CORONA Kunstler: When Americans Wake From The Corona-Coma, This Will Be A Different Country

Blacknarwhal

Let's Go Brandon!
So Kunstler's pulling out the Happy Motoring fallacy again, but aside from that, he raises a few good points. Looks like anyone who's holding farm ground might be in a good position. Though I note he doesn't talk much about the Internet, which will have some impact on things accordingly.

Fair use cited so on and so forth.


Kunstler: When Americans Wake From The Corona-Coma, This Will Be A Different Country

Authored by James Howard Kunstler via Kunstler.com,

People, Get Ready!
The cable news announced the other day that Covid-19 patients placed in critical care may have to be on ventilators for 21 days. Only a few years ago, I went in for an ordinary hip replacement. A month or so later, I got the hospital billing statement. One of the line-items went like this: Room and board: 36 hours…$23,482.79. I am not jiving you. That was just for the hospital bed and maybe four lousy hospital meals, not the surgery or the meds or anything else. All that was billed extra. Say, what…?

Now imagine you have the stupendous good fortune to survive a Covid-19 infection after 21 days on a ventilator and go home. What is that billing statement going to look like? Will the survivors wish they’d never made out of the hospital alive?




Right now, we’re in the heroic phase of the battle against a modern age plague. The doctors, nurses, and their helpers are like the trembling soldiers in an amphibious landing craft churning toward the Normandy beach where the enemy is dug in and waiting for them, with sweaty fingers on their machine guns and a stink in the pillbox. Some of the doctors and nurses will go down in the battle. The fabled fog-of-war will conceal what is happening to the health care system itself, while the battle rages. After that, what?



One thing will be pretty clear: That the folks in charge of things gave trillions of dollars to Wall Street while tens or perhaps hundreds of thousands of Covid-19 survivors got wiped out financially with gargantuan medical bills. Do you think the Chargemaster part of the hospital routine will just stop doing its thing during this emergency? The billings will continue – just as the proverbial beatings will continue until morale improves! In the aftermath, I can’t even imagine the ‘splainin’ that will entail. The rage may be too intense to even get to that. For some, it may be time to lubricate the guillotines?

Meantime, of course, the global economy has shut down which suggests to me, anyway, that any prior frame of reference you may have had about money and business and social normality goes out the window.

The world is still here. We’re just going to have to learn to live in differently. The American portion of the world is in need of a severe retrofit and reprogramming. We waited too long to face this in a spell of tragic complacency and the virus has forced the issue.


Here are the main things we have to attend to:

  • Reconsider how we inhabit the landscape. Do you think $20-a-barrel oil is a boon to the Happy Motoring way-of-life? It’s going to at least bankrupt most of the companies producing shale oil, and that’s where way-more than half of our production came from in recent years. How many ordinary Americans will be able to finance car payments now? To say suburbia will not be functioning too well mere months from now is a merciful way to put it.
  • The big cities will not recover from the trauma and stigma of the virus, but that is only the beginning their problems. What, exactly, will the suffering poor of the ghettos do, under orders to remain cooped-up until the end of April? These are people who are unlikely to have laid in supplies ahead of time, and a month from now they are sure to be very hungry. How will the big cities be able to manage their infrastructures with municipal bonds massively failing? How will they provide social services when tax revenues are down to a trickle? The answer is, they won’t manage any of this. They grew too big and too complex. Now they have to get smaller, and the process will not be pretty.
  • What will the business of America be after Covid-19? If we’re lucky, it will be growing food and working at many of the activities that support it: moving it, storing it, selling it, making an order of smaller-scaled farm machinery, including machines that can be used with horses and oxen, breeding the animals. I’m not kidding. Growing food happens in the countryside, where the fields and pastures are. There are towns there, too, associated with the farming, where much of the business of farming and the activities that support it transact. I believe we’ll see impressive demographic movements of people to these places. There are opportunities in all that, a plausible future. The scale of agriculture will have to change downward, too. AgriBiz, with its giant “inputs” of chemicals and borrowed money, is not going to make it. Farms have to get smaller too, and more people will have to work on them. Farewell to the age of the taco chip!
  • If we want to get around this big country of ours, and move food from one place to another, we better think about fixing the railroads. Try to imagine what six trillion dollars might have done for that crucial venture. And I’m not talking about high-speed and high-tech; I mean the railroads that were already here. Where I live, the tracks are still in place, rusting in the rain. How did we let that happen?
  • Then there is the question of how do we behave? You may not think that matters so much, but we’ve become so profoundly dishonest that it’s impeding our relationship with reality. On top of that we’re surly, impolite, clownish, blustering, greedy, and improvident. Believe me, that is going to change. Hardship is a great attitude-adjuster.
When Americans awake from the corona coma like millions of Rip Van Winkles, it will matter again to be upright and to act in good faith. This will be a different country.
 

