Great Security Item I found

[darkdakota]

http://www.firequest.com/catalog_window.htm

Check out the 12 Gauge Security Control System....I'm ordering a few.

No survivalist retreat should be without it! (I bet it would make a few agents crap their draws during a sneak and peak as well...he, he, he)

They also have an interesting book on making your own fireworks, fused smoke generators, etc.

Edited to add: the link keeps going back to the main page. Type in item #HV005 (Booby trap items)

Dark

 

[Caplock50]

Be very careful how you use them. Since booby traps get the innocent as well as the guilty; they are illegal in most areas.

 

[okie medicvet]

frankly, I didn't click on that nor would I want to. don't exactly know why...

 

[ainitfunny]

Booby traps are HIGHLY ILLEGAL just about everywhere for GOOD REASONS.

Say you set up a few lethal booby traps at your mountain bug out retreat which you visit but do not occupy as your residence, it catches on fire and the local volunteer firefighters break in to put out the fire and are injured or killed by your "trap". You could be facing MURDER charges.

Or suppose a blizzard forces stranded or lost persons to break into your home(after knocking and shouting to try to be let in by any occupant)for refuge against the storm (or risk dying otherwise) and they are blown away by your mindless security system. They have a MUCH sounder legal position than you do and you will find yourself convicted in both criminal AND civil court, stripped not only of your freedom but also of all your worldly assets.

LISTEN AND LEARN- BOOBY TRAPS ARE NEVER A GOOD IDEA.

 

[Christian for Israel]

these aren't lethal booby traps, they're noise makers to alert you to trespassers. they don't fire normal shotgun shells, but instead 12 ga flares or flash/bangs.

 

[darkdakota]

these aren't lethal booby traps, they're noise makers to alert you to trespassers. they don't fire normal shotgun shells, but instead 12 ga flares or flash/bangs.

Yup, I was searching for something to keep bears out of my garden this summer. I thought it would be a great deterant if screwed to the wall next to the door with the trip wire hooked up to the door. Not many critters, two or four footed would keep trying to get in after having a 12gauge blank go off right in front of them. You can also order pepper spray cartridges for them.

Dark

 

[Caplock50]

A 12 guage is a 12 guage. That blank can be replaced by a real, live round; and then it is lethal. Really bad idea for now, but after TSHTF, well.....

I went to the site and took a good look. Saw how easy it is to make one; will be using the idea 'after'.

So, thanks Dark.

 

[eXe]

Post SHTF I would think they are useful however if you are thinking about pre SHTF.. these little things work pretty well.. no boom no danger just a snap light to let you know someone has been there.. I have these and they work.

Lightstick Trip Flare Security System
Order # FQ115
$29.99*$24.99 On Sale!
This U.S. Military issue unit is effective, easy to use trip flare which can be mounted on most any surface (trees, walls, etc.). When triggered by a trip wire, it activates a lightstick. It’s a useful and practical nighttime intrusion spotting device for any security observation post. Safe for use in any environment or under any conditions; it can not start a fire as could pyrotechnic trip flares. It’s also reusable - just insert a new lightstick and it’s ready to use again. Comes complete with one ultra high-intensity lightstick, trip cord and mounting hardware.

 

[darkdakota]

A 12 guage is a 12 guage. That blank can be replaced by a real, live round; and then it is lethal. Really bad idea for now, but after TSHTF, well.....

I went to the site and took a good look. Saw how easy it is to make one; will be using the idea 'after'.

So, thanks Dark.

Your welcome. I wondered what would happen if a live round was put into it...no barrel to direct it....anyone care to venture?

We are looking at some pretty remote property for after TSHTF. I am ordering one to play with and if I can make others I will, if not I'll order a few more.

Dark

 

[Todd]

I was going to start a thread in the BS in a few days addressing personal/area security but I'll mention a few things here.

First, most people who talk about things like booby traps have never prepared a comprehensive logistical and tactical plan. Much less one that is layered to cover differing levels of threat.

Booby traps may have a place in a plan or they may not. The same thing is true of various alarm and access restriction systems.

