OP-ED Rachel Campos Duffy: Feminists have an Amy Coney Barrett problem

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
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www.foxnews.com /opinion/rachel-campos-duffy-feminists-amy-coney-barrett

Rachel Campos Duffy: Feminists have an Amy Coney Barrett problem
Rachel Campos-Duffy
6-8 minutes

For the next thirty days, Amy Coney Barrett, President Trump’s nominee for the Supreme Court seat left vacant by Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg’s death, will be the most talked about woman in America.

Her life, both professional and personal, will be under a flaw-enhancing magnifier – the kind every woman detests.

Every decision Barrett has made will be sliced and diced by political operatives hoping to land a knock-out, nomination-killing punch.

Barrett is unquestionably qualified. She graduated number one in her Notre Dame Law School class, eventually winding up as a clerk on the Supreme Court for Judge Antonin Scalia.

Students, colleagues and former professors all agree that she is as brilliant as she is kind, generous, and humble.

In short, she has the perfect intellect and temperament for this all-important, lifetime appointment.

At her nomination ceremony Saturday at the White House she declared her love for America and the Constitution.

She also made no bones about the fact that she shares her former boss’ judicial philosophy that judges do not make policy, they interpret the law.

She’s refreshingly transparent and unlikely to be caught in a gotcha moment.

Barrett’s life challenges the feminist notion that fertility and children are a drain on a woman’s ambition. In her case, children and family gave her professional ambition purpose and perspective.

Since Barrett cannot be attacked on merit, Democrats are in a pickle. How to undermine an indisputably qualified woman in such a way that satisfies your left flank without looking like jerks?

It’s complicated.

The first round of mom-shaming has already been outsourced to social media trolls who are dutifully testing lines of attack before Democratic senators, still stinging from the electoral rebuke of their Kavanaugh spectacle, consider whether or not to use them in nationally televised hearings in October.

This is a dangerous game to play a month before a presidential election where women, including suburban women who look a lot like Barrett, could decide the outcome.

For the old guard feminist establishment, the stakes could not be higher.

As America gets a front-row seat to the life and times of Judge Amy Coney Barrett, a lot of fair-minded women will conclude that her journey looks a lot like feminism to them!

Call it “conservative feminism” if you like, but this feminist rebrand may prove a lot more desirable to everyday American women who harbor more hope for love, marriage, sex, and kids (even lots of them) than woke feminists thought-leaders think is possible or even reasonable.

But wait, how could a pro-life, Catholic mom of seven become the new face of feminism?

How dare she get married and start a family in her 20s? And how provincial to refuse to abide by a socially and environmentally acceptable number of children?

It wasn’t supposed to be this way. The feminist icon torch was supposed to be passed to Hillary Clinton, but she fell short in 2016.

Regardless, her brand of feminism – the icky tradeoffs, the anger, and the man-hating – never sat well with younger, sunnier women.

During her nomination ceremony, Barrett revealed that her husband “asks me every morning what he can do for me that day.”

A young woman hearing that could hardly be blamed for concluding that if she wants to one day have a career and family, the most important decision in her life is who she marries. And if she finds Mr. Right early in life, she would be smart to marry him sooner rather than later, lest she lose her lover and lifelong teammate forever.

That’s definitely not what young women are being taught in their Women’s Studies classes or in the pages of Cosmo.

As for the children, Barrett’s life challenges the feminist notion that fertility and children are a drain on a woman’s ambition. In her case, children and family gave her professional ambition purpose and perspective.

For the Barrett family, the generosity that faith and family life cultivate gave them the courage to open their hearts and homes to not one, but two Haitian children in need of adoption.

Likewise, her students at Notre Dame were as impressed with her maternal compassion as they were by her intellect. Caring for her own child with special needs may in part explain Barrett’s role in mentoring a student who went on to become the Supreme Court’s first visually impaired clerk.

Clearly, Amy Coney Barrett is operating at a higher intellectual and professional level than the vast majority of women.

Nonetheless, her life serves as a model to those of us seeking an alternative to the constraints of feminism.

