Ships did not cause Internet cable damage

S

saveamerica

Veteran Member
Geeesh .. This story isnt even on the main!?

Hey everyone, this event (cut comms cables) is the biggest dot I've heard of in a looonnng time.


Ships did not cause Internet cable damage
(AFP)

3 February 2008

CAIRO - Damage to undersea Internet cables in the Mediterranean that hit business across the Middle East and South Asia was not caused by ships, Egypt’s communications ministry said on Sunday, ruling out earlier reports.

The transport ministry added that footage recorded by onshore video cameras of the location of the cables showed no maritime traffic in the area when the cables were damaged.

‘The ministry’s maritime transport committee reviewed footage covering the period of 12 hours before and 12 hours after the cables were cut and no ships sailed the area,’ a statement said.

‘The area is also marked on maps as a no-go zone and it is therefore ruled out that the damage to the cables was caused by ships,’ the statement added.

Two cables were damaged earlier this week in the Mediterranean sea and another off the coast of Dubai, causing widespread disruption to Internet and international telephone services in Egypt, Gulf Arab states and South Asia.

A fourth cable linking Qatar to the United Arab Emirates was damaged on Sunday causing yet more disruptions, telecommunication provider Qtel said.

Earlier reports said that the damage had been caused by ships that had been diverted off their usual route because of bad weather.

Egypt’s communication and information technology ministry said it would report its findings to the owners of the two damaged Mediterranean cables, FLAG Telecom and SEA-ME-WE4.

A repair ship was expected to begin work to fix the two Mediterranean cables on Tuesday.
 
J

JUDGECAL

Deceased
saveamerica said:
Geeesh .. This story isnt even on the main!?

Hey everyone, this event (cut comms cables) is the biggest dot I've heard of in a looonnng time.


Ships did not cause Internet cable damage
(AFP)

3 February 2008

CAIRO - Damage to undersea Internet cables in the Mediterranean that hit business across the Middle East and South Asia was not caused by ships, Egypt’s communications ministry said on Sunday, ruling out earlier reports.

The transport ministry added that footage recorded by onshore video cameras of the location of the cables showed no maritime traffic in the area when the cables were damaged.

‘The ministry’s maritime transport committee reviewed footage covering the period of 12 hours before and 12 hours after the cables were cut and no ships sailed the area,’ a statement said.

‘The area is also marked on maps as a no-go zone and it is therefore ruled out that the damage to the cables was caused by ships,’ the statement added.

Two cables were damaged earlier this week in the Mediterranean sea and another off the coast of Dubai, causing widespread disruption to Internet and international telephone services in Egypt, Gulf Arab states and South Asia.

A fourth cable linking Qatar to the United Arab Emirates was damaged on Sunday causing yet more disruptions, telecommunication provider Qtel said.

Earlier reports said that the damage had been caused by ships that had been diverted off their usual route because of bad weather.

Egypt’s communication and information technology ministry said it would report its findings to the owners of the two damaged Mediterranean cables, FLAG Telecom and SEA-ME-WE4.

A repair ship was expected to begin work to fix the two Mediterranean cables on Tuesday.
Click to expand...

do you have a link to this story? thanks.
 
CeeBee

CeeBee

Inactive
Very interesting. But I still have to say "so what," repeating my earlier comment on another thread:
----------------------------------------------

For all those that see a conspiracy in the Internet "outage" (and three strikes in a row seem odd to me too), consider that any intentional severing of these cables would be, and has been, ineffective. The worst that it had done is slow down Internet access. The Internet is too robust for even three cable cuts to shut it down for the affected areas, the system just routes around the damage.

The worst impacted folks are the gameplayers who suffer from intolerable lag time! And the recreational browsers may give up for a while due to the slowness. But there's nothing about this outage that shuts out affected countries from the Internet, from the banking system, what have you.
 
D

dragonslayer2001

Inactive
If

this story is accurate, then most likely Subs.

And ceebee, test run? Practice?

Three cables cut within days, hundreds of miles apart, owned by the same company......... in that part of the world there is only so much redundency. Even in this country multiple carriers share the same hubs in some cities.
 
energy_wave

energy_wave

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I didn't know communication cables were cut just before the US entered the war with Germany.

