SOFT NEWS Archeologists Unearthed this Stone Turtle! What's Inside is An Ancient Machine?

[packyderms_wife]

Yes, the could have possibly stumbled upon it, but I think it far more likely that crystals scattered around were more of a sacred object as opposed to being used for anything electrical. "Cut and polished" is taking liberties as well. Get a large geode and you can pull crystals just like that out of them that are highly planar. As for the wire, I suspect a lot of jewelry used wire.

In general, anyone with the knowledge to build a "radio" of any kind probably wouldn't store it inside a carved stone turtle. It would be like storing a laptop in a cave.

I was thinking wire wrapped pendants for necklaces when I saw the wire and crystals.

 

[Melodi]

Yes, the could have possibly stumbled upon it, but I think it far more likely that crystals scattered around were more of a sacred object as opposed to being used for anything electrical. "Cut and polished" is taking liberties as well. Get a large geode and you can pull crystals just like that out of them that are highly planar. As for the wire, I suspect a lot of jewelry used wire.

In general, anyone with the knowledge to build a "radio" of any kind probably wouldn't store it inside a carved stone turtle. It would be like storing a laptop in a cave.

Nightwolf wanted to know (and I haven't had time to look it up today) "What did Turtles symbolize in Cambodian/Hindu or Buddhist traditions?"

He said that might give a "hint" to their purpose.

He said if "we found something like that in a Norse Find and the stuff was inside of Stone Ravens (Odin's Messengers) that would be a hint that maybe if it looks like it could be a communication device, that is at least work seriously studying and considering."

He also said that doesn't mean that it was it is, it could have been used for an "Oracle" to "Communicate" with the Gods - aka a slightly unusual actual "ritual object" despite that being the archeologists way for saying for the last 200 years, "If we don't have a clue, it must be a ritual object and/or a phallic one."

Another real-life example the Bagdad Battery was found in the ruins of was obviously a medical doctor home, they found his instruments and other items still enough "there" to make that rather clear. A bit of talking to local people (even today) found that a local "cure" for arthritis was to have the patient stand on an electric fish that give off a slight charge and live in the waters nearby. The use of minor charges of electricity to deal with pain has even been used in pain control experiments today and you can buy modern versions of "electric" fish from some health sites.

So while originally it was thought the battery was used for electroplating, and jewelers may have done that, but the only one found so far was in a doctor's "office" so was probably a "medical device."

Again, why didn't they go on to make lightbulbs? Well if you do a social history of modern electricity, for the first decades after it was discovered, it was used mostly for "medical cures" for a given form of cure, and entertainment (like the tiny steam engines for rich men's toys in Alexandria).

It took a couple of centuries to really make it very practical for daily use, especially for things like lighting; once that happened the technology took off like a rocket - but it might not have, or at least not nearly as quickly or become so widespread.

But I did mention the high likelihood that this may just be "ritual stuff" or jewelry makings, it just that it isn't impossible that it might be very simple radio or signaling technology; finding out more about turtles in context would help.

Especially if say we see turtle designs on the clothing of dancers that look like they are wearing clothing decorated with turtles or something.

 

[packyderms_wife]

Nightwolf wanted to know (and I haven't had time to look it up today) "What did Turtles symbolize in Cambodian/Hindu or Buddhist traditions?"

It means eternal life, IIRC, because they live so long, well that's what the mean in Thai and Malay cultures... I'm assuming that it's a pretty common theme throughout that part of the pacific. Turtles were highly revered by many NA cultures as well.

 

[Melodi]

It means eternal life, IIRC, because they live so long, well that's what the mean in Thai and Malay cultures... I'm assuming that it's a pretty common theme throughout that part of the pacific. Turtles were highly revered by many NA cultures as well.

Thank you, I knew some of the Turtle Island connections but nothing Asian, so Eternal Life is really cool but probably not associated with communications, except perhaps between the dead and the living which again would point to ritual divination, tools or jewelry.

 

[FaithfulSkeptic]

The Baghdad battery was most likely used for crude electroplating. Discovering that by accident isn't a stretch at all. Any dissimilar metals in any kind of of acid will do "interesting" things. Taking it from that to submersing a couple dissimilar electrodes ( as we know now call them ) even in lemon juice is easily believable. But technology higher than just happenstance? Doubtful, as such knowledge would have spread quickly and radically changed the cultures, and we'd find way more of it laying about.

 

[Melodi]

The Baghdad battery was most likely used for crude electroplating. Discovering that by accident isn't a stretch at all. Any dissimilar metals in any kind of of acid will do "interesting" things. Taking it from that to submersing a couple dissimilar electrodes ( as we know now call them ) even in lemon juice is easily believable. But technology higher than just happenstance? Doubtful, as such knowledge would have spread quickly and radically changed the cultures, and we'd find way more of it laying about.

Many papers have been written on this topic, the last time I looked into it, the majority of even main-stream archeological opinion was that it was probably a medical device because of where it was located and the other tools found with it.

Researchers have looked far and wide for similar "batteries" in jeweler's workshops and have yet to find any, also there is little if any evidence for electroplating during this particular period or in this particular region.

However, Wikipedia goes with your theory and it used to be the most popular one so who knows?

It is not uncommon in archeology (like any science or semi-scientific field) for researchers to get extremely attached to certain theories and get stuck on them come heck or high water and this is one of them.

And there is a strong tendency for people to get stuck in this or this (it is either a medical device because of where it was found and there's a folk belief in the area that would fit its use) or it was used to make jewelry.

Even though the "real" answer may be YES/AND - Yes it was used by doctors (as similar ones are today) and Yes it was used by jewelers (as modern versions are today).

Note: I am currently looking at and exploring this theory of EITHER/OR and YES/AND because I've started to notice it is a serious problem in terms of modern thinking patterns and not just about archeology.

 

[FaithfulSkeptic]

Many papers have been written on this topic, the last time I looked into it, the majority of even main-stream archeological opinion was that it was probably a medical device because of where it was located and the other tools found with it.

Researchers have looked far and wide for similar "batteries" in jeweler's workshops and have yet to find any, also there is little if any evidence for electroplating during this particular period or in this particular region.

However, Wikipedia goes with your theory and it used to be the most popular one so who knows?

It is not uncommon in archeology (like any science or semi-scientific field) for researchers to get extremely attached to certain theories and get stuck on them come heck or high water and this is one of them.

And there is a strong tendency for people to get stuck in this or this (it is either a medical device because of where it was found and there's a folk belief in the area that would fit its use) or it was used to make jewelry.

Even though the "real" answer may be YES/AND - Yes it was used by doctors (as similar ones are today) and Yes it was used by jewelers (as modern versions are today).

Medical? Yeah, I can see that. Get a tiny bit of current out of it and "treat" your patients with the new magic. Completely believable. Sorry I missed that the first time around. I still hold, however, they didn't really understand any of the science behind it. Certainly not at the level we do.

There was a very good 6-part series on the more ancient civilizations ( and the formation of civilization itself ) and the take-away was that more and more they're finding they were farther along that first thought. Not tech or anything like that, but had broader travel than we thought; knew more about agri and the seasons than we thought, etc. A lot of them were a bit more bloody than we thought as well. Was a fascinating series, on Amazon Prime: Secrets of Ancient Empires