…… Book restoration

[kyrsyan]

We have a very old family bible. The spine is falling apart. The last time Dad priced a repair, he was quoted a very high price. But that is apparently because he went to a place would charge a very high price. (Williamsburg, VA)

Is there somewhere or someone who has the skill to repair something like this? I won't say money isn't an object but I can hope that there is a good person that doesn't want several thousand dollars to do it. It's either repair it or it's likely to fall apart by the time one of us inherits it. And... I know how to preserve it when it falls apart but I'd really rather preserve it in one piece. Or at least repair enough that we can photograph it for the family members that would like it, and preserve the book in a way that will help it last for history.

Why? Because this Bible has, beyond the family stuff, sections that are not in modern bibles. And I am curious. I'm sure others are as well. And I really don't like the thought of more knowledge being lost to the ages. Especially this type of knowledge which tends to be heavily gatekept. He says it was printed in 1814.

 

[Delta]

I'd suggest that it depends on the quality of the paper. If it is wood pulp, it will be yellowish, and brittle (now or within a few years). If it is rag it will be white. If rag paper, it is probably worth rebinding. If wood pulp, probably not. They changed early 19th century--or about that time.

You speak of unique content other than family lore. Frankly, I doubt it is really unique. Books exist in multiple copies. Regardless, there comes a time when the xerox or the camera is the only option.

 

[kyrsyan]

I'd suggest that it depends on the quality of the paper. If it is wood pulp, it will be yellowish, and brittle (now or within a few years). If it is rag it will be white. If rag paper, it is probably worth rebinding. If wood pulp, probably not. They changed early 19th century--or about that time.

You speak of unique content other than family lore. Frankly, I doubt it is really unique. Books exist in multiple copies. Regardless, there comes a time when the xerox or the camera is the only option.

Actually, from what I can find so far, this book is rare. Not valuable in a monetary way but in a knowledge way. And in a "survived to now" way. Before my parents realized just how fragile it had become, they had used it regularly for several things. There are books in it that are not in any modern bibles. It is a large, thick bible in very tiny print. I am intrigued but not enough to cause it's destruction by handling it.

Dad has said he will try to get me some photographs. And if possible, the cover page with whatever information it has. Once I have that, I will go looking for a digitized copy. But there is a possibility that no digitized copies exist.

Given that it has made it 200+ years, I'm going to say that the pages are not wood pulp. But I'll ask him about it.

If it makes it to be inherited by one of us kids, I will likely push for us to contact one of the preservation resources that will preserve it and digitize it. That will likely mean that the Library of Congress will end up with the physical book (or somewhere similar) but we will get a digitized copy of it. And I, being me, will likely see about getting a really good quality reprint of it. I doubt it will last as many generations though. They just don't make things that well nowadays.

In another lifetime, when I was a lot younger, I got the privilege of viewing some old, rare documents. And I'm a book dragon, so I tend to be super fond of older books. I've got a few myself that don't have print dates in them, because they managed to come my way.

If we can't afford a restorer, I will likely at least invest in an archival box for it. To help it last as long as possible. Because my parents are not likely to agree to give the Bible away, even if they get a digitized copy.

 

[Kris Gandillon]

What “non-standard” books are in this Bible?

Are they these 14 known as “The Apocrypha?”

The 14 books of the Apocrypha are:

• The First Book of Esdras
• The Second Book of Esdras
• The Book of Tobit
• The Book of Judith
• Additions to the Book of Esther
• The Book of Wisdom
• The Book of Sirach
• The Book of Baruch
• The Epistle of Jeremiah
• Additions to the Book of Daniel
• The Prayer of Azariah and the Song of the Three Jews
• Susanna
• Bel and the Dragon
• The Prayer of Manasseh

 

[kyrsyan]

What “non-standard” books are in this Bible?

I honestly don't remember any more. My renewed interest has been batting at my skull for about a year and I finally worked up the courage to ask Dad. I should know more when he gets more information to me.

But when I asked Grok about the publicly available bibles in that time frame, there weren't many that were used by Catholics. And there were several books listed, by Grok, that aren't in modern bibles.

I remember a discussion once about one of the books being the "bookkeeper" of the group. I honestly don't remember the rest. I very much drifted away from Catholicism for a very long time. I won't say that I'm drifting back, but something is just not letting go.

 

[Kathy in FL]

Call a nearby university's library and explain. If they don't know anyone, call their literature program or something similar. It may not come to anything but it is a place to start. Another place would be their art department.

If not them, call the administrative off of your local library system.

Online you could try and find a collector's guild and maybe hunt up some contacts there.

