CRIME My Inattention Almost Got Me Carjacked!

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
Seen it here many times, probably needs to be a sticky up top with the other important info for this site. Situational Awareness.

Driving along this morning, running errands in one of this city's top suburbs, I missed my turn so around the back of a large strip mall I go. Look behind me to 4 young black men following me. Now I didn't know if I was going to find an exit toward where I was driving.

So, I sped up, flew around a corner and behold, an exit and people. The young men were still following me. I sped on to the access road of the expressway, weaving in and out of traffic and finally lost them.

Never once did I have time to pull out my cell phone from the pits of what I call a purse. Nor did I think to press ONSTAR emergency to have someone come screaming on an emergency call. All I could think to do was escape. And of course, I have not been carrying while running errands around the 'safer' neighborhoods.....no such areas any more.

I cannot honestly tell you where I picked them up.

Practice, plan, prepare and stay aware.
 

fruit loop

Inactive
You were lucky.

Immediately lock your doors when you get into the car.

Drive to a police station, or at least a very public place, if you are being followed. They don't want to attempt anything with lots of people around.
 

Dex

Constitutional Patriot
Good for you for being aware enough to spot them. Evasion was a good plan too. I would just say get yourself a handsfree setup in your car so you don't have to fumble for your phone in an emergency.

I had a black punk sneak up on me a few weeks ago. I had stopped at an abandoned parking lot to get something out of the back of my jeep. People have been parking their for sale cars there. I had my back turned digging for something on the floor in the back of my jeep and didn't notice this guy pull up behind me and get out of his car. As luck would have it or instinct or something I turned around just as he was approaching me with his hand under his shirt and a cell phone in his other hand. He stopped when I saw him and started acting like he was dialing his phone but he was paying too much attention to me. I got back in my Jeep and left but I knew I had just barely escaped a mugging.
 

SugarMagnolia

Deceased
ALWAYS carry.
Always always always.

Glad you are safe, and had good situational awareness.
Our trained-in good manners can cost us our lives.

Remain suspicious, and live long.
 

D_el

Veteran Member
GET OUT OF THERE at any cost Dex!

I was born and raised in between 'Balmer and Washnin' as the slang goes. Joined the military to get out at 19 and have never looked back except to visit parents while they were living.

My brother still lives there and hates it but will not leave as though there was some kind of magnetic pull keeping him there.
There's no amount of money you could give me to live there.
Once you get away from that hell hole socialistic cesspool the better you will be.

Ok, it wasn't always as bad as it is now but it has always been a notorious area. A great place to grow up in during the 40s, 50s, and even into the early 60s. The Johnson Administration started the downhill slide in my opinion and it has been gaining speed toward hell ever since.
Still love the memories of the 1000s of hours spent in the National Archives, Smithsonian Museums, and the D.C entertainment (mostly the Charlie Byrd Trio).
Lexington market was a highlight of the Baltimore day trips for astounding food bargains, not to mention Gordon's Crab businesses. Baltimore harbor was a treat before it became a backwater sludge basin. You could even catch and eat great fish, clams, and crabs from the Chespeake Bay back then.

The Mayberry RFD type town that I grew up in has long since vanished. Sheriff Andy Taylor types have been replaced with the JBTs with monumental egos for the most part. (Apologies to those few good LEOs who are still there).

Who was it that said: "You can never go home?"
Everything changes. Change is inevitable but Damn the speed with which us old pfarts have seen it go...never to return to yesteryear.
 

D_el

Veteran Member
ALWAYS carry.
Always always always.

Glad you are safe, and had good situational awareness.
Our trained-in good manners can cost us our lives.

Remain suspicious, and live long.


Gracious Lady, your location in Texas is 180 degrees from Maryland/D.C. as far as firearms. I agree with you 100% but when you live in Balt./D.C metro area, the laws won't allow the average citizen any protection. If you are caught with a firearm up there you'd better have a great lawyer and lots of $$$$.
 

FlyLadyFan

Inactive
Gracious Lady, your location in Texas is 180 degrees from Maryland/D.C. as far as firearms. I agree with you 100% but when you live in Balt./D.C metro area, the laws won't allow the average citizen any protection. If you are caught with a firearm up there you'd better have a great lawyer and lots of $$$$.

Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

FLF

.
 

Dex

Constitutional Patriot
D el,

Yeah you ain't just whistlin dixie. We have had a noted increase in crime in my neighborhood across the street from Fort Meade. I just call the cops anytime I see something suspicious now. They get here pretty quick. You are right about carrying a handgun, it's a good way to land in jail and loose all of your guns in this communist pinko state. FlyLadyFan is right too though, so I exercise my right under certain circumstances like when my wife and I are going for one of our dusk health walks...I wish I didn't have to worry about getting in trouble for it though.