Second, they will not have spent the time to consider the legal, moral and religious reprecussions of killing some one either intentionally or in error. Nor, will they have considered that they will have to kill all "trespassers", men, women and children. Or, what to do if all the individuals aren't dead. Then what? Whack them to put them out of their missery? How you going to feel shooting a wounded five year old that looks like your kid?

I am not saying lethal traps don't have a place in a plan but rather that these aren't things you do without significant forethought.

Finally, FWIW, it's really easy to build lethal traps using common hardware store items. You don't have to buy a commercial item.

Todd

 

[k_edwards]

There is an article on making a non lethal device similar to what you mentioned here:

http://www.doingfreedom.com/gen/0702/trip.html

 

[Simple Man]

Hey eXE, thanks for the thumbs up post on the Lightstick Trip Flare Security System. Had seen these before but wasn't sure if they actually did work worth a flip. May get a few then as they sure would be mighty handy if the 'lectric was out and the motion sensor floods were useless...

 

[Caplock50]

Dark Dakota asks:

"I wondered what would happen if a live round was put into it...no barrel to direct it....anyone care to venture?"

the shell will explode in all directions, so you don't want to be close to it when it goes off. A blank and the flare are way under-powered, compared to a regular 12 guage round. If the device is stoutly built, it could stop most of the backblast, but not all. The shell itself will become flying projectiles. And since the shot is to one side of the powder in a regular shotgun shell, the shot will mostly go in one main direction. Since there is no barrel to 'focus' the shot, though, they *will* spread immediately in a half-spherical shape. The firing chamber and the barrel of a gun makes it a 'controled explosion'. Without them, it is an 'uncontroled' one.

 

[dimensiondancer]

Well, our electric meter (perched on side of cabin) is still read by an individual up at our remote bug out retreat, so I think I'd have to forget something such as that. It most likely would be tripped each month whether we were there or not.

 

[timbo]

Several years ago a farmer rigged up a shotgun to go off if the door on his empty 'rental' house was open. The gun was pointed down in the leg area so he thought it was okay.

He lost his whole farm in a lawsuit from a guy that was illegally breaking into the house. The guy was 'crippled' from the birdshot shell that hit him in the legs.

This is cool stuff for when us and Mel Gibson run the same roads as warriors but sure not now.

Dont forget also, several people have been killed with blank shells as well.

That is a tremendous power even coming off lower load blank shells. If your head was close enough to the round it could easily kill you.

I like eXe's idea better.

 

[darkdakota]

Dark Dakota asks:

"I wondered what would happen if a live round was put into it...no barrel to direct it....anyone care to venture?"

the shell will explode in all directions, so you don't want to be close to it when it goes off. A blank and the flare are way under-powered, compared to a regular 12 guage round. If the device is stoutly built, it could stop most of the backblast, but not all. The shell itself will become flying projectiles. And since the shot is to one side of the powder in a regular shotgun shell, the shot will mostly go in one main direction. Since there is no barrel to 'focus' the shot, though, they *will* spread immediately in a half-spherical shape. The firing chamber and the barrel of a gun makes it a 'controled explosion'. Without them, it is an 'uncontroled' one.

Thanks Caplock...I can imagine someone not paying attention and putting a live slug into this thing. Duck! Would not help.

Dark

 

[darkdakota]

Several years ago a farmer rigged up a shotgun to go off if the door on his empty 'rental' house was open. The gun was pointed down in the leg area so he thought it was okay.

He lost his whole farm in a lawsuit from a guy that was illegally breaking into the house. The guy was 'crippled' from the birdshot shell that hit him in the legs.

This is cool stuff for when us and Mel Gibson run the same roads as warriors but sure not now.

Dont forget also, several people have been killed with blank shells as well.

That is a tremendous power even coming off lower load blank shells. If your head was close enough to the round it could easily kill you.

I like eXe's idea better.

I like eXe's idea for winter but I'm looking for something to keep mainly bear out of a garden in post TSHTF scenario. Here in Alaska it's still light out at 3AM in July and I don't think it would deter them. I think it's down to this and/or solar electric fence.

It's going to be in the middle of 37 acres in a very sparsely populated Alaska.


Dark

 

[LoupGarou]

Let's also not forget the lowly rat trap, the big 10-14 inch ones. Just add string and place in tree. When it goes off, it will wake you up. And they are cheap.

