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CRISIS Food riots grip western Venezuela, mob reportedly slaughters cattle in field
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  1. #1
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    Food riots grip western Venezuela, mob reportedly slaughters cattle in field

    https://news.trust.org/item/20180112035017-q9adf

    By Anggy Polanco and Francisco Aguilar
    SAN CRISTOBAL/BARINAS, Venezuela, Jan 11 (Reuters) - Hungry mobs ransacked a food collection center, and a supermarket in Venezuela's western Andean state of Merida on Thursday and reportedly even slaughtered cattle grazing in a field as unrest over food shortages spread through the country.


    An opposition lawmaker from Merida, Carlos Paparoni, said four people had died and 10 were injured in the chaos over the last two days, but he did not specify the circumstances.
    Four years of recession and the world's highest inflation have plunged millions of Venezuelans into poverty, and President Nicolas Maduro's authoritarian socialist regime faces mounting unrest.


    Venezuela's Information Ministry did not respond to a request for information about the latest disturbances to rock the nation of 30 million people.
    Looters plundered a truck carrying corn, a food collection center, and a state-run supermarket, according to Paparoni, and a vet who witnessed the mayhem.
    A video on social media also showed around a dozen men running into a lush pasture, chasing a cow, and then apparently beating it to death.


    "They're hunting. The people are hungry!" says the narrator of the video, who filmed the incident from his car. Lawmaker Paparoni said some 300 animals were believed to have been killed. Reuters could not verify the information.


    Zuley Urdaneta, a 50 year-old vet in Merida, witnessed the looting of a truck along the highway around 2 p.m. on Thursday afternoon. About two hours later, he said some 800 people converged on a food collection center and proceeded to plunder it.
    "They knocked down the gates and looted flour, rice, cooking oil, cooking gas," said Urdaneta. "The police and the National Guard tried to control the situation by giving out what was left."


    Looting has been increasing in the provinces since Christmas, with food shortages and hyperinflation leaving millions of people hungry, though the capital, Caracas, has so far been largely unaffected.
    The opposition says Maduro's failed economic policies and rampant corruption are to blame for the meltdown in the once booming country home to the world's largest crude reserves.


    "What we're living is barbaric," said opposition lawmaker Juan Guaido in a tweet referencing the slaughter the cattle. "The dehumanizing regime of Nicolas Maduro is turning a blind eye to the tragedy that we Venezuelans are living."


    Maduro's government accuses political opponents and business-friendly foreign powers of trying to foment a social uprising against him by stoking inflation and hoarding food.
    In what they said was an attempt to combat "speculation," authorities last week forced over 200 supermarkets to slash prices, creating chaos as desperate Venezuelans leapt at the chance to buy cheaper food.


    Some supermarkets were sold out of fruit and vegetables, and staff were unsure if the shelves would be replenished.
    "Dark and difficult times lie ahead. Soon we will all face the choice between what is right, and what is easy."
    Dumbledore to Harry Potter, Goblet of Fire.

    Luke 21:36

    A people who no longer recognize sin and evil, are not a people who will recognize tyranny and despotism either. Invar

  2. #2
    Only 30 million in the whole country. Only 800 sack a food distribution center.

    Muse, when it gets bad here of 350 million. Think the food distribution centers would be getting hit by at least/most tens of thousands.

  3. #3
    There's a video at this link.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Venezuela.html

    One can easily imagine cavemen doing the same.

  4. #4
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    Who didn't see this coming? They are starving. India is not immune either. Been reading the past few weeks about arrests of certain segments of Indian society being arrested for stealing (and presumably eating) cows there. They're pretty much cow-worshipers there so this is a big deal.
    So when's the Revolution? God or Money? Choose.

  5. #5
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    Socialism is a complete economic and socialistic failure everywhere and at every time in the past.

  6. #6
    God forbid it ever happens here (though I suspect it will at some point). The dark movie "The Road" probably gives us a window into what it would be like.

    Best regards
    Doc

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yogizorch View Post
    There's a video at this link.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Venezuela.html

    One can easily imagine cavemen doing the same.
    Further down the same page, they have a video of a "hungry homeless woman in Venezuela" eating a cat....
    Be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled…Let no man deceive you by any means…..
    they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved….for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie….
    Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.


