33dInd
Veteran Member
No it doesn’t on the first part
HEALTH Israel's PM Press Secretary says VACCINATED PEOPLE ARE DYING AND GOING TO THE HOSPITAL SICK
- Thread starter Doomer Doug
- Start date
Babs
Veteran Member
Only 2 boosters then? Surely the 3rd will work, won't it??
If The Science didn't tell us better, you'd think it was natural immunity or something.
If at first you don't boost, then boost boost again!
bw
Fringe Ranger
"Yump Ole, Yump! If you can't make it in one yump, yump twice!"
Mark D
Now running for Emperor.
Funny that, eh? :-)
Krayola
Veteran Member
Why do you ask me?
Babs
Veteran Member
Fair use, yada yada yada
The message from Israel is clear: Covid booster shots should be standard
A third dose of the vaccine provides significant protection, but that should not mean those who are unvaccinated go without
‘Booster jabs aren’t just an immune refresher – they are an immunological upgrade.’ Photograph: Abir Sultan/EPA
Mon 27 Sep 2021 06.47 EDT
In the summer, Israel began offering third doses of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine to the over-60s. It was the first country to start administering “booster shots”, to people vaccinated at least five months previously. The prime minister, Naftali Bennett, announced the decision after a study by Leumit Health Services, an Israeli healthcare provider, showed that those over the age of 60 who had been vaccinated more than five months previously were three times more likely to be infected than those vaccinated more recently. As of 29 August, Israel began offering a third dose to everyone aged 12 and older, who had waited this period of time. The question for other countries is now whether to follow Israel’s lead.
The first data evaluating the early impact of the third dose programme were published last week in the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM). It showed that two weeks after more than 1.1 million over-60s had received their third dose, they were 11.3 times less likely to become infected with the exceptionally contagious Delta variant that currently predominates in Israel and across the world.
In other words, third doses are highly effective at preventing people from becoming infected with Delta, among those who are willing to be vaccinated. When third doses dramatically reduce a person’s susceptibility to infection, it creates a barrier to the onward transmission and spread of the virus. This is important because growing numbers of people are getting infected despite being vaccinated (though the risks of infection, spread and severe illness remain greatest among those who are unvaccinated). And they have similar peak levels of virus in their noses to those who are unvaccinated, contributing to the unrelenting spread of the virus.
Third doses stimulate the production of neutralising antibodies that are both higher in magnitude and have greater breadth against viral variants than those elicited by a second dose. Taken together, booster jabs aren’t just an immune refresher – they are an immunological upgrade. These superior neutralising antibody responses create an immunological buffer that is effective even against the Sars-CoV-2 Delta variant, explaining the dramatic reduction in risk of infection following third doses in Israel. The same buffer would be expected to reduce the need for frequent “boosting” in the future, as higher levels of neutralising antibodies are predicted to confer longer-lasting immunity.
Other countries have watched the Israeli data closely but have been reluctant to embrace universal third doses for younger people for two main reasons. First, current vaccine programmes outside Israel continue to protect from severe disease, hospitalisation and death. This is a reasonable standard for evaluating vaccine protection, but it is not the only one. The crippling impact of Delta variant infections on hospitalisations in many locations in the US, despite widely available vaccinations, exposes the limits of using this as the sole benchmark.
An alternative reasonable standard for assessing vaccine impact is the prevention of even clinically mild infections in order to minimise transmission within communities. The status quo of vaccinated individuals who are not optimally protected from infection and transmission, sizeable populations (eg, young children) who are not allowed to be vaccinated, and large numbers of unvaccinated individuals have allowed Delta infections to rage.
Dramatically lowering the number of infections among people who have been vaccinated three times, one of the key outcomes of the NEJM paper, quickly reduces the number of susceptible individuals who are able to sustain the virus’s continued spread. Israel is already providing a real-world test of this concept, and the recent decline in its new cases is encouraging. Of course, such programmes need to exist alongside efforts to immunise those unvaccinated who are at the highest risk. Persuading unvaccinated people has been difficult, even with financial incentives and other creative strategies. Meanwhile, there is a sizeable segment of the population who would enthusiastically clamour for third doses as soon as they become available. Implementing third-dose programmes would provide an immediate benefit directly to this highly motivated group and the communities in which they live, while programmes aimed to encourage unvaccinated people to be immunised continue.