At the outset of the war, the Germans had five transatlantic cables that ran through the English Channel. One went to Brest in France, another to Vigo in Spain, one to Tenerife in North Africa and two to New York via the Azores. The English cable ship Telconia cut them all in England's first offensive action in the war.
Click to expand...

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0QUY/is_2004_July/ai_n6142317/pg_2

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/archives/cat_current_events.html
 
Amaryllis

Amaryllis

Inactive
Hermit said:
Well duh. Ships don't have razor sharp anchors that they drag along the bottom for miles.
Click to expand...

I agree. Wouldn't an anchor cause a tear as opposed to a cut? Not to mention in this case it would be a lot of boats with a lot of anchors in a lot of different locations within a short time frame. Big time not likely.
 
energy_wave

energy_wave

Has No Life - Lives on TB
By cutting the cables, you force the enemy to use other means to communicate. Maybe that is the plan. Make them use other means to get communications out and be ready to intercept them. Just like what was done to Germany.
 
Wardogs

Wardogs

Inactive
How interesting. I had just posted the following on another thread before I read this.

"I agree, and with India being the one who seems to be most affected, (at least financially), an economic attack is a likely motive. I'm not sure who would benefit most, but since it is Western businesses who have outsourced to India, and are the ones most likely to be inconvenienced, the suspect list isn't very long.
All of these breaks were underwater and the explanation of ship's anchors doing this damage just (if you'll pardon the expression) doesn't hold water. Anchorages for shipping are well away from cable areas. these areas are clearly defined on charts, but that also makes those cables easy to find as well."

DS, Subs might be feasible but the cables come ashore in two places. Even though they cross in some deep water, there are places where they are within range of divers with minimal equipment, so it wouldn't take much sophistication to do damage. I'd be interested to know exactly where these breaks occurred, and what the "cuts" looked like.
wardogs
 
plantman

plantman

Veteran Member
I thought this was a DOT the first time I heard it. The law of probability comes into play as well. Is it more likely that a cable designed to be miles long on the seabed cut itself, or was cut?

What would this do to internet users in Iran as well? From what I have read, the younger crowd uses internet cafes daily and this to the chagrin of the Islamist government.

Could Iran have done a special ops? For Islam?

Or is it an American op?

I can only imagine what the people in Iran are thinking right now. Imagine if you couldn't get online for a day. You would freak! They're probably watching old bit torrents of Jericho right now to prep themselves! ;)
 
M

Martin

Deceased
FLAG500.jpg
 
K

kelee877

Veteran Member
CeeBee said:
Very interesting. But I still have to say "so what," repeating my earlier comment on another thread:
----------------------------------------------

For all those that see a conspiracy in the Internet "outage" (and three strikes in a row seem odd to me too), consider that any intentional severing of these cables would be, and has been, ineffective. The worst that it had done is slow down Internet access. The Internet is too robust for even three cable cuts to shut it down for the affected areas, the system just routes around the damage.

The worst impacted folks are the gameplayers who suffer from intolerable lag time! And the recreational browsers may give up for a while due to the slowness. But there's nothing about this outage that shuts out affected countries from the Internet, from the banking system, what have you.
Click to expand...


:whistle: umm its up to 5 cables...there was another one today
 
Krymsonowl

Krymsonowl

Inactive
Its the fish, or perhaps the crabs. They decided all the cables look like giant worms and decided to have a feast. :eek:
 
L

LONEWOLF

Inactive
Whomever it *is* severing communication cables will continue to do so until the desired effect has manifest. Israel? USA? Iran? Look, there is something significant afoot, why deny it any longer?
 
Wardogs

Wardogs

Inactive
kelee877 said:
:whistle: umm its up to 5 cables...there was another one today
Click to expand...

That's right, and it's well beyond the "accidental"
Iran is not the target, It has been inconvenienced a bit, but the internet is up and running despite reports to the contrary. The only country who seems to be being systematically isolated is India. They have lost major sections and the rural areas, many of which host the outsourced Western businesses, are looking at at least 2 weeks of total blackout.
So who benefits most?
wardogs
 
I

intothatgoodnight

. . .
Likely that most/all of the cut cables were fiber optic, not copper, since they are major international internet backbone connectors for the affected countries -- copper does not have the bandwidth capacity to serve as a major backbone for an entire country, per se.


intothegoodnight
 
energy_wave

energy_wave

Has No Life - Lives on TB
With the US teetering on the brink of financial disaster, maybe some group is intent destabilizing the rest of the world in preparation for a one world currency.

