Celestial Vanishing act: Exploring the case of the disappearing moon

tanstaafl

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Can it be hollow and flat simultaneously?

I don't see why not. Every summer the ecowieners scream "global warming" and then every winter they scream "climate change." They hold both ideas in their heads simultaneously and trot out whichever one fits the weather that week. If they can do it then it seems only fair that others can too. :)
 

JF&P

Deceased
Gravity is the result of mass, it’s the reason all large objects in space are spheres.
 

jed turtle

a brother in the Lord
I've dug into it.

Still not buying the lame reasons of why we don't have a base at least on the moon, 50 years after landing on it.
There is a long article somewhere about all the serious problems they had with dust up there and the severe wear it caused on their space suits. According to Douglas Voght, we created NASA because the pentagon was worried about the intense amount of sunspots back around 1957, and suspected there may be evidence of previous micro novas from the sun on the moon. A video he included in one of his lectures showed the first astronauts noting in amazement about the glassed rock “prisms” And small blue “marbles” everywhere on the surface of the lunar soil.
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
There is a long article somewhere about all the serious problems they had with dust up there and the severe wear it caused on their space suits. According to Douglas Voght, we created NASA because the pentagon was worried about the intense amount of sunspots back around 1957, and suspected there may be evidence of previous micro novas from the sun on the moon. A video he included in one of his lectures showed the first astronauts noting in amazement about the glassed rock “prisms” And small blue “marbles” everywhere on the surface of the lunar soil.

If you happen across that article again please post it here I'd love to read more about this! I knew the lunar surface was pretty bad but this is the first I've heard about the marbles.
 

West

Senior
I'll still call BS!

There is no real reason we don't have like a Reno, Las Vegas or a Holiday Inn on the moon after 55 YEARS!

I alone would of paid at the least $50k for a weekend on the moon in the late 90s plus.

I spent that alone in Reno in a year. And I'm such a small fry it's not even funny.

I'm sure many, many big wigs would of paid millions for a weekend on the moon!

Really, think about it! Money was not a issue.

Politics and government regulations, yes. However, even then the anti moon regulations by government could of been overcome by time.

Over 55 years now!

I'm really negative that we did step on the moon now. Or I'm a idiot for not knowing the power that the government has to keep private interprise and capitalism at bay on the moon.

IDK
 

jed turtle

a brother in the Lord
I'll still call BS!

There is no real reason we don't have like a Reno, Las Vegas or a Holiday Inn on the moon after 55 YEARS!

I alone would of paid at the least $50k for a weekend on the moon in the late 90s plus.

I spent that alone in Reno in a year. And I'm such a small fry it's not even funny.

I'm sure many, many big wigs would of paid millions for a weekend on the moon!

Really, think about it! Money was not a issue.

Politics and government regulations, yes. However, even then the anti moon regulations by government could of been overcome by time.

Over 55 years now!

I'm really negative that we did step on the moon now. Or I'm a idiot for not knowing the power that the government has to keep private interprise and capitalism at bay on the moon.

IDK
Ya gotta remember, going to the moon started before Vietnam really took off. We realized that we couldn’t afford both. Especially if we had to fight our way back up there, since there were stories from some of the guys that came back that there were bases already there... and iirc, we were told we were not welcome...
 

packyderms_wife

Neither here nor there.
Ya gotta remember, going to the moon started before Vietnam really took off. We realized that we couldn’t afford both. Especially if we had to fight our way back up there, since there were stories from some of the guys that came back that there were bases already there... and iirc, we were told we were not welcome...

Did they say who or what was running those bases?
 

jed turtle

a brother in the Lord
It does when you realize that we're binary planets.
Do not forget the beyond “amazing coincidence“ that the moon’s size and distance from the Earth is perfectly proportioned to permit total solar eclipses of the sun which allow observers to study the CORONA of the sun... Unique in all the solar system.
 

tanstaafl

Has No Life - Lives on TB
It does when you realize that we're binary planets.

I think technically binary planets or asteroids or what-have-you rotate around a point in space (for example, Pluto and Charon), whereas as far as I know the Moon rotates around a point located inside the Earth.

Do not forget the beyond “amazing coincidence“ that the moon’s size and distance from the Earth is perfectly proportioned to permit total solar eclipses of the sun which allow observers to study the CORONA of the sun... Unique in all the solar system.

What's unique is that humans are here at the time when that is true. It won't be true a few tens of thousands of years from now.
 

Squib

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Wow, I’ll bet there are a lot of people here who think that Covid vaccines are 100% safe and effective too, right?

Well, the scientist told you they were, right? Established science and all?

My point is that no one here AFAIK has been to the moon. Any empirical data we have is given to us by others…interpreted by them, formed into a hypothesis, and then a theory…

Many of us here have become very distrustful of establishment science in our lives and for good reason too.

There are no such thing as brut facts. They all are placed into a group by people with beliefs, agendas, and there is a ton of money, power and control at stake with the so called scientific facts.

Who here hasn't read about the multitude of hoaxes pulled on wishful people longing to have Darwinism proven?

