar was backed by the country’s oil reserves. The Lebanese pound was killed by their civil war despite it being pegged to PMs; then to stabilize it it was pegged to the US dollar which the government then revalued in 2019 to control the collapse only causing it to collapse to about 90% of its previous value.
So it doesn’t appear to matter whether a currency is pegged to PMs or not, more in how the government manages the currency.
doctor_fungcool
TB Fanatic
Here's your challenge...address this for starters....one cogent paragraph...concerning this subject. This will be your own creation.
While macro indicators like Gross Domestic Product (GDP) and corporate profits are resilient, the average household is heavily squeezed by a sudden resurgence in inflation.
I used this technique with my graduate students. It inevitably separated the wheat from the chaff.
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I’ve never said I did. Quite often, if you actually read for content instead of being butthurt when someone doesn’t bow to your wisdom, that I said there were lots of things I didn’t know, especially about any transition period. But what I do know is facts. And coming from someone that uses AI rather extensively, your questions of research is a jest.
King Samson
I'm Here
Absolutely, it's part of my balanced investment portfolio. I hold more than most. And much of it is up 3X - 4X from what I bought it for.
But where I differ, is thinking it's the "save all" from all the evils of fiat currency, that the PM Bulls keep saying.
Like I said above, like it or not, 10% of the population holds PM's, 100% of the population deals in fiat dollars, so it makes the most sense, to plan accordingly.
I'm under ZERO illusion, that I'll do anything substantial with my PM's, they certainly won't bail me or anyone else out in an economic collapse... Most likely, my kids will be stuck doing something with them, when I'm out of here.
doctor_fungcool
TB Fanatic
Tnx...Search query...how much research is bogus?
Answer is. "
A lot of published research is unreliable, but there is no single trustworthy percentage for “bogus” across all fields. The best-supported answer is that fraud is usually a minority problem, while weaker but more common problems like sloppy methods, selective reporting, and irreproducibility are much more widespread
What the evidence suggests
A recent analysis reported that about 1 in 7 scientific papers may be at least partly fake, but even the author called the estimate “wildly nonsystematic,” and other experts said it mixes different kinds of problems together. A separate article on paper mills says bogus manuscripts are rising and that some detectors found very high rates in certain areas, with one estimate suggesting up to 34% of neuroscience papers in 2020 and 24% in medicine were likely made up or plagiarized, though those numbers come with major false-positive concerns EOM
I’ll answer for myself. It is just one medium of exchange in my arsenal. I don’t just rely on one stream of income. And basically it is a method of transferring wealth from one generation to the next and I have a next generation to transfer it to. If I didn’t I’m not sure I would have as much in my possession as I do.
Everyone needs to do what works best for them. That means you need a realistic plan - not a cookie cutter assumption - that works for today, tomorrow, and down the freaking road all the way until you exist on the other side of the cemetery sod.
Your extensive use of AI is rather hypocritical if you are going to question the research posted on TB2K.
King Samson
I'm Here
And once again, I've addressed that multiple times in the past, but I'll post it again..
Stating that the average family is squeezed by inflation, without providing any other data is meaningless. No one EVER addresses the other side of the equation, SPENDING and INCOME and BUDGETS. It never gets mentioned in all these financial articles. What gets harped on is high prices and inflation..
I've posted in the past the ratio of income to current costs, showing BOTH, the rise in wages and the rise in costs. And for many everyday items, that ratio has held even.
Bottom line, complaining about inflation while NOT addressing matching personal spending to income and budgets, holds zero validity in a conversation, in my opinion.
How's that?
doctor_fungcool
TB Fanatic
As for me...I have lived a lifetime of flying by the seat of my pants(an old term)
I have crashed and burned...flown to unbelievable heights...and putted along like a misfiring moped. I normally follow my gut. By the way K.S. I set aside early morning just to process good reads ...especially if they are written by some of my favorite authors.
I have crashed and burned...flown to unbelievable heights...and putted along like a misfiring moped. I normally follow my gut. By the way K.S. I set aside early morning just to process good reads ...especially if they are written by some of my favorite authors.
You’ve got to be kidding me. ROFLMAO. You’re now handing out assignments like members are students in some class you are pontificating in? ROFLMAO!!! You can’t even respond without resorting to AI.
doctor_fungcool
TB Fanatic
Don't assume anything about me and AI. My knowledge comes pre AI...(books...papers...interviews...ect. )
King Samson
I'm Here
Which is why people need to source information across MULTIPLE platforms..
