Check out the TB2K CHATROOM, open 24/7               Configuring Your Preferences for OPTIMAL Viewing
  To access our Email server, CLICK HERE

  If you are unfamiliar with the Guidelines for Posting on TB2K please read them.      ** LINKS PAGE **



*** Help Support TB2K ***
via mail, at TB2K Fund, P.O. Box 24, Coupland, TX, 78615
or


GUNS/RLTD Scope advice
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 22 of 22

Thread: Scope advice

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149

    Scope advice

    One of the gifts Iím receiving for Christmas this year is a Rock River 458 Socom upper (from my son - yay me!). Havenít decided if Iím going to play musical lowers or build one just for it. Researching dies, brass, bullets, data and loading knowledge particular to this round. That said, Iíd like to solicit advice on scope choice. At the moment I have 4 orphan optics. They are, in no particular order:

    Vintage Redfield 2 3/4X ďTVĒ screen (love this scope)
    Tru-Glo Tactical 4X (pretty low end optic-recoil may kill it)
    Bushnell 3X9 (basic beater scope-pretty big in size)
    Nikon P22 2X7 (reticle is meant for 22rimfire @1,500-1,640 FPS).

    I lean towards the Redfield or Nikon, but have a couple concerns. The Redfield is a sweet and mint vintage scope and I donít want to potentially wreck it with 458 recoil. Itís previous home was on a Winchester Trapper in 357 mag where it performed admirably. Thoughts?

    The Nikon is my preferred choice and was thinking that the BDC reticle calibrated for 22 rim fire at 1,500-1,640 FPS (is there any such 22 ammo?) ought to be pretty close to 458 Socom ballistics (except for terminal effects ). I think itíll handle the recoil as itís the same scope as their P223 (meant for 223/5.56) just a different reticle. Thoughts?

    The ideal choice would be my Leopold Mark AR Mod 1 1.5-4X Fire Dot, but I donít want to move it from its current home on another AR. Appreciate the guruís amongst the members input.
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Snow Belt
    Posts
    4,012
    Quote Originally Posted by Creedmoor View Post
    One of the gifts I’m receiving for Christmas this year is a Rock River 458 Socom upper (from my son - yay me!). Haven’t decided if I’m going to play musical lowers or build one just for it. Researching dies, brass, bullets, data and loading knowledge particular to this round. That said, I’d like to solicit advice on scope choice. At the moment I have 4 orphan optics. They are, in no particular order:

    Vintage Redfield 2 3/4X “TV” screen (love this scope)
    Tru-Glo Tactical 4X (pretty low end optic-recoil may kill it)
    Bushnell 3X9 (basic beater scope-pretty big in size)
    Nikon P22 2X7 (reticle is meant for 22rimfire @1,500-1,640 FPS).

    I lean towards the Redfield or Nikon, but have a couple concerns. The Redfield is a sweet and mint vintage scope and I don’t want to potentially wreck it with 458 recoil. It’s previous home was on a Winchester Trapper in 357 mag where it performed admirably. Thoughts?

    The Nikon is my preferred choice and was thinking that the BDC reticle calibrated for 22 rim fire at 1,500-1,640 FPS (is there any such 22 ammo?) ought to be pretty close to 458 Socom ballistics (except for terminal effects ). I think it’ll handle the recoil as it’s the same scope as their P223 (meant for 223/5.56) just a different reticle. Thoughts?

    The ideal choice would be my Leopold Mark AR Mod 1 1.5-4X Fire Dot, but I don’t want to move it from its current home on another AR. Appreciate the guru’s amongst the members input.
    I think you answered your own question. The Leupold Mark AR series are great and the price is reasonable. I have two of them. Of course, I don't have any rifles, but I really like the scopes.
    1. If you import the Third World, you become the Third World. It really is that simple.
    2. The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he didn't exist
    3. If you have not been to the range in a month, you are under performing.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Eastern NE
    Posts
    1,396
    Primary Arms. For the money, they are the best out there.

    Revelation 6:8
    I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

    http://www.mdsoptics.com

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Behind Enemy Lines
    Posts
    169,367
    PM dogmanan. He did a months-long research project into scopes.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    State of confusion
    Posts
    8,668
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Olson View Post
    PM dogmanan. He did a months-long research project into scopes.
    He’s been trying to achieve minute-o-cat at 500 yards.
    "...Cry 'Havoc' and let slip the cats of war..."
    Itís a real pisser when your belief system gets T-boned by reality.
    Iím not afraid of dying...I just donít want to be there!
    ...sell your cloak, and buy a sword...Second Amendment 1.0