 

[kyrsyan]

Per Grok, and it's likely right, the difference in books that I remember is likely because this is an Italian Catholic bible, not a Protestant bible. Now I'm even more intrigued. I might have to go buy a Catholic bible for comparison before all is said and done. Somehow I have been unaware of those differences for a very long time. And a bit surprised that the bible my family gave me when I went to college was a King James.

 

[Kathy in FL]

Combined the books different between Protestant and Catholic Bibles are called the Apocrypha. They are historical in nature, though the authors/authenticity aren't for sure. They are no longer considered "canon" but are included as they were written during the time period between the Old Testament and the New Testament.

There are different "apocrypha" books. Some say 7, some say 14. The Eastern Orthodox Bible has a different list of books than the Catholic version. The Protestant Bible doesn't include them at all. The Jewish Apocrypha also includes some and doesn't include others. I think one of the problems with considering them "canon" is they all were originally written in Greek rather than Hebrew and as I said, all except one has an unsubstantiated author.

Also different are the books of Esther and Daniel. As it was explained to me, while both books are in both the Catholic and Protestant Bibles, they aren't exactly the same with the Catholic Bible containing additional/different verses.

That's how it was explained to me by a friend who was raised Catholic.

 

[kyrsyan]

More rabbit holes...
The modern unabridged reprint, if I've found the right one, runs ~$140.00 to $200.00. If it's the right one, their Christmas gift this year is likely to be an unabridged reprint for them to use, and an archival box for the family one. There is no guarantee that the reprint is word for word exact but it's likely as close as will be available in modern times.

I still want to preserve the family bible. If only because, apparently, there aren't too many that have survived so long and there are likely differences. But for now, I have to wait for Dad to be able to take the time to give me the full name of the one they have, and if possible, without endangering the book, the print date. Because the "unabridged" is actually based on version published in the 1870s.

The thing that amused me is the "Book of Solomon". I have read it. I have been lectured on it. Etc, etc. To find out that is actually called Wisdom of Solomon. And is only in Catholic Bibles.

 

[Cardinal]

We have a very old family bible. The spine is falling apart. The last time Dad priced a repair, he was quoted a very high price. But that is apparently because he went to a place would charge a very high price. (Williamsburg, VA)

Is there somewhere or someone who has the skill to repair something like this? I won't say money isn't an object but I can hope that there is a good person that doesn't want several thousand dollars to do it. It's either repair it or it's likely to fall apart by the time one of us inherits it. And... I know how to preserve it when it falls apart but I'd really rather preserve it in one piece. Or at least repair enough that we can photograph it for the family members that would like it, and preserve the book in a way that will help it last for history.

Why? Because this Bible has, beyond the family stuff, sections that are not in modern bibles. And I am curious. I'm sure others are as well. And I really don't like the thought of more knowledge being lost to the ages. Especially this type of knowledge which tends to be heavily gatekept. He says it was printed in 1814.

Book repair is a specialty, and won't be cheap because it requires a specialist.

How Much Does It Cost?

Visit the post for more.

www.leonardsbooks.com

 

[Meemur]

I have another suggestion which might be more affordable.

First, scan the information in a non-invasive way. I don't know what is being done now, but in older times, family history archivists used a special camera on a tripod to copy the pages, and then the pages could be digitalized, so that you and others could easier refer to the information and see the originals without actually handling the book.



As Kathy suggested, contacting the nearest university library archive staff might give you some ideas.

After the info is copied, then look into how to best store the book, and you might need some additional supplies, such as a special box and oxygen absorbers. I don't know what is being done in 2025.

Here is one link:

Family History Rare Book/Bible Storage | Gaylord Archival | Gaylord Archival

No matter what book you're looking to preserve, Gaylord Archival has designed a kit to protect it. From family Bibles to diaries, we have it covered.

www.gaylord.com

In any case, that would be a lot cheaper than a total restoration and would preserve the information in more places if you give the digitalized version to additional family members.

 

[Walrus]

Call a nearby university's library and explain. If they don't know anyone, call their literature program or something similar. It may not come to anything but it is a place to start. Another place would be their art department.

If not them, call the administrative off of your local library system.

Online you could try and find a collector's guild and maybe hunt up some contacts there.

That's a good suggestion; I was thinking the same thing. There are lots of book conservators and restoration specialists around but they don't have big shopfronts or anything, in my experience. Librarians and archivists would definitely be able to point you in the right direction, particularly if they get a look at the Bible and its condition.

 

[Walrus]

I have another suggestion which might be more affordable.

First, scan the information in a non-invasive way. I don't know what is being done now, but in older times, family history archivists used a special camera on a tripod to copy the pages, and then the pages could be digitalized, so that you and others could easier refer to the information and see the originals.

