INTL Disaster portends in Mexico...gonna be bad for us.

T

Troke

Deceased
http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/

A FRIEND EMAILS FROM MEXICO: “Shit’s about to collapse in MX and points south. It is frightening. I am seeing first hand, am traveling. Total anarchy and terror unfolding.” Well, that’s encouraging. All those counter-insurgency and nation-building skills we’ve honed in Iraq might come in handy closer to home.

Or, you know, we could just legalize drugs and pull the rug out from under the cartels.

UPDATE: A followup email:

It’s so complex. The USA unilaterally legalizing weed, as many have proposed, wouldn’t stop the violence — there are any number of possible outcomes to that. The causes are complex and brewed over time… all I know is that all signs are pointing to a far worsening situation down there, and increasing impact here.

Militarizing the border isn’t a solution, but having seen what I’ve seen, I’d be terrified if we weren’t hardening that border right now.

Time to come back to the States, I think.

I have been ranting about this for some time. Anybody for 'claymoring' on Channel 6 news the 10,000,000 refugees that will be fleeing Mexico in terror? They are coming if something is not done. BTW, the number is that % that usually flees when TSHTF in a country.
 
jed turtle

jed turtle

a brother in the Lord
this will happen. where else can they flee to?

we will be overwhelmed, even more so than now.

the chaos will spread like contagion.

like faith in the dollar,

our national unity will disappear suddenly, without warning.
 
Jeff Allen

Jeff Allen

Producer
jed turtle said:
our national unity will disappear suddenly, without warning.
Click to expand...

IMO, we need to think about this statement. This could portend true disaster to any American living in those border states!!!!!

I think war IN America is a done deal, the cake is almost baked...just waiting for it to come on out of the oven.

J
 
AzProtector

AzProtector

Veteran Member
Jeff Allen said:
IMO, we need to think about this statement. This could portend true disaster to any American living in those border states!!!!!

I think war IN America is a done deal, the cake is almost baked...just waiting for it to come on out of the oven.

J
Click to expand...

You obviously do not live in a border State....
 
AzProtector

AzProtector

Veteran Member
jed turtle said:
this will happen. where else can they flee to?

we will be overwhelmed, even more so than now.

the chaos will spread like contagion.

like faith in the dollar,

our national unity will disappear suddenly, without warning.
Click to expand...

Our national unity HAS disappeared, Red State, Blue State, the South, the Yankees, welfare infested inner-cites, the 'burbs, rural people...whites, black, hispanics, asians....the MSM and democrats have made damn sure that everyone is of all the differences that divide us, instead of that which should bond us.
 
NoPlugsNM

NoPlugsNM

Deceased
Ten thousand???? Probably a lot more than that. I would bet there are a lot more agencies personnel and mil on the border than what have been reported, but, they will not stop the onslaught of people if it does go completely crazy in Mexico.

US citizens need to get out of Mexico now, maybe better stated - like yesterday. It's like a firecracker whose fuse suddenly went out just before detonation . . any second it will blow, beware.

Up until a couple weeks ago, border patrol vehicles and other LE were patrolling a lot and visible everywhere. Today, quiet as a church mouse, hardly see any of the enforcement vehicles, it's like the just vanished suddenly. My best guess, they are dug in waiting. When I noticed the sudden disapearance of all of them, that's when I knew it was getting much worse, maybe to the point of no return.

I was down in Alamogordo NM yesterday. Normally, I would have seen several border patrol vehicles in the couple hours I was there - notta one - no state police - no local police - nobody from any dept of enforcement. I did see several helocopters traveling east-west, back and forth, and this was probably a good 80 miles into the US off the border to it's north. Even the usual traffic that's seen coming/going north from the border from El Paso TX, with lots and lots of Mexico license plates, just not there like it always is . . TOO quiet - that's a big screaming sign if there ever was one, somethings is up, and it's up big time. We have many time mores Mexican Nationals in our area where I live than I have ever seen, and I am about 150 miles north of the border.



NP
 
doctor_fungcool

doctor_fungcool

TB Fanatic
Troke said:
http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/

A FRIEND EMAILS FROM MEXICO: “Shit’s about to collapse in MX and points south. It is frightening. I am seeing first hand, am traveling. Total anarchy and terror unfolding.” Well, that’s encouraging. All those counter-insurgency and nation-building skills we’ve honed in Iraq might come in handy closer to home.

Or, you know, we could just legalize drugs and pull the rug out from under the cartels.