  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Socialism is a complete economic and socialistic failure everywhere and at every time in the past.
    Yeah, not sure about over in Britain but here, they all swear they got their shit together and figured our how to make it all get us to Heaven on Earth and we just need to give them a chance. "OUR" Socialism is different from everyone else'!"
    "It ain't no secret I didn't get these scars falling over in church."


    The healthy human mind doesn't wake up in the morning thinking this is it's last day on Earth. But I think that's a luxury, not a curse. To know you're close to the end is a kind of freedom. Good time to take... inventory.

  9. #9
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    The Bible describes the depths that desperate, starving people will resort to to keep at least some of their family alive.
    Nothing I have seen or heard from Venezuela approaches what you can read there. As long as Caracas has not been “affected” the people still have some other resources to plunder. When those are gone, “Katie bar the door!”
    You who SEEK JUSTICE for the wrongs, crimes and sins done to you, will find it in the same place that God is freely handing out Mercy, At the Cross, where Christ died taking the punishment not only for your sins, but also for the sins committed against you by others!

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Countrymouse View Post
    Further down the same page, they have a video of a "hungry homeless woman in Venezuela" eating a cat....
    Honestly, if the food issues are as severe there as we're being told, I'm surprised there is a cat or dog left in the country.

    Summerthyme

  11. #11
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    Food issues there are both less severe and more severe than we are being told. It depends on what part of Venezuela is being reported on. In the aggregate, they are bad with pockets of desperation and pockets of fair condition.

    I see hypothermia as an analog. The extremities begin shutting down first trying to preserve the core.
    Facts?? We don't need no stinkin facts...

  12. #12
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    How much of that cow described was wasted? That's another example of the utter futility of socialism. Conjecture: That could have been a milk cow providing milk and cheese to several families. It could have been the bull to service 40 cows for NEXT years calf crop. It could have been fed for the last year by some family that was just as hungry as the mob.

    It didn't belong to them. I can't imagine the desperation of being hungry. I can't imagine that the planet still has people that would consider themselves intelligent, that could argue that socialism has any redeeming qualities. No, It WON"T WORK BETTER NEXT TIME. ANYWHERE. Not for more than a short period of time.
    "You are allowed to be disappointed but not surprised"

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Luddite View Post
    How much of that cow described was wasted? That's another example of the utter futility of socialism. Conjecture: That could have been a milk cow providing milk and cheese to several families. It could have been the bull to service 40 cows for NEXT years calf crop. It could have been fed for the last year by some family that was just as hungry as the mob.

    It didn't belong to them. I can't imagine the desperation of being hungry. I can't imagine that the planet still has people that would consider themselves intelligent, that could argue that socialism has any redeeming qualities. No, It WON"T WORK BETTER NEXT TIME. ANYWHERE. Not for more than a short period of time.
    I think they graze them year round down there, with seasonal dry and wet cycles. Up here we have to put up hay, so that brings another big dynamic to prepping. How to preserve a whole herd for later consumption if fuel isn't there for hay production.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by mzkitty View Post
    Who didn't see this coming? They are starving. India is not immune either. Been reading the past few weeks about arrests of certain segments of Indian society being arrested for stealing (and presumably eating) cows there. They're pretty much cow-worshipers there so this is a big deal.
    https://scroll.in/article/854242/fac...m-2014-to-2017
    Snip of headline.
    "Fact-check: Did India fall 45 places in Global Hunger Index rank from 2014 to 2017?
    India stood at 100 of 119 countries and has the third-highest score in all of Asia. Only Afghanistan and Pakistan are ranked worse."

    It's a long article the gist of which is yes they did drop 45 places.

    The Essential Commodities Act in India circa 1955 started out as one thing, but in recent years, has criminalized individuals their government considers as hoarding food, having nothing to do with the original intent of the law. They do in fact have a food security issue that grows by the day, but the cows are another matter.

    Regarding the cows, Modi’s government banned the sale of cows for slaughter last April. Since then they've had a problem with what they are branding as 'Hindu fundamentalist vigilantes' attacking people suspected of possessing beef, or cows for the production of the same. The people who are being attacked are calling Modi’s BJP government "food fascist". While there is a minority of Indys (25 or so million out of 1.3 billion) who eat beef, they are overwhelmingly outnumbered.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-40116811
    Snip;
    "More recently, the chief of BJP's powerful ideological fountainhead Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (National Volunteers' Organisation) has called for a countrywide ban on the slaughter of cows. And this week, a senior judge said the cow should be declared a national animal and people who slaughter cows should be sentenced to life in prison. "

    If the fundamentalist have their way, you could get a life sentence for a fillet mignon ot T-bone there.
    Facts?? We don't need no stinkin facts...