The cable cutting has cost business billions per day in lost revenue and productivity.

Who would have the capability to do such a thing. :whistle:
 
D

dragonslayer2001

Inactive
about

a month an a half ago or so I read an article that claimed that one or more warheads had been taken out of the Paki arsenal and that the target was in India, a major city.

I wasn't sure at all it was trustworthy or not.

And I don't think the Pakis' have the underwater capability to do this.

And there was a dream someone posted about India a while back. Means nothing but pointing out that India has been the only one isolated.......... makes you ponder the 4th.
 
T

tanstaafl

Has No Life - Lives on TB
"I didn't know communication cables were cut just before the US entered the war with Germany." (energy_wave)

I guess it depends on how you define "just before the US entered the war." Britain, France, Australia, and New Zealand declared war on Germany on 09/03/1939 but I think the U.S. didn't enter the war until 12/11/1941 when Germany and Italy declared war on the U.S. So the cable cuts took place over two years before the U.S. entered the war. The story clearly said the cable cuts were "England's first offensive action in the war" (England, not the U.S.).

As to these recent cable cuts/disruptions/what-have-you, the timing sure is odd. The Arab states don't have a lot of love for each other, no matter how much anti-Muslim people might want to lump them all together into the same group. So it's entirely possible this is an internal Middle Eastern thing. I don't know which regional military forces have subs, although I think the Israelis might have a sub or two.
 
C

cooter

cantankerous old coot
after reading the data on that cable, average size is 69mm, not all that large:whistle:

would be interesting to know what kind of damage was done,

with all the demo equipment in the middleeast , seems that would have been the preferred method and do it in a bunch of places sectioning up the cable:whistle:
 
Caplock50

Caplock50

I am the Winter Warrior
dragonslayer, is this the dream you were referring to?


" India get's nuked on February 04, 2008

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This came to me in a dream and part of the dream has come true already...

I was in a dimly lit room, trying to watch two simultanious events that were of extreme importance. The first event was a woman directly in front of me having a baby...her back was to me so I couldn't see her face or who she was exactly, but I could tell her race and see her hair. The second event was on a TV that was hanging from a wall to my left. It was a live speech that was being broadcast by the Indian Prime Minister...it was the current PM, Dr. Manmohan Singh...he was screaming and ranting on and on about how dare they do this to us, who do they think they are? India is the greatest Nation on Earth and we will crush our enemies beneath our feet. On and on he went about the enemies of India...on and on we will crush them to dust, He was literally screaming, and with each statement his right hand, which was clenched into a fist, would swing wildly up and down. Hw looked like Hitler, but worse.

My head went back and forth from the woman to the TV. In my mind I knew what had happened...it had occurred the day before, but I didn't think about what specifically had happened, I just knew that it was the worst thing that could have ever happened, and here was the PM giving India's official statement regarding the matter...and that statement was nothing short of a declaration of war on all of India's enemies. It was the end of the world, or so one may think...maybe just the end of an age, and a declaration of war.

So I had that dream in before the man became PM. And once he entered office, I was so suprised...and since then, I have been looking for the baby to arrive. And then in October I got the news, Mamta, my dreadful ex-wifes sister is having a baby that is due to arrive on February 4. In the dream the PM was speaking in Hindi, and I could understand him...so I have concluded that I was watching the event unfold through the eyes of Ravi, that's Mamta's husband, and he understands Hindi."
 
D

Dozdoats

Deceased
The transport ministry added that footage recorded by onshore video cameras of the location of the cables showed no maritime traffic in the area when the cables were damaged.


And what nation in the region is the proud owner of some relatively new submarines???

dd

ETA: The worst impacted folks are the gameplayers who suffer from intolerable lag time! And the recreational browsers may give up for a while due to the slowness. But there's nothing about this outage that shuts out affected countries from the Internet, from the banking system, what have you

Ummmm, someone isn't paying attention.

http://www.internettrafficreport.com/asia.htm today (Sunday) reports Iran has suffered a 100% packet loss... That would seem a pretty good 'shutout' to me.
 