We are planning on getting out of this area ASAP. Maybe PA or VA or even Vermont depending on the job situation. I already know i'm getting laid off in a few months and have to stick around for the severance pay. I was in West Virginia recently and people sure were nice there but not enough jobs there.
 

Dozdoats

Deceased
Mindset

Skillset

Toolset

IN THAT ORDER!

The most critical part of Mindset is SITUATIONAL AWARENESS. Learn to always live in Condition Yellow when you are out in public. None of us can take our safety for granted anywhere outside our homes any more, and unless proper preparations for security have been made, we cannot take safety at home for granted either.

Stay Safe, friends...

dd
=========================
http://www.teddytactical.com/SharpenBladeArticle/4_States of Awareness.htm

Home of the National Tactical Invitational

American Tactical Shooting Association

To view us online, visit http://www.teddytactical.com/

Sharpen the Blade: 05-2004


States of Awareness, the Cooper Color Codes
By Tom Givens
www.rangemaster.com

Most people stumble through life, blissfully unaware of the world around them. They remain preoccupied with thoughts of work, or personal problems, or how to get a date, or other trivialities, with no thought to their immediate environment. By not paying attention to their surroundings, they place themselves in needless jeopardy.

Go sit in the intake area in your neighborhood hospital emergency room one evening, as an educational exercise. Observe the unfortunates who come in for treatment, and you will get an excellent illustration of this point. About twenty percent of the customers are actually sick-discount them. The remaining eighty percent are there because they were inattentive to their environment. These will be people who walked off loading docks, or stepped off ladders twenty feet up, or backed into running machinery, or stepped into the path of a vehicle, OR allowed a thug to walk right up to them un-noticed and bean them with a brick. You can be stupid, inattentive, and oblivious in your work environment day in and day out and get away with it until one day the odds catch up with you and you are injured. The same applies on the street. You can be stupid, inattentive, and oblivious and get away with it until your path happens to cross the path of a criminal. The vast majority of criminals are opportunists, who only strike when presented with a viable opportunity. Remove the opportunity and you remove the risk to you!

By learning to observe your environment, constantly evaluate it, and react appropriately to what you see, you can achieve a large degree of control over your fate. This requires you to learn to shift up and down a scale of readiness, just like shifting gears in a car, so that you can match your level of awareness/readiness with the current requirements of your situation. In a car, you shift gears based on the grade encountered or the speed desired. On the street, you must learn to "shift gears" mentally, to match the threat level encountered. There is a sliding scale of readiness, going from a state of being oblivious and unprepared to a condition of being ready to instantly do lethal violence if forced. One cannot live stuck at either end of this spectrum.

If you try to live at the bottom of the scale, you will fall victim to an accident or to a criminal, eventually. It's just a matter of "when", not "if". On the other hand, you can't go through your daily routine with your hand hovering over your holstered pistol, ready to shoot if anything moves! What you must learn to do is escalate and de-escalate up and down this scale as the circumstances around you dictate. This is an easily learned system, and one that will help you be in the right frame of mind to deal with any conflict you encounter.

If you should find yourself faced with a life-threatening attack by a criminal, as a typical normal person, you will be faced by three enormous difficulties. They are:
1. Recognizing the presence of the predator in time;
2. Realizing, internalizing, and accepting that THAT MAN, RIGHT THERE, is about to kill you for reasons you do not understand; if you don't stop him; and
3. Overcoming your reluctance to do lethal violence against a fellow human being.


Let's look at each of these in turn. First, you have to see him and realize that he is a threat. Thugs are flesh and bone, and are not invisible. Contrary to public opinion, they do not beam down from the mother ship, attack you, and beam back up. They typically walk right up to you un-noticed because of the fog most people operate in daily. Learn to lift that fog and see the warning signs earlier, so you can be prepared.

Second, it is very difficult for normal, rational, socialized, civilized people to grasp that they live cheek by jowl with people who are NOT normal, rational, socialized, or civilized. There are people out there who do not care about your hopes or plans for the future, they do not care about your family, they do not care about the pain and suffering they inflict-they just don't care. They may kill you for the contents of your wallet, so they can buy one more day's supply of drugs. They may rape you because they feel powerless, degraded, and abused except while they are degrading and abusing someone else. They may kill you simply to move up one rank in their street gang. Guess what? It doesn't matter "Why?". A typical victim reaction is, "But why would anyone want to hurt me?". Who cares why?

Third, it will be difficult for you to put your sights in the center of a human being's chest and press the trigger, knowing that you are turning a vertical, living, breathing person into a horizontal pile of meat. Don't let anyone tell you that will be easy. As a society, we don't want it to be easy, do we? This is why legally armed citizens don't shoot people over arguments, or traffic accidents, and so forth. In fact, shootings by armed citizens are almost always ruled justifiable by the authorities, while almost a third of police shootings are ruled questionable or improper. Private citizens are reluctant to actually shoot, even when it is necessary. You must overcome this obstacle if your life is on the line. You will have to realize that there are times when lethal violence is not just excusable, or justifiable, or acceptable, but actually required.