  15. #15

    It happens here in Australia as well as the U.S. just not so blatant.


    ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

    Cattle Rustling Still A Big Issue In The West
    Branding is still the best defense against cattle rustling, experts say.

    By Debby Schoeningh | Mar 27, 2012

    Today’s cattle rustlers usually aren’t as bold as the gun-slingers of the Old West; you can’t hang them from the nearest tree, either. In fact, Rodger Huffman, Oregon Department of Agriculture (ODA) livestock inspection and predator control programs manager, says few cattle thieves these days ever stand trial.

    “More often than not, the victims know the people stealing from them – relatives, neighbors or hired help; they are typically not random thefts,” he says. “Victims almost always say they don’t want to prosecute, they just want their livestock back.”

    A common way for cattle rustling to occur, Huffman says, is when cows stray onto a neighbor’s property and the neighbor holds the animal and raises calves from her. Many times, the cows “mysteriously” return to the owner a couple of years later.

    Absentee ranch owners are also at risk for cattle theft.

    “Sometimes, we’ll find that a ranch manager doesn’t brand a certain percentage of the calves and claims them as death loss to the owners. In fact, the manager is peeling off those young calves, and selling or trading them,” he says.

    Stolen cows are usually used for breeding purposes or hamburger, but Huffman says stolen calves are typically sold via Internet cattle auctions or classified ad websites like Craigslist. They’re also sold directly to feedlots, as most feedlots don’t require brand inspections until the cattle leave the feedyard.

    The best defense

    Branding, Huffman says, remains the best defense against livestock theft. He reports that 83% of Oregon producers brand calves – down slightly from 90% in years past. Hot-iron branding, although not mandatory in Oregon, is permanent. Other methods currently available for marking cattle are alterable or removable.

    As a result of brand inspections, in 2010, 846 animals were impounded at Oregon livestock auctions until ownership could be proven.

    “Some never can prove ownership, and end up as theft investigations,” Huffman says. “In most cases, the people trying to sell them probably should have known they were in with their herd; in fact, they probably did, but when we do the brand inspections and identify them, the typical response is ‘oh, I didn’t know that was there.’ If we were to classify situations where we think they should have known better – it’s in the hundreds.”

    As far as out-and-out cattle nabbing from properties, Huffman says it happens, but not as often. In this situation, most producers won’t even realize the theft has taken place until the cattle are gathered from open range.

    That was the case for Skinner Ranches in Oregon’s Malheur County. Operating on nearly 10,000 square miles of open range, of which 72% is public land, Bob Skinner says they operate in the most remote area of the lower 48 states. The Skinners graze cattle on Bureau of Land Management (BLM) ground stretching from eastern Oregon’s Jordan Valley to the Nevada state line.

    About two years ago, Skinner says he came up short 200 head when he pulled his Double S brand cattle off the open range, far more than normal death loss would account for. He soon discovered that many of his neighbors also had large numbers unaccounted for.

    “Cattle are big animals, they don’t evaporate overnight,” he says. “Carcasses of dead animals will stay in the area for a long time. We searched by airplane, local deputies searched, no one could find any sign of them. It was a serious problem. We got together with other ranchers and decided to do something.”
    A team effort

    The Malheur County Sheriff’s Department stepped in and Skinner says they put so much pressure on the area that cattle rustling, for the most part, stopped.

    Malheur County Sheriff Brian Wolfe says slowing down cattle theft in the area was a team effort by several different agencies, including BLM, Oregon State Police, Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife, and the local ranchers who participated in meetings with counterparts in Idaho and Nevada.

    Wolfe says his department increased backcountry and aircraft patrols. And, local producers who own aircraft, including the Skinners, fly a deputy over the area several times a week. Funding from BLM helps pay for the flights and the remainder of the costs come out of the Malheur County budget.

    About 63 search-and-rescue volunteers also perform backcountry and livestock patrols using county vehicles and ATVs, up to seven days/ week.