Barrett broke all the rules in the feminist playbook. Fully aware of her exceptional academic and legal talents, she didn’t take the predictable, high-powered law firm route.

She went back to South Bend, to the Catholic community she knew and loved, to teach and raise babies.

She followed her heart, investing early in the things that last – marriage, family, and a deep and active spiritual life.

It takes courage and faith to build a full personal life when the world is telling you that you are squandering your talents by dividing your time and energy on diapers, carpools and the quotidian work of family life.

Liberals seem to be slowly and begrudgingly coming to terms with the fact that Amy Coney Barrett is more likely than not to replace their beloved and iconic, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, the notorious RBG.

Soon, feminists will also have to contend with the fact that ACB will be an icon in her own right, tempering the excesses of feminism, and offering women the cultural validation that feminism denied them.

She is not a victim of the patriarchy. She is the product of her choices, and she reminds women who want to be mothers that there are miles of space between June Cleaver and Barbara Walters to land on.

President Trump should be commended for recognizing the value of including the voice of a mom with young children on the most important court in the land.

It sends a powerful message about what our country can and should value: the things that last.
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
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She'd better be confirmed before the election. The Marxists are counting on their "pwned" Chief Justice Roberts to provide an 4-4 deadlock on any cases coming before them on the election. That's why they're so hysterical to block her appointment.
 
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packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
Stolen from a meme on Facebook.

Tell me again that babies keep you from your dreams?

In accepting her Golden Globe award, Michelle Williams said, “I've tried my very best to make a life of my own making…and I wouldn't have been able to do this without employing a women's right to choose.”

THIS
1f446_1f3fb.png
ideology has been sold to women for the past 60 years to make us believe that our own flesh and blood will keep us from happiness and life itself. It sells motherhood as the lowest possible position and hands her abortion has the means out of it. This ideology pits a mother against her child. The baby is now the enemy and stands in the way of freedom and happiness. There is NO DREAM, NO LIFE, that is worth the murdering of a child.

And now, we have another woman, Amy Coney Barrett, who stands in great opposition to the words and Michelle and this ideology...

Amy is wife to Jesse, a criminal defense attorney, she is mother to 7 children, a lawyer, jurist, and academic who serves as a circuit judge on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit, and now nominated for the Supreme Court.

The abortion ideology abhors Amy and MANY other mothers who have proven time and time again that Babies And Dreams ALWAYS go together...and often interdependent on one another.

Michelle’s words saddened me greatly, and I sincerely pray for all those that believe this lie, since I too in my past, believed many of the lies of our culture.

But Amy’s LIFE gives me hope. Hope that our world (and its women) will recognize the powerful contribution of women, of mothers ... and for these roles to be fulfilled, we do NOT have to kill our children.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
This is a dangerous game to play a month before a presidential election where women, including suburban women who look a lot like Barrett, could decide the outcome.

The hatred towards Amy and her catholic faith is already backfiring and is turning those who are on the fence into Trump supporters. Or rather they are turning into supporters of the constitution.
 

marsh

On TB every waking moment
The issue with traditional suburban feminists will not be with her motherhood, her children or her Catholic Faith. It will be her long time affiliation with the tight knit People of Praise - which is not governed by the Catholic Church.

The fringe group makes s women accountable to her husband's guidance aas her superior. Whether this will clash with mainstream modern women's view of marriage as an equal partnership and whether the covenant to the group brings into question her independence of thought will be a question. In addition, the group opposes homosexuality, which is a vocal and wealthy constituency in the US.


How Amy Coney Barrett’s Religious Group Helped Shape a City
The People of Praise isn’t well-understood by outsiders, but its influence — and social conservatism — run deeply through this Indiana city.
The Trinity School, where Amy Coney Barrett, President Donald Trump’s pick to replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg on the Supreme Court, served as a board member on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Ind.

Photos by Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine
By ADAM WREN
09/27/2020 07:23 PM EDT

Adam Wren is a contributing editor at Politico Magazine and Indianapolis Monthly.