Fortunately, there is a system available to help you overcome all three of these problems. By learning to use this system, practicing it, and making it part of your daily routine, you can be assured of seeing an attack in its developing stages, and become both mentally and physically prepared to defend yourself. Jeff Cooper, who taught it at ‘Gunsite’ and later gave an excellent videotaped presentation, first publicized this system, called the Color Code. I had the great good fortune of being taught this by Jeff early in my career, and I can say without reservation that this system saved my life on several occasions. Not what kind of gun I had, nor the brand of ammo, but this mental system. I feel so strongly that this is one of the most important weapons in your arsenal, that I feel it is my duty to share it with you.

I mentioned earlier learning to move up and down a scale of readiness, just like shifting gears. The scale consists of four mental states, which Jeff gave color names. The colors simply let us conceptualize and discuss the basic mental states. You must learn to go up and down this scale as the situation and circumstances around you change, as they invariably do as you go through your daily routine.


CONDITION WHITE- White is the lowest level on the escalator. In Condition White one is unaware, not alert, oblivious. This state can be characterized as "daydreaming" or "preoccupied". People in White tend to walk around with their heads down, as if watching their own feet. They do not notice the impending danger until it literally has them by the throat.

You see examples of this frequently. When was the last time you saw someone in traffic roll right up to a barricade or stalled vehicle, then expect you to stop and let them into your lane? They're operating their vehicle in Condition White. When a motorist runs over a motorcyclist and kills him, what are the first words out of their mouth? "I didn't see him." They're not lying. They were so inattentive and complacent that they did not notice a 200-pound man on a four hundred pound machine right in front of them. When this same guy runs past a stop sign and broadsides your car, killing your child, he will say, "I didn't see it.".

These same guys will be the victims of violent crime, because the criminal targets the inattentive, the complacent, the lazy, the distracted, the preoccupied. Why? Because the criminal wants to get to him, get what he wants from him, and get away from him, without being hurt or caught. Who would be the easiest person to do that to? Someone in Condition White. I'm sure you've seen or read about the Miranda card police officers carry. From it they read off a suspect's rights before questioning him. Dedicated victims carry a similar card in their pockets. If they are still alive when the police arrive, they take this card out of their pockets and read from it, as follows:
" Geez, it all happened so fast.
He materialized right next to me.
I never saw him.".

So, when would it be acceptable to be in Condition White? When in your own home, with the doors locked, the alarm system on, and your dog at your feet. Then, you can turn off your mind, if you wish, because you have sufficient layers of protection and warning to enable you to get up, get your gear, and get your head running. If you leave your home, you leave Condition White behind. The instant you leave your home, you escalate one level, to Condition Yellow.

CONDITION YELLOW- This is a relaxed state of general alertness, with no specific focal point. You are not looking for anything or anyone in particular; you simply have your head up and your eyes open. You are alert and aware of your surroundings. You are difficult to surprise, therefore, you are difficult to harm. You do not expect to be attacked today. You simply recognize the possibility.

Here's an excellent analogy. You are on a small naval patrol vessel in the middle of the Mediterranean. You are not at war with anyone today, so you do not expect to be attacked. You do, however, recognize the possibility, so you have your radar on twenty-four hours a day, making a continuous 360 degree sweep of the area, looking for potential problems. Suddenly, there is a blip on your radar screen. You cannot tell by looking at the small, greenish-yellow dot on the screen whether it is a good thing or a bad thing, so you ask a fighter plane to intercept the blip and check it out. If it is an Al Italia airliner a hundred miles off course, the fighter pilot will wave at it. If it's a Libyan MIG headed toward your boat, he will shoot it down. He won't know whether to wave or shoot until he first assesses the blip as a threat. This is exactly the same process you go through on the ground. When you leave home you turn on your radar, and it continually sweeps the area around you for potential hazards. When something catches your attention, you assess it. If it's not a threat, dismiss it. If it is a threat, start getting ready mentally to deal with it.

Anything or anyone in your immediate vicinity that is unusual, out of place, or out of context, should be viewed as potentially dangerous, until you have had a chance to assess it. Someone who looks out of place, or someone engaged in activity that has no obvious legitimate purpose, should be looked over carefully. When your mental radar picks up on a blip, you immediately escalate one level on the scale, to Condition Orange.

