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INTL RUSSIA: Jehovah's Witnesses banned as extremists and annoying.
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  1. #1
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    4 RUSSIA: Jehovah's Witnesses banned as extremists and annoying.

    Sheesh!!! They're not THAT annoying.



    Christianity Today‏Verified account @CTmagazine 6m6 minutes ago

    #Breaking: Russia officially bans Jehovah's Witnesses, forcing them to close nearly 400 centers across the country


    ----------------

    Russia Bans Jehovah’s Witnesses As Extremists
    High court puts pacifist faith in same category as terrorists.


    [ posted 4/20/2017 12:36PM ]

    It’s official. Jehovah’s Witnesses can no longer practice their faith freely in Russia, where the Supreme Court on Thursday declared the pacifist religious organization an “extremist group” and banned all activity.

    The judge ordered all 395 local chapters and its Russian headquarters to close and authorized the government to seize all property. Under the ruling, distributing copies of the Watchtower, discussing their beliefs in public, or even worshiping at a meeting hall has become a crime.

    A lawyer for the justice ministry, Svetlana Borisova, told the court adherents “pose a threat to the rights of the citizens, public order and public security,” according to reports.

    To human rights and religious freedom advocates around the world, the move comes as a major blow. Ties between the Russian Orthodox Church and the Kremlin put ongoing scrutiny on all non-Orthodox faiths, but this case represents the first time the country banned a registered religious group.

    “If Jehovah’s Witnesses are persecuted, then that means later ‘on the block’ will come other religious movements—for example, Protestant churches,” law professor Anatoly Pchelintcev told Portal-Credo, an Orthodox news site. “For the Jehovah’s Witnesses, Armageddon has arrived, and the faithful of other religions await the apocalypse.”

    Christians in the country have been more ambivalent about the fate of the fellow minority group, as Christianity Today previously reported.

    Jehovah’s Witnesses number 175,000 adherents in Russia, and Protestants are about four to five times that. Though they have suffered under some of the same restrictive laws (like the anti-evangelism measures enacted last year), Russian Protestants have a better reputation among Orthodox and government officials. They disagree with Jehovah’s Witnesses’ theology and methodology for evangelism, often seeing their tactics as annoying.

    It’s impossible the government would use the extremist label against evangelicals’ literature, since they tend to use the same Bible translations as the Orthodox, said Roman Lunkin, an expert in Russian church-state relations, to Time.

    Still, some Russian evangelicals see the repression of Witnesses as reason to worry, according to William Yoder, spokesman for the Russia Evangelical Alliance. Some have brought up German pastor Martin Niemöller’s “First They Came For” poem and asked, “How soon will it hit us if we don’t protest?”

    The crackdown on Jehovah’s Witnesses follows rising nationalist furor in Russia and a skepticism toward groups associated with the West.

    “The treatment of the Jehovah’s Witnesses reflects the Russian government’s tendency to view all independent religious activity as a threat to its control and the country’s political stability,” according to the US Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF), which condemned Russia’s ongoing campaign against the group. “This approach dates back to the Soviet period and impacts other religious groups, including peaceful Christians and Muslims.”

    http://www.christianitytoday.com/gle...witnesses.html
    So when's the Revolution? God or Money? Choose.

  2. #2
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    They are annoying. Got a sign on my door "no Bible thumpers." If they ring the door bell, game is on! Haven't seen one for a very long time at my house.
    Proud to be Deplorable, Irredeemable, a Scumbag and a bigot! Nothing wrong in being any of them.

  3. #3
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    I am a former Jehovah's Witness and believe the organization to be harmful to its members and the public. I do not agree with the decision to ban them though. Apart from anything else it reinforces the leaders' persecution complex.

  4. #4
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    They just never bothered me. They used to have older women in pairs passing out the Watchtower downtown, and I would take them and give them a dollar and go on my way. They were happy.