But you didn't answer my this question of mine above. Here it is again:
So, what do you think?
Perhaps you don’t realize when you are constantly saying “Grok” etc that is AI derived. And again, if you are going to question all of the years of research that has been posted to TB2K then you need to add your own in there.
King Samson
I'm Here
That could be the issue, flying by the seat of the pants.... I don't do that, at all, as it usually ends in bad outcomes. Maybe it's the engineer in me, that I make sure to make a plan first, before jumping.
But, I've definitely lived through big ups and downs, and when I've had those down periods, I made sure to learn from them, and NOT repeat them.
I also am a big believer in this statement, "I rather try and fail, then never try at all". I made some business decisions, over my career, that didn't work out as planned. But when they didn't work out as planned, I learned, stuck the data into my 'Databank" and never repeated them.
This process is what led me to be in my current great financial position. It wasn't easy, it was hard work, but it paid off in the end.
Kathy, you said that you have PMs in your portfolio for insurance, but that you are not a stacker. Where do you draw the line? Every stacker stacks for insurance and knows that his stack has to be exchanged for paper for everyday use. This is, as has been stated multiple times, a matter of opinion. This thread was closed early on and reopened by two mods that had different opinions. I find it laughable that a guy in New Jersey with a dog an an opinion, and a landlady in Florida who is satisfied with her PM holdings and talks to bankers have become the board experts in the metals space, and everyone else's opinion is flawed. Incredible, actually.
A body in motion doesn't "tend to remain" in motion. It DOES remain in motion unless acted upon by an outside force, and there are many outside forces acting in the metals and markets space at the moment. What might happen out there that you need PMs for insurance? And why can't anyone else look at the future and choose differently?
A body in motion doesn't "tend to remain" in motion. It DOES remain in motion unless acted upon by an outside force, and there are many outside forces acting in the metals and markets space at the moment. What might happen out there that you need PMs for insurance? And why can't anyone else look at the future and choose differently?
Hfcomms
EN66iq
I think a very salient point (that many miss) is that metals are not for normal times. And as abnormal that these days are we are living in there is still some ‘normality’ around. Banks are still open, food is on the shelves at your local store and you can stop at any gas station and fill up if you have the cash or room on your credit cards. Metal has little use now as why would you sell metal if cash is working?
During local or regional emergencies from power outages, to tornadoes, earthquakes and hurricanes cash still works most of the time. Metals again have little utility here as a return to normalcy is days to weeks away or you can at least drive out of the affected area and resupply.
So what are the metals for?
Currency resets, systemic banking crises, long term grid/internet down or as a long term store of value to get your wealth over to the other side and/or TEOTWAWKI however your personal description of such an event might be. This is historically where the metals come into play. Also, since they retain value over time (unlike your savings/checking accounts) you use them as a personal savings account as I did when I cashed in gold late last year during the run up to buy a new truck.
I am mainly metals but not metals only. I have multiple checking accounts at different banks, a brokerage account and keep a cash cushion in the safe for the aforementioned local/regional disruptions. How much or what percentage should people use? Everybody is different but I cast my lot in with what Bill Holter has said on the subject. He said ‘Everything I can’t afford to lose is in physical metal’.
During local or regional emergencies from power outages, to tornadoes, earthquakes and hurricanes cash still works most of the time. Metals again have little utility here as a return to normalcy is days to weeks away or you can at least drive out of the affected area and resupply.
So what are the metals for?
Currency resets, systemic banking crises, long term grid/internet down or as a long term store of value to get your wealth over to the other side and/or TEOTWAWKI however your personal description of such an event might be. This is historically where the metals come into play. Also, since they retain value over time (unlike your savings/checking accounts) you use them as a personal savings account as I did when I cashed in gold late last year during the run up to buy a new truck.
I am mainly metals but not metals only. I have multiple checking accounts at different banks, a brokerage account and keep a cash cushion in the safe for the aforementioned local/regional disruptions. How much or what percentage should people use? Everybody is different but I cast my lot in with what Bill Holter has said on the subject. He said ‘Everything I can’t afford to lose is in physical metal’.