CONDITION ORANGE- This is a heightened state of alertness, with a specific focal point. The entire difference between Yellow and Orange is this specific target for your attention. Your focal point is the person who is doing whatever drew your attention to him. It might be the fact that he is wearing a field jacket in August. It might be that he's standing by a column in the parking garage, instead of going into the building, or getting in a car and leaving. It might be that you have been in five stores at the mall, and saw this same guy in every one of them. His actions have caused you to take note of him, so you must assess him as a potential threat, just as the fighter pilot assessed the blip earlier.

How do you assess someone as a threat? You have to take into account the totality of the cues available to you. His clothing, appearance, demeanor, actions, anything he says to you, are all cues. The single most important cue is body language. About 80% of human communication is through body language. Predators display subtle pre-aggression indicators, which are obvious once you learn to look for them.

When you shift upward to Orange, you begin to focus your attention on this individual that caught your eye, but do not drop your general over-view. You don't want to be blind-sided by his associates. You begin to watch him and assess his intentions, again looking at all of the cues available to you. Nine times out of ten, after a few seconds of observation, you will be able to see an innocuous reason for his behavior and then dismiss him. Once you figure out he's not a threat, dismiss him and de-escalate right back down to Yellow. Who is the tenth one? He is the predator, who would have got you if you had been inattentive. Now that you are aware of him, you are in far less danger.

As you assess this individual, and you see things that convince you he has evil intent, you start to play the "What if…." game in your mind, to begin formulating a basic plan. This is how we get ahead of the power curve. If he acts suddenly, we must have at least a rudimentary plan for dealing with him already in place, so that we can react swiftly enough. By saying to yourself, "That guy looks like he is about to stick me up, what am I going to do about it?", you begin the mental preparation vital to winning the conflict. With even a simple plan already in place, your physical reaction is both assured and immediate, if the bad guy presses his intentions. If, after assessing him, you believe he is an actual threat, you then escalate to the highest level, Condition Red.

CONDITION RED- In Red, you are ready to fight! You may, or may not, actually be fighting, but you are MENTALLY PREPARED to fight. In many, or perhaps even most, circumstances where you have gone fully to Red, you will not actually physically do anything at all. The entire process of escalating from Yellow, to Orange, to Red, then de-escalating right back down the scale as the situation is resolved, occurs without any actual physical activity on your part. The key is that you were mentally prepared for a conflict, and thus could physically act if the situation demanded.

When you believe a threat is real, and you have escalated to Red, you are waiting on the Mental Trigger, which is a specific, pre-determined action on his part that will result in an immediate, positive, aggressive, defensive reaction from you. This is how you achieve the speed necessary to win. By having a "pre-made decision" already set up in your mind, you can move physically fast enough to deal with the problem. Without that pre-made decision, the precious time in which you could have acted was wasted on trying to decide what to do after he starts his attack.

The Mental Trigger will differ depending upon the circumstances. It could be, "If he swings that gun in my direction I will shoot him", for instance. It could be, " I have told him to stop, if he takes one more step toward me with that (knife/tire iron/screwdriver) in his hand, I'll shoot him". Whatever trigger is selected, it is a button that, once pushed, results in immediate action on your part.

Your main enemy is reaction time. If you are not aware of your surroundings, and fail to see the suspicious character, he may overwhelm you before you can marshal an effective defense. On the other hand, if you are thinking to yourself, "I may have to hurt that guy if he doesn't wise up"; you've probably already won that fight, because you have a better understanding of what is transpiring than he does! The best fight is over before the loser fully understands what just happened. If you're caught in Condition White, you will need five to six seconds to realize what is happening, get your wits together, and respond. You simply don't have that much time.

There are a couple of mental tricks you can use in the early phases of your training to assist you in this. Remember that one of the three problems I mentioned earlier in this chapter will be actually "doing it", actually employing lethal force when required. To help with this, each morning when you put your gun on, remind yourself, "I may have to use my gun today". This plants in your subconscious mind (which drives 90% of your life) that there is a reason we wear these guns-we may actually need them to save our lives! When you pick up on that potential threat and escalate to Condition Orange, tell yourself, "I may have to shoot him today!". Believe me, if you have internalized that a specific person is an actual threat to your life, but that you have the means to stop him if need be, it gets easier to mentally deal with the situation.

Let's work through a scenario to illustrate these principles. Let's say you are working in a jewelry store today, a small storefront shop in a strip mall in suburbia. All of the other employees went to lunch and left you here alone. There are not even any customers in the store at the moment, you're alone. What mental state are you in? (Yellow. You are not ensconced in your home; you're out in the real world.) So you keep your head up, and occasionally you scan out through the glass storefront and check out the parking lot. Since there is no one else in the store, any problem will have to come from outside. You want to know about a problem while it's out there, not when it's standing across the counter from you.

