8/17/06 16:52 CDT N. Korea Appears to Be Preparing for Nuclear Test

From ABC News

THERE IS NEW EVIDENCE THAT NORTH KOREA MAY BE PREPARING FOR AN UNDERGROUND TEST OF NUCLEAR BOMB, U.S. OFFICIALS TELL ABC NEWS. A SENIOR STATE DEPARTMENT OFFICIAL SAYS, "IT IS THE VIEW OF THE INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY THAT A TEST IS REAL POSSIBILITY," AND A SENIOR MILITARY OFFICIAL TELLS ABC NEWS THAT "SUSPICIOUS VEHICLE MOVEMENT" HAS RECENTLY BEEN OBSERVED AT A SUSPECTED NORTH KOREAN TEST SITE
 

ctsurvivalist

Membership Revoked
N. Korea Appears to Be Preparing for Nuclear Test

U.S. Officials Tell ABC News Evidence Show Signs an Underground Test is in the Works

Aug. 17, 2006 — There is new evidence that North Korea may be preparing for an underground test of a nuclear bomb, U.S. officials tell ABC News.

"It is the view of the intelligence community that a test is real possibility," says a senior State Department official.

A senior military official tells ABC News that a U.S. intelligence agency has recently observed "suspicious vehicle movement" at a suspected North Korean test site.

The activity includes the unloading of large reels of cable outside an underground facility called Pungyee-yok in northeast North Korea. Cables can be used in nuclear testing to connect an underground test site to outside observation equipment. The intelligence was brought to the attention of the White House last week.

Even before this most recent intelligence, there has been growing concern within the U.S. government that North Korea is moving toward a nuclear test. North Korea is believed to have enough nuclear material to build as many as a dozen nuclear bombs, but it has never tested one. A successful test would remove any doubt that North Korea is a nuclear power.

MORE AT:

http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=2326083&page=1
 
Here is the complete story...

From ABC News.com

There is new evidence that North Korea may be preparing for an underground test of a nuclear bomb, U.S. officials tell ABC News. "It is the view of the intelligence community that a test is real possibility," says a senior State Department official.

A senior military official tells ABC News that a U.S. intelligence agency has recently observed "suspicious vehicle movement" at a suspected North Korean test site.

The activity includes the unloading of large reels of cable outside an underground facility called Pungyee-yok in northeast North Korea. Cables can be used in nuclear testing to connect an underground test site to outside observation equipment. The intelligence was brought to the attention of the White House last week.

Even before this most recent intelligence, there has been growing concern within the U.S. government that North Korea is moving toward a nuclear test. North Korea is believed to have enough nuclear material to build as many as a dozen nuclear bombs, but it has never tested one. A successful test would remove any doubt that North Korea is a nuclear power.

"What does he have to lose?" asked one senior military official, referring to North Korean leader Kim Jong Il.

On July 4, North Korea conducted seven ballistic missile tests, provoking international condemnation, including a unanimous U.N. Security Council resolution condemning its actions. A nuclear test, however, would be seen as a much greater provocation than the missile tests. Only seven other nations in the world have ever conducted nuclear tests.

U.S. officials fear a nuclear test could provoke a nuclear arms race in East Asia, forcing Japan and South Korea to develop their own nuclear weapons.

"A nuclear test is going to be alarming and troubling for everyone and would cause a very strong reaction I think from all of North Korea's neighbors," said former National Security Council official Michael Green, now with the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

U.S. officials caution that the intelligence is not conclusive. Last year, U.S. spy satellites picked up suspicious activity at suspected test sites in North Korea, leading some
to predict an imminent nuclear test, but nothing happened.

Underground nuclear tests are notoriously difficult to detect ahead of time. U.S. intelligence agencies, for example, failed to predict nuclear tests by India and Pakistan in 1998.

Officials say it is possible that North Korea may either be putting on a show for American spy satellites to get attention, or may conduct a nuclear test in an entirely different location.