UPDATE: A followup email:

It’s so complex. The USA unilaterally legalizing weed, as many have proposed, wouldn’t stop the violence — there are any number of possible outcomes to that. The causes are complex and brewed over time… all I know is that all signs are pointing to a far worsening situation down there, and increasing impact here.

Militarizing the border isn’t a solution, but having seen what I’ve seen, I’d be terrified if we weren’t hardening that border right now.

Time to come back to the States, I think.

I have been ranting about this for some time. Anybody for 'claymoring' on Channel 6 news the 10,000,000 refugees that will be fleeing Mexico in terror? They are coming if something is not done. BTW, the number is that % that usually flees when TSHTF in a country.
Click to expand...

Good stuff Troke...loved your 'travels with troke' op ed.....keep'em coming.
 
amazon

amazon

Veteran Member
NoPlugsNM said:
Ten thousand???? Probably a lot more than that. I would bet there are a lot more agencies personnel and mil on the border than what have been reported, but, they will not stop the onslaught of people if it does go completely crazy in Mexico.

US citizens need to get out of Mexico now, maybe better stated - like yesterday. It's like a firecracker whose fuse suddenly went out just before detonation . . any second it will blow, beware.

Up until a couple weeks ago, border patrol vehicles and other LE were patrolling a lot and visible everywhere. Today, quiet as a church mouse, hardly see any of the enforcement vehicles, it's like the just vanished suddenly. My best guess, they are dug in waiting. When I noticed the sudden disapearance of all of them, that's when I knew it was getting much worse, maybe to the point of no return.

I was down in Alamogordo NM yesterday. Normally, I would have seen several border patrol vehicles in the couple hours I was there - notta one - no state police - no local police - nobody from any dept of enforcement. I did see several helocopters traveling east-west, back and forth, and this was probably a good 80 miles into the US off the border to it's north. Even the usual traffic that's seen coming/going north from the border from El Paso TX, with lots and lots of Mexico license plates, just not there like it always is . . TOO quiet - that's a big screaming sign if there ever was one, somethings is up, and it's up big time. We have many time mores Mexican Nationals in our area where I live than I have ever seen, and I am about 150 miles north of the border.



NP
Click to expand...

OP wrote 10 million, 10,000,000. BTW, is this on the news at all? I haven't seen it.
 
The Flying Dutchman

The Flying Dutchman

Deceased
=


I am posting this one article (from today's Winds of War).. Frieds are telling me the same thing - Mexico is about to "come into our collective back yard" The Mexican citizens are becoming terrified.


For Fair Use:
:srdot:

Mexico: tales from an armed city

Paramilitaries with automatic weapons have blockaded the entrance to an indigenous town.
By Myles Estey — Special to GlobalPost
Published: September 1, 2010 07:16 ET in The Americas
www.globalpost.com​


OAXACA CITY, Mexico — In San Juan Copala, paramilitaries from nearby towns violently rebuff would-be visitors. A blockade of large rocks prevents anyone from crossing into town.

Copala residents Mariana Flores Sanchez and Ila Sancha Gutierrez speak in strained voices about conditions under the blockade, which has lasted since April. They describe kidnappings, the constant threat of violence and rape and the vacuum of life in their town.

“We don’t have drinkable water, electricity, medical service,” Sanchez said somberly. “The children have lost their school year. The people of Copala are not dying of bullets right now, they are dying of lack of nutrition, dying of curable diseases, because there is no medical care. It's a ghost town.”

The indigenous Triqui residents of Copala want autonomy from what they consider a corrupt government. They declared independence in 2007, demanding the right to self-government by municipally elected indigenous leaders. They want to live by traditional indigenous law.

Other indigenous groups in nearby towns perceive this bid for autonomous rule as a threat to their financial and political ties with the state government. So much so that they have initiated the blockades and employed paramilitaries to patrol the town and the sole entrance to Copala. Armed with automatic assault rifles, the paramilitaries have been quite effective at limiting movement in and out of the town.


“The political initiative of the autonomous municipality caused the backlash from those who want to dominate and control the region to protect their own interests,” said Gustavo Esteva, a founder of Oaxaca’s Universidad de la Tierra and a well-known author and advocate.

Copala is not the only place where the struggle for indigenous rights has led to armed conflict. The Zapatista movement's fight for improved indigenous rights in Chiapas has come with spurts of violence, and there are numerous active land disputes around the country, some of which occasionally turn bloody.

However, Copala's recent call for self-government seems to have reignited existing tensions in the region, and caused the dispute to escalate to its current level.