As you glance through the glass, you see two men in their early 20's back up an old car to your store, get out in identical jogging suits, enter your door, and split up. Immediately, you go to Orange. They have done nothing illegal, and nothing aggressive, but they are out of place, out of the ordinary, so you escalate your mental state, and begin to think. "This looks like a hold-up in the making. I may have to hurt these guys. What should I do know? If things go bad, I'll drop behind this safe and I can shoot into that wall without endangering anyone on the parking lot. I have a plan." At this point you watch them, and continue to monitor their movements. If they leave, you de-escalate to Yellow once they are gone.

If they stay, they will probably get together on the far side of the store and briefly discuss what they have seen. They will then move toward your position at the counter, and after trying to distract you (Can I see that ring back there?) pull their guns and announce a stick-up. If you have been using the system, you went from Yellow to Orange when they came in, and went to Red as they approach your counter. You are ready. Because criminals have to be adept at reading body language (their lives depend upon this skill), they will see that you are prepared and simply leave. About nine out of ten pairs will leave at this point, without a confrontation. As they drive away, de-escalate from Red, to Orange, to Yellow.

What about the tenth pair? They are drugged, drunk, or both, and failed to recognize your level of readiness. They may go ahead foolishly with their hold-up. According to FBI studies, probably 80% of the ones you will actually have to fight will be under the influence of drugs/alcohol/drugs and alcohol at the time. What's the good news? They're drunk and/or drugged, which plays Hell with their reflexes, reaction time, and motor coordination. They'll be relatively easy to deal with, IF you are mentally prepared (Condition Red) and have done your homework.

If they come in, and upon observing them you go to Orange, then as they approach, to Red, but then they leave, and you de-escalate, you will have gone all of the way up the scale without even reaching for your gun, which is very common. The point is, you would have been ready to reach for your gun if necessary. This is how you win fights, by being mentally prepared to win.
 

Cardinal

Chickministrator
_______________
Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

FLF

.
\OK, I have something to say about this "judged by 12" bs. It is no bargain. Quite often the 12 you got judging you are of the same caliber or worse than what you shot. And if they are any better, you have a Judge telling them what to think, how to vote and over riding them if they do go independant on him. And the whole time, you are locked up with more of the same as what you shot.
So if you plan on defending yourself and waiting around for the cops, better make sure you have a good lawyer on retainer. Can you afford justice??

If you carry and must shoot, plan on NOT getting caught.
 

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
I am always vigilant, but never expect anything to happen. I think the men thought there would be no way out and I would have to turn around and pass them. I had decided that if there hadn't been an exit to a street, I was going to have to make one.

Question: what if they had had guns and I had been without? Do you think the car would have been enough? Jewelry? Purse, and everything in there? Or would I have taken a ride since I had seen all 4? Gives me the shivers to think about it.

And if I had carried my gun today and pulled it on one, how would I have handled the other 3?

I am still not prepared.
 

Mzkitty

I give up.
AR, don't ever pull off the main drag again, you know that now, right?

Driving along this morning, running errands in one of this city's top suburbs, I missed my turn so around the back of a large strip mall I go.

.
 

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
AR, don't ever pull off the main drag again, you know that now, right?

Driving along this morning, running errands in one of this city's top suburbs, I missed my turn so around the back of a large strip mall I go.

.

Yes, but -- broad daylight, in Plano, TX, pre-lunch traffic/crowds. Who would have thought? No, not ever.
 

mbabulldog

Has No Life - Lives on TB
\OK, I have something to say about this "judged by 12" bs. It is no bargain. Quite often the 12 you got judging you are of the same caliber or worse than what you shot. And if they are any better, you have a Judge telling them what to think, how to vote and over riding them if they do go independant on him. And the whole time, you are locked up with more of the same as what you shot.
So if you plan on defending yourself and waiting around for the cops, better make sure you have a good lawyer on retainer. Can you afford justice??

If you carry and must shoot, plan on NOT getting caught.


Cardinal,
There's a whole lotta "if's" and other other "maybe's" if you're tried by 12. There's only ONE outcome if you're being carried by 6.
I'll take my chances with the 12, because if I'm dealing with 6, I only got 1 chance, and I f--cked up...
 

Rams82

Inactive
I really am getting fed up hearing these kinds of stories from friends and the news. I often fantasize about using myself as bait for these types of criminals.:whistle::sh1:
 

Phil Ca

Inactive
There is a lot of good advice here and the primary thing is good old "Situational Awareness". Always lock the door after getting in the car and before exiting at your destination observe the surroundings before you alight from the vehicle. Does anything look out of place? Is anyone loitering or panhandling? Know the time so if someone asks you needn't be distracted by looking at your timepiece.

When you enter a business, take a look around,does it seem like normal activity or does the clerk look fightned oe are people acting strange. If things look out of place, backpeddle and get to a secure area.