SOUTH BEND, Ind. — In 2002, when Amy Coney Barrett moved here to begin her academic career, she joined the faculty at the law school where she’d been a student, attended Notre Dame football games and eventually joined a Primal Fitness gym where she’s currently known for her fierce pullup workout. She also connected with one other local community: People of Praise, a charismatic Christian group founded here in 1971.

Many aspects of her life dovetail with a typical high-achieving résumé: the summa cum laude law degree, the steady stream of academic papers, the family’s picturesque 3,800-square-foot brick home and the legendary Mardi Gras parties they’ve hosted over the years, bringing a little flair from her native suburban New Orleans to Indiana.

Her spiritual group, however, has drawn more questions. People of Praise is one of a number of groups that rose up in the 1960s and '70s to offer intense, highly supportive religious communities, in the style of evangelical churches, within the Catholic tradition. The group, though mostly Catholic, is outside control of the church itself. The group has a website, but doesn’t let reporters visit its worship center. When Barrett was nominated for her federal judgeship in 2017, she didn’t disclose her involvement. Critics, even those wary of making religion an issue in a judicial appointment, have questioned what role its member agreements—it’s “neither an oath nor a vow, but it is an important personal commitment,” the website notes—plays in her legal philosophy. Former members have called it “secretive” and a “cult”—and, above all, it has remained something of an opaque chapter attached to the life of an increasingly public figure.

The Trinity School, where Amy Coney Barrett served as a board member on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Indiana. | Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine

The Trinity School, where Amy Coney Barrett served as a board member, in South Bend, Indiana.

What’s difficult to understand outside South Bend, however, is just how deeply integrated this group is into the local community. Though the group has only a few thousand local members, and keeps a low profile as an organization, its influence and footprint in the city are significant. That influence, and its resistance to liberal changes in the wider culture, are likely to arise as issues in her Supreme Court nomination hearings, expected to begin Oct. 12.

People of Praise includes several prominent local families, including real estate agents and local financial advisers, who act as a sort of professional network for families in the group and provide considerable social capital to its members. In South Bend mayoral elections, campaigns have been known to strategize about winning over People of Praise as a constituency, given the fact that they live close together in several neighborhoods. The group runs Trinity School at Greenlawn, a private intermediate and high school that is considered by some to be the best—and most conservative—school in South Bend. Families from Notre Dame and elsewhere, even unaffiliated with the group, pay $14,000 to attend grades 9-12 and $13,000 for grades 6-8. Barrett served on its board from 2015 to 2017, and her husband, Jesse, a former assistant U.S. attorney who is now a partner in a law firm here, advised the school’s nationally recognized mock trial team.

As industry receded in South Bend with the closure of the automaker Studebaker in 1963, People of Praise has grown to occupy some of the city’s most storied institutions. The group’s original home was the nine-floor, 233-room Hotel LaSalle, a Georgian Revival structure from the 1920s, one of the most prominent buildings in downtown South Bend. When the group moved into the building in 1975, after it was bought by Charismatic Renewal Services, Inc., a closely affiliated nonprofit, it cleared out one floor to serve as a communal day care, and used a former ballroom for its meetings, where members spoke in tongues and practiced healing. Some members lived there.

For the right, Amy Coney Barrett's Supreme Court nomination seals the deal on a conservative majority for years to come. To the left, it's a rushed political attempt to undo abortion rights and Obamacare.

Trinity School occupies a sprawling mansion situated on a sylvan property on the east side of town that was formerly owned by the Studebaker family, whose factory once employed 30,000 workers. The group’s main meeting hall, which isn’t listed on Google Maps, is a former bowling alley and indoor soccer complex 10 minutes from downtown, near the Trinity sports fields.

