EDUC Problem: $42 goes missing. Solution: Let teacher strip-search a bunch of 12yo girls

F

Fred

Middle of the road
http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/17636835/detail.html

Parents Claim Teacher Strip-Searched Girls

MONROE, Mich. -- A Monroe mother claims her daughter was among a group of girls who were strip-searched by teachers at school after money went missing.

Several parents filed police reports last week alleging at least one female teacher from Trinity Lutheran School in Monroe strip-searched a group of seventh-grade girls when $42 was reported missing from a student.

"They treat criminals like that, not 12-year-old innocent children," said mother Martha Feller.

Feller said the school staff acted on the principal's orders.

"Some were taken down to their bra and panties and some had to pull their tops out and shake them," said Feller.

The next day, the school's principal, John Hilken, issued a letter admitting to parents that he acted in bad judgment, and should not have subjected the girls to this type of search.

Police said they have received three complaints from parents who feel an apology is not enough.

The school declined an interview, but released a statement saying, "the situation is under investigation and we have no comment."

Feller's daughter said she feels humiliated and hasn't returned to class since the incident occurred.

"I hope that they will take them out of that school and make them pay for what they did to the children," said Feller.
 
Breeta

Breeta

Veteran Member
So did they ever find the $42?

ETA: Yes, they found it... see link below (it's an old story, apparently before the principal knew the whole story.) - I still wonder WHERE the money was found.

http://www.monroenews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081003/NEWS01/110039956/-1/NEWS

(story dated 10/3/08)

A parent filed a complaint against an elementary school teacher who allegedly strip-searched female students.

A mother of a seventh-grade female student at Trinity Lutheran School filed the complaint Wednesday night at the Monroe Police Department. Since juveniles are involved in the case, the Youth Bureau is investigating the possible incident.

According to Monroe police Lt. Charles Abel, the mother reported that a student claimed money was missing. When no one in the classroom admitted taking the money, the female students were taken into an office where the teacher allegedly strip-searched them.

The report does not indicate whether the money was found or its denomination.

The Evening News received a phone call Thursday from a parent who said it was the seventh-grade class. He said his daughter was one of the female students who were strip-searched in hopes of finding the money.

Principal John Hilken denied the claim that any of his teachers strip-searched students.

"We searched bags, lockers and searched their persons, but we did not strip-search the students," he said.

He added that another person was there when the teacher searched for the missing money. He says a total of $42 was missing but later was recovered. The alleged theft took place when the seventh-grade girls volleyball teams were taking team photos.

Mr. Hilken said he was not aware of the police report filed by the parent.

"A lot of stories were going around, so that's why a number of parents came in and talked to me about it, but no one complained about anyone being strip-searched," he said. "I handled it yesterday, and I'm totally satisfied that this has been taken care of. None of the teachers strip-searched the students."

Lt. Abel said the incident is not listed as a larceny since the mother's complaint is about what had transpired at the school.
 
B

BoatGuy

Inactive
I'll betcha that if the parents went down there and strip-searched the teachers and principal, they could come up with the 42 bucks... Then, no apology would be needed and good fun would've been had by all...
 
U

USDA

Veteran Member
I don't get it? What is wrong with a female teacher searching for the loot amongst a group of 12 yr old girls? Some girls that age do steal...it would be good to catch and embaress them before it becomes a habit. What is so sacrosanct bout girls...no one would mind if it were boys?

Are we so bedeviled about pedeofiles that we can't correct children...and don't tell me it emotionally scarred the girls that were innocent.
 
fruit loop

fruit loop

Inactive
I wouldn't bother calling the school at all. I'd be calling the cops and Child Protective Services, and filing a sexual harassment/sexual abuse complaint.
 
mt4design

mt4design

Has No Life - Lives on TB
My son is 12 and though I haven't been blessed with a daughter I do know many girls that age.

This PISSES me OFF! The Principal and the teacher should be FIRED immediately. At a minimum, placed on leave until the issue is resolved.

Next time, if there is an issue such as possible theft, call the professionals.... law enforcement should have handled this, period.

Mike
 
Cardinal

Cardinal

Chickministrator
_______________
mt4design said:
My son is 12 and though I haven't been blessed with a daughter I do know many girls that age.

This PISSES me OFF! The Principal and the teacher should be FIRED immediately. At a minimum, placed on leave until the issue is resolved.