    Whenever other areas such as highway patrols are fully covered, Wolfe says full-time deputies are rerouted to the backcountry roads.

    The Sheriff’s Department developed cards for ranchers to fill out with license plate numbers, dates and times when they spot an unattended vehicle in grazing areas. The card includes a section that can be torn off and placed on the vehicle’s windshield stating that the vehicle had been observed by the Malheur County Sheriff’s Department.

    Many producers have winter grazing permits so the air and land patrols take place year around.

    Several motion-sensing cameras have also been set up to monitor areas where gates have been previously left open or vandalism to private property has taken place, and in areas where small bales of hay have been stolen. Hay theft, Wolfe says, hasn’t been a huge problem, but it does happen, usually 4-5 bales at a time.

    As added incentive, pledges from livestock producers, which as of December 2011 totaled $63,000, are being offered as a reward for information leading to convictions.

    Although the incidence of cattle rustling has lessened – from several hundred head to the occasional 10-15 – Wolfe says everyone remains diligent.

    “It’s best to use preventive methods rather than react to the crime,” he says. “An ounce of prevention is definitely worth a pound of cure.”
    14 Property Theft Prevention Tips

    Here are 14 tips provided by the Texas & Southwestern Cattle Raisers Association to prevent property theft:

    1. Display a sign from your state cattlemen’s association on gates and entrances.

    2. Lock gates.

    3. Brand cattle and horses, and make sure the brand is recorded.

    4. Put your driver’s license number on all saddles, tack and equipment.

    5. Count cattle regularly.

    6. Video horses and tack, and keep complete descriptions on file. Establish an organized proof-of-ownership file to save time in the recovery process.

    7. Vary feeding times.

    8. Be cautious about who has keys and combinations.

    9. Park trailers and equipment out of view from the road.

    10. Keep tack rooms and saddle compartments on trailers locked.

    11. Don’t feed in pens.

    12. Participate in neighborhood Crime Watch programs.

    13. Don’t build pens too close to the roadway.

    14. Never leave keys in tractors or other equipment.

    Debby Schoeningh is a freelance writer based in North Powder, OR.


    http://www.beefmagazine.com/manageme...big-issue-west

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by KFhunter View Post
    I think they graze them year round down there, with seasonal dry and wet cycles. Up here we have to put up hay, so that brings another big dynamic to prepping. How to preserve a whole herd for later consumption if fuel isn't there for hay production.
    My rough estimate is 5 gals of diesel per head for hay production and feeding. I still have great Granddad's scythe. He did just fine making stacks. (I wouldn't like it )

    The OP describes desperation. History shows that Venezuela has resources. They HAD infrastructure and a good economy. Families that were WEALTHY by world standards a few years ago are eating dogs and cats now. But as mentioned in other posts "It will work better NEXT time"
    "You are allowed to be disappointed but not surprised"

  17. #17
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    Food riots grip western Venezuela, mob reportedly slaughters cattle in field


    Several years ago they were prosperous and had a standard of living similar to ours. What is the difference between us and them? We are the world's reserve currency allowing us to print money like it's going out of style with no repercussions but not for much longer. Inflation is about to blow through the Feds 2% target and the cat is out of the bag. We're not Venezuela yet but we are going to get there unfortunately.
    What is the lake of fire? What is it's purpose? Is the lake of fire eternal hell? Is there any hope of escape for those cast into this lake?
    http://bible-truths.com/lake1.html

  18. #18
    Eventually the full shelves of food that we have had for the last 100 plus years has to fail. Government has been subsidizing basic food production from the fields by hook and crook, for almost 100 years now. Causing the growth of maga farmimg corporations while over taxing and over regulation of the small farmers, mostly killing them off. Then for the last 20 plus years government has been subsidizing from the retail side by the many safety net systems like EBT.

    So now we are totally dependent on a few major maga corporations, and distributors that are dependent on government subsidies both in the field and in sales.

    I muse that the current system will need more EBT and more and more subsidies in the fields of the major food production corporations to keep the shelves stocked and open.

    Like a pyramid scheme. That has to fail, and maybe sooner than later, as people get a job and off EBT.

    The only fix that I can think off, ... remove all self employment taxes on people making less than poverty. Remove all mandated payroll liabilities on small businesses (small farm/ranchers are small businesses) up to $100 million a year in total reciepts/sales.