Piltdown man, Peking Man, geocentric solar system, blood letting, and a million other things were accepted and later debunked…

If we’ve learned anything, there is no such thing as settled science…ask the Average astronomers in Galileo‘s day…it wasn’t so much church vs. Science…anymore than the covid debacle was.

It was official, controlled science vs. unofficial, free thinking science…both sides had reputable, credentialed scientists in their corner...and at least one side had an agenda!

Those who embrace a minority opinion, no matter how goofy you may think it is, should be patiently refuted…not burned at the stake, ridiculed, or mocked.

Sure, I have my beliefs…I hold them by faith, but most people have to exercise as much faith as the most religious person does when it comes to their understanding of the cosmos, micro biology, etc.
 

West

Senior
Somebody’s been pulling your leg and blowing smoke up your exhaust port.

“For example, the brightness of a full Moon is usually quoted at magnitude around –13, about 14 magnitudes or 400,000 times fainter than the Sun. (With a mean albedo, or reflectivity, of just 13%, the Moon is actually as dark as worn asphalt.)”

Many nights when the full moon is up or directly above, I've walked around and near the woods, often stepping into the shade of the forest trees disappearing, to watch the wild life play in the moonshine. With no flashlight or alike.

Really, granted it was in the country and mountains. And clear full moon nights around midnight or when the moon is at 12 in the sky.

Don't think old pavement could reflect that much light. It's enough to see by. Granted younger eyes.

IDK
 
Many nights when the full moon is up or directly above, I've walked around and near the woods, often stepping into the shade of the forest trees disappearing, to watch the wild life play in the moonshine. With no flashlight or alike.

Really, granted it was in the country and mountains. And clear full moon nights around midnight or when the moon is at 12 in the sky.

Don't think old pavement could reflect that much light. It's enough to see by. Granted younger eyes.

IDK
When you, and your eyes, are in that dark, your irises are wide open, and whatever else your eyes can do to be more sensitive, is being done.
When you look at asphalt in daylight, your eyes are cranked way down, as you have much ambient light around you. If you could block your view to see only the daylight asphalt at the same time as the sunlit moon, and nothing else, they should appear similar.
 
Do not forget the beyond “amazing coincidence“ that the moon’s size and distance from the Earth is perfectly proportioned to permit total solar eclipses of the sun which allow observers to study the CORONA of the sun... Unique in all the solar system.
That’s why we have “visitors” around eclipse time, we’re a friggin tourist trap.
 
My point is that no one here AFAIK has been to the moon. Any empirical data we have is given to us by others…interpreted by them, formed into a hypothesis, and then a theory…
“We” could fire a laser and bounce if off that reflector up there, but are we sure it wasn’t just dropped by a probe?
 

tanstaafl

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Also the only one with that eclipse proportion just right.

It won't be in another few tens of thousands of years since the Moon is slowly moving farther away from Earth. Which suggests (but I don't know this for a fact) that the Moon was closer a few tens of thousands of years ago (well within the timeframe of humans in terms of modern brain power) and those proportion didn't used to be "just right."
 

ghost

Veteran Member

Vanishing act: Exploring the case of the disappearing moon

Nearly 1,000 years ago, the moon vanished from the night sky without trace, and wasn’t seen for months on end. A team of researchers believes it knows why.

By Thomas Leffler, AccuWeather staff writer
Published Apr. 19, 2022 4:40 PM CDT | Updated Apr. 20, 2022 6:54 AM CDT
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Nearly a millennium ago, the moon completely vanished from view, maybe even lasting years. After combing through medieval records, researchers now have a better idea of what may have happened.

The relationship between the Earth, moon and sun has been documented since the beginning of time. The welcoming golden light of the sun greets humanity and serves as the dawn of a new day, while the eerie white glow of the moon sends the human race into its nightly slumber.

But what if there was a day when one occurred without the other? What if that day became weeks or even months?

Such an occurrence took place nearly a millennium ago, as Earth's moon disappeared from view during the month of May in the year 1110, with nary a reason given for the strange phenomenon. The unusual occurrence puzzled those who lived through it and continued to baffle astronomers throughout the ages. There was a belief that the moon's disappearance was the result of an eclipse.

The British astronomer George Frederick Chambers wrote about the celestial mystery in his 1899 book The Story of Eclipses. About 800 years after it happened, Chambers pegged the date of the eclipse as having occurred on May 5, during the reign of Henry I.

"The totality occurred before midnight," Chambers wrote of the moon's disappearance from the night sky, adding that it was “evident that this was an instance of a ‘black’ eclipse when the moon becomes quite invisible instead of shining with the familiar coppery hue.”

But is that really what happened?

Finding out the root of the lunar absence became the work of a 2020 study in the journal Scientific Reports, leading to a more complex answer than originally thought.

The previously agreed-upon conclusion was that an eruption at Iceland's Mount Hekla was the culprit. Hekla, located in the southern end of Iceland, was referred to as the "Gateway to Hell" by Europeans during the Middle Ages due to its frequent eruptions.