View attachment 544560

As Kathy suggested, contacting the nearest university library archive staff might give you some ideas.

After the info is copied, then look into how to best store the book, and you might need some additional supplies, such as a special box and oxygen absorbers. I don't know what is being done in 2025.

In any case, that would be a lot cheaper than a total restoration and would preserve the information in more places if you give the digitalized version to additional family members.

Besides that, you may want to display it somewhere where family can view the actual Bible. A high-quality picture framer can give you guidance with respect to sealing and atmospheric control. Speaking as a former picture framer, ensure that you insist that any glass be high-quality conservation glass to avoid (or at least delay) the effects of sunlight and flourescents.

 

[Meemur]

Yes, that's another idea that could work!

My friend had a similar problem, but in her case, the Bible was close to 200 years old and being eaten by insects and mold (it was stored in a wine cellar in Germany for many years). She wasn't made of money! A librarian friend scanned the pages using a set-up similar to the image I posted. I think it ended up costing her a steak dinner and a bottle of wine.

 

[patriotgal]

At least put it in an archival box. Scanning is a tedious process and you need decent equipment to get a clean readable copy. Also consider asking nearby historical societies if they can recommend someone. We used to have someone over in Boone County who repaired and sometimes put new covers on books but she stopped doing them.

 

[kyrsyan]

I've scanned books before. But that won't be allowed at this time. I'm keeping fingers crossed that it is not a rarer Bible in the sense of available at all. Just rare in surviving this long.

When the times comes, I will likely contact somewhere that keeps old books and would take it. And if we're lucky, provide a digitized copy. At this time it seems like there are two places that will do that. And the Catholic church will take it, if offered.

 

[progressingamerica]

Why? Because this Bible has, beyond the family stuff, sections that are not in modern bibles. And I am curious. I'm sure others are as well. And I really don't like the thought of more knowledge being lost to the ages. Especially this type of knowledge which tends to be heavily gatekept. He says it was printed in 1814.

I do not have the physical/book restoration skill you seek, but I am curious. What are the sections that are not in modern Bibles?

I love this kind of stuff, and getting information out against the gatekeepers.

What is the name of this version of the Bible? Does it have a specific name?

 

[progressingamerica]

I have another suggestion which might be more affordable.

First, scan the information in a non-invasive way. I don't know what is being done now, but in older times, family history archivists used a special camera on a tripod to copy the pages, and then the pages could be digitalized, so that you and others could easier refer to the information and see the originals without actually handling the book.

View attachment 544560

Hopefully Meemur's attached image makes it into the hands of the person currently holding the book.

When the book-holder hears the phrase "scanning in the pages" they probably have a thought in the back of their heads about a sincerely destructive act. Seeing this would change their opinion.

 

[joekan]

I think you're going have to pay the money if you want it done right

 

[Cardinal]

I do not have the physical/book restoration skill you seek, but I am curious. What are the sections that are not in modern Bibles?

I love this kind of stuff, and getting information out against the gatekeepers.

What is the name of this version of the Bible? Does it have a specific name?

Catholic Bibles have several books that protestant Bibles deleted, as has been discussed upthread.

 

[kyrsyan]

Happy, happy dance!

This rabbit hole has been fun. And Mom revealed another family bible that has been in storage. That one is an 1862 mass print, leather bound. It is in slightly better condition. Emphasis on slightly.

Both have white pages, despite the age. The older one has unabridged reprints available. And turns out to be from a family that was close friends of hers. Mom is actually looking for that family to see if any of the descendants want it back.

The younger one, by 12 years, has no unabridged reprint available. This is the Bible that came through the maternal family line.

We are discussing me providing them with archival boxes for both of them, unabridged reprint of the older one, and a reprint of the yoinger one of their chosing if wanted as well.

And, surprisingly, there is only one partial digital scan of the older bible. None of the younger. How did Bibles get missed in the digitization of books over the past decades? I can't find ebook versions either. So there will be an unabridged version heading to my household as well. Because the curiosity...

Hey, genealogy folks, anyone know the family of Gustave Bohne, circa 1852?

 

[Meemur]

Hey, genealogy folks, anyone know the family of Gustave Bohne, circa 1852?

I just pulled up a dozen entries.
Where did he live?
Do you have a middle name or initial?
Wife's name?
Children?

That info would help narrow it down.

One example:

Gustave Jean Marie Bohne​

in the Paris, France, Births, Marriages, and Deaths, 1555-1929​

Name	Gustave Jean Marie Bohne
Gender	homme (Male)
Residence Age	29
Birth Date	Abt 1852
Spouse	Marie Faivre
Child	Pierre Ernest Bohne

 

[Rucus Sunday]

I have an NASB bible that was rebound in Highland goatskin about 20 yrs ago by RL Allan in Britain, incredible leather. Unfortunately, it looks like they don't do custom work any more.