Two Triqui groups — MULT and Ubisort — appear to be behind the siege, Esteva said. The PRI, Mexico’s most traditionally powerful party, openly backs the two groups.

In June, the paramilitaries fired warning shots to prevent a 300-person caravan of elected officials, journalists and activists from entering the impoverished region with 40 tons of humanitarian aid.

“The people don’t have a regular life there. No one sleeps because of fear the paramilitaries will come in the night to the village,” said Sanchez. “The paramilitaries want this. They don’t want to see Copala autonomous.”

Sanchez and a small group of women recently snuck past the paramilitary barricades in the night to travel to Mexico City to raise awareness through a live radio broadcast and conference. They also set up a stand in the city's main square to raise money.

“We are fighting for this because we know we can change this. We know it won’t be easy,” said Gutierrez. “We believe in the idea of an autonomous municipality that would be respected, that the paramilitaries will leave us alone in our region … and we can name our own autonomous president, that he won’t be a person like in years past that is named by the paramilitaries.”

Gutierrez and Sanchez’s words echo reports from the region for the past several months: that residents feel at risk outside of their homes, that parents constantly fear for their children and that basic goods and services are unable to reach the people in the town that need them.

With the election of a new government in July, observers hope an end to the conflict is near.

“There hasn’t been a clear declaration, but it seems like the new governor of the state will have to act distinctly differently to the outgoing one,” said Tomas Lopez Sarabia, president of CEPIADET, an organization in Oaxaca that provides legal counsel and translation services to the state’s large indigenous population.

Yet, at present, there is no clear path forward, and no road map for resolving the issue.

Despite this life under constant fear, residents such as Gutierrez and Sanchez remain devoted to fulfilling the community’s goals for autonomy.

“We are scared, but we have to return, because its our people, and we can’t abandon the people who are there,” Gutierrez said. “Copala has a better future, with more freedom for the people.”



=
 
J

Joann

Inactive
Good thread ...

We hear of various drug cartels and I've often been curious how they are created. The following is an article that describes the history of Los Zetas, absolutely fascinating, IMO, and it portends threat to the US. Written 3/09 which gives creditability to the predictions a year and a half later, as we see today. You really should go to the site to read the entire article, will only post a few paragraphs because of cr concerns.

Los Zetas: Evolution of a Criminal Organization

11 Mar 2009

From the original 31 members, the Mexican organized criminal faction Los Zetas has grown into an organization in its own right, operating separate from the Gulf Cartel and just as violent, Sam Logan writes for ISN Security Watch.

By Samuel Logan for ISN Security Watch
Click to expand...
Many journalists and analysts who write about Los Zetas still refer to this group as the enforcement branch of the Gulf Cartel. This was a true description when the original 31 Special Forces soldiers abandoned the Mexican military to protect a young, upcoming leader of the Gulf Cartel, Osiel Cardenas Guillen. But today, the Zetas have evolved into a separate entity with its own agenda. And it doesn't take orders from the Gulf Cartel.

The original 31 "Zetas" saw to it that at least another 10 men were trained. Members of Los Zetas, along with Cardenas, bribed, threatened and cajoled local and state police to assist with that protection detail. In most areas where the Gulf Cartel operated, local and state police formed the outer rings of a four or five ring-deep security detail for Cardenas and other top leaders of the Gulf Cartel. The Zetas remained at the inner rings, providing close protection support, and acting on the wishes of Cardenas and their leader, Arturo Guzman Decenas, known as Z1, and the man for whom Los Zetas was named.

But that was in 2003, when the Mexican Defense Department separated out Los Zetas as the most formidable death squad to have worked for organized crime in Mexican history. At that time there were perhaps some 300 members of Los Zetas: 30 or so original military deserters and the men they trained. Across the landscape of Mexican organized crime, no one could compete. These men were intelligence specialists and experts with a number of different types of weapons and operational tactics.

In many ways, these men innovated paramilitary tactics in use by organized crime today. Many agree that these men raised the bar in the Mexican criminal underworld, forcing Cardenas' rivals to find former military soldiers of their own, just so they could compete.
Click to expand...

Los Zetas vs the Zetas Organization

"Most of the original Zetas are gone, but the legacy of the Zetas still lives on," Jose Wall, Senior Special Agent with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives told ISN Security Watch. He added that the current version of the Zetas carries a "more brutal mindset" and apart from military and police deserters relies on a force of regular guys who have very little training with no future and no job to speak of.
Click to expand...