    Then we could keep the shelves stacked deep.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by KFhunter View Post
    I think they graze them year round down there, with seasonal dry and wet cycles. Up here we have to put up hay, so that brings another big dynamic to prepping. How to preserve a whole herd for later consumption if fuel isn't there for hay production.

    If the fuel isn't their then people need to be looking at horses/ox to do crops.
    JUST A FEW OF MY SIMPLE THOUGHTS
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by KFhunter View Post
    I think they graze them year round down there, with seasonal dry and wet cycles. Up here we have to put up hay, so that brings another big dynamic to prepping. How to preserve a whole herd for later consumption if fuel isn't there for hay production.
    Pumpkins and squash. That is how they were wintered up in New England before "amber waves of grain" were available.
    "Dark and difficult times lie ahead. Soon we will all face the choice between what is right, and what is easy."
    Dumbledore to Harry Potter, Goblet of Fire.

    Luke 21:36

    A people who no longer recognize sin and evil, are not a people who will recognize tyranny and despotism either. Invar

  21. #21
    The only thing surprising about this story is it took this long for starving people to totally snap and start actively taking not just the chickens out of their neighbor's garden, but actively taking cattle from the fields (the grocery stores don't have much worth stealing in the rural areas).

    And no, things were not "Just like us" 6 years ago; the money and even some food shortages showed up 20 years ago; that's how Chavez got elected in the first place and his "give away" policies (like taking over factories and confiscating ranches) to feed the destitute is one reason he had the fan base that he did for so long.

    People were also used to corruption and food shortages; heck, when I was there in the 1970's they, ran out of "Harina Pan" a sort of white corn flour (related to grits but a finer grind) that was used to make the "daily bread." Eventually, the government of the day (which was moderate) took over the ships in the harbor to unload them and also took over factories and had the military distribute food and get the productions lines going.

    I don't remember why, but they also started producing "flour" that was yellow (basically yellow cornmeal) rather than white; the old ladies (mostly born in the 1880's and 1890's) were hysterical screaming that "we were all gonna die." I know why these days because the Harina Pan is lime treated; which means it is much healthier as a staple food, especially if you don't have much else (too much yellow corn product can kill if there isn't enough other stuff to eat).

    But these days, there is no wheat flour (people got used to eating wheat bread over the last couple of decades) or corn flour to make the traditional bread; in fact, many people have nothing.

    Eventually, people are going to storm the Presidential palace, but with the military base surrounding it, folks will have to feel that dying is better than staying alive and it takes awhile for people to get to that point.

    Meanwhile, folks in the far West (where this happened) will probably eat anything that moves and makes it impossible to keep crops planted in the Spring, because people will mob them and take the produce first.
    expatriate Californian living in rural Ireland with husband, dogs, horses. garden and many, many cats

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Pumpkins and squash. That is how they were wintered up in New England before "amber waves of grain" were available.
    Not as the sole source of feed, though... nowhere near enough fiber for most ruminants, plus, its gonna take a LOT of land and work to grow enough pumpkins to feed even a single milk cow. A smallish (900#) Jersey cow giving 30# of milk a day needs at least 30# of dry matter daily. Pumpkins are 10% dry matter. That means she's gonna need to eat around 300# of pumpkins *every day*.

    Cattle CAN be "outwintered" in even bitter northern climes, as long as they have a windbreak, and preferably access to liquid water. But we had a Dexter cow go feral on us a few years back... she could jump 5 foot fences with hobbles on her front feet AND a 4 foot logging chain hooked onto a ring in her nose!!

    She spent the entire winter roaming our 160 acres, in temps that got down to 23 below zero, and with over 3 feet of snow on the ground almost the entire time. We would find where she had pawed through the snow to get to the third crop alfalfa we hadn't been able to harvest. But she must have eaten snow for water, as there wasn't a single spot where our small creek wasn't frozen solid (or at least with thick enough ice you weren't getting to water without an ice chisel or auger)

    We managed to get her into the barn in early March when she got trapped in a single line of heifers in a lane with 7 foot banks on either side and she came into the barn with them. Wilder than a whitetail deer! She turned out to be not pregnant (the only reason we hadn't gone out with a 30-30 and "harvested" her while the weather was cold), so we sent her to the butcher. She was fat as butter! Best hamburger we ever had... And she was 14 years old at the time.