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K

Kadee

Inactive
How many more do they have by now:whistle:

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htsub/articles/20051212.aspx

Iranian Mini-Submarines

December 12, 2005: Iran, apparently with technical help from North Korea, is now building mini-submarines for operations along its coasts, and throughout the Persian Gulf. Two have been built so far. The sub has a two man crew, and can carry three divers, or several naval mines, or a torpedo. The Iranians say they will use the mini-subs to lay mines or launch underwater commando attacks. While the North Koreans provided some technical assistance, the Iranian sub is a local design, smaller than most North Korean mini-subs, which is a reflection of the more turbulent seas found off the Korean coast. In the shallow waters of the Persian Gulf, the Iranian minisubs (which look like an enlarged torpedo, with a glassed over cockpit in the front), can be very difficult to detect. Their range is probably a few hundred kilometers, more than sufficient to reach any targets in the area. However, the United States Navy has spent a lot of time and effort on the problem, and is probably better prepared to deal with minisubs than most navies. North Korea has a fleet of over 60 mini-subs, and apparently Iran wants at least a few dozen.
 
Wardogs

Wardogs

Inactive
energy_wave said:
With the US teetering on the brink of financial disaster, maybe some group is intent destabilizing the rest of the world in preparation for a one world currency.

The cable cutting has cost business billions per day in lost revenue and productivity.

Who would have the capability to do such a thing. :whistle:
Click to expand...

The only "capability" needed would be a scuba tank, mask, fins and an underwater torch or saw. That being said, as more of these incidents come to light, look to see who is most affected and you will be able to extrapolate from that who the culprits are. There is no reason to assume a high-tech attack, (like subs or ROV's) although it's possible.
wardogs
 
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Caplock50

Caplock50

I am the Winter Warrior
dragonslayer, and others, note the date for the nuking...Feburary 4, 2008...that's tomorrow. We don't really have long to wait on this one, do we? We'll know within hours.
 
energy_wave

energy_wave

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Another interesting article on the subject...

There has been some concern that the undersea internet cables, that have been cut recently, are perhaps no accident?

The first incident happened 8km from Alexandria in Egypt, which involved 2 cables apparently alongside each other. According to initial reports, the cables may have been "snapped" by a ship´s anchor.

Whilst this explanation is certainly a possibility, it seems a strange coincidence that barely two days later another cable is cut, this time 56km from Dubai in the Persian Gulf. There is even rumor of a fourth cable being damaged, but this has not been confirmed.

The countries most affected by the damaged cables are Egypt, India and the Middle East (in particular Iran). Israel and Iraq, as far as we can tell, were not affected by this problem as they use an alternative route for this service.

Cables involved in the "breaks" belong to companies connected to Reliance Communication Ventures, where Anil Ambani has a 66.75% interest. His father (Dhirubhai Ambani) originally founded the company and it is a classical rags to riches story.

Dhirubhai Ambani started with absolutely nothing, but developed a company that was a huge success. Questions were raised about how Dhirubhai managed to raise so much cash to do this, and this appears to be the result of a "Non-Resident Indian" investing Rs. 220 million in Reliance during 1982-1983. Dhirubhai has been accused of "manipulating" government policies and was known to be a "king-maker" in government elections (enjoying a certain amount of media protection). He was also involved in other business interests, including the oil industry.

Following Dhirubhai´s death in 2002, the company was split between the Ambani brothers, with the youngest (Anil Ambani) taking control of Reliance. Anil, born June 4 1959, is the 6th richest person in the world (worth $45 billion).

On the assumption that the cables cut were no accident, we must ask ourselves who would do such a thing and why. Clearly Iran, who were most affected, would gain nothing from such an action and are perhaps the target of those responsible?

But why would anyone want to disrupt communications in Iran (and other countries)? Could this be some subtle message to Iran, an example of how their communications can be affected by outside forces? Maybe this is a prelude to an attack, or perhaps a test run for a future one?

Communication has always been an important factor in military action, and cutting these cables might affect Iran´s ability to defend itself. But even if that were not the case, it would certainly make it difficult for them to report any events to the outside world. So, if they were attacked, we would have to rely on news reports from the usual sources (the Mainstream Media), and we all know where their loyalties lie.

Oddly enough, Russia also experienced some "internet problems" during this same period, but that may be another coincidence?
Click to expand...

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article3588.html
 
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