Crossing the Border

Nevertheless, the Zetas Organization remains a formidable criminal faction, operating both in Mexico and, to an extent, inside the US. Rumors of training camps continue to circulate, and there is proof that this organization knows how to amass weaponry. In November 2008, Mexican military soldiers seized from a Gulf Cartel safe house in the Mexican border state of Tamaulipas the largest cache of weapons ever discovered in Mexican history: over 500 firearms, including .50 caliber Barrett sniper rifles, rocket and grenade launchers, assault rifles and over a half-million rounds of ammunition.

At the time of the discovery, many analysts in the US considered the cache as a bold statement of what the Gulf Cartel intends to do. Some headlines even read that the Zetas "prepared for war."

Speculation about highly trained members of Los Zetas crossing the US border to hunt down and kill civilian targets seemed to be confirmed when a group of men dressed like a Phoenix police SWAT team entered a house and killed a Jamaican drug trafficker in June 2008.

Police in Birmingham, Alabama, who responded to a multiple homicide in a suburban apartment complex in August 2008, suspected Zeta involvement in the death of a number of Mexican men, found with their throats cut. Money and drugs in the apartment were not disturbed. Police in Georgia suspected Zeta involvement when they discovered that a man had been bound and tortured in the basement of a house near Atlanta.

Yet in none of these cases have authorities publically confirmed that members of the original Zetas carried out these hits, often referred to as "account adjustments" in Mexico. While it remains unlikely that Mexican members of the Zetas Organization cross the border to maim and kill rivals, there is strong evidence that connects Mexican organized crime with a robust and widespread prison gang population in both California and Texas.

The Barrio Azteca and Texas Syndicate prison gangs are most likely the Zeta operatives inside the US. There may also be some links to the Mara Salvatrucha (MS-13), as well as other, smaller groups. Yet these groups are contractors, hired for one job, maybe two, explained the intelligence officer. But there is little to no evidence to suggest that these groups operate on some sort of retainer, or use the Zeta name to spread fear inside the US.

Back in Mexico, however, the Zeta Organization has become more and more of a headache, both for the Mexican government and for the organizations' rivals.
Click to expand...
Fair use for discussion only see here for entire article

As an example:
Mexican Cartel Zetas Attack and kill an American in Phoenix
Photos below are of the attackers: Daniel Garcia-Saenz, 24, Manual Garcia-Trejom, 25, and Rodolfo Madrigal Lopez, 19
 

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NoPlugsNM

NoPlugsNM

Deceased
amazon said:
OP wrote 10 million, 10,000,000. BTW, is this on the news at all? I haven't seen it.
Click to expand...

OOPS, broke my glasses yesterday, my error . . TEN MILLION . . going to be a boatload of fun if it all goes crazy. None of this had made the news here, let alone the national news . . it certainly WILL if it becomes our reality.


NP
 
dimensiondancer

dimensiondancer

Inactive
Any word on how all those crappy US corps that went over there for production are surviving all of this?

I know lots of GM auto production, even Coca-Cola went there. Maybe they will reverse their location, who knows.
 
Scotto

Scotto

Set Apart
dimensiondancer said:
Any word on how all those crappy US corps that went over there for production are surviving all of this?

I know lots of GM auto production, even Coca-Cola went there.
Click to expand...

IMO they are all traitors. By moving their operations there just proved they don't care about America, just the almighty dollar. They can stay there and eat shit for all I care.
 
AzProtector

AzProtector

Veteran Member
dimensiondancer said:
Any word on how all those crappy US corps that went over there for production are surviving all of this?

I know lots of GM auto production, even Coca-Cola went there. Maybe they will reverse their location, who knows.
Click to expand...

The Coke facilities produce for Mexico...not the US.
 
T

Thomas Paine

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Troke said:
I have been ranting about this for some time. Anybody for 'claymoring' on Channel 6 news the 10,000,000 refugees that will be fleeing Mexico in terror? They are coming if something is not done. BTW, the number is that % that usually flees when TSHTF in a country.
Click to expand...

No problem, I'd also like to put in a few 2-3 kilometer mind fields with assorted anti vehicle and personnel minds, covered by stronf points with heavy and GMP MGs and on call arty and Tac Air. Backed up by company and battalion sized reaction forces to repel cross border incursions. I want the southern and northern borders to make the Berlin Wall/ Iron Curtain to look lile gauze curtains in a nursery. But then I'm a bastard of an ugly american
 
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