Name List of Booksellers' and Bookbinders' Labels | American Antiquarian Society [you'll have to google the binders since they aren't linked to]

or

Type 'bible bookbinders' into Google. You'll get loads of returns.

 

[Glennster]

We have a very old family bible. The spine is falling apart. The last time Dad priced a repair, he was quoted a very high price. But that is apparently because he went to a place would charge a very high price. (Williamsburg, VA)

Is there somewhere or someone who has the skill to repair something like this? I won't say money isn't an object but I can hope that there is a good person that doesn't want several thousand dollars to do it. It's either repair it or it's likely to fall apart by the time one of us inherits it. And... I know how to preserve it when it falls apart but I'd really rather preserve it in one piece. Or at least repair enough that we can photograph it for the family members that would like it, and preserve the book in a way that will help it last for history.

Why? Because this Bible has, beyond the family stuff, sections that are not in modern bibles. And I am curious. I'm sure others are as well. And I really don't like the thought of more knowledge being lost to the ages. Especially this type of knowledge which tends to be heavily gatekept. He says it was printed in 1814.

Hi Kyrsyan:

I worked for RR Donnelley & Sons Company in Crawfordsville, Indiana during the 80's & 90's. They produce Bibles. They did have a handwork operation that would repair books. They are now known as the Lakeside Book Company. This is their website: Solutions - Lakeside Book Company

I suggest you click on the orange button in the upper right corner labeled "Connect With Us". Select "SALES" in the drop down list for "Who would you like to contact". Describe as well as you can, what work you want them to do. Tell them you want a Quote for the work you want done. Maybe you can supply pictures to them so they can see what you are talking about. Good luck......Glennster

 

[kyrsyan]

@Meemur, dm sent. That's all we have.

So Mom and I had a long conversation which is surprising if you knew our history.

I am sending two archival cases for the two old Bibles. And their Christmas gift this year will be an unabridged reprint of the first version, which is the first translation from Latin/Greek/Hebrew to English.

I will talk with my brothers over time and see what, if any, interest they have in the family Bible. And determine the future from that. One brother and his wife are still very active in the Catholic church, as are their sons. So they may want to take over the care of it. And if the other does not have a family any longer, they may want that.

@Glennster, thank you! I will look at that this week. Dad did take pictures of both Bibles this morning. For both of them, the majority of the damage is in the spines. The pages have the damage you would expect from normal handling. Edges a little worn. Occasional stains from something at some point. They actually have both been protected and handled minimally for about 20 years now. Ever since they realized that if they kept using them, they were going to destroy them.

 

[Rucus Sunday]

also, type this into the youtube address bar

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=bible+book+binding

 

[progressingamerica]

Catholic Bibles have several books that protestant Bibles deleted, as has been discussed upthread.

Agreed. However I took it to potentially carry the meaning that several books were present that are missing from Catholic Bibles as well. The limitations of chat medium.

 

[progressingamerica]

We are discussing me providing them with archival boxes for both of them, unabridged reprint of the older one, and a reprint of the yoinger one of their chosing if wanted as well.

And, surprisingly, there is only one partial digital scan of the older bible. None of the younger. How did Bibles get missed in the digitization of books over the past decades? I can't find ebook versions either. So there will be an unabridged version heading to my household as well. Because the curiosity...

I don't know if you plan digitization along the lines of the way can be done safely as shown above with careful camera placement, but since what you have seems to have no digital equivalent that could have a lot of (non-monetary) value. People would want this. I'm curious to see it myself.

Where I'm going with this though is that there is potential not just to stuff it in an archival box which then gets stuffed wherever and rarely seen again except special family events but to keep the work in full use through dynamic copies. The digital copy is potentially your main one, but there is also the potential that it can be transformed into an audio book.

Librivox has 6 pages of various versions of The Bible (Link) in its roster, which would mean yours does not get lost in the digital ocean of the internet should you choose to upload via PDF. There's KJV, Wycliffe's Bible, the Hebrew Bible, Children's Bibles and many other versions including Catholic audio book versions at LV.

This last bit is of course my own opinion but I happen to think that audio booking is an important aspect of book restoration. If something(a book) is really that important, then it should be on YouTube. I have an LV account so I can help move it along, doing this is much less work than it seems and definitely less work than the page scanning since you(family) own the book.

 

[Cardinal]

Agreed. However I took it to potentially carry the meaning that several books were present that are missing from Catholic Bibles as well. The limitations of chat medium.

Gotcha.