Second, there is an understandable worry that programmes such as Israel’s perpetuate inequality. More vaccines are undoubtedly needed for more people in more places. This alone should not preclude consideration of third-dose programmes in vaccine-experienced countries struggling with Delta outbreaks. While the breathtaking short-term protection observed in clinical trials initially supported a two-dose vaccine series, the newer data suggests that a primary immunisation series followed by an additional dose months later should be the new standard protocol. This is already the schedule for other viral vaccines, such as the hepatitis B vaccine.
It’s shocking to see so many leftwingers lured to the far right by conspiracy theories | George Monbiot
This does not mean that the needs of the rest of the world should be ignored. Indeed, the potential need for three vaccine doses to minimise the threat of Covid-19 globally should be a clarion call to invest immediately in sustainable immunisation programmes worldwide. Creating and maintaining the infrastructure for sustainable programmes would likely have the side-effect of improving access to other critical vaccines that are also not yet universally available. For example, less than 75% of infants in Africa receive all three doses of the hepatitis B vaccine. There is precedent for such massive, transformational infrastructure investments that benefit public health: UNAids estimates that more than 70% of those with HIV now have sustainable access to antiretroviral drugs.
Facing a potentially difficult winter, countries with an existing vaccine supply are at a crossroads. There is a tendency to look askance at data that was collected in other countries whose demographics and Covid-19 epidemics are subtly different. The Israeli experience is not perfectly aligned with other countries that use multiple different vaccine types, with different timing of vaccination, have varying population demographics, socioeconomic conditions, and Covid-19 burdens. The biology of Sars-CoV-2 immunity, however, is the same whether you’re in Tel Aviv, Tokyo or Toronto. The pioneering Israeli work of making third doses the standard provides an instructive template for other countries to follow as quickly as possible, while also ensuring that this becomes the global standard of vaccination for everyone, no matter where they live.
The message from Israel is clear: Covid booster shots should be standard
A third dose of the vaccine provides significant protection, but that should not mean those who are unvaccinated go without
- David O’Connor is professor of pathology and laboratory medicine at the University of Wisconsin
‘Booster jabs aren’t just an immune refresher – they are an immunological upgrade.’ Photograph: Abir Sultan/EPA
Mon 27 Sep 2021 06.47 EDT
In the summer, Israel began offering third doses of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine to the over-60s. It was the first country to start administering “booster shots”, to people vaccinated at least five months previously. The prime minister, Naftali Bennett, announced the decision after a study by Leumit Health Services, an Israeli healthcare provider, showed that those over the age of 60 who had been vaccinated more than five months previously were three times more likely to be infected than those vaccinated more recently. As of 29 August, Israel began offering a third dose to everyone aged 12 and older, who had waited this period of time. The question for other countries is now whether to follow Israel’s lead.
The first data evaluating the early impact of the third dose programme were published last week in the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM). It showed that two weeks after more than 1.1 million over-60s had received their third dose, they were 11.3 times less likely to become infected with the exceptionally contagious Delta variant that currently predominates in Israel and across the world.
In other words, third doses are highly effective at preventing people from becoming infected with Delta, among those who are willing to be vaccinated. When third doses dramatically reduce a person’s susceptibility to infection, it creates a barrier to the onward transmission and spread of the virus. This is important because growing numbers of people are getting infected despite being vaccinated (though the risks of infection, spread and severe illness remain greatest among those who are unvaccinated). And they have similar peak levels of virus in their noses to those who are unvaccinated, contributing to the unrelenting spread of the virus.