Some analysts believe Kim Jong Il may feel the only way to be taken seriously is to prove that North Korea is a nuclear power. Officials acknowledge that nobody really knows Kim Jong Il's intentions, but there is a belief among analysts that he is upset about the recent U.N. resolution condemning his missile tests and upset with the Chinese for supporting that resolution.

"It is the view of most in the community that there is a 50-50 chance North Korea will conduct a nuclear test by the end of the year," said one analyst.

Asked what the United States would do in response to a nuclear test, a senior U.S. official told ABC News, "We would try to hermetically seal the hermit kingdom."

The official said the United States would immediately push for sanctions to cut North Korea's ties to the outside world. Another possible option would be a naval blockade of North Korea.

But it is unclear how effective such efforts would be. North Korea is already the most isolated country in the world.
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
I must be getting old. Two of you beat me to it....:D

Ah well, as I said in the other thread, here's what's missing:

:siren: :siren: :siren: :siren: :siren: :siren: :siren:
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
On the day that Pyongyang tests a device, the entire balance of power in the Pacific Rim will change. It will also have to be assumed that the Iranians may well have a piece is such a test along with the PRC.

I can't see North Korea testing such a provocative weapon without a green light from Beijing.
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
Housecarl said:
On the day that Pyongyang tests a device, the entire balance of power in the Pacific Rim will change. It will also have to be assumed that the Iranians may well have a piece is such a test along with the PRC.

I can't see North Korea testing such a provocative weapon without a green light from Beijing.

OR....

Perhaps North Korea tests a nuke August 22, at 0000 UTC and Iran tests a nuke at 1200 UTC.

Care to gauge the impact of such an event anyone?:shkr: :dot5:
 

Mark D

Now running for Emperor.
CrapUnderControlMotivate.jpg


BoB-motivate.jpg
 

mt4design

Has No Life - Lives on TB
This may sound extremist...but I don't think we should allow them to proceed and use every measure at our disposal to disrupt or distroy this test before it can take place.

Mike
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
mt4design said:
This may sound extremist...but I don't think we should allow them to proceed and use every measure at our disposal to disrupt or distroy this test before it can take place.

Mike

About impossible unless we nuke them. It's going to be an underground test. I don't see us stopping them.

Just like I don't see us stopping Iran.
 

drafter

Veteran Member
mt4design said:
This may sound extremist...but I don't think we should allow them to proceed and use every measure at our disposal to disrupt or distroy this test before it can take place.

Mike

If they got em, they got em. Might as well let them waste one before we have to go to war.
 

mt4design

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Nuke them.

We are the ONLY nation ever to use a nuclear weapon in a time of war.

If the got em, they got em?

They are testing. Testing allows for larger, more capable weapons. Testing is unacceptable.

Testing allows for both NK AND IRAN to have vital data to bring them in to parity with our own weapons.

The deck is stacking against us people.

Either we use them or lose the ability to even threaten to use them...

IMHO, we are fricken doomed either way.

WAKE UP PEOPLE.

Mike
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
When you read this article consider the source, as always...

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/HH18Dg02.html

Korea
Aug 18, 2006



Missiles and madness
By Richard M Bennett

North Korea is by any international standard a failed or failing state. Yet it has a massive missile arsenal, a considerable and successful nuclear-weapons program, and one of the largest armed forces in the world.

Why? For its huge conventional military power, the answer is usually to both suppress its own civilian population and to protect against a US-South Korean invasion.

Neither is a satisfactory explanation, for in truth a highly pervasive internal security infrastructure and a people cowed by 60 years of unbending communist rule are probably more than enough to ensure the survival of the current regime for the foreseeable future.
The United States and South Korea are highly unlikely to launch a ground invasion of North Korea individually or jointly. Nor is the North likely to make another attempt to conquer the South.

Pyongyang's forces may be sufficient to achieve some success on the ground in the first week, but after that their limited logistic support combined with ferocious US-led air strikes would have so degraded the offensive capability of the main combat units as to lead to only one conclusion: another military disaster.

This time, and more important, it is highly unlikely that there would be a repeat of the Korean War intervention by hundreds of thousands of seasoned Chinese troops pouring across the Yalu River to rescue the North Korean regime from the consequences of its own stupidity.