  6. #6
    Just be aware that scopes do not hold their value well for resale. I never buy new scopes and on occasion have bought certain 2nd-hand rifles primarily to get the scope. I'm something of a horse trader when it comes to guns and accessories and always look at my probable return on investment if I later decide to sell or trade something.It's relatively easy to get most of your money back or make a profit when selling a firearm. Even if you buy a new gun, the depreciation is not horrible if you've kept it in good condition and it may even appreciate over time. It is relatively easy - with a practised eye - to make super deals on used firearms and almost guarantee a profit. This is virtually never the case when you buy a new scope, irrespective of brand. Also, be aware of deals on old, off-brand glass. K-Mart once (long ago) sold a house brand scope - I think they were the "Sportsman" line - that were actually very good Japanese optics. I've seen a few on gun show tables in recent years for $10, $15 and $20. I snap them up. Last year I bought a used Smith & Wesson (Magpul Original Equipment) AR15 for half it's new retail cost. Why did I buy it? The seller had equipped it with a premium Primary Arms scope. I didn't need or especially want that particular rifle, but I did want the scope (for a different rifle) for USPSA competition. Basically the seller coughed up a like-new scope (with box and paper work) to make the sale. It's not like he was really desperate and couldn't make the rent or anything; he just - like so many other sellers I've encountered - barely gave his scope a second thought.

    Don't get me wrong. Good optics can be important and I do own and believe in them. I just suggest that readers try to be smart about acquiring them.

    Best regards
    Doc

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    North Central Arkansas
    Posts
    459
    Fall down in the woods, your rifle is 4 feet away. Still trust that scope?
    Pain never makes me cry, but happiness does.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    4,016
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc1 View Post
    Just be aware that scopes do not hold their value well for resale. I never buy new scopes and on occasion have bought certain 2nd-hand rifles primarily to get the scope. I'm something of a horse trader when it comes to guns and accessories and always look at my probable return on investment if I later decide to sell or trade something.It's relatively easy to get most of your money back or make a profit when selling a firearm. Even if you buy a new gun, the depreciation is not horrible if you've kept it in good condition and it may even appreciate over time. It is relatively easy - with a practised eye - to make super deals on used firearms and almost guarantee a profit. This is virtually never the case when you buy a new scope, irrespective of brand. Also, be aware of deals on old, off-brand glass. K-Mart once (long ago) sold a house brand scope - I think they were the "Sportsman" line - that were actually very good Japanese optics. I've seen a few on gun show tables in recent years for $10, $15 and $20. I snap them up. Last year I bought a used Smith & Wesson (Magpul Original Equipment) AR15 for half it's new retail cost. Why did I buy it? The seller had equipped it with a premium Primary Arms scope. I didn't need or especially want that particular rifle, but I did want the scope (for a different rifle) for USPSA competition. Basically the seller coughed up a like-new scope (with box and paper work) to make the sale. It's not like he was really desperate and couldn't make the rent or anything; he just - like so many other sellers I've encountered - barely gave his scope a second thought.

    Don't get me wrong. Good optics can be important and I do own and believe in them. I just suggest that readers try to be smart about acquiring them.

    Best regards
    Doc
    All very true Doc. I have bought several rifles in the last few days for the store at the market value of the rifle, not even considering the scope on it.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by lanningro View Post
    Fall down in the woods, your rifle is 4 feet away. Still trust that scope?
    Lanningro, My serious, scope-equipped rifles all have see-through rings or BUIS (Back Up Iron Sights) for the reason you mentioned. In recent decades iron sights have ever more fallen by the wayside in the shooting community, but I'm still a huge believer in them.

    Best regards
    Doc

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    4,016
    Quote Originally Posted by Creedmoor View Post
    One of the gifts I’m receiving for Christmas this year is a Rock River 458 Socom upper (from my son - yay me!). Haven’t decided if I’m going to play musical lowers or build one just for it. Researching dies, brass, bullets, data and loading knowledge particular to this round. That said, I’d like to solicit advice on scope choice. At the moment I have 4 orphan optics. They are, in no particular order:

    Vintage Redfield 2 3/4X “TV” screen (love this scope)
    Tru-Glo Tactical 4X (pretty low end optic-recoil may kill it)
    Bushnell 3X9 (basic beater scope-pretty big in size)
    Nikon P22 2X7 (reticle is meant for 22rimfire @1,500-1,640 FPS).

    I lean towards the Redfield or Nikon, but have a couple concerns. The Redfield is a sweet and mint vintage scope and I don’t want to potentially wreck it with 458 recoil. It’s previous home was on a Winchester Trapper in 357 mag where it performed admirably. Thoughts?

    The Nikon is my preferred choice and was thinking that the BDC reticle calibrated for 22 rim fire at 1,500-1,640 FPS (is there any such 22 ammo?) ought to be pretty close to 458 Socom ballistics (except for terminal effects ). I think it’ll handle the recoil as it’s the same scope as their P223 (meant for 223/5.56) just a different reticle. Thoughts?

    The ideal choice would be my Leopold Mark AR Mod 1 1.5-4X Fire Dot, but I don’t want to move it from its current home on another AR. Appreciate the guru’s amongst the members input.
    I would go with the Nikon. The reason for this is that your can get new turret covers from Nikon calibrated for other calibers, and maybe they will have one for 458 SOCOM, though I doubt it. The main reason is that you can use their SpotOn application online to print a range card to use the BDC of the scope you have calibrated to 458. I have done that with their M-308 scopes on different rifles in different calibers.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Lone_Hawk View Post
    I would go with the Nikon. The reason for this is that your can get new turret covers from Nikon calibrated for other calibers, and maybe they will have one for 458 SOCOM, though I doubt it. The main reason is that you can use their SpotOn application online to print a range card to use the BDC of the scope you have calibrated to 458. I have done that with their M-308 scopes on different rifles in different calibers.
    Thanks Lone Hawk. I think you’re the only one that actually read my post and addressed the questions I asked. I wasn’t asking about what new scope to buy or what my backup plan was if I broke the scope or how great an operator someone was.