Next time, if there is an issue such as possible theft, call the professionals.... law enforcement should have handled this, period.

Mike
Click to expand...


Absolutely! Then the girls could have been handcuffed and tasered instead of searched. Oh, wait, then they would have been searched anyway. Nevermind.
 
fruit loop

fruit loop

Inactive
Please, parents.....tell your kids that sometimes it IS okay to disobey a teacher, and refuse to follow an order.
 
Fleataxi

Fleataxi

Inactive
Mike: According to the Principal, the incident never occurred.

From the Article:
Mr. Hilken said he was not aware of the police report filed by the parent.

"A lot of stories were going around, so that's why a number of parents came in and talked to me about it, but no one complained about anyone being strip-searched," he said. "I handled it yesterday, and I'm totally satisfied that this has been taken care of. None of the teachers strip-searched the students."

Lt. Abel said the incident is not listed as a larceny since the mother's complaint is about what had transpired at the school.
Click to expand...

The other alternative is the Mom is blowing this out of porportion looking for $$$ from the School District!

Fleataxi
 
F

Fred

Middle of the road
Fleataxi said:
Mike: According to the Principal, the incident never occurred.
Click to expand...
What's interesting is that the first story says the principal "issued a letter admitting to parents that he acted in bad judgment, and should not have subjected the girls to this type of search," while the second has him saying "[n]one of the teachers strip-searched the students."

Makes you wonder what the actual truth is, doesn't it?
 
D_el

D_el

Veteran Member
I think the Principal should be strip searched to locate his missing credibility. Maybe then he would realize the dangerous precedent that type of policy sets.
 
Hansa44

Hansa44

Justine Case
Being a mom and having 2 daughters in their mid-forties now, I personally feel those girls should have been lined up and threatened with the police and a full blown strip search.

When I look at the total lack of discipline and respect of others coming from kids today, it bugs my butt they are allowed to get away with so much, thanks to mommy and daddy running to their defense every d*** time they do something.

This thread is proving why kids today are out of control and have no sense of responsibilty for their actions.
 
C

cjoi

Veteran Member
fruit loop said:
Please, parents.....tell your kids that sometimes it IS okay to disobey a teacher, and refuse to follow an order.
Click to expand...

With all due respect, you don't have a clear understanding of the potential ramifications this advice could bring about.

BTW, even homeschooling is not a perfect haven from misguided state-employees, these days.
 
Amaryllis

Amaryllis

Inactive
Cjoi said:
With all due respect, you don't have a clear understanding of the potential ramifications this advice could bring about.

BTW, even homeschooling is not a perfect haven from misguided state-employees, these days.
Click to expand...

Well actually sexual abuse is very common between teachers and students.
 
fruit loop

fruit loop

Inactive
Cjoi, that is an incorrect assumption.

A lot of child molestation victims report that they complied with the perp's demands because their parents had told them to "always do whatever Grandma tells you" or "always obey an adult." Molesters know this, and will use it against the child.

I'd rather be a little embarrassed over my child yelling NO than have to deal with a child who has been traumatized by a strip-search...or worse.
 
B

BoatGuy

Inactive
USDA said:
I don't get it? What is wrong with a female teacher searching for the loot amongst a group of 12 yr old girls? Some girls that age do steal...it would be good to catch and embaress them before it becomes a habit. What is so sacrosanct bout girls...no one would mind if it were boys?

Are we so bedeviled about pedeofiles that we can't correct children...and don't tell me it emotionally scarred the girls that were innocent.
Click to expand...

USDA, I have a daughter. She is the light of my life. And, as she often says, she is the only thing that I ever did right. I have never had to spank her, because she has never done anything remotely "wrong enough" to warrant it. But, don't get me wrong. If she had deserved it, I would've done it in a second. I was just blessed with a wonderful child. I understand that others were not so lucky.

Now, I ask you this.. Have you ever had money disappear? I have. Did you wonder who did it? I did. Did you strip search everyone you had been in contact with, that day? I did not. I was upset that someone stole from me. I was po'd that I didn't catch the thief red-handed. And, I even "suspected" that I knew who did it. But, I didn't make everyone "prove" their innocence. In America, you are supposedly innocent until proven guilty and I didn't have enough evidence to pursue any one person. And, in point of fact, I am not a law enforcement officer and couldn't have compelled that person to disrobe, anyway. Neither the principal or the teacher(s) have been sworn to protect the public interest and, as such, have no right to demand ANYONE to prove their innocence. They also do not have the right (as of yet) to remove a student's right to unreasonable search and seizure, as provided by our Constitution. As a Supreme Court justice once said, "A person's rights do not stop at the schoolhouse door".