Dobbin

Faithful Steed
Meh. He overstates.

$20 a bbl oil will not STAY $20 oil afterwards. Likely it will become $100 oil for a short time after the competitive losers of production attempt to re-compete. Then competition between producers, old and NEW will reduce this back to where it was before all this started. The price will "oscillate" as the invisible hand of the market" finds out the new price-point of oil production/market consumption.

Railroads will not compete with truckers until all the railroad infrastructure is taken over by the Federal Government - as is the current business model for the Interstate Highway System. And the Electric Utilities. Rails will become like "Deregulation" of the utilities where a single PUC dominated rail maintainer will control the rail infrastructure (Like a PUC controlled "wires utility") while independent carriers (i.e. Power Producers for Electricity) will carry the transportation load.

AS for growing food - agribusiness will continue, and small independent producers will each have their niche.

Not saying it won't change. Just that the change will not be as extreme or earth shattering as Mr. D. says.

I go with Trump - "Some business will go out of business - shortly to re-emerge as NEW businesses."

Dobbin
 

20Gauge

TB Fanatic
Meh. He overstates.

$20 a bbl oil will not STAY $20 oil afterwards. Likely it will become $100 oil for a short time after the competitive losers of production attempt to re-compete. Then competition between producers, old and NEW will reduce this back to where it was before all this started. The price will "oscillate" as the invisible hand of the market" finds out the new price-point of oil production/market consumption.

Railroads will not compete with truckers until all the railroad infrastructure is taken over by the Federal Government - as is the current business model for the Interstate Highway System. And the Electric Utilities. Rails will become like "Deregulation" of the utilities where a single PUC dominated rail maintainer will control the rail infrastructure (Like a PUC controlled "wires utility") while independent carriers (i.e. Power Producers for Electricity) will carry the transportation load.

AS for growing food - agribusiness will continue, and small independent producers will each have their niche.

Not saying it won't change. Just that the change will not be as extreme or earth shattering as Mr. D. says.

I go with Trump - "Some business will go out of business - shortly to re-emerge as NEW businesses."

Dobbin
I agree there will be fewer businesses and new businesses will be created. I also agree the parts of food and oil production, etc.

What I don't agree with is that all things will be the same? They have changed and changed in ways many of us simply do not understand. As we have only lived through weeks or a couple of months of this virus, we do not have the depth of suffering on any level as those who lived through other periods where they truly suffered. Such as those who lived in the Great Depression.

BUT

The length of this virus and depth of how much society suffers will change the way we view the world.

Already, we are seeing preppers who have now been validated in their views of society.
We have begun to see people who now realize their debt is a curse on them and vow never to have any again.
We have seen people who are now beginning to realize they need more savings and will work towards that.
We have seen people who have sunk to the lowest levels of humanity and are enjoying themselves as never before.
We have seen people who now realize government will screw them the first chance it has.

and it goes on.

The longer this lasts, the more change we will see no matter how hard people are trying to maintain their previous lives, those lives no longer exist... there is before the virus and after the virus. Yes, the virus will be with us forever, but there is that line in the sand that still stands and will stand as long as people remember.
 

Meemur

Voice on the Prairie / FJB!
Mathew 6:34
New International Version

Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

Most know me well enough to know that I don't make it a habit of peppering my posts with Bible verses, but this is a situation where Mathew 6:34 applies. I'm trying to make my focus today and live in the moment as much as it is reasonable.
 

Sacajawea

Has No Life - Lives on TB
IMO, it's already changed. It's not going back to normal. Ever.
Oh... some things will hang in there - either to control or spy on Americans or "in the public interest".

Superficially, it was the virus that evoked the awareness; was the catalyst. But the BIG GOV types have just been waiting for this opportunity. The plans have been dusted off now and are being rolled out.

All bets are off. It's for all the marbles like has been said repeatedly.
 

Blacknarwhal

Let's Go Brandon!
IMO, it's already changed. It's not going back to normal. Ever.
Oh... some things will hang in there - either to control or spy on Americans or "in the public interest".

Superficially, it was the virus that evoked the awareness; was the catalyst. But the BIG GOV types have just been waiting for this opportunity. The plans have been dusted off now and are being rolled out.