We have a similar background. My husband’s 17 years in student loans, commercial banking, and loan documentation and work outs gave us an inside view of how things actually worked for a large segment of the population at all levels of the socioeconomic ladder. I worked in clerical, writing, mental health, and education (collegiate and CEUs for professionals). At the same time we kind of fell into real estate because the economy in the 90s didn’t allow us to sell our home or my in-laws’ after they both passed. Both still had mortgages on them at the time so we had no choice but to rent them out or get foreclosed as at the time we could not have paid three mortgages and associated expenses.
It grew from there. I never wanted our business to get as big as it is but not for financial reasons but because I saw what having rentals did to my grandparents. So, hubby and I made compromises and used our individual knowledge and talents and here we are 30+ years later with a multistreamed portfolio and assets. Still married at 38 years. LOL. Lots of sacrifices to get here but lots of blessings as well allowing us to steward what the Lord has given us to do. Given where we started from (both low middle class and all but one grand just plain low income) we‘ve been blessed beyond measure. Compared to the Rockefellers not so much. We’ve got enough to be responsible for so I’m not worried about it.
King Samson
I'm Here
And there's the point that the PM Bulls totally miss. If they want to USE their PM stacks, they first have to exchange them, at an acceptable rate of exchange, for those useless fiat dollars, that's collapsing soon (according to them). See the hypocrisy there?
And to exchange a stack for significant amount of "fiat dollars", is a big process. Go ask HFComms how long it took him to make that exchange, so he could buy a new truck, with those fiat dollars.
LOL... a big LOL...
You don't understand that the metals make up a SMALL percentage of our overall portfolios... That we both have significant investments in other financial vehicles. It's our ability to grow ALL our assets, not just PMs, gives us MORE financial knowledge than your average biased stacker and member here.
Hmm, where did I draw the line. Good question. Basically when we needed to determine where the dollars flowed. We bought our PMs early on. I also have some gems and stuff from that time period that I’ve never done anything with. We had our first child within 2 years of getting married. The same way my grandparents started me a savings account at my birth with $50 in it (big sacrifice for them but they did it for each granchild), we bought PMs by making sacrifices. But when we started to need our assets to work for us in an income approach way, the PMs were no longer as attractive an asset to acquire.
I do understand other people were and are in a different situation but that’s why I always say there is no cookie cutter approach, everyone has to do what works for them. Our PMs, by design, were for passing along wealth to the next generation.
Along that same line, about 7 years ago, we purchased life insurance policies for our kids that don’t just have a death benefit but have an income that accrues and can be taken after a certain period and also has a Long term insurance rider on it. That’s their inheritance and it has the capacity to be worth a great deal once they reach what is traditionally called retirement age. Even if they choose not to wait that long to take the income out of it, the death benefit for any family they might have is no small amount and the long term care rider/benefit could be worth worth … well, depends on the medical expenses.
With that same type of thinking we have a wealth structure that works for us that we developed back in 2015/2016 to address the real estate portfolio. The business was getting too big to remain a DBA, the risk was too great. We broke it down into 16 LLCs, a partnership, a Bridge Trust, another LLC that owns part of the Bridge Trust … all of which creates a corporate veil that prevents letigious indiividuals from taking advantage of what they would think of as deep pockets, while maximizing the effect on income. We also have a Family Trust that will be the final pot the wealth will rest in once both hubby and I pass.
But we don’t lets hay grow under our feet. A good plan is always flexible. Currently we are developing REITs for moving some of our real estate income properties out of the portfolio that helps deal with taxes. We are also looking strongly at Tax Loss Harvesting as another stream of income that will allow us to downsize the income producing property portfolio with negligible effect on our income.
If you are going to survive you can’t just get locked in and static. And you need to stay current, not live in the past, so that you aren’t dragging anchors while you are working to improve your position so regardless of what life throws, you can dodge and pivot to address what is thrown.
ETA: being a ”landlady” is only one facet of my existence. ROFL. I’m not ashamed of it but it certainly isn’t the sum total of my existence. ROFL. Not to mention, everyone needs to do what they need to do, and if successful expand on that. My experience is mine. Other people are going to have different experience and what created it.
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There is no hypocrisy, KS. If you took some metals out of your safe and exchanged them for 3-4 times the paper, why is that hypocritical? Sounds smart to me. And you don't know anything about the portfolios here, whether they're the average 0-1/2%, or 30%, or more in metals. Why do you get so bent out of shape at what other people choose to do?