Third doses stimulate the production of neutralising antibodies that are both higher in magnitude and have greater breadth against viral variants than those elicited by a second dose. Taken together, booster jabs aren’t just an immune refresher – they are an immunological upgrade. These superior neutralising antibody responses create an immunological buffer that is effective even against the Sars-CoV-2 Delta variant, explaining the dramatic reduction in risk of infection following third doses in Israel. The same buffer would be expected to reduce the need for frequent “boosting” in the future, as higher levels of neutralising antibodies are predicted to confer longer-lasting immunity.
Other countries have watched the Israeli data closely but have been reluctant to embrace universal third doses for younger people for two main reasons. First, current vaccine programmes outside Israel continue to protect from severe disease, hospitalisation and death. This is a reasonable standard for evaluating vaccine protection, but it is not the only one. The crippling impact of Delta variant infections on hospitalisations in many locations in the US, despite widely available vaccinations, exposes the limits of using this as the sole benchmark.
An alternative reasonable standard for assessing vaccine impact is the prevention of even clinically mild infections in order to minimise transmission within communities. The status quo of vaccinated individuals who are not optimally protected from infection and transmission, sizeable populations (eg, young children) who are not allowed to be vaccinated, and large numbers of unvaccinated individuals have allowed Delta infections to rage.
Dramatically lowering the number of infections among people who have been vaccinated three times, one of the key outcomes of the NEJM paper, quickly reduces the number of susceptible individuals who are able to sustain the virus’s continued spread. Israel is already providing a real-world test of this concept, and the recent decline in its new cases is encouraging. Of course, such programmes need to exist alongside efforts to immunise those unvaccinated who are at the highest risk. Persuading unvaccinated people has been difficult, even with financial incentives and other creative strategies. Meanwhile, there is a sizeable segment of the population who would enthusiastically clamour for third doses as soon as they become available. Implementing third-dose programmes would provide an immediate benefit directly to this highly motivated group and the communities in which they live, while programmes aimed to encourage unvaccinated people to be immunised continue.
Second, there is an understandable worry that programmes such as Israel’s perpetuate inequality. More vaccines are undoubtedly needed for more people in more places. This alone should not preclude consideration of third-dose programmes in vaccine-experienced countries struggling with Delta outbreaks. While the breathtaking short-term protection observed in clinical trials initially supported a two-dose vaccine series, the newer data suggests that a primary immunisation series followed by an additional dose months later should be the new standard protocol. This is already the schedule for other viral vaccines, such as the hepatitis B vaccine.
It’s shocking to see so many leftwingers lured to the far right by conspiracy theories | George Monbiot
This does not mean that the needs of the rest of the world should be ignored. Indeed, the potential need for three vaccine doses to minimise the threat of Covid-19 globally should be a clarion call to invest immediately in sustainable immunisation programmes worldwide. Creating and maintaining the infrastructure for sustainable programmes would likely have the side-effect of improving access to other critical vaccines that are also not yet universally available. For example, less than 75% of infants in Africa receive all three doses of the hepatitis B vaccine. There is precedent for such massive, transformational infrastructure investments that benefit public health: UNAids estimates that more than 70% of those with HIV now have sustainable access to antiretroviral drugs.
Facing a potentially difficult winter, countries with an existing vaccine supply are at a crossroads. There is a tendency to look askance at data that was collected in other countries whose demographics and Covid-19 epidemics are subtly different. The Israeli experience is not perfectly aligned with other countries that use multiple different vaccine types, with different timing of vaccination, have varying population demographics, socioeconomic conditions, and Covid-19 burdens. The biology of Sars-CoV-2 immunity, however, is the same whether you’re in Tel Aviv, Tokyo or Toronto. The pioneering Israeli work of making third doses the standard provides an instructive template for other countries to follow as quickly as possible, while also ensuring that this becomes the global standard of vaccination for everyone, no matter where they live.
- David O’Connor is professor of pathology and laboratory medicine at the University of Wisconsin
- The message from Israel is clear: Covid booster shots should be standard | David O’Connor
Profit of Doom
Dismember
The Isarelis are murdering their people!!