All bets are off. It's for all the marbles like has been said repeatedly.

So is it that you think Trump would allow that, or that Trump is unable to STOP it?
 

Faroe

Un-spun
Can't say myself for sure, but I think Trump is unable to stop it.
I haven't watched much of the press appearances, but from what little I do see, lately he seems to be more of a prisoner than a President.

I hope that will change. What he is up against is HUGE.
 

hiwall

Has No Life - Lives on TB
It is not just businesses. All levels of government will be in the same shape as most businesses - broke. The federal government will have to bailout most cities, counties, and even states.
By the time everything is done the national debt will be in the thirties of trillions. And how will we even pay the interest on that debt?
And nobody is even talking about pensions yet.
 

PghPanther

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Look no further than the private cartel who control the money supply here and worldwide............aka the WASP/Zionist elites who pull the reigns on all of this.......

In all of US history only 3 presidents dared defined them........

1) Andrew Jackson who killed the central bank for a while......(and during that time we had no inflation)...they arranged for numerous assassination attempts on his life which failed.........and they even had the white house burned down hoping that he was in it...............

2) Lincoln who issued the greenback independent of central bank monies..........they made sure a bullet ended up in his head............additionally his idea of sending the slaves back to Africa was not in the designs of the elite who wanted freed slaves to remain in American and weigh on its society.

3) Kennedy who issued silver certificates independent of the central bank........and they made sure he has his skull blown apart from a bullet on national tv live in front of the whole US.........he pissed off a number of other groups too.......but it was his idea taking a nuclear option off the table in ME for a certain group of folks weighed down on him more than any other situation than threatening the central bankers.

Sometimes connecting the dots gives you a clearer picture than you really want to admit............at least I felt that way for a long time until I realize the mountain of evidence that continues to pile up demonstrates that Presidents are chosen by the elites and then act as their puppets................its a good theater of distraction for the public to play the two party system but the usual suspects have them both covered.............the last time someone made an attempt to knock that two party system out was with Perot whom the elites made him look like a stooge in the end and as a result have destroyed any chance of another independent being able to run or participate in any debates...............
 

Blacknarwhal

Let's Go Brandon!
It is not just businesses. All levels of government will be in the same shape as most businesses - broke. The federal government will have to bailout most cities, counties, and even states.
By the time everything is done the national debt will be in the thirties of trillions. And how will we even pay the interest on that debt?
And nobody is even talking about pensions yet.

Unless, of course, no one's planning to repay it. Remember, the Fed is now part of the Treasury Department, essentially. Great time to say PHHFT! to FRN-denominated debt.
 

NoMoreLibs

Kill Commie's, Every Single One Of Them!
No IT guy in that pic? You're kidding me.

This forum alone has over 40K replies/info on this goofy thing not including all the other threads about it. Not one 1 flows without IT.

Then all the folks remoting. Yeah boy, plenty of IT guys keeping later days lately I bet.

Remember 3 lines of code to make this server work better when things really started getting hot? Yup.
 

Troke

On TB every waking moment
It is not just businesses. All levels of government will be in the same shape as most businesses - broke. The federal government will have to bailout most cities, counties, and even states.
By the time everything is done the national debt will be in the thirties of trillions. And how will we even pay the interest on that debt?
And nobody is even talking about pensions yet.
The federal government will have to bailout most cities, counties, and even states.
Pension plans at all levels are in the tank (Metaphor there) Their only hope is a Fed bailout. Otherwise the pensions promised will not be delivered leading to a large number of greatly vexed people. I cannot imagine the deficit but it might equal the Fed before recent times.
 

Matt

Veteran Member
When these legions of poor souls emerge from this disaster and find themselves in financial ruin...they will just default on everything and go on the dole! Their bodies may never be the same again. Why bother to work and watch the creditors and tax man sodomize you.....say screw it, stay home and smoke dope or join the ranks in the underground economy.
 

Meadowlark

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Meh. He overstates.

$20 a bbl oil will not STAY $20 oil afterwards. Likely it will become $100 oil for a short time after the competitive losers of production attempt to re-compete. Then competition between producers, old and NEW will reduce this back to where it was before all this started. The price will "oscillate" as the invisible hand of the market" finds out the new price-point of oil production/market consumption.

Railroads will not compete with truckers until all the railroad infrastructure is taken over by the Federal Government - as is the current business model for the Interstate Highway System. And the Electric Utilities. Rails will become like "Deregulation" of the utilities where a single PUC dominated rail maintainer will control the rail infrastructure (Like a PUC controlled "wires utility") while independent carriers (i.e. Power Producers for Electricity) will carry the transportation load.