It would be an act of state suicide for North Korea to resort to the use of nuclear weapons to attempt to win or indeed even to prevent its eventual defeat. The US response would undoubtedly be to turn the whole of North Korea into a radioactive wasteland for generations to come.

North Korea's conventional armed forces are truly impressive on paper, but significantly probably still lack the logistic support, technological infrastructure and mobility that would make them as effective in war as their sheer weight of numbers might otherwise suggest.

The regime's massive investment in conventional defense, which goes well beyond any genuine strategic need, appears to be more a symptom of national insecurity and international paranoia than having any basis in a rational-defense policy.

Army
Some 950,000-strong, organized into one armored, four mechanized, 12 infantry, two artillery and one capital-defense corps, the North Korean army can deploy a large part of its forces in combat units, which include 27 infantry divisions, as well as 15 armored and 14 mechanized brigades. There is a heavy concentration on artillery and battlefield missiles, with some 35 gun and 15 missile brigades.

Of particular importance are some 120,000 special-operations troops, the largest such force in any of today's armed forces. There are some 25 attack, seaborne and airborne brigades, including a very large number of specialist sniper units. North Korea is reported to have the ability to transport some 10,000 special forces by air at any one time.

The army is deployed in an offensive rather than a defensive manner, with the first operational echelon made up of the 1st, 2nd, 4th and 5th Forward Army Corps; the second operational echelon with the 806th and 815th Mechanized, and the 820th Armored Corps; the strategic reserve has the 108th and 425th Mechanized Corps; while the rear echelon has the 3rd, 6th, 7th and 8th Rear Army Corps.

Combine these with the other combat units and a total of some 800,000 men appear to be in actual fighting units - a very high proportion of teeth to tail indeed.

Weapons
Arms and equipment are mostly obsolete Russian and Chinese in origin, although attempts have been made to modernize, mainly through the production of modified designs or new developments by North Korea's burgeoning arms industry.

There are currently believed to be some 4,100 T34/85, T54/T55, Type-59, T62 and PT76 tanks, 2,800 armored personnel carriers, 3,500 towed artillery, 4,500 self-propelled artillery and more than 2,600 mobile multiple rocket launchers, some 8,000 mortars, 9,000 anti-tank rocket launchers and more than 8,000 man-portable anti-tank missile systems.

North Korea is probably one of the most heavily fortified nations in the world, with some 600 kilometers of tunnels and more than 8,000 deep bunkers, plus caverns that have been enlarged to protect command centers, missile and nuclear facilities, combat aircraft and indeed entire units close to the Demilitarized Zone along the border with the Republic of Korea. Most have been constructed within granite mountains, with the main service entrances facing north.

All the most significant military facilities have now been moved to underground facilities believed to be capable of withstanding US bunker-busting bombs. Some 5 million tonnes of ammunition, food and fuel are thought to be stored underground for wartime use.

Air defense
North Korea has a very large number of SAM (surface-to-air missile) systems, though once again of older design, mainly Russian, or Chinese copies of the SA-2, SA-3 and SA-5. Some 15,000 man-portable Wha-sung copies of Russian SA-7 and SA-16 are known to be available. These are backed up by some 12,000 static and mobile anti-aircraft guns, most of which are manually operated and therefore not so vulnerable to modern electronic warfare. Radar early warning and target tracking, command and control, however, are all likely to be overwhelmed in the first few days of a major conflict with the US.

Coast defense
North Korea's long and rugged coastline is covered by at least six major missile bases with anti-ship systems with a range of up to 160km and many hundreds of well-protected gun emplacements.

Air force
The 1st (Kaechon AB), the 2nd (Toksan/Hamhung AB) and the elite 3rd (Hwangju AB) air-combat divisions have about 70 modern fortified air bases, many with underground hangars and multiple runways. However, the command-and-control systems, radar, fighter control and aircraft fleet are now largely obsolete and would provide little long-term opposition to the US and South Korean air forces.