    So, it's possible. We also outwintered a group of yearling dairy heifers before we built our new barn. But halfway through the winter we had to switch them out with the Dexter beef cows, because they were being hassled by a pack of wild dogs. Several of the Dexter were horned, and they all have plenty of attitude!

    A few days later when we took feed back to them, there was a mess of dog tracks and cow tracks all mixed up near the feed bunk, and a large puddle of blood. Not a mark on any of the cows. We never saw any sign of the dogs again!

    My son and his wife have harvested 3 acres of hay using a sickle bar mower, leaf rakes and pitchforks, pitching it loose onto a trailer, and stacking it in a large covered pavilion they have on their small farm. Enough to feed a couple dozen goats and sheep, plus bed up hogs and chickens. It's a LOT of work!

    Summerthyme

  23. #23
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    It's a LOT of work!

    Anything to do with hay is a lot of work. Perhaps round bales excepted, haven't ever handled them personally. They're all tractor work.
    The wonder of our time isn’t how angry we are at politics and politicians; it’s how little we’ve done about it. - Fran Porretto
    -http://bastionofliberty.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-wholly-rational-hatred.html

  24. #24
    Venezuela doesn't really have "Winter" or any other season; rather it is by elevation to the area around Merida (where these cattle were) is temperate and in the mountains, there are actually ski resorts there.

    There is some slight seasonal variations; but in general if you live in the Andes (San Cristobal where the report was lodged, a lovely town I spent two Christmas Seasons in) if it likely to be somewhat cool year-round; if you live in Caracas by the Sea it will be about 70 to 80 degrees all year round.

    It is the location on the equator that creates this situation; and it takes awhile to get used to, there is some limited "wet and dry" seasons which make sense to a California, but some years there really isn't even much of that.

    Merida is probably one of the only areas where cattle ranching is a big deal - well that and traditionally part of the Llanos (interior plains); both of those areas being more temperate than tropical; there are some cows almost everywhere but the heat and diseases tend to be too much for them in the interior (going towards the Amazon) and parts of the coast (like where I stayed a good part of the time) were daily between 90 and 115 degrees - way too hot without air conditioned barns, at least for most breeds.
    expatriate Californian living in rural Ireland with husband, dogs, horses. garden and many, many cats

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    Meanwhile, folks in the far West (where this happened) will probably eat anything that moves and makes it impossible to keep crops planted in the Spring, because people will mob them and take the produce first.

    Manual repeating shotguns (pump shotguns) are relatively inexpensive, and in minimally trained hands can be quite effective in close range social work. Buckshot is useful, close range and to whom it may concern for the cheap stuff, the better grades of buckshot pattern better at longer ranges and the best is still effective at 50 yards or so. Stick to 00. Birdshot is for birds, training/practice, and making noise except at contact distance. Slugs will push effective range out beyond 100 yards depending on the shooter.
    The wonder of our time isn’t how angry we are at politics and politicians; it’s how little we’ve done about it. - Fran Porretto
    -http://bastionofliberty.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-wholly-rational-hatred.html

  26. #26
    Yep and what army are you going to hire to patrol huge Fincas (large ranches and/or farm/plantations), pay to patrol the area (along with feeding and housing them or they will leave) etc.

    This usually is not small family farms, the Venezuelan system (at least for the larger growers) is more like a Plantation system with "serfs" who have lived their for generations many of whom are uneducated and do their jobs well enough but are not trained in large-scale defense (and if you did turn them into a private army they wouldn't be growing your crops or tending your cattle).

    The "llanos" is even worse, with huge areas (like Texas) with herds that wonder and ranches the size of some US counties; some of this may have changed and 40 years ago a lot more people were family farmers or at least gardeners (I gather that had fallen by the wayside especially on the coast) but the whole idea of "land redistribution" that you hear over and over again in Latin American (often by various Letist or even Catholic organizations) is because the average person, even a peasent, doesn't own any.

    Everything a "peasant" may have is usually either provided by the landowner and/or "the company store" system that used to be a big thing in the US as well.