PRESS SECRETARY FOR ISRAELI PM: VACCINATED PEOPLE NOW DYING, AND GOING TO HOSPITAL VERY SICK
Brighteon.com is a leading online free platform that empowers free speech, allowing individuals to freely share videos and express their thoughts without any form of censorship. Join us today and be part of our community.www.brighteon.com
If this government official is correct, we are looking at a self inflicted 2nd Holocaust.
The video lasts 15 minutes
bw
Fringe Ranger
Now there's a phrase to warm the heart. Sounds like the harvesting of a renewable crop, huh?
Mary Contrary
Inactive
People tend to forget that with a TRUE vaccine the immunity should not wear off in less than a year. It should last many, many years....but this Bioweapon shot is not a true Vaccine and so of course it only offers limited immunity. No surprise that the vaxxed are getting covid and other illnesses due to GETTING the shot. How many are dying FROM the shots now and they are not telling us about it?
Mary Contrary
Inactive
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
Good news for you, you'll get raises by default
Profit of Doom
Dismember
I have heard there is a period of suspectibility for a while after the jab, where you can easily catch covid? Is there also something about the spikes actually giving you covid or something that presents like covid? And then there are all the cardiac and neurological effects and misc. crap we see videos of?
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
Winner Winner Chicken Dinner ! kinda hard to duck and dodge those pesky NUMBERS ! Damn things are blowing up the optics.
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
Won't be the first time just ask Soros
bw
Fringe Ranger
Sorry, you flunk Set Theory 101. Even if a majority of the country is vaxxed, a majority of the sick can be the unvaxxed.
Mary Contrary
Inactive
Israeli doctors find severe COVID-19 breakthrough cases mostly in older, sicker patients
By Maayan Lubell
6 minute read
1/3
A medical staff member attends to a patient suffering from the coronavirus disease (COVID-19), in a ward at Beilinson hospital in Petah Tikva, Israel August 18, 2021 REUTERS/ Ammar Awad
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JERUSALEM, Aug 20 (Reuters) - In Israel's COVID-19 wards, doctors are learning which vaccinated patients are most vulnerable to severe illness, amid growing concerns about instances in which the shots provide less protection against the worst forms of the disease.
Around half of the country's 600 patients presently hospitalized with severe illness have received two doses of the Pfizer Inc (PFE.N) shot, a rare occurrence out of 5.4 million fully vaccinated people.
The majority of these patients received two vaccine doses at least five months ago, are over the age of 60 and also have chronic illnesses known to exacerbate a coronavirus infection. They range from diabetes to heart disease and lung ailments, as well as cancers and inflammatory diseases that are treated with immune-system suppressing drugs, according to Reuters interviews with 11 doctors, health specialists and officials.
Such "breakthrough" cases have become central to a global debate over whether highly vaccinated countries should give booster doses of COVID-19 vaccines, and to which people.
Israel began offering booster doses to people age 60 and up in July, and has since expanded that eligibility.
The United States, citing data out of Israel and other findings, said on Wednesday it would make booster doses available to all Americans beginning in September.
Other countries, including France and Germany, have so far limited their booster plans to the elderly and people with weak immune systems.
"The vaccinated patients are older, unhealthy, often they were bedridden before infection, immobile and already requiring nursing care," said Noa Eliakim-Raz, head of the coronavirus ward at Rabin Medical Centre in Petach Tikva.
In contrast, "the unvaccinated COVID patients we see are young, healthy, working people and their condition deteriorates rapidly," she said. "Suddenly they're being put on oxygen or on a respirator."
Israel's Health Ministry raised new alarm this week with a report showing the effectiveness against severe disease of the Pfizer vaccine, developed with Germany's BioNTech, appeared to have dropped from more than 90% to 55% in people age 65 and up who received their second jab in January.
Disease experts say it is not clear how representative the figures are, but agree it is concerning given evidence that overall vaccine protection against infection is waning.
They cannot say whether that is due to the amount of time that has passed since inoculation, the ability of the highly contagious Delta variant to evade protection, the age and underlying health of the people vaccinated, or a combination of all of these factors.