Loup Garou

 

[Moe and Curly]

There is an easier way to be alerted to a surprise visitor. Buy a simple motion activated outdoor light. When it detects motion, the light comes on. It would be simple to run an extension cord from it to whatever you want to activate whether it is a warning light inside the dwelling, an alarm, a loud radio or whatever and it can be rigged so that the intruder is scared away or that the home occupant is warned without the intruder knowing that it has been detected. There is no risk or danger to this approach and these can be purchased for under $20.

 

[Grantbo]

This is Grantbo
What ever happened to the traps that set off a tear gas canister? Seems to me that it would send a robber running.

 

[Hamilton Felix]

OK, it took me a while to sort through the Firequest catalog.

You were talking about this gadget, a "shellholder" 12 gauge firing device for use as a perimeter alarm.

I bought one of these a few years ago from Shomer-tec, just to satisfy my curiousity.

I still haven't sorted out Firequest's price. I see this:

HV-5 Pest Control System
Item # HV005 $44.99 $34.99 On Sale!
3 Units Per Package $11.99 $9.99 On Sale!

Does it mean three of these gadgets are $9.99 or that they're $9.99 apiece? If so, what's the line above, with sale price of $34.99? If the items are under ten bucks, they're definitely cheaper than Shomer-tec.

A friend and I were curious. He's a Machinist, so he experimented with making two or three more.

As I understand it, this is a SHELLHOLDER only. That should be legal. We've only tried them with the "game control" shells that pop a charge up in the air, then it goes bang --- and with some 6 dram equivalent black powder blanks. Most recently, I noticed the black powder blank (which is in a plastic shell, roll crimped with a front card wad) made a flash and bang, and never even blew out the front wad. It just split the case in 3 or 4 places.

If someone's curious, I'll be happy to set one off with a live 12 gauge round in it. I'll keep the tree between me and the device, maybe set up some cardboard, light wallboard, etc. around it to see what happens.

I rather expect, since the shot charge outweights the device and there's no containment, the shell will split open and the device itself will receive some downforce. I don't expect shot to be launched effectively.

Where you'd get into trouble, would be if you slipped a piece of 3/4" pipe over the shell, making a crude chamber and barrel. Now you have device that can be roughly aimed and will qualify as an illegal short barreled shotgun. Aside from the fact that booby traps are illegal, nondescriminating, and you can harm an innocent and/or lose the farm ---- does anyone here want to end up like Randy, Sammy or Vicki Weaver? The noisemaker is fine, but I'd have to recommend against turning it into a harmful booby trap.

Knowing how to do this, make VietCong "footbreakers," rig fences & locks to electrocute people, set punji stakes, etc. may be useful skills when TEOTWAWKI comes along. But as long as civilization is hanging together, this stuff will just buy you trouble.

 

[darkdakota]

OK, it took me a while to sort through the Firequest catalog.


I still haven't sorted out Firequest's price. I see this:

HV-5 Pest Control System
Item # HV005 $44.99 $34.99 On Sale!
3 Units Per Package $11.99 $9.99 On Sale!

Does it mean three of these gadgets are $9.99 or that they're $9.99 apiece? If so, what's the line above, with sale price of $34.99? If the items are under ten bucks, they're definitely cheaper than Shomer-tec.

.

The links on the catalog are a little off. It is $34.99. The 3units/pkg price is for the shells.

Thanks for the info.

Dark

 

[Hamilton Felix]

Thanks, Dark. The gadget is overpriced. Buy one if you MUST, to copy it. But it's very simple to figure out. Actually, it's kind of fun to figure the simplest way to make them yourself.

Buy the blanks in 25 round boxes at gun shows.

By the way, I had to fumble around a bit in my effort to connect with the "Burglarmist" I remembered from years ago. Names that go with this are: Terminator, Revel Technologies, Interceptor and Repulsar. I think Burglarmist nad Terminator have disappeared by now. Also, it appears Burglar Bomb AB 2000 is the current version of the original Burglarmist product.

Look here: http://www.stopthecrime.com/products.htm

It looks like they're using pepper spray now. The one we got for Grandpa back in the 80's was about the same, but it used CN tear gas. That stuff will air out OK, and it is fairly quick acting. Don't use CS, as it permanently impregnates the house.