    If they came to my door, I would tell them I am saved and I believe in Jesus, and then show them my children's JW Bible I bought for my son ages ago. They left happy.

    I guess it depends on who you are as to whether they're annoying or not.

    Got to be careful what you outlaw.
    So when's the Revolution? God or Money? Choose.

  5. #5
    Yeah, but it's Russia. They don't have our Constitution. They can outlaw what ever nuisance they want. I kinda sympathise with that one.

    Half the town I currently live in seems to be JW. They still knock on occasion hoping to save us. My understanding is that according to them, only 140,000-something souls will ever make it to Heaven. I guess space is tight up there... So, given that, why would anyone try to save another, thereby lowering their own chances? Never made any sense to me, but they are always cagey about that stuff, and I couldn't find a straight answer on their website (and that stupid handout is an entirely useless waste of paper).

    Don't care much for that group.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faroe View Post
    Yeah, but it's Russia. They don't have our Constitution. They can outlaw what ever nuisance they want. I kinda sympathise with that one.

    Half the town I currently live in seems to be JW.
    Don't care much for that group.
    I understand. There's a Kingdom Hall on a quiet street about 4 blocks from me. You never hear a peep out of them. I think in Russia maybe they're a little more aggressive about proselytizing, but not here. In the summer we even see Mormon young men going up and down the streets once in a while. I think Russia wants everybody to be Orthodox.

    But it's not like the JW's are going after converts with bombs and beheadings, after all.
    So when's the Revolution? God or Money? Choose.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by mzkitty View Post
    I understand. There's a Kingdom Hall on a quiet street about 4 blocks from me. You never hear a peep out of them. I think in Russia maybe they're a little more aggressive about proselytizing, but not here. In the summer we even see Mormon young men going up and down the streets once in a while. I think Russia wants everybody to be Orthodox.

    But it's not like the JW's are going after converts with bombs and beheadings, after all.
    True. They are always polite, and nicely dressed. That is actually a BIG improvement over the what goes on with the denomination (not to be specifically named) two doors down the street from my house.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faroe View Post
    True. They are always polite, and nicely dressed (actually a BIG improvement over the what goes on with the denomination two doors down the street from my house).
    I know. The ones where I am, the men wear suits and shined shoes, and the women are in longish modest dresses. I think they might wear little hats too, but kinda fuzzy on that recollection.

    So when's the Revolution? God or Money? Choose.

  9. #9
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    My co-worker is JW. One of the nicest man I know. He and his Hall are very disappointed with this turn of events. He still hasn't saved me...lol /sarc
    "...shall not be infringed"

  10. #10
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    We get JWs come over from England, I normally have a chat with them at the gate, I'm not JW and don't intend to be, I tell them that but I'm happy to talk scripture, you have to feel sorry for them being sent over here, we're seriously deep behind enemy lines
    Si vis pacem para bellum.

  11. #11
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    This is an article from the JW website. Not sure if the original story is completely accurate.


    https://www.jw.org/en/news/releases/...me-court-case/

    NEW YORK—With a large number of observers in attendance, the Supreme Court of the Russian Federation continued into its fourth day of hearings, considering a claim

    from the Ministry of Justice to liquidate the Administrative Center of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia. The Court announced a recess late in the afternoon, and the hearing

    will resume on Wednesday, April 19, 2017, at 10:00 a.m.


    Attorneys for Jehovah’s Witnesses opened with arguments in defense of the Administrative Center, followed by a cross-examination from attorneys representing the

    Ministry of Justice. Reacting to evidence presented by the defense, the judge requested the Ministry of Justice to identify the specific legal basis for liquidating Jehovah’s

    Witnesses’ Administrative Center. The attorneys for the Ministry of Justice were unable to provide a response to the judge’s request and other related questions. The

    day’s proceedings concluded after hearing testimony from witnesses for both parties.