When an eruption took place at Hekla on approximately Oct. 15, 1104, sulfur-rich particles launched into the stratosphere. For many years, this event was thought to be the catalyst for the moon's apparent disappearance.

Hekla-e1650380217740.jpg


An eruption of Icelandic volcano Hekla, above, was thought to be the root cause of a multi-year disappearance of the moon. (Photo/Getty Images)

The Scientific Reports study, led by a team from the University of Geneva in Switzerland, began to unravel new information into the moon's whereabouts. To see whether the Hekla eruption was the sole cause of the disappearance, the researchers analyzed ice cores from Iceland and Antarctica, and eventually determined that the date of the Hekla eruption did not line up with the 1110 timeline of lunar absence.

To find the true source, researchers combed through the records of medieval times for any references made to a "dark lunar eclipse" or a "black eclipse." After pouring over many a scripture, the team made a breakthrough with the following 1110 entry from The Peterborough Chronicle: "[The moon] was so completely extinguished withal, that neither light, nor orb, nor anything at all of it was seen."

AP091202018742.jpg


The full moon is seen behind clouds above the village Gaiberg near Heidelberg, Germany, on Wednesday, Dec. 2, 2009. (AP Photo/Daniel Roland)

Knowing the lunar absence began around 1110, the team suggests a cluster of volcanic eruptions from between 1108 and 1110 was most likely the root cause, not the 1104 Hekla eruption as previously thought.

One of these oft-forgotten eruptions took place in 1108 in Honshu, Japan. A diary entry from a Japanese statesman, uncovered by researchers and cited in the Scientific Reports study, said that an eruption of Honshu's Mount Asama began in late August of 1108 and continued through that October.

"On August 29, there was a fire at the top of the volcano, a thick layer of ash in the governor's garden, everywhere the fields and the rice fields are rendered unfit for cultivation," the entry read. "We never saw that in the country. It is a very strange and rare thing."

MountAsama.jpg


Japan's Mount Asama, photographed here from a commercial airplane, was home to one of the oft-forgotten volcanic eruptions that led to a long-term lunar absence. (Getty Images)

The 1108 eruption at Asama, known as perhaps the most significant in the volcano's history, is one of what the study called "several major volcanic events" that is consistent with the "stratospheric aerosol loading sufficient to induce" the dark eclipse. Observations of changes to the moon, such as the dark, total lunar eclipse, as well as observations of dimming or discoloration of the sun, are major corroborators of the timing of major explosive volcanic activity.

On top of the eclipse, the 1108-1110 eruptions led to several societal impacts in Europe, particularly in agriculture. The researchers' work revealed descriptions of an abundance of severe weather conditions, crop failures and famines compared to other years with similar volcanic events. Losing the lunar connection between Earth and the moon had several negative side effects, making the bright nightly appearance missed all the more.
Think of this ? NASA dropped a part of one of their space probes on the Moon. It rang like a bell for about an hour. To me it is ?Now does the Moon Rotate, yes it does. I use a brown spot near true North as a marker. some days an others it is gone. I can see it with my own eye. The Moon does rotate. IT IS A SPACE STATION. Now look at the ring of fire, between the earth and moon. The { The ring is perfect } only man can make a perfect circle ? Who is living inside the moon and on Earth with US ????
 

Doc1

Has No Life - Lives on TB
NASA would know if that was true. Why so bright? Full sunshine, and nothing else around you in full sunshine to compare it with. Any photographers with spot light meters care to chime in? I think it’s supposed to be kinda gray.

The Moon is not "so bright" relative to anything else. It only appears as bright as it does due to the fact that from our perspective it rests in the blackness of space.

Film exposures on the Moon - or their modern digital equivalent - are almost exactly the same as they would be on Earth, with adjustments for Earth's atmospheric conditions. IOW if you could somehow find yourself on the surface of the Moon with an ancient Kodak Brownie camera, the old 'Sunny (f)16' rule would work just fine, 16 being one of the standard f stops in a camera's lens.

This is because, in astronomical terms, the Earth and the Moon are almost exactly the same distance from the Sun and it is the Sun which provides daylight illumination on both celestial bodies. If one were on Mars the Sunny 16 rule would not work because the Sun's illumination of that planet is dimmer (due to greater distance). The rule would have to be adjusted to something like Sunny (f)11 or Sunny (f)8. IOW larger lens apertures would be required to allow more light to pass through the lens.

Best
Doc
 

Doc1

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Think of this ? NASA dropped a part of one of their space probes on the Moon. It rang like a bell for about an hour. To me it is ?Now does the Moon Rotate, yes it does. I use a brown spot near true North as a marker. some days an others it is gone. I can see it with my own eye. The Moon does rotate. IT IS A SPACE STATION. Now look at the ring of fire, between the earth and moon. The { The ring is perfect } only man can make a perfect circle ? Who is living inside the moon and on Earth with US ????

I'm with you, dude. I've been selling lunar condos and time shares as a side gig for decades!

Best
Doc
 
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