You think people here are sitting on a heap of silver in a bunker somewhere, oblivious to the outside world. Wrong. They are just not accountable to you, although you keep coming back with questions that no one will, but could, answer. This whole thread is kind of amusing, actually.
You think people here are sitting on a heap of silver in a bunker somewhere, oblivious to the outside world. Wrong. They are just not accountable to you, although you keep coming back with questions that no one will, but could, answer. This whole thread is kind of amusing, actually.
I believe this is why the Iran Event took place. The dollar was about to collapse due to the price of Gold and Silver. It will go back up.
King Samson
I'm Here
Who's bent out of shape? I find in amusing that because I'm not on the PM Bull train, that I'm accused of not having financial experience. That I realize, what the PM Bulls don't, that other investments return better results, with less effort.
Ahhh, they are. Many have posted exactly that.
Or, do you think they are all lying, and have large investments in other financial vehicles, besides their silver?
King Samson
I'm Here
Three of those, the German, Zimbabwe & Venezuelan experiences also had the unique distinctions of each having had the fastest growing, most profitable, stock markets in the entire world shortly before their currency collapsed.
Hmmm, I bet that each their high-flying stock markets contributed to even more people being blindsided back then when their currency finally imploded, what do you think?
Panic Early, Beat the Rush!
- Shane
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KS, what financial vehicles people here have is none of your business. There are people here who have been buying and selling metals and miners since the late 90s, when the board started. They have a lot of financial experience and varying portfolios. Are you so insecure, with your wonderful portfolio and profits, and your happy fulfilled life with many great returns, that you have to come here like a woodpecker to the nearest dead tree and pick people apart who don't agree with you? Go be happy. AND, if someone does want to sit in his bunker on a pile of silver, why do you care? This is TB after all. He may be a kook but he's our kook, and he might have a very diverse portfolio that you would just love to have him divulge to you. The point is, and you still fail to understand this, is that people think differently.
It's simple math. As long as the Feds print, keep a little stack going at all times. "The wise man sees the danger coming and prepares."
It's simple math. As long as the Feds print, keep a little stack going at all times. "The wise man sees the danger coming and prepares."
It does show what happens in an expanding inflationary environment. I want to compare apples to apples though because currency collpases don’t happen in a vacuum. What were the other stock markets of the day doing concurrently? If someone else gets to it first, please post. I am hip deep in gators and working in the field.
winodog
The Bible is a flat earth book
Now do the "worlds reserve currency". Pretty sure the last one was the brits sterling pound
The UK pound is still in use. It was even in use when the UK was part of the EU. The UK pound is about $1.35-ish to the US$ though they keep getting closer and closer to parity. The UK pound is still the currency in 10 countries including a weird one I wasn’t aware of … South Georgia.
Is that what you meant?
Kathy, I don't mean to belittle your life's experiences by calling you a landlady.. Many people here could write their story, but choose not to. They have a lifetime of education, work experience, financial lessons, etc, and have arrived at their own conclusions. It just gets a little tiresome sometimes when you and KS, who are the echo chamber, completely dismiss the other members. I mean, God forbid someone go out and buy a silver dime instead of putting that $5 in the stock market. Yes, there is another thread on the subject which is safe, and quiet, and civil, but this one is an interesting study in human psychology.
mbabulldog
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Interesting thread drift.....
They also do not mind paying thousands a year for insurance.
That they get no return on, unless they file a claim. But we that
buy a type of insurance that has increased in value, by 3-4x or
for some of us 10x. We are stupid, and should follow their way.
I like an insurance policy that increases in value, not one I have
to keep paying more into every year.
That they get no return on, unless they file a claim. But we that
buy a type of insurance that has increased in value, by 3-4x or
for some of us 10x. We are stupid, and should follow their way.
I like an insurance policy that increases in value, not one I have
to keep paying more into every year.
I wasn’t offended. No big deal. But you need to understand this is actually a thread about alternatives to the echo chambers that other PM threads have become. Summerthyme cleaned up the last one before this one, thread banned multiple people, and then KS was invited to start his own, which he did so he could post his opinion without being hounded to hell and back. Since I’ve been around a lot longer than KS and have the same opinion that I’ve always had I don’t get the “echo chamber” comment from other people who I disagree with philosophically for one reason or another. We are two forum members that have our own experiences with how PMs fit into our financial planning. More than likely KS has more in his safe than I do as far as PMs go. No biggie because his plan is his and mine is mine.