To try to gain combat experience, it has been reported that North Korea sent more than 200 pilots to fight in the Vietnam War, where they helped to defend Hanoi with some success. A further 25 pilots went to Syria during the June 1967 war with Israel and 30 pilots to Egypt and Syria during the Yom Kippur War of 1973.

Equipment
North Korea is believed to have about 85,000 personnel and some 700 air-defense and strike fighters, including 40 Chinese A5, 140 F5 (MiG-17), 120 F6 (MiG-19) and 40 F7, 180 Russian MiG-21, 18 Su-7BMK and a few more modern types: 36 Su-25, 50 MiG-23 and 40 MiG-29; up to 75 elderly Chinese H-5 (Il-28) bombers, more than 300 helicopters, including 50 Mi-24, and a large fleet of 200 or more transports, mostly ancient Y5 (An-2).

Navy
The North Korean navy has a strength of about 46,000 and some five to six naval squadrons in the West (Yellow Sea) Fleet based at Nampo (headquarters), Pip'a-got and Sagot and another 10 squadrons in the East Fleet at T'oejo-dong(headquarters), Najin and Wnsan.

The main surface combatants and submarines are sheltered in more than 20 reinforced pens, each up to 900 meters long and 22 meters wide. There are some 26 Russian Romeo and Whisky ocean-going submarines and about 65 coastal and mini-submarines used for covert intelligence or special-forces operations; three missile frigates; more than 30 fast missile craft; 110 fast torpedo boats; and several hundred minesweepers, minelayers, patrol and amphibious-warfare craft.

Weapons of mass destruction
North Korea can produce about 100 missiles a year. It began to make ballistic missiles around 1981, with copies of Russian Scuds purchased originally from Egypt. These became operational as the Hwasong 5 in 1984. There are now 900-1,000 Hwasong-5/6 and Nodong 1/Rodong 1 (improved Scud) and more than 100 medium-range Taepodong 1/Nodong 2 ballistic missiles with nuclear warheads deployed in underground silos or hidden in caves.

Within the next couple of years, development of the Taepodong 2/Nodong 3 intercontinental ballistic missiles will be completed and North Korea will gain a genuine strategic deterrent with a range of at least 8,000km, though some observers have suggested as much as 12,000km. This missile was test-fired in July, and despite media speculation that the flight was aborted after just 42 seconds, it now seems likely that it flew for seven minutes and was a significant technical success.

Some observers would undoubtedly argue that there is a rather more pernicious reason behind North Korea's long-range-missile and nuclear-weapon programs. With a failing economy to support, the temptation must be strong for the Pyongyang regime to use its advanced technology to underpin its survival.

While North Korea is undoubtedly a poor country, it has still managed to develop advanced and effective missile systems. Not even economic failure, famine and a severe lack of human resources have prevented the headlong dash for weapons technology.

While such arms are obviously considered vital for defense or even a preemptive strike, the major overriding reason has been financial: such technology is available for export to the highest bidder.

Such hard-currency transactions help keep North Korea afloat and the regime in power. Over the past 20 years or so North Korea has earned substantial revenue from the sale of missiles, and the relevant technology, to a number of states high on Washington's hit-list. Among these are the Nodong to Pakistan as the Ghauri and to Iran as the Shehab 3, while both Syria and Libya received Hwasong-5. It is reported that missile parts and technology have also been exported to Egypt, the United Arab Emirates and Vietnam.

It appears certain that North Korea's nuclear-weapons program has been largely funded by the sale of missiles and other conventional arms to countries around the world.

North Korea is believed to have some 120 nuclear weapons, including a small number of hydrogen bombs to go with its growing arsenal of operational long-range ballistic missiles. It has built a considerable capability since the early 1960s with nuclear-research facilities at Yongbyon, Taechon, Pyongyang and Kumho. Significantly for North Korea, it is fortunate to have its own uranium mines, with more than 4 million tonnes of exploitable high-quality uranium.

An advanced chemical and biological warfare program has produced a considerable number of chemical warheads for battlefield missiles, aircraft bombs and artillery shells. These are known to include modern nerve agents. It is believed that a serious attempt has also been made to weaponize anthrax and that a small number of warheads may have been deployed.