Health officials in the UK and United States, two other nations with high vaccination rates and a spike in Delta infections, have reported similar trends. In the UK, about 35% of the people hospitalized with a Delta case in recent weeks had received two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine. Nearly three-quarters of U.S. breakthrough infections that led to hospitalization or death were among people age 65 or older, according to federal data.
U.S. officials said their booster plan is based on concern that over time, the vaccines will provide less protection against severe disease, including among younger adults.
"We are watching other countries carefully and (are) concerned that we too will see what Israel is seeing, which is worsening infections over time" among vaccinated people, U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Director Rochelle Walensky said at a press conference on Wednesday.
The World Health Organization has repeatedly urged wealthy nations to refrain from providing boosters while much of the world has yet to access their first COVID vaccine doses.
IMMUNE RESPONSE
The Delta variant, first identified in India, has become the dominant version of the SARS-CoV-2 virus globally, accelerating a pandemic that has killed more than 4.4 million people.
In Israel, daily new cases have increased from the single digits in June to around 8,000 since the arrival of Delta. Approximately half of the cases - the majority of them mild to moderate - are in vaccinated people.
Those vaccinated first in Israel were at high-risk, including people age 60 and up. The immune response of some may have weakened by the time Delta hit Israel. But for others with underlying health conditions, the vaccine may have not kicked in at all.
"For some of them the vaccine did not trigger an immune response, they had no antibodies, because of the illness itself or because they are treated with medication that suppresses the immune system," said Dror Mevorach, who heads the coronavirus ward at Hadassah hospital in Jerusalem. He cited examples such as chronic lymphocytic leukemia and lymphoma.
Among 3 million vaccinated Israelis covered by Clalit, the country's largest healthcare provider, 600 have suffered severe breakthrough cases since June. Around 75% of them were above the age of 70 and were at least 5 months after their second dose, according to Ran Balicer, Clalit's chief innovation officer. Nearly all of them have chronic illnesses.
"We are hardly seeing young vaccinated people in severe condition," said Balicer.
In the UK, doctors described similar characteristics among vaccinated patients who fall severely ill.
"In those people who come in, because of their age, because of their co-morbidities, they might be people that you would expect that the vaccine is not quite so efficacious as other age groups," said Tom Wingfield, a clinical lecturer at the Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine.
A new surge in U.S. coronavirus cases and deaths has been fueled by Delta, particularly in states where vaccination rates remain low. Among vaccinated patients who become infected, there is evidence of older people being hit harder.
In Texas, 92% of the vaccine breakthrough cases that resulted in death were in people over the age of 60 and 75% had a known underlying condition that put them at high risk from COVID-19, according to a public health department spokesperson.
Initial data in Israel suggests the booster shots administered in the last few weeks are reducing the risk of infection in older people compared with those who have received only two doses. read more .
Even without boosters, Israeli doctors say that vaccinated patients tend to recover more quickly.
"The vaccinated patients I've treated usually left the ICU in about three days. The unvaccinated patients took a week or two until they stabilized," said Yael Haviv-Yadid, head of the critical care ward at Sheba Medical Centre near Tel Aviv.
Even if the vaccine did not stop them getting ill, it may have mitigated their illness, said Alex Rozov, head of the coronavirus ward at Barzilai Medical Centre in Ashkelon.
"Our cautious impression is that the vaccinated patients suffer an easier course of illness - the treatment is more effective among those who have antibodies."
/cloudfront-us-east-2.images.arcpublishing.com/reuters/KMBFZU2FKJIBHF4K3TWBEW2QZA.jpg)
Israeli doctors find severe COVID-19 breakthrough cases mostly in older, sicker patients
In Israel's COVID-19 wards, doctors are learning which vaccinated patients are most vulnerable to severe illness, amid growing concerns about instances in which the shots provide less protection against the worst forms of the disease.www.reuters.com
I no
Did you mean safe from covid cuz they got the shot? Or safe from vaccine side effects? Not sure what you meant. Type O blood is supposed to be more resistant to covid, but won't help with the dangerous side effects from the vaccine.