    Next week, the court is expected to begin their review of the case materials.
    "...shall not be infringed"

  12. #12
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    The don't like any disturbances in the Force......

    Mormon missionaries now to be known as Volunteers.....

    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...olunteers.html

    A change is coming to the designation for missionaries of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints who are serving in Russia, with elders and sisters serving in the country to be known as volunteers, rather than as missionaries.

    The change is in response to a new Russian law aimed at combatting terrorism — but one that also restricts religious organizations in the country.

    All Mormon missionaries serve on a volunteer basis, but to comply with the new law set to take effect Wednesday, the LDS Church is making adjustments to what the missionaries assigned to Russia are involved with and known as.

    The sweeping new anti-terrorism law also restricts missionary work to faith organizations registered with the government, requiring that all proselytizing must happen within houses of worship.

    When the law was enacted earlier this month, the LDS Church responded with a statement that reads in part: "The Church will honor, sustain and obey the law. Missionaries will remain in Russia and will work within the requirements of these changes. The Church will further study and analyze the law and its impact as it goes into effect."

    In a recent email message from mission presidents distributed to the relatives of missionaries currently serving in Russia, family members are instructed to refer to their family members in the future — including in social media posts and messages — as volunteers, rather than missionaries who are involved in volunteer service.

    The LDS Church has seven missions established in Russia, headquartered in major cities throughout the country.

    The new law impacts all religious organizations in Russia, and other faiths have expressed concerns the law is vague, leaving a lot of questions about how it will be applied.

    In the 25 years since the LDS Church was first established in Russia, missionary efforts have helped the faith grow to more than 22,000 members who participate in 100 congregations throughout the country.
    True North Strong and Free

  13. #13
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    My take, I'm sure all JW's aren't the same, I never experience anything like this from any other religion, I'm all for you believing what you want, except terrorism, but my experience w/JW's started when I took my small children dressed for Halloween to Daddy's office and they told them it was the Devils holiday and they were Satan's children. The 2 ladies that worked as receptions, stole an average of $2k worth of stamps & office supplies a month & until they left we didn't know. Christmas was special, they didn't believe in parties, gifts or alcohol. Every year I would put together a basket of a Honey-baked Ham, pea soup mix, bread, mustards, cheese, 3 wines, party cake for each employee, cuz guests happen during the holidays My hubby handed out the bonus, they didn't do the gift exchange w/other employees, but they were the first to grab the baskets at the party. The other employees would laugh how they always were willing to take things, but never give.

    I have a good workman that has been with us for 15 years, 1st thing he does is comment on how evil the Catholic Church is, he will argue about any Christian faith, only his elders know the truth and they put it in there watchtower guide for meetings. We have driven him to WJ meeting halls Thursdays & Sundays all over the world, his best commment is that only 144k people can enter heaven & 133k Jehovah Witness are there. So I ask him why be good then. Exactly he saids. His comments on relgion stresses me beyond words, his is the only religion per him, but he is a great worker, can do or make anything
    Last edited by Night Owl; 04-20-2017 at 06:52 PM.
    God Bless Us & God Bless America!

  14. #14
    First the JW's, next will be the other churches

    I America you will see the same thing in the future
    Churches will have to go underground

  15. #15
    JW chicks mess up the Hot vs Crazy Matrix big time. No matter how hot they are it ain't worth it!!!

  16. #16
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    My experience with JWs, has always been cordial. We don't agree on some basic matters, but I cannot imagine them being the threat that the Russian court suggests. Maybe the Russian Orthodox Church considers them a threat because of their door-to-door visitation.
    “And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”
    ― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garryowen View Post
    My experience with JWs, has always been cordial. We don't agree on some basic matters, but I cannot imagine them being the threat that the Russian court suggests. Maybe the Russian Orthodox Church considers them a threat because of their door-to-door visitation.
    Maybe the Russians think JW stands for Jihadi Warriors.
    "Dark and difficult times lie ahead. Soon we will all face the choice between what is right, and what is easy."
    Dumbledore to Harry Potter, Goblet of Fire.