So, IF I had been the parent of one of those children and IF it were proven to my satisfaction, that this incident did in fact, occur, I would have been out for the LIFEBLOOD of anyone involved, first through the court of public opinion, and then through a court of law.

You're right, though. I don't believe that any child would be "scarred for life" by an incident such as this. But, I'd be hard pressed to explain to my daughter why such a thing might be acceptable in a civilized society, such as ours... Because then I'd also have to explain why the Constitution even exists, if we are not willing to follow it. Boy or girl, it was wrong and shouldn't have happened in this country, where the protections exist, to keep it from happening.
 
T

Tiberius797

Inactive
This is wrong is so may ways. First the teachers have no legal bounds to search students. The police would have to do it with the parents present. Second, the principal and teachers could be charged with child molestation, sexual assault and battery. So if the parents have any brains they will bring legal action against the school.
 
G

gunnersmom

Veteran Member
And if one WAS guilty, what about the other 11 who weren't? I know kids are different than they were when I was 12, but I would have been absolutely mortified to have someone search my person like that at that age. I hated gym class for that very reason. I developed very early and didn't look like any of the other girls. It was horrifying to have to run naked across a large room from the locker to the community shower they had set up.

I don't know if I would have survived a strip search, honestly. And of course, all the jibber jabber of the school afterwards.
 
H

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
In loco parentis, though allows for a lot, isn't supposed to allow for the breech of the civil rights of the student.

They might get away with this in the case of a weapons search on in loco parentis grounds. But this was about a missing $42, in most areas a misdemeanor that by itself likely as not won't rate a visit by an sworn officer or even a community services officer to take a report. If called in the department will take the information and mail you a report to fill out and mail back.

Considering what would happen to a host parent of a kid's sleep over and this happened, you'd have to pipe sunlight to them.

However you spin this dumb was the operative word for polite company.
 
M

mbo

Membership Revoked
fruit loop said:
I wouldn't bother calling the school at all. I'd be calling the cops and Child Protective Services, and filing a sexual harassment/sexual abuse complaint.
Click to expand...

Hmmmm, not so sure if CPS has any jurisdiction here, or would be recommended. The parents would be taking a big risk getting them involved in any regard. Their modus operandi is making the child unavailable to ANYONE, including the parents.



:dot5:
 
mbabulldog

mbabulldog

Has No Life - Lives on TB
USDA said:
I don't get it? What is wrong with a female teacher searching for the loot amongst a group of 12 yr old girls? Some girls that age do steal...it would be good to catch and embaress them before it becomes a habit. What is so sacrosanct bout girls...no one would mind if it were boys?

Are we so bedeviled about pedeofiles that we can't correct children...and don't tell me it emotionally scarred the girls that were innocent.
Click to expand...

It's called an illegal search. There was no probable cause.

Boys OR girls, Adults or children, it was an ILLEGAL search. Imagine yourself, pulled over on the side of the road. Officer says that the grocery store you just came from had a $42 piece of beef shoplifted. The only details we know are it was a male/female. Since you're male/female you fit the description (yes, intentionally vague) Now we are going to search your vehicle and your person. You wouldn't have a problem with that?!
 
U

USDA

Veteran Member
Fruit with your attitude you are just a 'cause' waiting for a happening.

Instead of grownups determining if the money was really missing and shaking down a group of probable suspects and getting to the bottom of it, embarressing yes but if one girl had that money getting caught would be the best thing for her life.

U would follow Dennis's statement point by point...the police show up, taser the girls or a few of them for general fun, taser a few again for screaming, and gave them a body search anyway...maybe even in cavaties...meanwhile the SWAT team shows up and shoots everybody's dog...the CPS arrive...all the girls are bundled off to foster homes and the parents are wondering 'how the hell did this happen?"

We saw it in Texas, but not sure about the dogs being shot.