Except then other forum members followed the activity to this thread and started bullying and all the other etc. They could have kept their PM discussions to the thread that they helped to create but nope, wasn’t good enough for them. They come looking for a fight. Sorry, but other opinions are welcome on TB2K. Other people are more than able to start their own PM threads. And everyone can remain civil.
Maybe if I simply thread ban the others so that they can only post on Summerthyme’s PM thread that would stop the endless bickering. Or people could choose on their own. At the moment the thread has been spicy at times, yes, but it hasn’t gone down to the level of kicking people out or infractions though a case could be made. A few members are getting close and they know it because many of those members have wound up with those types of infractions years before I became a mod. Nothing new. Everyone acts innocent until they can’t. Or they conveniently forget. Either/or.
Bottom line, the concept of the term ”echo chamber” appears to be what people want. It appears they can’t handle other people having alternative opinions. My lord the butthurt that occurs when someone questions the place that PMs hold in any given plan. They’d rather fight than use the ignore button.
It’s like how some people throw the term racist around never realizing they need to hold a mirror up to their own face. Unfortunately as a mod I can’t use the luxury of the ignore button. I wish other people would when they get so everloving sensitive when their sacred cows get tipped even a little.
winodog
The Bible is a flat earth book
It was once as mighty as the dollar but it unlinked from the gold standerd and has been a fiat note since.
King Samson
I'm Here
I could care less what people use for their financial vehicles, as long as their saving for the future. But there's been a bunch of the PM Bulls that have stated here, that the bulk of their finances are saved in PMs.
Should we believe them, or not, when they post that?
As Kathy just said, this thread was started as a secondary thread, to question what happened to silver. We already had the Rah Rah thread for silver and PMs.
Bottom line if you don't like, or can't handle different points of views on PMs, then maybe the other thread is for you.
But to sit here, and chastise me, for posting regarding what the thread topic is...... well....
LOL... that's funny, we're the "echo chamber". Apparently you haven't spent ANY time reading that other thread. And we're just posting alternative ideas, inline with this thread topic..
Here's another fun fact (can you see I really like numbers):
8 out of 10 millionaires say they became a millionaire through the stock market. Other popular reasons were business and real estate. Yet, the PM Bulls constantly knock down people who invest in the stock market, and actually, over 60% of the population does.
On the other hand, I've done extensive searches, and couldn't find any stats that tell me how many millionaires became that way through PMs.
Why do you think that is?
Seriously? None of what you’ve said has ever been said by anyone other than that little guy in your imagination. Please find a post that actually says that. I’m serious, find it and repost it here with the context.
I keep hearing people saying that but they are only repeating sarcasm and snark, not actual posts by members they claim say it. I know for a fact I’ve called PMs a type of insurance multiple times over the years. I’ve also said there is no cookie cutter approach and everyone is going to have to create their own plan to deal with their own needs.
Please don’t repost that nonsense unless you can back it up with actually posts. It really isn’t a good look.
If it gives someone comfort to hold PMs then by all means do so. Not my business, not my circus, and certainly not my bank account. For me, PMs are primarily a means of passing wealth from one generation to the next. If I didn’t have a next gen, then I doubt I would have the PMs that I do given when and why I acquired them. But that’s me. I take the income approach when it comes to assets.
My opinion is that PMs will never be a mainstream currency. Even after states such as Florida have created ways for people to directly use PMs to pay municipal bills with PMs there are so many requirements and mandates attached to the system that it is only limitedly feasible for some people to do so in a likely hardship case, not as a regular use of PMs as a currency. This is proven out even in war torn areas such as Gaza PMs are not welcome, they prefer small denominations of local currencies.
In my opinion once again, a fully digital currency system will be enacted prior to a full crash. We’re already more than half way there. The PM markets manipulations pretty much lean that direction as well.
The question in my mind which I don’t have the answers for is how will a transition period look. For one it will depend on what is the final driving factor that pushes the currency to be fully digitized and how in line will the rest of the world be when it happens … and they have access to digital funds even in places like Gaza so it isn’t that big of an impossibility even if war is what causes it. Lots of questions left to consider. But that needs to be based on facts, not on assumptions. There’s normalcy bias on all sides of the PM issue.