As the group’s members grew their families, many gaining prominence in the community, they spread out through the suburban neighborhoods and business community of South Bend “They’re involved in all sorts of professional life, whether it’s real estate or law or whatever,” said Ryan Dvorak, a South Bend-based Democratic Indiana state representative who ran for mayor in 2011, when I asked him about the group’s local presence.
On Thursday evening, as a cool breeze swept over the city and national network correspondents staked out the Barretts’ home in their rental cars, I joined a 25-year-old former People of Praise member to tour her old stomping grounds, including Trinity, which she attended, and the group’s worship center. (This former member, who once worked for the congressional campaign of businessman Democrat Mel Hall in 2018, requested anonymity for the privacy of her family; she grew up in People of Praise, but says they became disillusioned with the group after several decades of membership, having moved from Maryland to South Bend to be closer to fellow members when she was young.)

The headquarters is a modest and unmarked two-story brick building east of downtown, just north of the school on the same campus. As we walked across the green grounds, a man who appeared to be in his 20s ran toward us, asking us to identify ourselves. My guide recognized him as a former classmate. “I thought y’all were reporters,” he said, out of breath. “They’ve been calling us a ton. It’s been no fun. They’ve been calling us a cult. It’s like, ‘Well, I don't know what to tell you, but we’re not.’” He sighed. We left.

The Barretts’ five oldest children attended Trinity School, founded in 1981. Trinity operates two other private schools, in Eagan, Minn., and in Falls Church, Va. (Though the institution was founded by People of Praise, now Trinity Schools, Inc. and the People of Praise are separate 501 (c)(3) corporations.) Group membership isn’t required to work there; faculty members, however, must be Christian and “assent in good faith to the tenets of the Nicene Creed,“ according to the Trinity cultural statement.

The home of Amy Coney Barrett photographed on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Indiana. | Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine

The home of Amy Coney Barrett, photographed on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020, in South Bend, Indiana.

The school publishes a “cultural statement” laying out its views on social issues. It articulates a clear, conservative Christian set of values, including discouraging sex before marriage and cautioning students who experience same-sex attraction from “prematurely interpret[ing] any particular emotional experience as identity-defining.” It also appears to have been at odds with American law while Barrett served on the board: A version of the statement from the 2018-19 school year, provided to POLITICO by the parent of an alum, says: “the only proper place for human sexual activity is marriage, where marriage is a legal and committed relationship between one man and one woman.” “Homosexual acts” are said to be “at odds with Scripture.” A spokesperson for the school said the language changed around the 2018-19 school year, meaning it would have been in place during Barrett’s tenure as a board member from 2015-17—and well after the Supreme Court decision Obergefell v. Hodges, which in 2015 legalized same-sex marriage nationwide.

The current version still disapproves of same-sex marriage: “We understand marriage to be a legal and committed relationship between a man and a woman and believe that the only proper place for sexual activity is within these bounds of conjugal love.” The spokesman also added that there is a new passage rejecting “any form of harassment, bullying, verbal abuse or intimidation by any member of the Trinity School community towards any other member for any reason,” including a “student’s sex, race, ethnicity, religion, sexuality or perceived sexuality.”

A White House spokesperson said Barrett had no involvement in crafting the statement, but it aligns with her public views on the subject: she co-signed a letter to Catholic bishops, dated three months after the Obergefell decision, affirming that marriage is the “indissoluble commitment of a man and a woman.” In a 1998 article "Catholic Judges in Capital Cases," she referred to abortion as “always immoral.” Barrett has also said these views would not impact her jurisprudence. “It’s never appropriate for a judge to impose that judge’s personal convictions—whether they derive from faith or anywhere else—on the law,” she said during her 2017 confirmation.

The school is popular even among Notre Dame faculty who are not affiliated with People of Praise: It takes a seminar-style approach to education, focusing on reading original texts. The ninth-grade reading list includes The Federalist Papers and the Lincoln-Douglas debates. By 10th grade, students are reading Jean-Jacques Rousseau; before they graduate, they will have read John Locke’s "Second Treatise on Civil Government." Trinity teams have also represented Indiana in National High School Mock Trial competitions.

Though its members are influential, the People of Praise tends to stay out of the public eye as an organization. Many South Benders say they knew little or nothing about the group prior to Barrett’s 2017 nomination to the federal court; Jack Colwell, the city columnist at the South Bend Tribune, told me he hadn't heard of the group before Barrett’s nomination to the 7th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.