With such a willing market for its missile technology and the financial advantages gained from the exportation of such weapons, why not offer the secrets of the nuclear bomb as well?

With the looming confrontation with the West over Iran's own nuclear program and an economy rich in petrodollars, Tehran would be a prime market for Pyongyang's weapons know-how. Tehran is North Korea's closest ally in the Middle East.

This would be the ultimate nightmare scenario for Washington, a determined Iranian enemy secure behind the unexpected deployment of an operational long-range missile system armed with a nuclear warhead.

Richard M Bennett is an international intelligence and security analyst.

AFI Research provides expert information on the world's intelligence services, armed forces and conflicts. Contact rbmedia@supanet.com.

(Copyright 2006 AFI Research. Used with permission.)
 

'plain o joe'

Membership Revoked
Kickapoo Kicker said:
Here is the complete story...


The activity includes the unloading of large reels of cable outside an underground facility called Pungyee-yok in northeast North Korea. Cables can be used in nuclear testing to connect an underground test site to outside observation equipment. The intelligence was brought to the attention of the White House last week.

Underground nuclear tests are notoriously difficult to detect ahead of time. U.S. intelligence agencies, for example, failed to predict nuclear tests by India and Pakistan in 1998.

Officials say it is possible that North Korea may either be putting on a show for American spy satellites to get attention, or may conduct a nuclear test in an entirely different location.

.

Didn't Ed Dames predict a NK nuke explosion near the DMZ, followed by an invasion of the south.. :shkr:
 

TheSearcher

Are you sure about that?
JohnGaltfla said:
OR....

Perhaps North Korea tests a nuke August 22, at 0000 UTC and Iran tests a nuke at 1200 UTC.

Care to gauge the impact of such an event anyone?:shkr: :dot5:

What will Israel do? Will they tolerate a nuclear Iran?

What will Japan do? Do they have nukes "under the table" and will they tolerate a nuclear North Korea?

As Professor Higgins might say:

"Damn, Damn, DAMN!"

CARP! (tm)
 

Rams82

Inactive
Wasn't there a rumor about 2 years ago that Iran and North Korea were going to test nuclear devices simultaneously?
 

BV141

Has No Life - Lives on TB
DOUBLE CARP!!

Back to JohnGlatFla prep thread .......

bv

EDIT ADD:
Didn't Ed Dames predict a NK nuke explosion near the DMZ, followed by an invasion of the south..

He predicted the first use of a nuke in anger would be on the Korean Penisula. Near the DMZ. US counterstrikes, radiation fallout over China. Chinese get PO'd
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
Rams82 said:
Wasn't there a rumor about 2 years ago that Iran and North Korea were going to test nuclear devices simultaneously?

I heard that, but can't find the source on it. That's why I posted it. If you can find the link, it would be appreciated. I remember that rumor.

If that happens, be short the S&P indexes big time. This will be the mother of all panics.
 

Rams82

Inactive
JohnGaltfla said:
I heard that, but can't find the source on it. That's why I posted it. If you can find the link, it would be appreciated. I remember that rumor.

If that happens, be short the S&P indexes big time. This will be the mother of all panics.
I remember hearing it on Coast to Coast one night from a listener that called in when "a certain someone" was a guest on the show. I cant remember ever seeing it anywhere online though.
 

Mark D

Now running for Emperor.
JohnGaltfla said:
I heard that, but can't find the source on it. That's why I posted it. If you can find the link, it would be appreciated. I remember that rumor.

If that happens, be short the S&P indexes big time. This will be the mother of all panics.

I just received an e-mail from one of my subscription services that said to expect a pullback in the precious metals market at the end of this month. An excerpt:

With all that is going on in the geopolitical arena gold and silver should be making new highs and they are not. Additionally, the big money is heavily short this sector and they usually are correct.

Big money scares me.
 

almost ready

Inactive
how does does it take?

How long to set this up? A day a week a month I don't know captain?

Could they do this anytime from right now to forever? Or does it take a few days to set up?

All day I've been scanning the news cause my spine is tingling and tells me something is up and this might be it.....

thanks for taking the time to clarify things to someone with no personal military background.
 