Yesterday, my wifeand I were preparing to go to the store. A lady that had been cleaning house once a week for a neighbor was parked across from our driveway. Her driver's side door was openand she had left herkeys and purse on the console. She was returning with her cleaning supplies at that time and exclaimed,"I can't believe that I left thhe door open!" I asked how long she had been in the neighbor's house and she ssaid that it was one hour. Thankfully we live in a relatively secure neighborhood with little traffic. In the 5 years we have beeen here we have had about 10 total people coming to the door to peddle something. Also probably 40 doorhangers with ads for painting, plumbing, electrical, AC, and other home repairs. many of those were stuffed in the gate to the yard and not even hung on the door.
 

Firebird

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Wow, glad you got out of that one ok. Always keep your weapon with you, always. My grandfather and his cousin rana jukebox repair business many years ago. Good business, but it put them in a lot of seedy bars and places. They collected money from the jukeboxes nightly too.
One night his cousin went into a bar that he had been goin to for years to collect money from the jukebox. This one time he decided to leave his pistol in the glovebox. Bad mistake. He normally strapped it on in its holster and nobody bugged him.
Anyhow, he went in unarmed and an ethnically diverse fellow whom he had known for years followed him out to his truck afterwards. He was beaten to death with a lead pipe by this fellow. Devestated my grandfather. KEEP YOUR WEAPON WITH YOU AT ALL TIMES!!!
 

Tucson Sal

Veteran Member
The very good thing about all this is that "YOU ESCAPED" You will have better plans in the future from now on - you had a scare and this will never happen again to you. You have been "God Blessed" God Bless
 

SurvivalRing

Rich Fleetwood - Founder - author/coder/podcaster
Yes, but -- broad daylight, in Plano, TX, pre-lunch traffic/crowds. Who would have thought? No, not ever.

Holy Crap....MY hometown...Was just there in May on that "road trip"...

Could not believe the growth, expansion, long gone green farm fields either covered by concrete and strip malls, or getting small and smaller tract homes as far as the eye could see....

I could still find my way around town, but yes, most of what was good and new and nice, is now run down, aging, and industry and commerce continue to sprout along the edges...

I spent my first 33 years there, and the only time *I* nearly got mugged was in front of the old Williams High school one evening, and it was by a classmate who lived on that street...and whom I recognized...and who then just pretended he was going to mug me...strange night...

I would not choose to live there ever again, although my mom still lives in the house I grew up in, not a mile east of Central Expressway...not one neighbor who lived around us when I was growing up is still there...and most of the new ones my mom "suggests" are mostly hispanic...I couldn't verify when I was there..

But, Plano, like any suburb of a large dynamic metroplex like Dallas, goes the the cycle of tiny town, growth spurt, good times, downturn, decay, and the bad side of town becomes all sides...

AR...I no longer live in or near big cities...still living in extreme rural Wyoming, since 2000...but I DO carry, and have handy a cell phone with 1.3 megapixel camera, a 7.1 megapixel digital Kodak within reach, and one eye always watching the surroundings..and yes, there have been times when the hair on the back of my neck went up...because of a situation just like you describe.

The cell phone I can flip open in 2 seconds with my thumb, and the camera button is then right under my thumb. I've used it a couple of times in the middle of an event, just to get a snap of the area, or a license plate, or a semi-truck registration number printed on the drivers door...proof of the day, time, and something that can be traceable by LEO.

Yep, CCW is nice, but gun and run (get out of dodge) mui pronto works better...unless they're able to catch you and run you to ground...get a pic and go, but have the weapon if you have to stop...and remember...your car is just as deadly as a weapon...use it to stop the threat....if it gets to that...

Good job on keeping yourself safe....

Rich
 

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
Actually I am more angry that I let my guard down just because it wasn't South Dallas. I am looking to take a tactical defense course as soon as I can find one. And I am going to pick up a bigger gun (.38 special 5 slug wasn't going to be enough) with alot more rounds.

Definitely, not going to do that again. I still have the willies.
 

LeafyForest

Veteran Member
The very good thing about all this is that "YOU ESCAPED" You will have better plans in the future from now on - you had a scare and this will never happen again to you. You have been "God Blessed" God Bless
Really glad you are ok, and have learned lessons from it. You definitely have been 'God blessed" :hugs:
 

Dozdoats

Deceased
AR,

I neglected to say earlier that I too am glad you found a way to get out of what could have been a very bad situation. Good for you! Your saying that had there not been an exit, you would have made one with your car, is absolutely spot on. Your vehicle is a weapon too if you need it, and does in fact offer some protection against gunfire, though it is not 100% safe.

You wondered what would have happened of you'd drawn on them (if you'd had your gun). Well, a lot of folks expect thugs to run like roaches under a light if they get a gun pulled on them. That can't be relied on to happen, though. Lots of thugs see more violence, fights and gunfights than some combat soldiers do. You aren't going to scare them with a gun.