    Yep, one of the reasons I bought the Nikon was their SpotOn thing. Still wondering where you find 22LR that can touch 1,640fps. Do you think the P22 will stand up to 458 recoil?
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    4,016
    Quote Originally Posted by Creedmoor View Post
    Thanks Lone Hawk. I think you’re the only one that actually read my post and addressed the questions I asked. I wasn’t asking about what new scope to buy or what my backup plan was if I broke the scope or how great an operator someone was.

    Yep, one of the reasons I bought the Nikon was their SpotOn thing. Still wondering where you find 22LR that can touch 1,640fps. Do you think the P22 will stand up to 458 recoil?
    Yes, I think that it will. Nikon actually built that scope for multiple calibers, the only difference is the turret covers.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Lone_Hawk View Post
    Yes, I think that it will. Nikon actually built that scope for multiple calibers, the only difference is the turret covers.
    That’s what I thought too. Imma going to find some trajectory plots for hi-vel 22RF and some 458 in the same range and compare ‘em I bet they’re not that dissimilar.
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    4,016
    Quote Originally Posted by Creedmoor View Post
    That’s what I thought too. Imma going to find some trajectory plots for hi-vel 22RF and some 458 in the same range and compare ‘em I bet they’re not that dissimilar.
    Think 22WMR

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Lone_Hawk View Post
    Think 22WMR
    That makes more sense. Will do.
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Happy on the mountain
    Posts
    69,465
    How is the parallax adjustment on the Nikon? How far out do you plan to shoot this thing?

    OK, that first one was easy - The Nikon P22 is set parallax free at 50 yards - http://www.riflescopespy.com/rimfire-scopes/nikon-p-22/
    The wonder of our time isnít how angry we are at politics and politicians; itís how little weíve done about it. - Fran Porretto
    -http://bastionofliberty.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-wholly-rational-hatred.html

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Dozdoats View Post
    How is the parallax adjustment on the Nikon? How far out do you plan to shoot this thing?
    Hmm. Forgot about parallax. It’s set for 50 yards. Damn. I expect most shooting to be at 75-200 yards.
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Upstate SC. Go Tigers!
    Posts
    852
    The 458 shooting a 300gr bullet has ballistics very close to a 12 ga shooting 300 gr slugs (1800 fps). There are a few shotgun BDC scopes that will be extremely close to the 458 and they are built to take the recoil.
    Member of the Nowski Brigade
    "Fighting communism was more fun when it was a group effort abroad instead of an insurgency at home."

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Central WA
    Posts
    2,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Peabody View Post
    The 458 shooting a 300gr bullet has ballistics very close to a 12 ga shooting 300 gr slugs (1800 fps). There are a few shotgun BDC scopes that will be extremely close to the 458 and they are built to take the recoil.
    Aren’t most shotgun scopes also set up to be parallax free at 50 yards?
    To most Christians, the Bible is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree." - unknown

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michiganistan
    Posts
    961
    shoot what ya got.
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet"

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Upstate SC. Go Tigers!
    Posts
    852
    Nikon Prostaff P3 Shotgun 2-7X32 BDC 200
    Member of the Nowski Brigade
    "Fighting communism was more fun when it was a group effort abroad instead of an insurgency at home."

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    North Central Arkansas
    Posts
    459
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc1 View Post
    Lanningro, My serious, scope-equipped rifles all have see-through rings or BUIS (Back Up Iron Sights) for the reason you mentioned. In recent decades iron sights have ever more fallen by the wayside in the shooting community, but I'm still a huge believer in them.

    Best regards
    Doc
    I do have 2 weapons with scopes. Both have barrels and actions that simply do not allow use of iron sights. Everything else just plenty of range time.
    Pain never makes me cry, but happiness does.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts


NOTICE: Timebomb2000 is an Internet forum for discussion of world events and personal disaster preparation. Membership is by request only. The opinions posted do not necessarily represent those of TB2K Incorporated (the owner of this website), the staff or site host. Responsibility for the content of all posts rests solely with the Member making them. Neither TB2K Inc, the Staff nor the site host shall be liable for any content.

All original member content posted on this forum becomes the property of TB2K Inc. for archival and display purposes on the Timebomb2000 website venue. Said content may be removed or edited at staff discretion. The original authors retain all rights to their material outside of the Timebomb2000.com website venue. Publication of any original material from Timebomb2000.com on other websites or venues without permission from TB2K Inc. or the original author is expressly forbidden.



"Timebomb2000", "TB2K" and "Watching the World Tick Away" are Service Mark℠ TB2K, Inc. All Rights Reserved.