The People of Praise meeting house, photographed on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Indiana. Amy Coney Barrett is a member of the group. | Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine

The People of Praise meeting house in South Bend, Indiana.

But the group had become woven into the civic fabric, nonetheless. “Over the years, members of the People of Praise have become solid, indeed strong members of the South Bend community,” says Robert Schmuhl, professor emeritus of American Studies at the University of Notre Dame, who has taught here since 1980. (Schmuhl’s son, Mike, ran former South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg’s 2020 presidential campaign.) “They have been responsible for a number of activities that have added to the spiritual and cultural life of the community.”
In 1971, two Catholic charismatics, Kevin Ranaghan and Paul DeCelles, founded People of Praise in South Bend, according to a history of the group written by one of its first 29 members, Adrian Reimers, a former Notre Dame professor who later became a critic of the movement. (Reimer declined an interview with POLITICO.) It’s not a church; members attend services at their own churches, mostly Catholic. There were two tiers of memberships: “underway,” in which members take courses and aren’t yet considered fully admitted to People of Praise, and “covenanted” members, making an agreement to each other to abide by the group’s dictates.

In his 1986 article “Charismatic Covenant Community: A Failed Promise” published in Cultic Studies Journal, Reimers wrote that members agreed “to obey the direction of the Holy Spirit manifested in and through these ministries in full harmony with the Church. ... We recognize in the covenant a unique relationship one to another and between the individual and the community. We accept the responsibility for mutual care, concern, and ministry among ourselves. We will serve each other and the community as a whole in all needs: spiritual, material, financial. ... We agree that the weekly meeting of the community is primary among our commitments and not to be absent except for a serious reason.”

Part 1 of 2
 

marsh

On TB every waking moment
Part 2 of 2

Asked about the covenant, Sean Connolly, the group’s communications director, told POLITICO in an email: “After a multi-year period of prayer and discernment, many People of Praise members choose to make a permanent commitment called a covenant. The covenant of the People of Praise is a promise of love and service we choose to make to one another. The covenant is not an oath or a vow. Our covenant is a commitment to be there for one another for the long run, to support one another through thick and thin, through all of life's seasons.”

Eventually, the group’s members spread out into neighborhoods such as Barrett’s Harter Heights. The group also acquired its current meeting house near Trinity’s athletic fields, along Ironwood Road, a few miles from the school. The virtually windowless facility, dotted with private property signs, sports a black-and-white People of Praise sign on the side. In the back of the worship center last Thursday night, on a patio where People of Praise youth gather for the Action Group, a kind of youth group, a whiteboard showed a diagram of the mythological House of Atreus.

Media wait outside the home of Amy Coney Barrett photographed on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Indiana. | Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine

Media wait outside the home of Amy Coney Barrett on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020, in South Bend, Indiana.

Since Barrett’s 2017 nomination to the federal bench, journalists have worked to learn more about the group, in some cases describing a “sexist” and “authoritarian” environment. Barrett has never confirmed her involvement in People of Praise, nor has People of Praise confirmed her membership—though she hasn’t denied reports of her membership from numerous outlets over the past two years. But the former member who spoke to POLITICO said she saw Barrett and her family at meetings on Sundays, and the family regularly sat in front of hers. “She prayed with my mother when we were adopting my youngest brother, my dad and her husband got to know each other pretty well, and my other brother and her son were in a Saturday boys group together,” this person said. “My point being that, though I don’t agree with her political affiliations, I think she’s probably a really kind person.”

The last time she recalls seeing the Barrett family at a meeting was in 2011, when she was in high school. The group’s magazine, Vine and Branches, published photos of her, as well as birth and adoption announcements, before later scrubbing them. A 2018 article by the National Catholic Reporter raised questions about “the group’s practice of being accountable to a more spiritually mature personal adviser, called a ‘head’ for men and previously called a ‘handmaiden” (now ‘women’s leader’) for single women. Married women — such as Barrett — are ‘headed’ by their husbands.”