If you have to draw a gun, you had better be both prepared to use it, and capable of using it well enough to hit what you shoot at under pressure. You mentioned feeling that your 5-shot revolver was not enough, and that you wanted a bigger gun. Please look at the list in my earlier post- Mindset - Skillset - Toolset.

Toolset (hardware) is last on the list for a reason. It's last because it is least important. You can't buy awareness, judgement, skills and abilities in a box. They have to be learned, trained, practiced, developed. A bigger gun that holds more ammunition is not going to fix any of those things for you.

You said there were four of them, and then said, "What about the other three?" Well, if you have to draw, it needs to be with the absolute intent to shoot, and with the trained and practiced ability to hit what you shoot at.

Your gun should be loaded with capable ammunition for its caliber. I too carry a 5-shot .38 Spl, and mine is loaded with 110 grain CorBon DPX. Speer's 135 grain Gold Dot load for snubbies is good too. And you should have at least one reload in a speedloader as well, and be practiced at getting the gun reloaded.

If you are faced with multiple assailants, then "tea party rules" apply. That means if they don't run when you start shooting, each one gets one bullet, and then you worry about who gets seconds after that. If you train to shoot center of mass (COM), use an adequate caliber (.38Spl definitely is) with good ammo, you shouldn't have to worry unnecessarily (though you never assume any firearm is going to stop someone with one shot, either).

You wondered what they might do, if they would just take your stuff and maybe your car, or if you might be kidnapped too. Statistics indicate that you NEVER want to get taken to a second crime scene. If anyone ever tries to make you go somelace else, you might as well do everything you can right where you are to stop them. Most people don't survive a secondary crime scene- don't let anyone try to take you to one.

If you would, go over to Kathy Jackson's website at http://www.corneredcat.com/ and spend some time there. I think 'listening' to her would do you more good than getting 'lectured' by me. You said you were going to look for a training class- please let me encourage to do that. A good instructor can do a lot in a very short while to steepen your learning curve, and is worth every penny.

Don't beat yourself up unnecessarily- you got out of it, no one got hurt and you aren't out any property. There is no better outcome than that in the long run. And you found out some things you wouldn't have otherwise known- and that, as they say, is priceless.

Please do get training, please do prepare to protect yourself fully. No one else can protect you the way you can, and no one else is with you all the time to protect you.

Again, I'm glad you are OK, and I hope that is always the case.

Stay Safe,

dd
 
I NEVER go anywhere without my Fila Brasileiro riding shotgun.
She will alert to any perceived danger, make a serious rukus, and back it up with action should some idiot get closer.
All these give me time to get ready for action on my part, if still needed by the time my Fila does her thing.
Meanwhile, at home in the yard and also the house, are more Filas on patrol.
I've big heavy driveway gates, and loose Filas. Someone that I don't know, or even if I do know, comes to my gate, those Filas are right in their faces, or trying to bite them through the gate if they stand too close to it.
No worries. No fears. Plenty of Filas for protection.
And they are so cuddley and devoted companions to those that they love.
Yes, carrying is good to do. But just like in this instance, she would have needed to fumble in her bag for her gun, or cell phone, while driving and dodgeing down a back alley. But the silouette of the mighty Fila riding shotgun would have kept the thugs from targeting her to begin with.
 

Dozdoats

Deceased
AR,

I'm glad you're feeling better! If you want some help finding a class near you, please let me know and I'll see what we can find.

dd
 

Fleataxi

Inactive
AR: One piece of advice Filas mentioned - Two sets of eyes are better than one - either a human or four-legged partner should go EVERYWHERE with you if possible.

If you're in a communist hell-hole and can't legally carry, carry what you can - an ASP expandable baton can do a LOT of damage against a mugger, and your automobile can be used as a lethal battering ram if necessary.

Thank GOD you made up for your lack of SA, and immediately started evasive techniques. You were correct that if cornered, the best solution is to do a bootlegger turn and CHARGE! Even a potential carjacker in another automobile will normally evade a wreck with an aggressive driver, and a smart pedestrian will dodge an oncoming car moving at speed.

Fleataxi
 

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
I NEVER go anywhere without my Fila Brasileiro riding shotgun.
She will alert to any perceived danger, make a serious rukus, and back it up with action should some idiot get closer.
All these give me time to get ready for action on my part, if still needed by the time my Fila does her thing.
Meanwhile, at home in the yard and also the house, are more Filas on patrol.
I've big heavy driveway gates, and loose Filas. Someone that I don't know, or even if I do know, comes to my gate, those Filas are right in their faces, or trying to bite them through the gate if they stand too close to it.
No worries. No fears. Plenty of Filas for protection.
And they are so cuddley and devoted companions to those that they love.
Yes, carrying is good to do. But just like in this instance, she would have needed to fumble in her bag for her gun, or cell phone, while driving and dodgeing down a back alley. But the silouette of the mighty Fila riding shotgun would have kept the thugs from targeting her to begin with.