:rolleyes:
 
U

USDA

Veteran Member
it was an ILLEGAL search. Imagine yourself, pulled over on the side of the road. Officer says that the grocery store you just came from had a $42 piece of beef shoplifted. The only details we know are it was a male/female.
Click to expand...

As a reasonably old man...I have been around long enough to have been searched for one thing or another quiet a few times. Mostly causually looking for weapons or drugs or alcohol...one cop, I being pulled over for going around the block three times in a 'poor' neighborhood that my good friend happened to live...was patted down because the cop thought my pounch was a gun in my pants...

I never took offense at these precautions...was mostly innocent (a DUI once or twice)...and if I had been them, I would have done the same thing. And my car was searched either by looking through with a flesh light or given the whole treatment with popped trunk. I never knew I was being singled out for some unusal punishment.

"Turn around, lean on the car, spread your legs..." No problem.
 
Mzkitty

Mzkitty

I give up.
I think back in the olden days a small amount of money may have "vanished" and the teacher said if nobody admitted who took it we all had to stay after school for detention. Nobody admitted it so we all had to stay. I don't think there were any thefts after that.

I'll tell you what though, nobody had ever better put one hand on my kid when he was growing up, I don't care WHAT the excuse would have been.

It never happened though and he's grown up now.


Nobody. Touches. My. Kid. For. Any. Reason.

Repeat after me.


:)
 
fruit loop

fruit loop

Inactive
USDA, you're a moron. You're talking to a kid who got paddled for supposedly stealing $5. (The money I had was for lunch, and they wouldn't call my dad to confirm). The "missing" money turned out not to be missing at all.

Tell me how you make that up to a kid. Tell me how you regain their trust afterwards.

You can't.

I would NEVER EVER let someone strip-search me OR my child. "It's for their own good" just doesn't fly.

It's not just "embarrassing".....it's an assault. Go feel up your daughter and find out if she will just get over it and move on.
 
R

ready2go

Veteran Member
If this happened as reported, the principal is felony-stupid. You'd have to prove the intent for gratification in order for the sex crime charge (in most states anyhow). The principal should, at the lest, be fired and subject to civil action.
 
R

ready2go

Veteran Member
mbabulldog said:
It's called an illegal search. There was no probable cause.

Boys OR girls, Adults or children, it was an ILLEGAL search. Imagine yourself, pulled over on the side of the road. Officer says that the grocery store you just came from had a $42 piece of beef shoplifted. The only details we know are it was a male/female. Since you're male/female you fit the description (yes, intentionally vague) Now we are going to search your vehicle and your person. You wouldn't have a problem with that?!
Click to expand...

School officials are not burdened to show 'probable cause' under the 4th Ammendment, only law enforcement and those acting under their direction. School officials are bound by district policy and State law. Most school districts have pretty clear policy regarding student searches.

I should add though, if it were my daughter, I'd beat someone's ass.
 
mbabulldog

mbabulldog

Has No Life - Lives on TB
ready2go said:
School officials are not burdened to show 'probable cause' under the 4th Ammendment, only law enforcement and those acting under their direction. School officials are bound by district policy and State law. Most school districts have pretty clear policy regarding student searches.
Click to expand...

Not the way I understand it. An unreasonable search is an unreasonable search, especially those agents acting in a supervisory capacity. Some precedent has been search for workplace searches, for example work lockers, but NEVER have I seen searches of the person blessed the Courts.
Please reference your thesis...
 
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R

richw

Inactive
fruit loop said:
It's not just "embarrassing".....it's an assault. Go feel up your daughter and find out if she will just get over it and move on.
Click to expand...

That right there is a crock of shit to say to ANY man!!! I don't give a shit who's bud you are!! You seem to be suffering from cranial rectal inversion lately FL. The article says some were stripped to thier bra and panties IMHO that is NO WHERE near molestation!!


Rich W.
 
Mzkitty

Mzkitty

I give up.
richw said:
That right there is a crock of shit to say to ANY man!!! I don't give a shit who's bud you are!! You seem to be suffering from cranial rectal inversion lately FL. The article says some were stripped to thier bra and panties IMHO that is NO WHERE near molestation!!


Rich W.
Click to expand...


How loud do I have to say it?

Repeat after me:

NOBODY. TOUCHES. MY. KID. FOR. ANY. REASON.


GOT IT?


Sheesh!

What's wrong with some of you?


:dvl2:
 
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