On Sundays, the parking lot here fills up with 12-passenger vans, as People of Praise families are typically large, according to the former member, whose parents were involved for nearly 20 years, before leaving when, despite their best efforts, they could not advance from the underway classification to full covenanted status. Her parents’ spiritual guides in the group urged the family to not save for college, she said, but instead pay for Trinity, because it would pay off with a college scholarship.

Though families are free to leave, in South Bend there is fear about losing the social capital and status membership affords. “When my parents left, they lost all their friends,” the former member said. There is anxiety: “If I leave, is my kid going to get into Notre Dame?”
People of Praise’s former headquarters in downtown South Bend is now a mixed-use apartment complex called The LaSalle, most recently renovated in 2017. Its first floor is home to the Hideaway, a wood-paneled cocktail bar. On a recent evening, Jerry Roberts, 57, owner of the Hideaway, made an Old Fashioned on what was an otherwise slow night. The cocktail bar, he said, was once the smoking lounge for the People of Praise.

After he opened the bar, Roberts said, he was given a tour of the building by members of People of Praise. Long before Barrett’s involvement in the group brought it national attention, he had heard the group was a cult. “I’ve been told it’s a cult by everyone I’ve talked to,” he tells me.

Now that national attention is back. Earlier in the evening, regional reporters from CNN and NBC trained their eyes and lenses on Barrett's house. “I’m sure she deals with it like everything else—with grace,” Nicole Garnett, Notre Dame’s John P. Murphy Foundation Professor of Law, told me Friday morning. Garnett, among Barrett’s closest friends and a neighbor, has known her since they met in 1998. At the time, Garnett was clerking for Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas and Barrett was clerking for Antonin Scalia. They bonded over takeout Japanese eaten out of bento boxes in the courtyard.

Notre Dame, South Bend’s most prominent institution, is fiercely protective of Barrett. After POLITICO published a story about Barrett’s path to the nomination, which mentioned her involvement in People of Praise, as well as Notre Dame’s legal conservatism, Paul Browne, vice president of public affairs and communications, canceled on-campus interviews I requested with fellow law professors, though Garnett still agreed to speak with me.

Asked specifically about People of Praise, Garnett told me: “I know a lot of folks are involved in People of Praise, and they’re members of a parish, and they’re just your normal, nice, generous people.” Her own daughter attends Trinity, and she says she knows a number of Notre Dame faculty who are members of People of Praise.
The Trinity School, where Amy Coney Barrett served as a board member on Friday, Sept. 25, 2020 in South Bend, Indiana. | Taylor Glascock for Politico Magazine

The Trinity School, where Amy Coney Barrett served as a board member, in South Bend, Indiana.

In South Bend, despite Barrett’s national prominence, she never crossed paths with another famous South Bender, former Mayor Pete Buttigieg. “I don’t know her, personally,” Buttigieg told me in 2019. I asked him whether the local judge would be among his Supreme Court picks should he be elected. “From what I know of her personal judicial philosophy, I can't picture it,” he said. According to a copy of Barrett’s ballot history from the Indiana Statewide Voter Registration System obtained by POLITICO, Barrett voted in the 2016 and 2018 general elections, and the 2016 Republican primary, though she pulled a Democratic ballot in the 2011 primary, when Buttigeg ran for mayor.

Prior to the pandemic, Coney Barrett would travel to Chicago a couple of times a month to hear cases before the 7th Circuit, but kept her chambers and law school office back in South Bend. She keeps an office near the center of campus, and teaches two classes—one a statutory interpretation and one on constitutional theory. She does high-intensity training at Primal Fitness, where she is said to be fiercely competitive and particularly adept at pullups. She rarely eats out at local establishments, on account of her large family.

The Garnetts and Barretts have raised their families together, she said. Garnett’s daughter, Maggie, wrote a FoxNews.com op-ed about their close relationship.

“As a child, the Barretts’ house was one of my favorite places,” Garnett writes. “We spent countless dinners, holidays and weekday afternoons there.”

Garnett said they had plans with the Barretts last Friday evening, though wasn’t sure whether the scheduled gathering stood. “Hey Rick,” she had said to her husband earlier that morning, before we talked. We were supposed to go to the Barretts’ tonight.”