There is no room for a Fila in my car. I could fit a cocker spaniel in -- maybe.
 

Dozdoats

Deceased
Outstanding- glad to hear you're signed up already. One warning though- good training tends to be addictive 8^).

Do The Work!

dd
 

AddisonRose

On loan from Heaven
One curve and a exit(entrance?) with black people and you were in this panic, surely you left something out or I am lmao.


Truthseeker, it was the abridged edition - if you want more details, buy the book. I am not in the mood to be trolled by you.
 
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Achilles

Infidel
You would be amazed at the kind of people I run into behind strip malls: crackheads, potheads, burglars, homeless ex-cons....you name it. Nothing good happens back there at all.

If you get followed again, call the police and tell them what is happening, where you are and what your car looks like and what the car behind you looks like. Give them the number of occupants and the plate if you can get it. Then head for a police station or fire station - those are the two best places to go. Guys working at either place are not going to stand by and let you get whopped on. Never go home! If they have only followed you for like three turns around town, that's nothing to worry about. If they followed you for three or four turns, through a parking lot and behind a strip mall, that is something to worry about.

When the police locate the guys following you, and if you haven't made it to a police or fire station, make a few turns so the officer can see that they are following you. That gives him way more than ample probable cause to stop them and see what they are up to. Just keep driving unless dispatch wants you to stop. The officer rmay need a written statement from you about where they followed you from, or he may not. It just depends on what he finds. Either way, they won't be following you anymore.
 

Ravekid

Veteran Member
\OK, I have something to say about this "judged by 12" bs. It is no bargain. Quite often the 12 you got judging you are of the same caliber or worse than what you shot. And if they are any better, you have a Judge telling them what to think, how to vote and over riding them if they do go independant on him. And the whole time, you are locked up with more of the same as what you shot.
So if you plan on defending yourself and waiting around for the cops, better make sure you have a good lawyer on retainer. Can you afford justice??

If you carry and must shoot, plan on NOT getting caught.

#1: Save your money for a lawyer. Who knows when you will need a lawyer. Most have payment plans as long as you can come up with their retainer. Retainers for some great lawyers here in Indy are $10,000 for the best. $5,000 will get you a good lawyer that is good at making legal arguments and talking to a jury.

#2: Do not believe that the jury folks are all bad. If anything, it is a roll of the dice for _both_ sides.

A good case here in Indy: About 6-8 years ago, a man (black, middle to upper class, common decent citizen) looks out his window and see three teens (black, believed to be poor to middle class, thug culture) stealing his SUV. He gives chase in another vehicle that was also in his driveway. They drive a short while and they end up in a field. The guy was stopped right behind his SUV. Two of the teens in passenger seats (1 front, 1 rear) get out of the passenger side and run. The driver gets out and is shot, I believe the bullets were to the front side of the teen. Owner gets arrested, cops/prosecutors claim he used deadly force to protect property. He takes it to trial, is found not guilty _very_ quickly. His story was that the kid (driver) got out and instead of running with his friends, started coming toward him. At that time, he was now in fear for his life and shot the kid. At least one of the other thugs that was later arrested, testified he turned around and saw his friend running away from the vehicle.

In the end it did not matter, the man was vindicated by the jury. Maybe he got sued civilly, that I don't know. Even if so, I doubt he would lose. In the end, you will find that people on the jury are a good mix. Remember, all you have to do is convince one person out of 12 to say "Not guilty." As long as that person isn't talked into changing their opinion by the rest of the jury, you have nothing to worry about. Obviously a hung jury means you can still be tried again, but if the vote is equal or more in your favor, they might not prosecute again. I mentioned race because that seems to be an issue in some cases.

If anything, things have gotten worse. You will find most folks on the jury likely are just common folks who make the average amount of money or a little more. They understand the hardships of life and how precious life is. They likely will have no compassion of the dead person if they were a criminal.

Many other justified shootings don't ever end up in an arrest. If your shoot is clean, you won't have any problems. I think it was Ill. that passed a law saying that if you were found in possession of a firearm based upon the fact you had used it in self-defense, you cannot be arrested under various firearm laws. It _is_ much better to be judge by 12 than dead. I think families would rather have their loved ones alive and broke instead of buried.

This again shows the importance of a large cash reserve. If you have $10,000 in savings, that is a good thing. If you don't have that money, but have equity in your home, you need a HELOC or credit card that you and your spouse can access if need be. The HELOC would be used in emergency situations only such as above.
 
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