    Luke 21:36

    A people who no longer recognize sin and evil, are not a people who will recognize tyranny and despotism either. Invar

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by KFhunter View Post
    JW chicks mess up the Hot vs Crazy Matrix big time. No matter how hot they are it ain't worth it!!!
    That made me laugh.

  19. #19
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    I always enjoyed reading their anti papist articles. News of the world IIRC. Weird things amuse me.
    Proverbs 28:28 When corruption takes over, good people go underground, but when the crooks are thrown out, it's safe to come out.

  20. #20
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    I wish we would ban them here in Arizona .. pain in the asses ring my bell all the time
    It is sunny here in Arizona :)

  21. #21
    They are a cult pure and simple. Watched them destroy my employees 30 year marriage when his wife and kids got brainwashed and he wouldn't go along with it. They were telling her what to do every step. The sad thing is I think she now has a glimmer of how they destroyed her life.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Cally View Post
    I am a former Jehovah's Witness and believe the organization to be harmful to its members and the public. I do not agree with the decision to ban them though. Apart from anything else it reinforces the leaders' persecution complex.
    I am in the same position and have the same opinion.
    "To disagree, one doesn't have to be disagreeable." - Goldwater
    "The only thing we should prohibit is violence." - Paul
    --------------------------
    God: the Ultimate "Deadbeat Dad"

  23. #23
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    Good grief. We know they're cultists but since when did these "extremists" behead, bomb, or run over masses of people over with a truck?

    I guess Russians don't have a door or a mouth to say, "No thank you, I'm not interested."

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Faroe View Post
    Yeah, but it's Russia. They don't have our Constitution. They can outlaw what ever nuisance they want. I kinda sympathise with that one.

    Half the town I currently live in seems to be JW. They still knock on occasion hoping to save us. My understanding is that according to them, only 140,000-something souls will ever make it to Heaven. I guess space is tight up there... So, given that, why would anyone try to save another, thereby lowering their own chances? Never made any sense to me, but they are always cagey about that stuff, and I couldn't find a straight answer on their website (and that stupid handout is an entirely useless waste of paper).

    Don't care much for that group.
    A common misunderstanding.

    99% of them have ZERO expectation of going to Heaven and are quite content with that. They view a heavenly afterlife as being like elected (or, selected by Jesus) to go to Congress and work for the government. Instead, their hope for an afterlife is to live unending lives in a restored paradise on Earth under that newly elected government of Jesus as king and his 144,000 co-administrators.

    One of their several large departures from mainstream Christianity.

    No official stand on whether living in this restored Eden means romping about naked and unshaven; their literature depicts otherwise.
    "To disagree, one doesn't have to be disagreeable." - Goldwater
    "The only thing we should prohibit is violence." - Paul
    --------------------------
    God: the Ultimate "Deadbeat Dad"

  25. #25
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    The JW website has indeed confirmed what happened in Russia's courts.

    https://www.jw.org/en/news/releases/...ahs-witnesses/

    APRIL 20, 2017
    RUSSIA


    Russia’s Supreme Court Rules Against Jehovah’s Witnesses


    NEW YORK—After six days of hearings over the last two weeks, the Supreme Court of the Russian Federation today upheld the claim submitted by the Ministry of Justice

    to liquidate the Administrative Center of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia and 395 Local Religious Organizations (LROs) used by Witnesses throughout Russia. The ruling

    goes into effect immediately.


    “We are greatly disappointed by this development and deeply concerned about how this will affect our religious activity,” states Yaroslav Sivulskiy, a spokesman for

    Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia. “We will appeal this decision, and we hope that our legal rights and protections as a peaceful religious group will be fully restored as soon

    as possible.”


    Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia have 30 days to submit their appeal for consideration by a three-person panel.
    "...shall not be infringed"

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