“I don’t think that’s gonna happen.”
 

blueinterceptor

Veteran Member
It might just be me, but, a feminist should relish a strong woman. A woman that’s successful, confident, well educated and can do it all. What feminism seems to be is a celebration of loony leftists that aren’t sure of who they are. The more screwed up the better
 

Dennis Olson

Chief Curmudgeon
_______________
It might just be me, but, a feminist should relish a strong woman. A woman that’s successful, confident, well educated and can do it all. What feminism seems to be is a celebration of loony leftists that aren’t sure of who they are. The more screwed up the better
You’re confusing original feminism with today’s version. They are entirely different.
 

Seeker22

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Covenant of Praise sounds good if you get Prince Charming for a husband. What if you get an abuser, a liar, a cheat, a sadist? Some of those things show after the marriage and by then, it is too late. Is a woman supposed to follow behind the likes of that when her integrity, her gentleness, her honesty- are impeccable? I for one don't think so.
 
It might just be me, but, a feminist should relish a strong woman. A woman that’s successful, confident, well educated and can do it all. What feminism seems to be is a celebration of loony leftists that aren’t sure of who they are. The more screwed up the better
I knew a female doc many years ago. She had 4 children. They all became doctors too. When she was 58 she married a man who was 38. She told me to always go for a younger man.
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
Covenant of Praise sounds good if you get Prince Charming for a husband. What if you get an abuser, a liar, a cheat, a sadist? Some of those things show after the marriage and by then, it is too late. Is a woman supposed to follow behind the likes of that when her integrity, her gentleness, her honesty- are impeccable? I for one don't think so.
I don't either, and I'm strongly against divorce... or "frivorce" as MS loves to rant. But while I firmly believe that marriage between two rational adults who WANT it to work, and who are sincerely attempting (even though they both are fallible sinners, as we all are) to follow God's will in their lives can be an amazing relationship, well... that fallible human thing comes in sometimes.

And while too many men *and* women rush into a commitment due to lust, societal pressure (girlfriends getting married, parents want grandchildren) etc, there are an awful lot of sociopaths, and they can maintain a facade of normalcy and empathy for months or years... only to change into a nasty, sadistic abuser (whether physically or mentally) within days (or hours) of the wedding.

NO ONE should be forced to stay in a genuinely abusive marriage. Note; "genuine abuse" is slapping the sandwich out of your hands or dumping the hot bowl of soup in your face because it wasn't exactly as he wanted, NOT asking if you'd mind making him lunch!

My mom's parents were married for 57 hellish years. He was a paranoid schizophrenic who self medicated with alcohol... also one of the toughest, hardest working men I've ever seen... I remember seeing him shingling a 2nd story roof in 95 degree temps- at the age of 87. And he was an amazing artist... some of his sculptures were just stunning.

But he also was nasty, devious and cruel. He was constantly abusive to my grandmother, with incessant little digs about her appearance, housekeeping, mental abilities, etc... think Archie Bunker and Edith, but without any of the underlying love. I remember one time he kept pestering her to turn in the garbage compactor in the kitchen. Just a constant stream of little remarks, until she decided to open it to see "why". He had put her beloved cat inside... and of course, if she had turned it on, it woukd have been horrific.

And then there were the multiple forced abortions... granted it was the depths of the depression, and they were nearly starving and kept getting evicted for nonpayment of rent, but her life was apparently threatened if she didn't go to the back alley abortionist.

Yet, her priest told her that under no circumstances could she consider divorce. They were married, there was no evidence of infidelity, and Divorce Isn't Allowed. Period.

I often wondered if he had killed her in one of his drunken rages, if the priest could have been charged as an accessory.

Summerthyme
 
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MinnesotaSmith

Membership Revoked
This all may be moot. Over on Instapundit, there is discussion about Trump possibly doing a recess appointment to replace Justice Ginsberg.
 