INVAR

Sword At-The-Ready
Nothing to worry about folks.

Bush and the illegal wiretapping of international calls to suspected foreign terrorists is more dangerous to liberty than some mythic threat that North Korea might pose.

We should trade land for peace, give Pyongyang South Korea and pull our troops out of the Pacific and make reparations - and we shall have peace.

After all, it is only because we have nukes that North Korea has a divine right to nukes as does Iran. They need to protect themselves from the evil of GW Bush.


There is no Jihadist threat.

There is no North Korean threat.


There is only the GW Bush threat.



Keep repeating that over and over.




Then you will go back to sleep.
 

Rams82

Inactive
Well if the Iranians did buy a nuke from North Korea they probably want to see if the merchandise works before they use theirs in battle. Would the Iranians pay and recieve a device before one was tested? Would North Korea let them have it on credit? Or is Kim Jong il just that crazy that he would give one away as a gift???
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
Rams82 said:
Well if the Iranians did buy a nuke from North Korea they probably want to see if the merchandise works before they use theirs in battle. Would the Iranians pay and recieve a device before one was tested? Would North Korea let them have it on credit? Or is Kim Jong il just that crazy that he would give one away as a gift???

They've been trading oil for missle and nuke technology for years now.
 

Hokey

Veteran Member
Why is anyone surprised at this? They said they had nukes. Its only logical they would test them at some point. Lil' Kim must be getting all upset too since he's no longer the center of attention. He'll be getting some attention alright once he lights off one of those atomic firecrackers!
 

Rams82

Inactive
JohnGaltfla said:
They've been trading oil for missle and nuke technology for years now.
Yes, but I am talking about an actual device. Maybe they need this test now because the Iranians need to know if theirs is going to work. My question was would the Iranians pay for and deploy a device before they knew the merchandise was likely to work?
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
Rams82 said:
Yes, but I am talking about an actual device. Maybe they need this test now because the Iranians need to know if theirs is going to work. My question was would the Iranians pay for and deploy a device before they knew the merchandise was likely to work?

That's what I'm saying; they probably have already traded one. Remember in 2001, I think it was, the US Navy following a ship from North Korea heading to Iran with higher than normal radiation emissions (gamma if I remember).....
 

Rams82

Inactive
JohnGaltfla said:
That's what I'm saying; they probably have already traded one. Remember in 2001, I think it was, the US Navy following a ship from North Korea heading to Iran with higher than normal radiation emissions (gamma if I remember).....
If this test happens before August 22 then we might know what Iran's answer to the UN is going to be...
 

skip1

Membership Revoked
Housecarl said:
On the day that Pyongyang tests a device, the entire balance of power in the Pacific Rim will change. It will also have to be assumed that the Iranians may well have a piece is such a test along with the PRC.

I can't see North Korea testing such a provocative weapon without a green light from Beijing.



N. Korea is testing a nuke for Iran. I bet its an Iranian nuke
 

BV141

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Post # 3,000

Well if the Iranians did buy a nuke from North Korea they probably want to see if the merchandise works before they use theirs in battle.

You have missed FUNDAMENTAL point of the Iranian and North Korean Nuclear programs.

Iran is working on enriched uranium for it's bomb program.
North Korea is working on plutonium for it's bomb program.

In WW II, the US pursued both paths (enriched uranium and plutonium) for
operational atomic weapons

If one design fails, they still can share the other design. The chances of both
programs failing is much smaller.

Further more, the programs are operating in 2 very separate locations.
Taking out 1 program by US military invasion (similiar to Iraq) would allow
the other country to continue working on the bomb.

North Korea has it's military for protection
Iran has oil, and expanding missile capacity and threats to the Straights of Homuz for it's protection....

Both have China and Russia as "Big Brothers."

bv
 

JohnGaltfla

#NeverTrump
Rusty Shackelford said:
Well there goes Japan into the ocean! Wonder what kind of seismic activity is going to happen all over the asian rim!!!!:shkr:

More like the Japanese stock markets. They will crash severely if North Korea pulls off a success here....
 
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