AS for growing food - agribusiness will continue, and small independent producers will each have their niche.

Not saying it won't change. Just that the change will not be as extreme or earth shattering as Mr. D. says.

I go with Trump - "Some business will go out of business - shortly to re-emerge as NEW businesses."

Dobbin
Actually there has been a lot of RR rebuilding the past couple of years. T Boon Pickens was investing in RR refurbishment, since a lot of crude is shipped via rail due to the lack of pipeline infrastructure in many of the shale areas.
 

Sacajawea

Has No Life - Lives on TB
After what the Dems wrote into the virus stimulus bill? Do you think Trump doesn't realize his chances of stopping this ongoing train wreck are slim? I think he's TRIED; perhaps he's not as naive now as he was on inauguration day...

But I also think the commie deep state has pulled out all the stops to fight against him & us, too.

I daresay y'all can figure out what's left for me, you & everyone else.
 

hiwall

Has No Life - Lives on TB
No no, it would entail the end of the FRN. The US dollar--especially if its gold-backed--would be a wholly different matter.
First the now used dollar would die. This would be total chaos around the world. Yes from the ashes might rise a new gold-backed currency but there would be a long while of chaos. Long enough for a big part of the population to die.
 

summerthyme

Administrator
_______________
I've been saying for over 6 weeks that this *is* TEOTWAWKI. No, it's not "the end of the world". But things are going to be profoundly different after this wave goes through. If a second wave shows up in the fall... all bets are off. My summer is going to be spent prepping to the best of my (very limited, given my spine issues that won't be getting fixed this summer) ability.

Summerthyme
 

mikeabn

Finally not a lurker!
In one of Whitley Streiber's books, coauthored, he wrote about a post-nuclear war USA and one of the BIG changes was a debt moratorium for all. Also about each citizen getting a share of physical gold.
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
No no, it would entail the end of the FRN. The US dollar--especially if its gold-backed--would be a wholly different matter.

IF the deep state/banksters/etc pull this off, you will not see any form of currency ("money") backed by and directly exchangeable for any kind of metal or other real stuff.

Such a system guts the bankster's ability to create monetary digits at will and will not be allowed if they win.

Otherwise, it's all up in the air.
 

hiwall

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I've been saying for over 6 weeks that this *is* TEOTWAWKI. No, it's not "the end of the world". But things are going to be profoundly different after this wave goes through. If a second wave shows up in the fall... all bets are off. My summer is going to be spent prepping to the best of my (very limited, given my spine issues that won't be getting fixed this summer) ability.

Summerthyme
I hope everyone takes the opportunity to prepare however they can. Even if all they can do is go to church.
 

Blacknarwhal

Let's Go Brandon!
No no, it would entail the end of the FRN. The US dollar--especially if its gold-backed--would be a wholly different matter.

IF the deep state/banksters/etc pull this off, you will not see any form of currency ("money") backed by and directly exchangeable for any kind of metal or other real stuff.

Such a system guts the bankster's ability to create monetary digits at will and will not be allowed if they win.

Otherwise, it's all up in the air.

Unless it's not the deep state that's doing it....
 

et2

Has No Life - Lives on TB
After what the Dems wrote into the virus stimulus bill? Do you think Trump doesn't realize his chances of stopping this ongoing train wreck are slim? I think he's TRIED; perhaps he's not as naive now as he was on inauguration day...

But I also think the commie deep state has pulled out all the stops to fight against him & us, too.

I daresay y'all can figure out what's left for me, you & everyone else.

you know ...
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
Unless it's not the deep state that's doing it....

Who else is in a position to do it? Honest question ...
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
I was hoping that wasn't what you would say.

I figure the odds are better for DJT being co-opted by the DS than running a separate faction of his own, however. YMMV of course.
 

Troke

On TB every waking moment
Unless it's not the deep state that's doing it....

Who else is in a position to do it? Honest question ...
What makes you think somebody is doing something? What I see is a bunch of people including banks running around trying to plug the holes in a very leaky ship.
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
What I see is a bunch of people including banks running around trying to plug the holes in a very leaky ship.

No, Troke. What they are doing is boring more holes in the ship, to let the water out.
 

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment
Not sufficiently doomer to believe there are indeed good guys involved?

Anyone involved in carrying on this bankster assault on traditional America is NOT a good guy. Even if it is DJT (the self described King of Debt).
 
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