    Maduro isn't even going to be able to use his military to protect everything that will need protecting in the Spring; there simply are not enough of them, they are already guarding some warehouses and food distribution points, but to guard all the agricultural lands and ranches would be impossible; the more so because so may of their owners left the country long-long ago; so people who might have taken a personal stake in the welfare of their workers and neighbors (even for reasons of enlighted self-interest like not being attacked with pitchfolks and shovels) are no longer there.
    expatriate Californian living in rural Ireland with husband, dogs, horses. garden and many, many cats

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Dozdoats View Post
    It's a LOT of work!

    Anything to do with hay is a lot of work. Perhaps round bales excepted, haven't ever handled them personally. They're all tractor work.
    Well, yes..

    But sitting on a tractor cutting, raking and then baling small squares (which then do have to be unloaded manually and stored in the barn somehow- currently we use an electrically powered elevator and then a mow conveyor that runs the full 120 feet across the haymow, which distributes the bales evenly so we can fill the entire mow) is one HECK of a lot easier than swinging a scythe, then raking by hand, then gathering the windrows into stacks or loading it onto a wagon and pitching it into a barn!!

    Summerthyme

  28. #28
    Yep and what army are you going to hire to patrol huge Fincas (large ranches and/or farm/plantations), pay to patrol the area (along with feeding and housing them or they will leave) etc.
    One of the reasons I've prepped with more staple foods than our family should need (beans, wheat, rice) is to "pay" extras for whatever help we might need that we ourselves couldn't supply. I'm guessing there are a LOT of folks in Venezuela now who would be thrilled to take a "guard job" guarding cattle or whatever, in exchange for a simple place to stay and better daily rations than they're getting out of the dumpsters now...

    Summerthyme

  29. #29
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    A security officer guards the entrance of a fabric store near the central market with his pump-action, sawed-off shotgun. This was a common sight.

    -- http://www.dbooth.org/guat2000/small/day3_4.htm

    20 years ago it was necessary for a fabric store in Guatemala to have armed guards....
    The wonder of our time isn’t how angry we are at politics and politicians; it’s how little we’ve done about it. - Fran Porretto
    -http://bastionofliberty.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-wholly-rational-hatred.html

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by summerthyme View Post
    One of the reasons I've prepped with more staple foods than our family should need (beans, wheat, rice) is to "pay" extras for whatever help we might need that we ourselves couldn't supply. I'm guessing there are a LOT of folks in Venezuela now who would be thrilled to take a "guard job" guarding cattle or whatever, in exchange for a simple place to stay and better daily rations than they're getting out of the dumpsters now...

    Summerthyme
    Yes, and if the owners of the ranches still lived on them, that might even happen (and probably will in some cases) through the land areas are vast enough I can' see this being very easy to do; especially since that would require food to feed "the help" which you have wisely put aside.

    One thing about the crises in Venezuela is that it is a lesson that collapses a be extremely slow and painful; gradually using up most of what almost anyone (including a government) can put aside.

    There are already starting to be problems feeding the families of the lower-ranking military; when that goes up the chain, I expect there to be "regime change" if it hasn't already occured for other reasons.
    expatriate Californian living in rural Ireland with husband, dogs, horses. garden and many, many cats

  31. #31
    The "vast areas" of the big ranches, though, *also* make it highly unlikely that people would be able to run down and kill cattle often, if ever. Cattle on those types of holdings are wilder than deer, and often at least as dangerous as a bear, especially if there are calves in the vicinity. You absolutely would get some poaching if someone had a decent gun, and I suppose there might be a few smart enough to figure out that it's possible to set snares on the cattle paths (their one weakness... they tend to follow the same narrow paths to water or pasturage, and a smart "hunter" could do very well taking advantage of that trait)

    Heck, even our Dexters, which are handled from birth, and are brought into the barn every night for a bit of food and to be checked over, are protective as hell when outside. Our Amish hired kid once had to shoot into the ground, TWICE (he said the first time they just stopped very briefly, then started for him again) when the entire herd charged him as he was walking across the pasture at dusk, hunting. They DON'T like strangers, and apparently, he registered as "stranger" while in THEIR pasture!

    But I absolutely do expect it to become a problem, although as I've written before, many people simply don't even recognize "food" when they see it. Show most citiots and suburbanites a potato field, and 99% would never know there was enough food underground to feed them for a very long time...

    Summerthyme

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