Looks like they make plenty of money on the little things.

 

[Caplock50]

Ya wanna know what a 12 guage shotgun shell will do if it goes off outside of a firing chamber? Build a small wood fire in the middle of a well cleared area at least 20 in diameter. Select your shell and drop it into the middle of the fire. Then run like he...er, heck. You want to get as far away from it as possible or behind substantial cover. I'm sure that after it explodes, you find your fire has gotten much smaller...to the point of almost being extinguished.

Ya know those itty bitty hearing aid batteries? I burn them when I burn trash. I like to watch them put dents and holes in my burn barrel, a 55 gal. metal drum.

 

[darkdakota]

Thanks, Dark. The gadget is overpriced. Buy one if you MUST, to copy it. But it's very simple to figure out. Actually, it's kind of fun to figure the simplest way to make them yourself.


.

I'm a pretty good carpenter and I like working with wood but I never took metal shop. I want to order one to check out the strength of the base, spring, etc. I think it's a nifty gadget. The suggestions here about lighting options just won't work I'm afraid against a bear intent on having a midnight snack in my garden.

I'll check out the next gunshow about the blanks.

Dark

 

[Hamilton Felix]

I did the test tonight: shotgun shell in the shellholder alarm device. Some of the shot stayed in the shell, though the star crimp did open. The overpowder wad stayed, too. Camera at work, so I'll do pictures tomorrow.

 

[Caplock50]

Please do take and post a few pictures. thanks for doing the 'research' for us, Hamilton Felix. Your efforts are appreciated.

 

[Hamilton Felix]

You know what they say, my friend: "Inquiring minds want to know."

I grabbed some cardboard, old mirror boxes from moving Mom, stuff with lots of surface area. Stood it about 2 feet from the device (on the side of a tree, because it's in use in the field). I figured if it threw some shot, I might be able to see holes in the cardboard and estimate if there was any significant velocity. I just stepped behind the tree and pulled the string.

Turns out the cardboard was a waste of effort. No effect on cardboard, even at two feet. Some shot even remains in the game/target load -- looks like #8 (I couldn't read the shell, just something the kid left in the kitchen and I grabbed quickly).

Notice the 6 dram black powder blank never lost its roll crimp or its big overpowder wad. It just split in three places.

The shotshell split in one place, bulged, but overpowder wad and shot cup never left the shell. The star crimp did open, and some of the shot escaped. It's probably in the moss below where the device is screwed onto the tree. The gadget is held with two screws. It does not appear to have developed enough downforce to have affected it.

I think this result is part of the reason it's legal to sell the 12 gauge alarm device. Even with an ordinary shotshell (admittedly, easier to find than blanks or game control loads), it's not likely to do any harm. Just a startling pop -- and a bit of a flash if you're looking right at the black powder blank (did that one a few nights ago, from a slight distance).

 

[Caplock50]

You're mean. Mean and nasty. You've slandered my Dad and all my military training. Now I guess I'm going to have to do the 'tests' myself to prove you wrong and them right.

I have always been taught...ah, ok, maybe it has to do with 'modern propellants' Heh, that should explain it...the difference between what I was taught and what you have shown. Ya reckon?

 

[Hamilton Felix]

LOL! Well, I guess I can try tossing one of each into a campfire sometime....

You can see there was some bursting force outward from the shell. Tossing that 6 dram black powder blank into a fire would get your attention. But these were sitting on the alarm device -- homebuilt, so it's actually a small machined block of aluminum with striker made from a 1/4" bolt. With no containment at all, unless you count a tree on one side, they just burst outward a bit.


And while "inquiring minds" wonder what might result if a foot of 3/4" pipe were to be placed over the shell, we can't do that experiment. Federales, you know...

 

[darkdakota]

Hamilton Felix...thanks for the test. How "big" of a pop and flash was it? Enough do you think to scare most varmints...two and four legged....from continuing their breaking in to my garden?

I wonder about an enclosed area like a shed? If this was put on the door to go off if broken into....

Definitely something to consider for perimeter control after TSHTF...it would alert you to someone sneaking up to the cabin.

Dark