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
Mary Contrary
Inactive
So did this little boy get a heart attack from the covid vaccine? Notice his crooked mouth. Looks like he got Bells Palsy from the shot too. And he will never be able to eat all that food. He will probably be infertile now too. No grandkids for the parents!!
bw
Fringe Ranger
but they're not, and if my uncle had tits he'd be my aunt, facts not theories
The ratio of who's jabbed/unjabbed among the sick does not come from the ratio of jabbiness in the population.
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
look Joe Biden told me that if I got the vaccine, I wouldn't get the virus, sadly this hasn't been the case. Lucy for me common sense told me to do exactly the opposite of what Sleepy joe requested, I have a hard hard time understanding why people want to put an untested substance into their bodies based on promises from a bunch of communist sheisters who are enriching themselves off of this "pandemic". Don't forget Kamala said she would never take that "Trump" poison, its amazing how you're opinions can change when you're getting payola.
I mean Jesus, 99.7% survival is pretty damn good, most people are just self-serving tunnel vision morons who think only of themselves, they hear the word "death" and their damn heads explode, I see these idiots driving on the highway everyday like their the only son of a bitches on the planet.
I'm entirely too old and have a nice semblance of a red wine buzz so ratios are all yours, the fact is Vaccinated people are getting sick and apparently in pretty damn large numbers, so if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle
naegling62
Veteran Member
I think what you're referring to is the first dose which is Binding Anti-bodies. Do Binding Anti-bodies make you Covid fly paper without the Neutralizing Anti-bodies? That's for another board member with a better understanding to answer.
Perfect. And typical.
He didn't have a heart attack, he had a stroke.
It happened 3 years ago, way before any vaccine or even COVID in the first place.
If only he had taken ivermectin, that wouldn't have happened.
Rebounding Back to Life, Dominic Perseveres Past Pediatric Stroke
Pediatric stroke can occur in an instant and impact family for a lifetime. Now seven months after their oldest son Dominic survived multiple strokes that were treated by a national leader in pediatric stroke at Seattle Children's, Tony and Laurie Donati share their message of hope and recovery.
pulse.seattlechildrens.org
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
That's terrible, to exploit a kid, Facebook is a den of liberal snakes, hell all of social media is...Perfect. And typical.
He didn't have a heart attack, he had a stroke.
It happened 3 years ago, way before any vaccine or even COVID in the first place.
If only he had taken ivermectin, that wouldn't have happened.
Rebounding Back to Life, Dominic Perseveres Past Pediatric Stroke
Pediatric stroke can occur in an instant and impact family for a lifetime. Now seven months after their oldest son Dominic survived multiple strokes that were treated by a national leader in pediatric stroke at Seattle Children's, Tony and Laurie Donati share their message of hope and recovery.
After first vaccine and until you make antibodies you are just as vulnerable to infection as an unvaccinated person. About 8-10 days. 21 days you rechallenge with second dose to get neutralizing antibodies.
naegling62
Veteran Member
naegling62
Veteran Member
As COVID cases surge, Israel starts vaccinating young children
Israel’s health ministry estimates that one in 3,500 children infected with coronavirus will later develop Multisystem Inflammatory Syndrome in Children (MIS-C)in which parts of the body beco…
www.mercurynews.com
Intestinal Fortitude
Have Faith
or maybe Bruce Jennerbut they're not, and if my uncle had tits he'd be my aunt, facts not theories
Fenwick Babbitt
Veteran Member
Wait I thought it was Kaitlyn
von Koehler
Has No Life - Lives on TB
naegling62
Veteran Member
I think the reason for pushing the narrative of a surge when charts don't back it up is just to try to get people to vax their kids.
Average folks not too concerned won't go dig up the charts. They'll just take the headline for granted.
Average folks not too concerned won't go dig up the charts. They'll just take the headline for granted.
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bw
Fringe Ranger
Like it's carved in stone, huh?