Seeker22

Has No Life - Lives on TB
You have to look at exactly who started Feminism and who and what they actually were. What their goals were. Why did they want to destroy the American family? The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world. Men are stronger with a good wife and a strong man is a better fighter. He has something for which to fight. So the Traditional Family had to go.

Once you can say that name with out whispering it, look deeper. These same kinds of people gave us Hollywood. The silver screen and all the ooohhhss and aaahhhsss of motion pictures and all our on screen heroes. Until it morphed into sex and violence and now perversion and satanic in your face signaling if you know what you are looking at. That takes courage to investigate, too.

These people are all about getting you in the palm of their hand (think cell phones and computers) and then they MORPH and suddenly, it's a nightmare.

Feminism just followed the same template. None of this was organic. None of this just happened.

This is who we will have to root out in order to take our Country back. Will Barrett be instrumental in that? I hope so.
 

marsh

On TB every waking moment
Feminism was about becoming a sexual being (not just to lie back and think of England.) It was about becoming self supporting and not being an accessory, totally beholden to your husband for your living and having little existence outside your children and being supportive of your husband. It meant the potential of having a career and education that developed your own brain and talents. (Why so many adult women of the period divorced to go "find themselves.")

My grandmother never learned to drive. Her husband paid the bills and gave her a small allowance. She wore a housecoat most of the time and seldom went out of the house except for once a week bridge club. I loved her, but I am happy that this was not my life.

I always loved the movie Pleasantville. To me, it was the spirit of traditional feminism. It added dimension and color to a woman's life. Having a choice as to what her path would be meant so much.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
Covenant of Praise sounds good if you get Prince Charming for a husband. What if you get an abuser, a liar, a cheat, a sadist? Some of those things show after the marriage and by then, it is too late. Is a woman supposed to follow behind the likes of that when her integrity, her gentleness, her honesty- are impeccable? I for one don't think so.

This can happen to anyone no matter the religion. With those types of spouses more often than not the only way out of the relationship is in a body bag.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
I don't either, and I'm strongly against divorce... or "frivorce" as MS loves to rant. But while I firmly believe that marriage between two rational adults who WANT it to work, and who are sincerely attempting (even though they both are fallible sinners, as we all are) to follow God's will in their lives can be an amazing relationship, well... that fallible human thing comes in sometimes.

And while too many men *and* women rush into a commitment due to lust, societal pressure (girlfriends getting married, parents want grandchildren) etc, there are an awful lot of sociopaths, and they can maintain a facade of normalcy and empathy for months or years... only to change into a nasty, sadistic abuser (whether physically or mentally) within days (or hours) of the wedding.

NO ONE should be forced to stay in a genuinely abusive marriage. Note; "genuine abuse" is slapping the sandwich out of your hands or dumping the hot bowl of soup in your face because it wasn't exactly as he wanted, NOT asking if you'd mind making him lunch!

My mom's parents were married for 57 hellish years. He was a paranoid schizophrenic who self medicated with alcohol... also one of the toughest, hardest working men I've ever seen... I remember seeing him shingling a 2nd story roof in 95 degree temps- at the age of 87. And he was an amazing artist... some of his sculptures were just stunning.

But he also was nasty, devious and cruel. He was constantly abusive to my grandmother, with incessant little digs about her appearance, housekeeping, mental abilities, etc... think Archie Bunker and Edith, but without any of the underlying love. I remember one time he kept pestering her to turn in the garbage compactor in the kitchen. Just a constant stream of little remarks, until she decided to open it to see "why". He had put her beloved cat inside... and of course, if she had turned it on, it woukd have been horrific.

And then there were the multiple forced abortions... granted it was the depths of the depression, and they were nearly starving and kept getting evicted for nonpayment of rent, but her life was apparently threatened if she didn't go to the back alley abortionist.

Yet, her priest told her that under no circumstances could she consider divorce. They were married, there was no evidence of infidelity, and Divorce Isn't Allowed. Period.

I often wondered if he had killed her in one of his drunken rages, if the priest could have been charged as an accessory.

Summerthyme


The movie Sleeping with the Enemy comes to mind.
 
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